A while back, I decided to build a knight tribal deck so that I can have a relatively powered-down deck for more casual play. White is obviously required for the deck, and I wanted black because Haakon, Stromgald Scourge is pretty much the entire reason to play lnight tribal. I also added in green for the best knight ever, Knight of the Reliquary, and a small land theme grew around that. I chose Teneb for the color combination and the fact that he's a decently-relevant beater when I have nothing better to do.
When I finally completed the deck, it turned out to be much better than I originally anticipated, though it's often lacking in answers and still plays mediocre knights that beat. Luckily, it also turned out to be quite fun to play.
Drawing Haakon can be a pain sometimes. The only discard outlets are Greater Good and Mask of Memory, as well as going over seven cards (which is quite possible). I have considered adding something like Undead Gladiator to further alleviate the problem, but I don't know what to cut yet.
When considering what knights to add, I settled on ones with solid utility (like Dakmor Lancer), multiple protections (like Paladin en-Vec), good evasion (like Dauthi Mercenary or Skyhunter Skirmisher), or just extreme efficiency (like Chameleon Colossus or Wilt-Leaf Liege). There are some clunkers in there, but most of them are decently useful, either by themselves or when wielding a sword.
With all the protections and color hosers (like Pentarch Paladin and Lightwielder Paladin), Distorting Lens might actually not be bad in this deck. I've considered trying it numerous times, though never found the space.
Wizards really needs to print a better Knightkrataal than Dakmor Lancer.
Kudos to you. I've been thinking about this same deck for quite some time. I built it in a Vish Kal shell, and sadly played it at a table that was too competitive for what I was trying to do.
Some thoughts, which you may have considered and discarded in the name of being casual:
* Karador, Ghost Chieftain as commander? Plain casting your knights from the graveyard seems more reliable than needing to connect to do so. Teneb has a lower threat profile, which is maybe what you're thinking. But once people you realize you're just durdling around with knights, they'll be less worried about Caspar the Friendly Centaur.
*Fauna Shaman. The discard you need for whatever creature you want.
*Soul of the Harvest and Primordial Sage as a second version. I've played Soul of the Harvest in a Karador deck before and it's just ridiculous card draw that you don't have to pay for like Mentor of the Meek. And it has trample so likes holding a sword of pump and value.
*Kamahl, Fist of Krosa isn't a knight, but he reminds me of one, and man he'd be pretty sweet. I love the Mirror Entity interaction with Haakon, but you need some trample.
*Oh, Tortured Existence is another value way to get Haakon into the graveyard.
*To play a deck like this in my meta I need to consider Ground Seal and Witchbane Orb effects to help protect my graveyard, but that's going beyond casual. If someone wants to exile your knights from your graveyard, woo hoo, they did it, now they can sleep at night.
*I know Cultivate and Kodama's Reach also give you a land in hand in addition to one in play, but Wood Elves and Farhaven Elf also give you bodies that activate your ETB card draw, can be pumped up by Mirror Entity, block, recur, etc.
*Sensei's Divining Top or Mirri's Guile or similar would help you make sure not to draw Haakon. I'll admit one of the times I played the deck in which I had him I just kept drawing without playing a card/land so I had to discard. Of course that was early game and I had 6 cards in hand, but still I felt kind of sheepish.
Love me some knights, hope you have fun playing this.
* Karador, Ghost Chieftain as commander? Plain casting your knights from the graveyard seems more reliable than needing to connect to do so. Teneb has a lower threat profile, which is maybe what you're thinking. But once people you realize you're just durdling around with knights, they'll be less worried about Caspar the Friendly Centaur.
I don't like becoming too dependent on my own graveyard, and Karador would lead the deck way more in that direction. Teneb makes for a much better plan B should my own yard be nuked and I run out of cards to cast, since he's still a 6/6 flier that reanimates from my opponents' graveyards. I also rarely lack for ways to bring back my own knights thanks to Haakon, Reveillark, and Patriarch's Bidding, so Karador just seems unnecessary.
*Fauna Shaman. The discard you need for whatever creature you want.
Forgot about that one! Yeah, she should be in there for sure. I'm not comfortable putting Survival of the Fittest in a casual deck, but Fauna Shaman is more than fine.
*Soul of the Harvest and Primordial Sage as a second version. I've played Soul of the Harvest in a Karador deck before and it's just ridiculous card draw that you don't have to pay for like Mentor of the Meek. And it has trample so likes holding a sword of pump and value.
This deck tends to have less ramp than typical EDH decks, and it has a relatively low curve as well. I'm afraid Soul of the Harvest would just be too slow, especially since most of my creatures can come out before I even get to cast it. I also like the fact that Mentor triggers off tokens from Knight-Captain of Eos and Hero of Bladehold, but that's a minor interaction since there aren't many token makers in the deck. Soul of the Harvest is worth considering, but I'm skeptical of its usefulness here.
Greaves is okay, but I like the usefulness of the other equipment better. Most individual knights aren't all that strong, so protecting them and giving them haste don't really accomplish much. Sure, Duathi Mercenary gets in there for two damage one turn earlier, but I'd much rather have a Mask of Memory or a Sword of some kind on it instead.
Memorial is worth considering, but it is very expensive (mana-wise). In addition, most of the knights are weenies, and Memorial doesn't really add utility to them or directly increase my clock (unlike a Sword). I also tend to have only a few knights in play at a time as opposed to a swarm of them, so something like Sword of Vengeance might be better. And yeah, it draws artifact hate like a magnet. Still, Memorial has a very powerful effect, and it's definitely on my short list of cards to try in the deck.
As I said above, the deck tends to have 2-4 creatures in play at a time rather than a large swarm, so global pump effects aren't great (even Door of Destiny is mostly just there for thematic reasons). I've had Cathar's Crusade in the deck before, but it is a little slow. The upside is still there, but I like equipment better. (Craterhoof's good enough even with only a few guys in play.)
*Kamahl, Fist of Krosa isn't a knight, but he reminds me of one, and man he'd be pretty sweet. I love the Mirror Entity interaction with Haakon, but you need some trample.
I've thought about putting in Brawn or Filth for evasion. Kamahl is fairly good, but the non-Knight creature slots are the most competitive of all, and Craterhoof Behemoth is usually just better.
*Oh, Tortured Existence is another value way to get Haakon into the graveyard.
It does help with discarding, but I don't really like it as a card. Fauna Shaman just seems better. It also has the problem of making me more dependent on my own graveyard.
*To play a deck like this in my meta I need to consider Ground Seal and Witchbane Orb effects to help protect my graveyard, but that's going beyond casual. If someone wants to exile your knights from your graveyard, woo hoo, they did it, now they can sleep at night.
I'd much rather limit my graveyard involvement than play narrow cards to fight the hate. My meta isn't that heavy with graveyard hate, though there's the usual Bojuka Bog, Nihil Spellbomb, and Puppeteer Clique type value cards that handle graveyards. Still, even if they exile a few of my cards, I'll usually have already gotten value out of them. Loam has probably already drawn me some lands, Sun Titan still sticks around as a beater, and I often don't search out Haakon until I can immediately cast some guys out of the yard. The deck is not so graveyard dependent that it can't survive a few exiles (unlike many Karador decks).
*I know Cultivate and Kodama's Reach also give you a land in hand in addition to one in play, but Wood Elves and Farhaven Elf also give you bodies that activate your ETB card draw, can be pumped up by Mirror Entity, block, recur, etc.
I like the guaranteed land drop of those two more than the small bodies of the creatures. If I had Karador as my general, I'd probably play the creatures instead, but the small guys are only relevant in a few specific cases (that rarely happen in the early game when I want them) and being able to hit my land drops is very important.
*Sensei's Divining Top or Mirri's Guile or similar would help you make sure not to draw Haakon. I'll admit one of the times I played the deck in which I had him I just kept drawing without playing a card/land so I had to discard. Of course that was early game and I had 6 cards in hand, but still I felt kind of sheepish.
Those cards are okay, but they're a little durdly for a beatdown deck and I don't have the space. Plus, I only have one Top and it's in a deck that needs it more. I think just adding another discard outlet or two (like Fauna Shaman) should keep the problem under control.
Oh man, I love this. I'm also running a knight-tribal deck, though mine is led by Oros, the Avenger. I'm a bit more "religious" about the tribal aspect than you seem to be. I don't allow any non-knights. Which might be why my win-loss ratio is so horrible
I would recommend against running Karador as your commander. Until they print decent multicolored Knight-legends, having a dragon command your deck, seems like the only acceptable thing to do
I'm considering cutting Haakon from my deck, but I like the way you seem to be supporting him.
Oh, and have you considered Chieftain en-Dal? I'm always happy to see him, and in many matches, he's been the MVP.
When I finally completed the deck, it turned out to be much better than I originally anticipated, though it's often lacking in answers and still plays mediocre knights that beat. Luckily, it also turned out to be quite fun to play.
1x Teneb, the Harvester
Knights (28)
1x Cairn Wanderer
1x Chameleon Colossus
1x Crib Swap
1x Crusading Knight
1x Dakmor Lancer
1x Dauthi Mercenary
1x Haakon, Stromgald Scourge
1x Hero of Bladehold
1x Juniper Order Ranger
1x Kinsbaile Cavalier
1x Knight Exemplar
1x Knight of the Reliquary
1x Knight of the White Orchid
1x Knight-Captain of Eos
1x Lightwielder Paladin
1x Mirran Crusader
1x Mirror Entity
1x Order of Yawgmoth
1x Paladin en-Vec
1x Pentarch Paladin
1x Phyrexian Crusader
1x Riders of Gavony
1x Silverblade Paladin
1x Skyhunter Skirmisher
1x Soltari Crusader
1x Soltari Lancer
1x Stillmoon Cavalier
1x Wilt-Leaf Liege
Equipment (5)
1x Behemoth Sledge
1x Mask of Memory
1x Sword of Feast and Famine
1x Sword of Fire and Ice
1x Sword of Light and Shadow
1x Cultivate
1x Expedition Map
1x Kodama's Reach
1x Pilgrim's Eye
1x Sakura-Tribe Elder
1x Sol Ring
Other Support Creatures (7)
1x Craterhoof Behemoth
1x Eternal Witness
1x Mentor of the Meek
1x Reveillark
1x Stoneforge Mystic
1x Stonehewer Giant
1x Sun Titan
Other Support Spells (15)
1x Austere Command
1x Beast Within
1x Buried Alive
1x Door of Destiny
1x Entomb
1x Greater Good
1x Hallowed Burial
1x Hunter's Insight
1x Jarad's Orders
1x Life from the Loam
1x Lurking Predators
1x Marshal's Anthem
1x Mirari's Wake
1x Patriarch's Bidding
1x Pernicious Deed
Lands (38)
1x Arid Mesa
1x Barren Moor
1x Bayou
1x Bojuka Bog
1x Command Tower
1x Fetid Heath
3x Forest
1x Gavony Township
1x Godless Shrine
1x Horizon Canopy
1x Inkmoth Nexus
1x Isolated Chapel
1x Krosan Verge
1x Marsh Flats
1x Misty Rainforest
1x Murmuring Bosk
1x Overgrown Tomb
3x Plains
1x Reflecting Pool
1x Secluded Steppe
1x Selesnya Sanctuary
1x Sevannah
1x Stirring Wildwood
2x Swamp
1x Temple Garden
1x Tranquil Thicket
1x Treetop Village
1x Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
1x Vault of the Archangel
1x Verdant Catacombs
1x Volrath's Stronghold
1x Wooded Bastion
1x Woodland Cemetary
Random factoids about the deck:
- Crusading Knight and Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth make for a very amusing combo in a multiplayer game.
- Entomb will almost always go for either Life from the Loam or Haakon, Stromgald Scourge barring specific circumstances.
- Drawing Haakon can be a pain sometimes. The only discard outlets are Greater Good and Mask of Memory, as well as going over seven cards (which is quite possible). I have considered adding something like Undead Gladiator to further alleviate the problem, but I don't know what to cut yet.
- When considering what knights to add, I settled on ones with solid utility (like Dakmor Lancer), multiple protections (like Paladin en-Vec), good evasion (like Dauthi Mercenary or Skyhunter Skirmisher), or just extreme efficiency (like Chameleon Colossus or Wilt-Leaf Liege). There are some clunkers in there, but most of them are decently useful, either by themselves or when wielding a sword.
- The worst knights in the deck are Juniper Order Ranger, Lightwielder Paladin, and Riders of Gavony. I'll be very glad to replace them once new knights come out. I might also try some random other knights like Eastern Paladin. Suggestions are welcome.
- Between Phyrexian Crusader, Inkmoth Nexus, and power boosters, I've actually managed to poison some people out before.
- With all the protections and color hosers (like Pentarch Paladin and Lightwielder Paladin), Distorting Lens might actually not be bad in this deck. I've considered trying it numerous times, though never found the space.
- Wizards really needs to print a better Knightkrataal than Dakmor Lancer.
Suggestions are welcome!Some thoughts, which you may have considered and discarded in the name of being casual:
* Karador, Ghost Chieftain as commander? Plain casting your knights from the graveyard seems more reliable than needing to connect to do so. Teneb has a lower threat profile, which is maybe what you're thinking. But once people you realize you're just durdling around with knights, they'll be less worried about Caspar the Friendly Centaur.
*Fauna Shaman. The discard you need for whatever creature you want.
*Soul of the Harvest and Primordial Sage as a second version. I've played Soul of the Harvest in a Karador deck before and it's just ridiculous card draw that you don't have to pay for like Mentor of the Meek. And it has trample so likes holding a sword of pump and value.
*Lightning Greaves or Swiftfoot Boots to use knights the turn they come in. I'd also vote for Akroma's Memorial but that'll get blown up faster.
*Sword of the Paruns is useful in a weenie deck.
*Some pumping enchantments. Beastmaster Ascension seems good. Cathar's Crusade is better in token decks, but will give you value.
*Kamahl, Fist of Krosa isn't a knight, but he reminds me of one, and man he'd be pretty sweet. I love the Mirror Entity interaction with Haakon, but you need some trample.
*Oh, Tortured Existence is another value way to get Haakon into the graveyard.
*To play a deck like this in my meta I need to consider Ground Seal and Witchbane Orb effects to help protect my graveyard, but that's going beyond casual. If someone wants to exile your knights from your graveyard, woo hoo, they did it, now they can sleep at night.
*I know Cultivate and Kodama's Reach also give you a land in hand in addition to one in play, but Wood Elves and Farhaven Elf also give you bodies that activate your ETB card draw, can be pumped up by Mirror Entity, block, recur, etc.
*Sensei's Divining Top or Mirri's Guile or similar would help you make sure not to draw Haakon. I'll admit one of the times I played the deck in which I had him I just kept drawing without playing a card/land so I had to discard. Of course that was early game and I had 6 cards in hand, but still I felt kind of sheepish.
Love me some knights, hope you have fun playing this.
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How I know I should build a deck:
I don't like becoming too dependent on my own graveyard, and Karador would lead the deck way more in that direction. Teneb makes for a much better plan B should my own yard be nuked and I run out of cards to cast, since he's still a 6/6 flier that reanimates from my opponents' graveyards. I also rarely lack for ways to bring back my own knights thanks to Haakon, Reveillark, and Patriarch's Bidding, so Karador just seems unnecessary.
Forgot about that one! Yeah, she should be in there for sure. I'm not comfortable putting Survival of the Fittest in a casual deck, but Fauna Shaman is more than fine.
This deck tends to have less ramp than typical EDH decks, and it has a relatively low curve as well. I'm afraid Soul of the Harvest would just be too slow, especially since most of my creatures can come out before I even get to cast it. I also like the fact that Mentor triggers off tokens from Knight-Captain of Eos and Hero of Bladehold, but that's a minor interaction since there aren't many token makers in the deck. Soul of the Harvest is worth considering, but I'm skeptical of its usefulness here.
Greaves is okay, but I like the usefulness of the other equipment better. Most individual knights aren't all that strong, so protecting them and giving them haste don't really accomplish much. Sure, Duathi Mercenary gets in there for two damage one turn earlier, but I'd much rather have a Mask of Memory or a Sword of some kind on it instead.
Memorial is worth considering, but it is very expensive (mana-wise). In addition, most of the knights are weenies, and Memorial doesn't really add utility to them or directly increase my clock (unlike a Sword). I also tend to have only a few knights in play at a time as opposed to a swarm of them, so something like Sword of Vengeance might be better. And yeah, it draws artifact hate like a magnet. Still, Memorial has a very powerful effect, and it's definitely on my short list of cards to try in the deck.
As I said above, the deck tends to have 2-4 creatures in play at a time rather than a large swarm, so global pump effects aren't great (even Door of Destiny is mostly just there for thematic reasons). I've had Cathar's Crusade in the deck before, but it is a little slow. The upside is still there, but I like equipment better. (Craterhoof's good enough even with only a few guys in play.)
I've thought about putting in Brawn or Filth for evasion. Kamahl is fairly good, but the non-Knight creature slots are the most competitive of all, and Craterhoof Behemoth is usually just better.
It does help with discarding, but I don't really like it as a card. Fauna Shaman just seems better. It also has the problem of making me more dependent on my own graveyard.
I'd much rather limit my graveyard involvement than play narrow cards to fight the hate. My meta isn't that heavy with graveyard hate, though there's the usual Bojuka Bog, Nihil Spellbomb, and Puppeteer Clique type value cards that handle graveyards. Still, even if they exile a few of my cards, I'll usually have already gotten value out of them. Loam has probably already drawn me some lands, Sun Titan still sticks around as a beater, and I often don't search out Haakon until I can immediately cast some guys out of the yard. The deck is not so graveyard dependent that it can't survive a few exiles (unlike many Karador decks).
I like the guaranteed land drop of those two more than the small bodies of the creatures. If I had Karador as my general, I'd probably play the creatures instead, but the small guys are only relevant in a few specific cases (that rarely happen in the early game when I want them) and being able to hit my land drops is very important.
Those cards are okay, but they're a little durdly for a beatdown deck and I don't have the space. Plus, I only have one Top and it's in a deck that needs it more. I think just adding another discard outlet or two (like Fauna Shaman) should keep the problem under control.
Thanks for your suggestions!
I would recommend against running Karador as your commander. Until they print decent multicolored Knight-legends, having a dragon command your deck, seems like the only acceptable thing to do
I'm considering cutting Haakon from my deck, but I like the way you seem to be supporting him.
Oh, and have you considered Chieftain en-Dal? I'm always happy to see him, and in many matches, he's been the MVP.
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