I've been seeing a few $50 budget decks recently (Specifically, OCPunisher's $50 Sharuum and Hazek's $50 Reaper King), and I have decided to challenge myself by building a few of them. This is the first, of hopefully a few to come.
My playgroup tends to keep a rather casual mentality, but all of our decks remain quite well tuned, and a number of them have some interesting mana bases; this has caused a few new players to be a bit intimidated from joining. Some players at my group would break a $50 limit on a single card (myself included), however, my group is one of the easiest places to see that money doesn't buy you a win. My Tibor and Lumia deck pulled out a game when I was focused down to 8 life early, and then a runecaster's pike and wheel of fortune managed to bring in enough defense to hold off and eliminate 3 other players.
The only thing I've seen of a more expensive deck is that it has a more convoluted theme that requires you to know the deck better to play well.
The Purpose of this experiment is two-fold: 1) Make a budget deck that is can hold its own, 2) Make a deck that can easily be loaned to another player to promote the fun spirit of EDH.
Hopefully, not only will I be able to pilot these decks, but I would be able to loan them to prospective players and they could see for themselves that they can carve a decent foothold in the game, while being easily able to obtain any of the cards in the deck.
General Choice
Mono-red may seem like an interesting choice to build a loaner deck out of, since red is typically viewed as the weakest EDH color. The purpose here is that red has several cheap crap rares that can really affect gameplay. Red also has some of the cheapest board sweepers out there, which could be nice since Oblivion Stone commands a decent price tag. Red also lets us have an aggressive game plan, while Kazuul gives us a decent defensive deterrent.
Plus, I've wanted to build this guy for a while now.
Prices from mid- magiccards.info (wtf happened to reverberate, 1 seller at $75 is ruining the average...)
$50 deck limit
$4 card limit (to prevent a $25 deck with a $25 win con).
I am sure if anyone wanted to go out and buy the deck online or from any one online store, the overall price may be a bit higher than what is listed, however the goal is to assemble a deck that is relatively cheap, that you don't need to scour the ends of the earth for once in a lifetime prices. Many commons and uncommons can be gotten for free from other friendly players. I have both given and received massive amounts of commons/uncommons at various times.
Glad to see you liked this idea. Couple of suggestions for you:
- Get yourself a Caged Sun. Unlike the other two mana-doublers, it's cheap enough for this kind of deck, and it seems really good with your commander.
- Is Helm of Kaldra worth it? It seems like one of your pricier cards, and I wonder if the effect is worth it.
- Vicious Shadows is very cheap and always a good card in this format. Stalking Vengeance isn't bad, either.
- Hellkite Charger is another good mono-red card for those times when you decide to start attacking people.
- Angel's Trumpet is a good way to make sure everyone attacks as much as possible.
EDIT: Don't forget to make sure you look at all the different versions of each card. That should save you a little cap space (for example, the Commander versions of Darksteel Ingot and Austere Command are cheaper than the originals).
Glad to see you liked this idea. Couple of suggestions for you:
- Get yourself a Caged Sun. Unlike the other two mana-doublers, it's cheap enough for this kind of deck, and it seems really good with your commander.
- Is Helm of Kaldra worth it? It seems like one of your pricier cards, and I wonder if the effect is worth it.
- Vicious Shadows is very cheap and always a good card in this format. Stalking Vengeance isn't bad, either.
- Hellkite Charger is another good mono-red card for those times when you decide to start attacking people.
- Angel's Trumpet is a good way to make sure everyone attacks as much as possible.
EDIT: Don't forget to make sure you look at all the different versions of each card. That should save you a little cap space (for example, the Commander versions of Darksteel Ingot and Austere Command are cheaper than the originals).
Excellent suggestions!
I usually really like the Helm of Kaldra, but you're right on the price tag, it got cut in the final phase sadly. I was being optimistic with the cheaper cards at first, thinking I could get away with it; but was already thinking that it was going to be one of the first that would have to be cut.
And the rest of those are some seriously awesome suggestions! I really like how this budget restriction really shows where the hidden gems for this format are. Added all of them, except for Viscious Shadows, because I don't want my playgroup to know what that thing does. =P
Starstorm could be Blasphemous Act, it's a downgrade but gives you some more money to play with. There has got to be better card draw than Font of Mythos...maybe Memory Jar? A little more expensive but approximately 135.6 times better according to the number I just made up.
EDT: Added the ascendant and Boldwyr Intimidator (because he's funny, and actually... kinda good). Removed the Font. The idea behind the Font was that since I am playing Red, I will have less card draw than my opponents, so using the font would de-value their card draw, which would be fine with me.
also revamped the creatures, pulling out some of the back expensive fatties (hamletback goliath) for better, cheaper, less pricey baddasses (taurean mauler)
all recurr fairly easily in mono red, and pack a decent punch. plus deathtouch equips like gorgon flail or quietus spike could do well here. best would be basilisk collar if you happen to have one lying around. warstorm surge seems missing with kazuul as your general. free creatures that do damage seem good. journeyer's kite may be the best mon red draw engine available and still keep you under budget. explorer's scope has proven to be invaluable in my mono red builds as it serves as a red oracle of mul dya effect. one to cast, one to equip, and it puts permanents into play for doing what you should be doing anyway....attacking. ghitu war cry why play dragon breath when you can give all your critters firebreathing, or jump in on your opponents attack????? pillage seems better than some of your other removal into the core exile those pesky blightsteels.....and other pesky artifacts....
i second shadows suggestion from above.
other monetarily cheap effective red creatures.....
slith firewalker (when i play on turn 2 he's never less than an 8/8 when he dies.)
also, while you can't afford uber creatures, a cheap alternative is to use your opponents'. there are a lot of theft effects available to red. and most all of them are readily affordable. and they might make better alternative spell selections. especially if you decide to run charmbreaker devils
Stigma Lasher may be a bit pricey, but since I am decently far under budget, I can afford a bit of splash.
Wither is a great deterrent to blocking, and tossing some trample onto him so he gets the hit with his second ability can really shut a player down from stabilizing off of a Loxodon Warhammer or something like that.
All that said, I have found a few other spells I'd like to run, I have recently discovered Haze of Rage, and love it. I may need to shuffle a few things around to get that in. Kazuul looks like he may have a decent army thing going, and buyback + storm seems pretty darn cool if you ask me.
Of these, all have a pretty powerful effect on the game. The most expensive, skullclamp is too good to not run. Stick it on a token, and keep it back to block, and you have a very strong deterrent against attacks.
Actually, tec edge is the most expensive, which is why I had problems putting it in at first, but I want two lands that can deal with Maze of Ith problems. Even if it won't have much of an effect against me, I'd rather that person be available for attacks from other people as well.
Dragonmage is good card draw tech, especially if we deplete our hand fast, Lox gives us some life stability in red. Konda's seems like a good idea with a General that makes tokens that share a type with himself, and we just touched on the Lasher. If I get close to the limit again, he is probably the first that will get cut, but until then he seems like a decent addition.
Also, if I loan the deck out, he has one of those splashy effects that can have some fun with player interaction in the game, or be a powerful addition for some spikey players.
Much like the Boldwyr Intimidator can have some fun with other players at the table.
Wither is a great deterrent to blocking, and tossing some trample onto him so he gets the hit with his second ability can really shut a player down from stabilizing off of a Loxodon Warhammer or something like that.
Eh, that doesn't sound like a good reason to run this card. Wither by itself isn't all that great. If I have a Primeval Titan that's looking to get in there, I'm not gonna worry about trampling over that little 2/2 body. Furthermore, I hope you aren't intending to block much with the Lasher anyways, because at that point you are probably in pretty rough shape.
Eh, that doesn't sound like a good reason to run this card. Wither by itself isn't all that great. If I have a Primeval Titan that's looking to get in there, I'm not gonna worry about trampling over that little 2/2 body. Furthermore, I hope you aren't intending to block much with the Lasher anyways, because at that point you are probably in pretty rough shape.
Apologies, I meant that wither is a good deterrent if they should look at blocking him. If he has a sword of vengeance (or any other equipment on him) A player might think twice about blocking him, especially since if they attack me after, they'd have to deal with a 3/3 blocker.
I don't think this deck needs to worry too much about blocking. It'll most likely try to go down to trading blows, because it will win that fight in the long run, especially if I put in Haze of Rage.
Stigma Lasher helps in that race as well, as he makes it so that they cannot recover from life trades.
Looks like you still have room for a couple cheapies.
Buried Ruin is fantastic in mono-red. Cut a basic.
How bout some old-fashioned X-spells to take someone out? Devil's Play mid is 75 cents and can give the red deck some great reach. It's a monster with Caged Sun. And I have to second the opinion that Stigma Lasher is too situational to be worth a whole 2+ here. He does not at all pull that kind of share here. Perhaps this would be a good swap.
I think Blasphemous Act is much better than Chain Reaction. It's like a .20 difference and it's much more reliable.
I don't think Contested War Zone is worth a whole dollar in the deck. If you're looking for budget space, that's an option.
I don't know if you want to let land destruction get involved (you should- it's mono-red budget, what other deck could possibly need it more?)... Wake of Destruction is 1.30 or so and just takes out another mono-colored player and significantly weakens bi-color players. Ruination is only .66 and it's another one this deck can really break the symmetry with. I'm sure you can find some chaff to cut for at least one of these, though you should really play both since the Blood Moon effects are over your 4-dollar limit.
For .45 cents Shard Phoenix can deal with token decks and kill anything smaller than... you guessed it, a 3/3 troll.
I'd say that both Chain Reaction and Blasphemous Act are worth it. You can never have enough sweepers in this format, and both are cheap enough to be worth it.
Contested War Zone also seems pretty weak in general, and definitely not worth a dollar in your cap.
Some excellent suggestions again. Buried Ruin - Excellent card, I don't know how I overlooked it with all the equipment I'm running.
X-Spells. I like the looks of all 3 suggestions, I'll have to see what the mana looks like in the deck before deciding. Comet Storm is another possibility, but climbs up there in cost.
Sweepers. I'm still looking at Blasphemous Act vs Chain Reaction. I like how the reaction only costs 4 though. I suppose if I want to kill dragons or such though, I'd need 6-7 creatures on the field for the reaction to be worthwhile, and at that point Blasphemous would cost only 2 or 3. I'll make the swap and try it out. Flowstone Slide will remain as my second sweeper, since it simply does so much more.
Contested War-Zone seemed safe in this deck for a few reasons. 1) gives people a reason to attack me if I want tokens; 2) I have tokens and can beat them rightback and take it; 3) it pumps my tokens. I do have to agree it may be a bit weak for it's cost. I think this will be another "might as well keep it while under cost, but likely to be replaced if something awesome shows up."
Dragon Breath - huh. I guess a bunch of dragons got cut. Looks like those that can use it are now... Godo, Homura, Stalking, Geargrabber, Hoard Smelter, (Bogardan if not cut?), Dagonmage, Knollspine (probably not, since I want to drop him after combat), Crater Hellion, Hellkite Charger, Artisan, and the Intimidator.
That's... 11 creatures, plus 1 who may be cut. I think it's still valid.
EDIT: I never got around to answering this, apparently:
all recurr fairly easily in mono red, and pack a decent punch. plus deathtouch equips like gorgon flail or quietus spike could do well here. best would be basilisk collar if you happen to have one lying around. warstorm surge seems missing with kazuul as your general. free creatures that do damage seem good. journeyer's kite may be the best mon red draw engine available and still keep you under budget. explorer's scope has proven to be invaluable in my mono red builds as it serves as a red oracle of mul dya effect. one to cast, one to equip, and it puts permanents into play for doing what you should be doing anyway....attacking. ghitu war cry why play dragon breath when you can give all your critters firebreathing, or jump in on your opponents attack????? pillage seems better than some of your other removal into the core exile those pesky blightsteels.....and other pesky artifacts....
i second shadows suggestion from above.
other monetarily cheap effective red creatures.....
slith firewalker (when i play on turn 2 he's never less than an 8/8 when he dies.)
I have started looking at the phoenixes, but some of them feel a bit expensive for their effect. Journeyers kite is a bit prohibitively expensive. Explorer's Scope is awesome, and has been routinely considered. Ghitu War Cry is inferior to the Dragon's Breath for one very large reason. Dragon's Breath gives haste, and haste is awesome.
Pillage and Into the Core need to be examined as well. I still like fissure and Aftershock simply because they have the opporunity to hit creatures. Into the Core though is extremely powerful.
Of the other creatures I like the Scourge and Hateflayer the most. Spikeshot Elder might also be worth considering with the equipment I run.
Overall a lowering of the cost. I may keep the War Zone in then, as I still want to try it, and the budget can definitely afford it for now.
Land D - I agree that mass land D would be extremely good for this deck, but since I'm tailoring it for a more casual playgroup, and as a potential loaner deck, I will withhold on adding them for now. What I'll most likely do is start to add a sideboard of cards to sub in should I run into a more competitive playgroup.
Don't be so hasty on cutting Chain Reaction. I remember a standard game, someone dropped Avenger of Zendikar on me...and I answered it my next turn with a windmill slammed Chain Reaction! Best. Answer. To. Avenger. Ever.
Don't be so hasty on cutting Chain Reaction. I remember a standard game, someone dropped Avenger of Zendikar on me...and I answered it my next turn with a windmill slammed Chain Reaction! Best. Answer. To. Avenger. Ever.
Indeed I should not ignore Mogg Infestation I actually run it (or used to?) in my T&L deck. It's a very strong card as it's a 1-sided wrath. Especially since I doubt my opponent weill want to attack into Kazuul with 1/1 tokens. Very nice find!
In the Avenger situation though, Blasphemous Act still does the same thing. In fact, since they'll have so many plants, it'll likely only cost R making it even better in that situation (though far less splashy!).
Indeed I should not ignore Mogg Infestation I actually run it (or used to?) in my T&L deck. It's a very strong card as it's a 1-sided wrath. Especially since I doubt my opponent weill want to attack into Kazuul with 1/1 tokens. Very nice find!
In the Avenger situation though, Blasphemous Act still does the same thing. In fact, since they'll have so many plants, it'll likely only cost R making it even better in that situation (though far less splashy!).
I can agree Act is better, seems like a no-contest to me really.I just didn't want you to write CR off completely is all.
I know what you mean, but it gets hard narrowing down to the last 100 slots. I think in this situation, Flowstone and Blasphemous will probably help more.
I might cut Taurean Mauler. It's a nice, cheap fatty after a little while, but it's really just a vanilla creature, and your commander makes a lot of those.
I want to promote EDH fun and big stuff. The mauler just has this satisfying feeling watching it get bigger and bigger.
I also now want to add in Obsidian Fireheart. Started finally assembling all the cards from my collection, and ran across this guy again. I've always wanted to put him into a deck, and if not a mono red, where would he fit? I am liking the sub-theme of putting in cards with rather unique abilities that would not typically see play.
The ability to spite someone by setting fire to their lands is just too cool; especially sitting behind Kazuul as defense.
I'm also contemplating putting paradise plume into the deck in place of one of the other mana artifacts. I hate dedicating a card to lifegain with nothing else, but tying it to a mana rock makes it not take up a space. It's also light enough to not be threatening, but probably heavy enough to stabilize the player for an extra turn or two of fun. If I loan out the deck, I'd like to see the new player last a little while. The plume might be able to extend that out a bit.
Played the deck a few times during the week, despite not actually winning any games, it help up surprisingly well and even managed to take a commanding board position in a few of the games. The deck does have a few issues being budget in mono-red, namely Enchantment removal. The lack of O-stone/Nevy Disk is felt quite strongly.
The anti-air defense is a tad bit lacking, and colorless support for pro-red creatures is definitely lacking. The Battlemaster and Geargrabber do pull their weight in pulling greaves and Swords of Fire and Ice off of stuff to leave them vulnerable.
I've been seeing a few $50 budget decks recently (Specifically, OCPunisher's $50 Sharuum and Hazek's $50 Reaper King), and I have decided to challenge myself by building a few of them. This is the first, of hopefully a few to come.
My playgroup tends to keep a rather casual mentality, but all of our decks remain quite well tuned, and a number of them have some interesting mana bases; this has caused a few new players to be a bit intimidated from joining. Some players at my group would break a $50 limit on a single card (myself included), however, my group is one of the easiest places to see that money doesn't buy you a win. My Tibor and Lumia deck pulled out a game when I was focused down to 8 life early, and then a runecaster's pike and wheel of fortune managed to bring in enough defense to hold off and eliminate 3 other players.
The only thing I've seen of a more expensive deck is that it has a more convoluted theme that requires you to know the deck better to play well.
The Purpose of this experiment is two-fold: 1) Make a budget deck that is can hold its own, 2) Make a deck that can easily be loaned to another player to promote the fun spirit of EDH.
Hopefully, not only will I be able to pilot these decks, but I would be able to loan them to prospective players and they could see for themselves that they can carve a decent foothold in the game, while being easily able to obtain any of the cards in the deck.
General Choice
Mono-red may seem like an interesting choice to build a loaner deck out of, since red is typically viewed as the weakest EDH color. The purpose here is that red has several cheap crap rares that can really affect gameplay. Red also has some of the cheapest board sweepers out there, which could be nice since Oblivion Stone commands a decent price tag. Red also lets us have an aggressive game plan, while Kazuul gives us a decent defensive deterrent.
Plus, I've wanted to build this guy for a while now.
Prices from mid- magiccards.info (wtf happened to reverberate, 1 seller at $75 is ruining the average...)
$50 deck limit
$4 card limit (to prevent a $25 deck with a $25 win con).
I am sure if anyone wanted to go out and buy the deck online or from any one online store, the overall price may be a bit higher than what is listed, however the goal is to assemble a deck that is relatively cheap, that you don't need to scour the ends of the earth for once in a lifetime prices. Many commons and uncommons can be gotten for free from other friendly players. I have both given and received massive amounts of commons/uncommons at various times.
1 Kazuul, Tyrant of the Cliffs - .35
Creatures - 18
2 Tunnel Ignus - .37
3 Mogg Assassin - .27
3 Taurean Mauler - 1.45 *
3 Zo-Zu the punisher - .67
4 Anger - .71
4 Fumiko the Lowblood - .92
4 Obsidian Fireheart - .85
5 Vulshok Battlemaster - .39
6 Crater Hellion - 1.35
6 Godo, Bandit Warlord - .89
6 Hellkite Charger - .66
6 Hoard-Smelter Dragon - .31
6 Homura, Human Ascendant - .65
6 Ogre Geargrabber - .14
7 Boldwyr Intimidator - .17
7 Knollspine Dragon - .64
7 Stalking Vengeance - .71
9 Artisan of Kozilek - .36
Card Draw - 5
2 Carnage Altar - .16
3 Serum tank - .18
4 Tower of Fortunes - .50
5 Bargaining Table - .43
5 Illuminated Folio - .16
Permanents - 6
2 Ankh of Mishra - .87
3 Aggravated Assault - .88
3 Angel's Trumpet - .34
3 Shared Animosity - .23
4 Grand Melee - .38
5 In the web of war - .52
2 Shattering pulse - .21
3 Incite War - .12
4 Aftershock - .15
4 Wild Ricochet - .53
5 Fissure - .14
5 Savage Beating - .68
5 World at war - .31
9 Blasphemous Act - .59
4x Flowstone Slide - .35
Equipment/Auras - 11
2 Dragon Breath - .15
1 Infiltration Lens - .38
1 O-Naginata - .42
1 Skullclamp - 2.51
2 Konda's Banner - 2.32
3 Darksteel Plate - 1.37
3 Loxodon Warhammer - 1.74
3 Obsidian Battle-Axe - .25
3 Sword of Vengeance - 1.31
3 Tenza, Godo's Maul - .24
6 Argentum Armor - 1.00
Mana Rocks / Ramp - 10
1 Wayfarer's Bauble - .18
2 Armillary Sphere - .15
2 Mind Stone - .63
2 Walking Atlas - .10
3 Darksteel Ingot - .51
3 Foriysian Totem - .19
3 Palladium Myr - .59
3 Pristine Talisman - .13
3 Spectral Searchlight - .28
6 Caged Sun - 1.39
----------
Land - 40
28 mountain
1 Buried Ruin - .36
1 Dormant Volcano - .31
1 Ghitu Encampment - .39
1 Ghost Quarter - 1.53
1 Keldon Megalith - .40
1 Kher Keep - .50
1 Shinka, the Bloodsoaked Keep - .64
1 Spinerock Knoll - .59
1 Temple of the False God - .39
1 Valakut, the molten pinnacle - 1.47
1 Tectonic Edge - 2.62
1 Terrain Generator - .37
TOTAL CARDS: 100
Process: Complete/Upgrading/Playtesting
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Glad to see you liked this idea. Couple of suggestions for you:
- Get yourself a Caged Sun. Unlike the other two mana-doublers, it's cheap enough for this kind of deck, and it seems really good with your commander.
- Is Helm of Kaldra worth it? It seems like one of your pricier cards, and I wonder if the effect is worth it.
- Vicious Shadows is very cheap and always a good card in this format. Stalking Vengeance isn't bad, either.
- Hellkite Charger is another good mono-red card for those times when you decide to start attacking people.
- Angel's Trumpet is a good way to make sure everyone attacks as much as possible.
EDIT: Don't forget to make sure you look at all the different versions of each card. That should save you a little cap space (for example, the Commander versions of Darksteel Ingot and Austere Command are cheaper than the originals).
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
Excellent suggestions!
I usually really like the Helm of Kaldra, but you're right on the price tag, it got cut in the final phase sadly. I was being optimistic with the cheaper cards at first, thinking I could get away with it; but was already thinking that it was going to be one of the first that would have to be cut.
And the rest of those are some seriously awesome suggestions! I really like how this budget restriction really shows where the hidden gems for this format are. Added all of them, except for Viscious Shadows, because I don't want my playgroup to know what that thing does. =P
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
The searchlight has a cheaper price tag and can be political, and the red mana battery lets me charge up if there isn't anything to spend mana on.
How do you feel about Starstorm? I feel there could be less pricey options for that slot.
I also want to add Ankh of Mishra (revised @ .87) since that tends to annoy people off and get them to attack me.
I also now need a slot for Tunnel Ignus. At .37, this guy is pure AWESOME!
EDIT: cut Boldwyr Heavyweights for the Ignus. The heavyweights looked fun, but... they are kinda bad I guess.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
EDT: Added the ascendant and Boldwyr Intimidator (because he's funny, and actually... kinda good). Removed the Font. The idea behind the Font was that since I am playing Red, I will have less card draw than my opponents, so using the font would de-value their card draw, which would be fine with me.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
also revamped the creatures, pulling out some of the back expensive fatties (hamletback goliath) for better, cheaper, less pricey baddasses (taurean mauler)
I let myself be convinced to drop Red Mana Battery, and put the Walking atlas in instead. He can hold equipment! Likewise, the Dreamstone Hedron gave way to an Armillary sphere which I think will help more, early.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
- magma phoenix
- shard phoenix
- kuldotha phoenix
all recurr fairly easily in mono red, and pack a decent punch. plus deathtouch equips like gorgon flail or quietus spike could do well here. best would be basilisk collar if you happen to have one lying around.warstorm surge seems missing with kazuul as your general. free creatures that do damage seem good.
journeyer's kite may be the best mon red draw engine available and still keep you under budget.
explorer's scope has proven to be invaluable in my mono red builds as it serves as a red oracle of mul dya effect. one to cast, one to equip, and it puts permanents into play for doing what you should be doing anyway....attacking.
ghitu war cry why play dragon breath when you can give all your critters firebreathing, or jump in on your opponents attack?????
pillage seems better than some of your other removal
into the core exile those pesky blightsteels.....and other pesky artifacts....
i second shadows suggestion from above.
other monetarily cheap effective red creatures.....
also, while you can't afford uber creatures, a cheap alternative is to use your opponents'. there are a lot of theft effects available to red. and most all of them are readily affordable. and they might make better alternative spell selections. especially if you decide to run charmbreaker devils
hope this helps, good luck!
EDIT: You might want the versatility of Spine of Ish Sah somewhere in here...
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
Wither is a great deterrent to blocking, and tossing some trample onto him so he gets the hit with his second ability can really shut a player down from stabilizing off of a Loxodon Warhammer or something like that.
All that said, I have found a few other spells I'd like to run, I have recently discovered Haze of Rage, and love it. I may need to shuffle a few things around to get that in. Kazuul looks like he may have a decent army thing going, and buyback + storm seems pretty darn cool if you ask me.
My big budget cards are:
1 Dragon Mage - 1.88
1 Konda's Banner - 2.32
1 Loxodon Warhammer - 1.74
1 Skullclamp - 2.51
1 Tectonic Edge - 2.62
Of these, all have a pretty powerful effect on the game. The most expensive, skullclamp is too good to not run. Stick it on a token, and keep it back to block, and you have a very strong deterrent against attacks.
Actually, tec edge is the most expensive, which is why I had problems putting it in at first, but I want two lands that can deal with Maze of Ith problems. Even if it won't have much of an effect against me, I'd rather that person be available for attacks from other people as well.
Dragonmage is good card draw tech, especially if we deplete our hand fast, Lox gives us some life stability in red. Konda's seems like a good idea with a General that makes tokens that share a type with himself, and we just touched on the Lasher. If I get close to the limit again, he is probably the first that will get cut, but until then he seems like a decent addition.
Also, if I loan the deck out, he has one of those splashy effects that can have some fun with player interaction in the game, or be a powerful addition for some spikey players.
Much like the Boldwyr Intimidator can have some fun with other players at the table.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Eh, that doesn't sound like a good reason to run this card. Wither by itself isn't all that great. If I have a Primeval Titan that's looking to get in there, I'm not gonna worry about trampling over that little 2/2 body. Furthermore, I hope you aren't intending to block much with the Lasher anyways, because at that point you are probably in pretty rough shape.
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
Apologies, I meant that wither is a good deterrent if they should look at blocking him. If he has a sword of vengeance (or any other equipment on him) A player might think twice about blocking him, especially since if they attack me after, they'd have to deal with a 3/3 blocker.
I don't think this deck needs to worry too much about blocking. It'll most likely try to go down to trading blows, because it will win that fight in the long run, especially if I put in Haze of Rage.
Stigma Lasher helps in that race as well, as he makes it so that they cannot recover from life trades.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Current thoughts
- Bogardan Hellkite
- Illuminated Folio
- Reiterate
+ Fumiko
+ ankh of Mishra
+ Haze of Rage
thoughts?
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Buried Ruin is fantastic in mono-red. Cut a basic.
How bout some old-fashioned X-spells to take someone out? Devil's Play mid is 75 cents and can give the red deck some great reach. It's a monster with Caged Sun. And I have to second the opinion that Stigma Lasher is too situational to be worth a whole 2+ here. He does not at all pull that kind of share here. Perhaps this would be a good swap.
I think Blasphemous Act is much better than Chain Reaction. It's like a .20 difference and it's much more reliable.
I don't think Contested War Zone is worth a whole dollar in the deck. If you're looking for budget space, that's an option.
I don't know if you want to let land destruction get involved (you should- it's mono-red budget, what other deck could possibly need it more?)... Wake of Destruction is 1.30 or so and just takes out another mono-colored player and significantly weakens bi-color players. Ruination is only .66 and it's another one this deck can really break the symmetry with. I'm sure you can find some chaff to cut for at least one of these, though you should really play both since the Blood Moon effects are over your 4-dollar limit.
For .45 cents Shard Phoenix can deal with token decks and kill anything smaller than... you guessed it, a 3/3 troll.
Lunchtime now but I'm sure I could think of more.
:symu::symr: Melek WheelStorm
:symw::symg: Trostani Enchantress (updated 6/5)
:symg::symr::symu: Unexpected Results.dec
Thada Adel Stax WIP
Contested War Zone also seems pretty weak in general, and definitely not worth a dollar in your cap.
I might go with either Red Sun's Zenith or Fanning the Flames as additional X spells.
EDIT: What is the point of Dragon Breath in this list? I don't see many 6cc creatures in this list...
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
Buried Ruin - Excellent card, I don't know how I overlooked it with all the equipment I'm running.
X-Spells. I like the looks of all 3 suggestions, I'll have to see what the mana looks like in the deck before deciding. Comet Storm is another possibility, but climbs up there in cost.
Sweepers. I'm still looking at Blasphemous Act vs Chain Reaction. I like how the reaction only costs 4 though. I suppose if I want to kill dragons or such though, I'd need 6-7 creatures on the field for the reaction to be worthwhile, and at that point Blasphemous would cost only 2 or 3. I'll make the swap and try it out. Flowstone Slide will remain as my second sweeper, since it simply does so much more.
Contested War-Zone seemed safe in this deck for a few reasons. 1) gives people a reason to attack me if I want tokens; 2) I have tokens and can beat them rightback and take it; 3) it pumps my tokens. I do have to agree it may be a bit weak for it's cost. I think this will be another "might as well keep it while under cost, but likely to be replaced if something awesome shows up."
Dragon Breath - huh. I guess a bunch of dragons got cut. Looks like those that can use it are now... Godo, Homura, Stalking, Geargrabber, Hoard Smelter, (Bogardan if not cut?), Dagonmage, Knollspine (probably not, since I want to drop him after combat), Crater Hellion, Hellkite Charger, Artisan, and the Intimidator.
That's... 11 creatures, plus 1 who may be cut. I think it's still valid.
EDIT: I never got around to answering this, apparently:
I have started looking at the phoenixes, but some of them feel a bit expensive for their effect. Journeyers kite is a bit prohibitively expensive. Explorer's Scope is awesome, and has been routinely considered. Ghitu War Cry is inferior to the Dragon's Breath for one very large reason. Dragon's Breath gives haste, and haste is awesome.
Pillage and Into the Core need to be examined as well. I still like fissure and Aftershock simply because they have the opporunity to hit creatures. Into the Core though is extremely powerful.
Of the other creatures I like the Scourge and Hateflayer the most. Spikeshot Elder might also be worth considering with the equipment I run.
1 Stigma Lasher - 2.22 - expensive
1 Bogardan Hellkite - 1.99 - expensive
1 Fervor - .77 - weak
1 Reiterate - .75 - mana intensive, inconsistent
1 magma phoenix - watching
1 kuldotha phoenix - watching
1 Scourge of Kher Ridges
1 into the core
1 Explorer's Scope
1 Ankh of Mishra
1 Haze of Rage
Some of the changes look fairly easy
Blood mark Mentor -> Fumiko the Lowblood +.54
Bogardan Hellkite -> Scourge of Kher Ridges -.85
Stigma Lasher -> Phoenix ~ -1.75 -2.00
Fervor -> Ankh of mishra +.10
Reiterate -> haze of rage -.52
Chain Reaction -> Blasphemous Act +.20
Contested War Zone -> Buried Ruin -.60
Overall a lowering of the cost. I may keep the War Zone in then, as I still want to try it, and the budget can definitely afford it for now.
Land D - I agree that mass land D would be extremely good for this deck, but since I'm tailoring it for a more casual playgroup, and as a potential loaner deck, I will withhold on adding them for now. What I'll most likely do is start to add a sideboard of cards to sub in should I run into a more competitive playgroup.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Don't be so hasty on cutting Chain Reaction. I remember a standard game, someone dropped Avenger of Zendikar on me...and I answered it my next turn with a windmill slammed Chain Reaction! Best. Answer. To. Avenger. Ever.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Indeed I should not ignore Mogg Infestation I actually run it (or used to?) in my T&L deck. It's a very strong card as it's a 1-sided wrath. Especially since I doubt my opponent weill want to attack into Kazuul with 1/1 tokens. Very nice find!
In the Avenger situation though, Blasphemous Act still does the same thing. In fact, since they'll have so many plants, it'll likely only cost R making it even better in that situation (though far less splashy!).
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
I can agree Act is better, seems like a no-contest to me really.I just didn't want you to write CR off completely is all.
Steel Sabotage'ng Orbs of Mellowness since 2011.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
Yeva (88/92 foils)
Raff
Scarab
Rakdos
Wort ($50 budget, 94/97 foils)
Trostani
I also now want to add in Obsidian Fireheart. Started finally assembling all the cards from my collection, and ran across this guy again. I've always wanted to put him into a deck, and if not a mono red, where would he fit? I am liking the sub-theme of putting in cards with rather unique abilities that would not typically see play.
The ability to spite someone by setting fire to their lands is just too cool; especially sitting behind Kazuul as defense.
I'm also contemplating putting paradise plume into the deck in place of one of the other mana artifacts. I hate dedicating a card to lifegain with nothing else, but tying it to a mana rock makes it not take up a space. It's also light enough to not be threatening, but probably heavy enough to stabilize the player for an extra turn or two of fun. If I loan out the deck, I'd like to see the new player last a little while. The plume might be able to extend that out a bit.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek
The anti-air defense is a tad bit lacking, and colorless support for pro-red creatures is definitely lacking. The Battlemaster and Geargrabber do pull their weight in pulling greaves and Swords of Fire and Ice off of stuff to leave them vulnerable.
Retired EDH - Tibor and Lumia | [PR]Nemata |Ramirez dePietro | [C]Edric | Riku | Jenara | Lazav | Heliod | Daxos | Roon | Kozilek