This is a pet deck that I've been playing/working on since 2010. Just for fun, I themed the deck after Zelda. I own all cards in the deck and have a second altered version of the deck with Zelda artwork. This deck list focuses on cards with counters and ways to use or add more counters. All critiques and suggestions are welcome
Spike Weaver
Comments: Easily refillable fog on a stick.
Viral Drake
Comments: Most commonly used to put planeswalkers in ultimate range. Repeatable proliferation is very useful in this deck. Infect is an option that is seldom used.
Solemn Simulacrum
Comments: This card is and effective color fix in a five color deck.
Vorel of the Hull Clade
Comments: It is disappointing that this card does not work on planeswalkers. That being said, it is a reliable way to increase counters on any number of cards.
Scavenging Ooze
Comments: This card's primary purpose is graveyard hate. Minor life gain and a beater are side benefits.
Havengul Lich
Comments: This card adds recursion to the deck.
Mindless Automaton
Comments: The added card draw and potential beater has been working well in the deck.
Deathbringer Thoctar
Comments: Deathbringer has been shining in my meta. Even when there isn't an army of 1/1's around, proliferating has kept this card relevant.
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled
Interacts with: Fertilid.
Comments: Absolutely disgusting in my meta. Aside from the strong combo with Fertilid, Ob Nixilis slows down land ramp and tutor/combo decks.
Clever Impersonator
Comments: A generically good card. I can copy the most useful permanent on the board at any given time.
Ajani, Mentor of Heroes
Comments: The first and second abilities are relevant. Ajani refills creatures that use +1/+1 counters and adds pseudo card draw to the deck.
Kiora, the Crashing Wave
Comments: All three abilities are relevant. The first ability is rather narrow, but has proved useful against target-able aggro generals and pingers.
Garruk Relentless
Comments: This deck supplies 1/1's to flip Garruk and then 1/1's to sacrifice for his tutor.
Ral Zarek
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn.
Comments: Useful when dealing with a single threat, primary use is the ultimate.
Xenagos, the Reveler
Comments: The potentially explosive mana is useful with Sliver Queen's ability or when casting Orochi Hatchery, Astral Cornucopia or Everflowing Chalice.
Liliana Vess
Comments: While the primary use of this card is tutoring, I occasionally get to use the ultimate to great benefit.
Artifacts:
Orochi Hatchery
Comments: The hatchery can be played at any point in the game and still be creating armies at mid and late game.
Contagion Clasp
Comments: Bad removal, but proliferate is the point.
Contagion Engine
Comments: It can quickly kill low defense armies. Proliferate is the point here as well.
Evolutoin Vat
Comments: Creates monsters out of nowhere (given enough mana).
Coalition Relic
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing and the counter can be temporarily increased.
Fellwar Stone
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing.
Astral Cornucopia
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing and the counter can be increased.
Chromatic Lantern
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing.
Everflowing Chalice
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Counters can be increased.
Sensei's Divining Top
Interacts with: Basalt Monolith, Rings of Brighthearth.
Comments: Increases the card quality of draws each turn. There is a lack of instant speed removal and counterspells in this deck, making the draw less useful.
Umezawa's Jitte
Comments: Usually used as removal, sometimes used as lifegain, and rarely used to pump a creature.
Forcefield
Comments: This card is great at slowing down General win conditions and buys enough time to get out from underneath a midrange aggro deck. Tokens run right over this card.
Staff of Domination
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn
Comments: I'm thinking about removing this card. It's an expensive version of Opposition and Glare of Subdual. I'm also not using this card to its fullest potential.
Instants/Sorceries:
Maelstrom Pulse
Comments: This is great removal for token armies as well as single threats.
Clockspinning
Comments: A very strong card that, at instant speed, pushes one of my planeswalkers to ultimate or killed opponent's planeswalkers.
Enlightened Tutor
Comments: A large portion of this deck is artifact/enchantment.
Demonic Tutor
Comments: Since I don't run a lot of removal, being able to reach into my deck to get one is helpful.
Guided Passage
Comments: This has been the best tool for editing my deck. My opponent chooses what they view as the three least useful cards in my deck and hands them to me.
Wheel of Fortune
Comments: The upside is that I get a new hand... the downside is that my opponents do as well. If played carefully, this can be a political tool. If not...it could lose you the game.
Merciless Eviction
Comments: That fabled removal I spoke of. With so much recursion running around, exile is so very strong.
Lands:
Mirrodin's Core
Comments: If I were to be honest, this card isn't very good. However, I couldn't resist playing at least one land that I could proliferate.
Mystifying Maze
Comments: Far slower than Maze of Ith, but it provides the threat I need for certain attackers while still tapping for mana.
Homeward Path
Comments: Has anyone ever had fun losing to their own creatures?
Gavony Township
Comments: This land refills utility creatures that use +1/+1 counters.
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
I have built a very similar deck to this one and I believe Sliver Queen is the best General for the job of protecting Planeswalkers. Mine is built towards board wiping till I can solidify a position and win with Planeswalkers, it only uses the absolutely necessary creatures like Witness, Djinn, or even Gilder Bairn. I would say that Chandra should stay but Lightning Reaver isn't necessary. Garruk, Primal Hunter is really good and if you can justify the triple green then worth it for sure. Propaganda, Collective Restraint, Ghostly Prison are a good defense for planeswalkers as no one wants to pay large amounts of mana to swing.
As far as counter spells go, I just stick to Hinder and Spell Crumple for the most necessary countering.
Do you find the counterspells necessary? I'm on the fence about them. Part of me wants to put 5 in the deck, but I'm not sure if I want to make room for them or not.
Lightning Reaver was fun, but I agree with you about taking it out. If Propaganda type cards work to protect planeswalkers, then those would be the natural replacement.
I don't seem to have much difficulty getting Sorin Markov into play with BBB. I think I can squeeze Garruk, Primal Hunter and its GGG
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Do you find the counterspells necessary? I'm on the fence about them. Part of me wants to put 5 in the deck, but I'm not sure if I want to make room for them or not.
Lightning Reaver was fun, but I agree with you about taking it out. If Propaganda type cards work to protect planeswalkers, then those would be the natural replacement.
I don't seem to have much difficulty getting Sorin Markov into play with BBB. I think I can squeeze Garruk, Primal Hunter and its GGG
I find only those two counters to be worth playing in this deck because they are the best counters in this format and just nice to have in case, but you don't need to waste too many slots with counters.
In all my years of playing EDH, I have never come across the ruling for planeswalkers and Propaganda effects before but you are right, they do not protect them like Norn's Annex would. So scratch those from the add list lol
Copy Enchantment would be a good add since enchantments are pretty common and it can copy them as well as your own enchantments like Doubling Season.
I would remove Legacy Weapon. I've made several 5c decks over the years, and 95% of the time, the Weapon goes unused. Either paying 7 and wasting a turn to cast or simply getting killed before I can use it lead me to take it out of any and all of my 5c decks. Very seldom is it good and (with a seedborn out) chances are it will die before you get to use it.
I would also add more artifact mana. I've played against quite a few 5c PW decks, and most of them run 15-20 walkers. Gilded Lotus, Mana Vault, etc.
I would remove Legacy Weapon. I've made several 5c decks over the years, and 95% of the time, the Weapon goes unused. Either paying 7 and wasting a turn to cast or simply getting killed before I can use it lead me to take it out of any and all of my 5c decks. Very seldom is it good and (with a seedborn out) chances are it will die before you get to use it.
I would also add more artifact mana. I've played against quite a few 5c PW decks, and most of them run 15-20 walkers. Gilded Lotus, Mana Vault, etc.
I can see your point about Legacy Weapon. The only times I use it are when I have the mana to play it and use it in the same turn. I never expect it to stay around long and I never search it up again. Perhaps a spell version along the lines of Vindicate would be an appropriate replacement.
I havnt noticed a problem with my mana or a need for more artifact mana, but my playgroup leaves this deck alone for the most part...not something I want to depend on. There are enough high cost spells in the deck to justify more mana excel. I'll give it a try and post how it turns out
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
The other downside to Legacy Weapon is choosing a target to spend 5 mana on. The few times I HAVE used it, I find it hard to justify spending the 5 mana to exile something when there are several threats on the board. Vindicate or Maelstrom Pulse do the job just fine...
I'm going to test out a little more defensive build.
Added:
+Luminarch Ascension
(testing its flying defense qualities)
+Gilder Bairn
(will probably only work once, but I want to test)
+Protean Hydra
(early,mid,late game viable with proliferate)
+Sentinel
(<3 blocker)
+Norn's Annex
(anti token nuts)
+Vein Drinker
(kill utility, proliferate to kill anything)
+Spiritmonger
(blocker, proliferate appropriate)
Removed:
-Azorius Guildmage
(less effective in meta)
-Lightning Reaver
(attracts too much hate to accomplish anything productive)
-Titan Forge
(too slow)
-Elspeth Tirel
(swapping out for something more in line with the deck)
-Jace Beleren
(did its job, swapping to test other cards...may put it back later)
-Lux Cannon
(too slow)
-Venser, the Sojourner
(no longer interacts with deck in current build)
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U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
on the topic of propaganda it doesn't feel like it does because the commander one doesn't say planeswalker either..
but on another note i think maybe etched monstrosity because he is a very powerful 5c card and bringer of the black dawn
also ghave, guru of spores does dumb things with proliferate
maybe run aura shards as well because of your leader skullclamp?? privileged position giving yourself some hexproof guys is crazy also if you have copy enchantment it makes everything you have hexproof
i would also add tons of search but thats me
anyways i hope this helps
EDIT: I posted a rules question asking about propaganda i'll get you your answer soon
on the topic of propaganda it doesn't feel like it does because the commander one doesn't say planeswalker either..
but on another note i think maybe etched monstrosity because he is a very powerful 5c card and bringer of the black dawn
also ghave, guru of spores does dumb things with proliferate
maybe run aura shards as well because of your leader skullclamp?? privileged position giving yourself some hexproof guys is crazy also if you have copy enchantment it makes everything you have hexproof
i would also add tons of search but thats me
anyways i hope this helps
I shy away from etched monstrosity in favor of etched oracle. Monstrosity doesnt benifit as much from proliferating 8-30 times a turn.
I kinda like bring of the black dawn. He's something to block with. Recurring tutors is fun...and his alternate cost isnt overly difficult to pay in this deck.
While Aura shards and skullclamp are solid cards, I typically play my general as a last resort. I know Plaguemaw Beast is subject to the same limitation, but there are only so many proliferate cards :P.
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
While Aura shards and skullclamp are solid cards, I typically play my general as a last resort. I know Plaguemaw Beast is subject to the same limitation, but there are only so many proliferate cards :P.
hehe well i play a meta where enchantments and artifacts are played all over the place so i look for everychance to blow them up in their face and well who doesnt love cards for 3 mana but those are my thoughts
I was thinking about Predatory Advantage. What do you think? My meta has moved away from heavy creature decks. My desire to improve my creature defense is for the few of us who still mass produce creatures.
avenger of zendikar (also proliferateable)
bringer of the green dawn
brood sliver (only if you wanna be aggressive with your tokens the queen makes)
flurry of wings (same as brood sliver)
grave titan
hornet queen
kazuul, tyrant of the cliffs
kher keep
emeria angel
I prefer the immediate defense these two provide. The rest work better only if I attack or are just slower than I would like.
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U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
predatory advantage is good when paired with multipliers or something to make those 2/2s really pop like beastmasters ascension. but once again a little bit more aggresive than yo saidyou play (idk i just find queen to be very aggressive)
predatory advantage is good when paired with multipliers or something to make those 2/2s really pop like beastmasters ascension. but once again a little bit more aggresive than yo saidyou play (idk i just find queen to be very aggressive)
Good news! Its time to shift the deck to be more aggressive! I've been eyeballing Predatory Advantage for a while now and I really like it. I just dont know how to fit it in.
I'm looking for 4 more creatures to put in the deck. I would like creatures that are good on their own and only get better with proliferation. I am open to non proliferate creatures, but would prefer something that benefits from the deck's subtheme.
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Change Log:
Removed:
Ajani Vengeant (with no intention of ulting, something else would be better)
Garruk Wildspeaker (no need for further mana excel/fixing, the overrun will be a loss with all the new creatures)
Sorin Markov (underpowered and unliked, exploring other routes)
Tezzeret the Seeker (underpowered in current build)
Black Sun's Zenith (Shouldn't remove ^^)
Norn's Annex
Voltaic Key
Saproling Burst
Luminarch Ascension (powerful, exploring other routes)
Sentinel
Protean Hydra
Plaguemaw Beast
Myojin of Night's Reach (powerful, exploring other routes)
Added:
Garruk, Primal Hunter
Venser, the Sojourner
Cytoplast Manipulator
Bringer of the Black Dawn
Dragon Broodmother
Grave Titan
Avenger of Zendikar
Pentavus
Myojin of Life's Web (for a specific reason that I wont tell you until later /evilgrin)
Evil Twin
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
*Updated deck list and added zelda themes. Soon to add card interactions.
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U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Offhand, I feel like the gods are a little weak in your current build. You likely want to either be running a token plan where Purpheros is good or just bail on it which currently I think just leaving him out is easier. I have also never been very fond of Thassa, God of the Sea as a singleton outside of like a mono blue deck or in voltron builds where the evasion is more important.
I think proliferate is in general too weak to be worth including in the list. Inexorable Tide is probably my favorite of the ones in your list but the others make me really question how valuable they would be.
Havengul Lich has always reminded me of a really bad Geth, Lord of the Vault because of the timing restrictions of your own turn only. It can get your own creatures back but I honestly have never been very impressed by it.
Glare of Subdual / Opposition it doesnt actually feel like your are token enough in build design for these to be great. I love these cards but generally when I am playing a heavier token plan.
Bow of Nylea outside of getting mass trample + this or running heavy tokens I dont feel like it pays off enough.
Lots of the walkers feel a bit so so here to me.
Clockspinning even with buyback I dont really see myself wanting to pay 4 mana for a single counter plus it has the downside of fizzling if anyone has instant speed responses.
Overall though... there are tons of interesting cards in here. I put together an Anafenza, the Foremostlist that is counter based this morning and this should give me some good ideas on cards I missed in my first pass. You might take a look at my list as well as it might give you some ideas as well.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Let me start by saying thank you again for reviewing my list. I really appreciate the advice.
Offhand, I feel like the gods are a little weak in your current build. You likely want to either be running a token plan where Purpheros is good or just bail on it which currently I think just leaving him out is easier. I have also never been very fond of Thassa, God of the Sea as a singleton outside of like a mono blue deck or in voltron builds where the evasion is more important.
I agree and have been considering taking them out for a while now. Purpheros, God of the Forge worked better in previous versions of the build that had more tokens, but the current build is going in a different direction. I was convinced that Thassa, God of the Sea would be great as a singleton and while she has been somewhat useful... I don't use her to the fullest. Nylea, God of the Hunt ... I never liked her but for the sake of the other two I wanted to give her a shot. As you might guess, she never carried her weight. I have two cards picked out to replace Thassa, God of the Sea and Nylea, God of the Hunt. What do you think of Mycoloth (I saw it on your list and have always been a fan of the card)? I had it in previous builds but removed it because I didn't have enough tokens to devour. Does my current build provide enough 'add a +1/+1 counter' that I can still cast Mycoloth when I don't have anything to devour? I would remove Thassa, God of the Sea and put Glen Elendra Archmage in her place. Doubling Season is the only card that non-bos with her, but I think it's worth the risk.
I think proliferate is in general too weak to be worth including in the list. Inexorable Tide is probably my favorite of the ones in your list but the others make me really question how valuable they would be.
I agree that proliferate is and has been weak for a long time. That being said, this list has been an experiment with proliferation for so long that I feel I would be lost without it haha. I enjoy using a mechanic that not many others use. The mechanic is unassuming and often flies under the radar. There are certain people who know where these cards lead (given enough time) and destroy them, but the amount of things with counters in this deck still makes me believe proliferate is worth holding onto.
Havengul Lich has always reminded me of a really bad Geth, Lord of the Vault because of the timing restrictions of your own turn only. It can get your own creatures back but I honestly have never been very impressed by it.
Good point. I run Havengul Lich because it can target by own graveyard as well as others. I've noticed in recent games that I have no interest in other player's creatures/graveyards as they don't normally provide any benefit to my game plan (at least in my playgroup). Perhaps replacing Havengul Lich with Phyrexian Reclamation?
I suspect you are right, but I would like to test anyway. I'm interested to see how the 'add a +1/+1 counter' effect (outside of combat) will play out.
Glare of Subdual / Opposition it doesn't actually feel like your are token enough in build design for these to be great. I love these cards but generally when I am playing a heavier token plan.
Three creatures seems to be the magic number for these cards in this build. Since I play this deck defensively, being able to tap down a few creatures here or there is all I need (but not great). What I'm really after is Gilder Bairn with these two. I would like to find a way to make these cards great in the deck. Increasing the token makers seems to be the only way.
Bow of Nylea outside of getting mass trample + this or running heavy tokens I dont feel like it pays off enough.
Nylea, God of the Hunt is the mass trample card here(planning to remove >.>). That aside, the Bow still adds a counter (I'm experimenting to see the value of adding 1 counter at a time) as well as providing a little protection against mill which is becoming a threat in the local meta.
Lots of the walkers feel a bit so so here to me.
Yep haha. I'm constantly re-evaluating the planeswalkers and how they interact with the rest of the deck. I've got my eye on a few that need replacing but havn't found the right replacement yet. Unfortunately I trapped myself into using exactly 7 for theme purposes. I imagine I will always be looking for the better choice when it comes to these 7 cards.
Clockspinning even with buyback I dont really see myself wanting to pay 4 mana for a single counter plus it has the downside of fizzling if anyone has instant speed responses.
At face value I agree. This card is just a toy
Overall though... there are tons of interesting cards in here. I put together an Anafenza, the Foremost list that is counter based this morning and this should give me some good ideas on cards I missed in my first pass. You might take a look at my list as well as it might give you some ideas as well.
I looked at it and I liked what I saw :D. I snagged a couple cards from your list and am mulling them over for this list :P. I had forgotten about Cauldron of souls which made me think ofCauldron Haze. They're both bad when Doubling Season is in play but when that's not around they seem very strong. I would like to add one or both.
U Thassa, God of the Sea (Seafood) G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion BU Phenax, God of Deception WGR Hazezon Tamar WUBRGSliver Queen - Zelda Theme
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I am testing the following new cards from Khans of Tarkir: Hardened Scales, High Sentinels of Arashin, Retribution of the Ancients, and Clever Impersonator.
I am eager to see these cards in action and would love to know what you all think of these additions to my deck.
Current Deck List
1 Sliver Queen
Creatures
1 Taurean Mauler
1 Ghave, Guru of Spores
1 Fertilid
1 Seedborn Muse
1 Spike Weaver
1 Viral Drake
1 Forgotten Ancient
1 Purphorous, God of the Forge
1 Nylea, God of the Hunt
1 Thassa, God of the Sea
1 Kalonian Hydra
1 Corpsejack Menace
1 Gilder Bairn
1 Solemn Simulacrum
1 Vorel of the Hull Clade
1 Master Biomancer
1 High Sentinels of Arashin
1 Scavenging Ooze
1 Havengul Lich
1 Mindless Automaton
1 Deathbringer Thoctar
1 Ob Nixilis, Unshackled
1 Clever Impersonator
Enchantments
1 Price of Glory
1 Glare of Subdual
1 Opposition
1 Rhystic Study
1 Assemble the Legion
1 Doubling Season
1 Inexorable Tide
1 Bow of Nylea
1 Cathars' Crusade
1 Hardened Scales
1 Retribution of the Ancients
1 Ajani, Mentor of Heroes
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion
1 Kiora, the Crashing Wave
1 Garruk Relentless
1 Ral Zarek
1 Xenagos, the Reveler
1 Liliana Vess
Artifacts
1 Orochi Hatchery
1 Contagion Clasp
1 Contagion Engine
1 Evolution Vat
1 Coalition Relic
1 Fellwar Stone
1 Astral Cornucopia
1 Chromatic Lantern
1 Basalt Monolith
1 Everflowing Chalice
1 Sensei's Divining Top
1 Rings of Brighthearth
1 Umezawa's Jitte
1 Forcefield
Instants
1 Maelstrom Pulse
1 Clockspinning
1 Enlightened Tutor
Sorceries
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Guided Passage
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Merciless Eviction
Land
3 Plains
2 Island
2 Swamp
3 Forest
2 Mountain
1 Mirrodin's Core
1 Mystifying Maze
1 Homeward Path
1 Command Tower
1 Reflecting Pool
1 Breeding Pool
1 Hallowed Fountain
1 Watery Grave
1 Blood Crypt
1 Overgrown Tomb
1 Badlands
1 Bayou
1 Plateau
1 Savannah
1 Scrubland
1 Taiga
1 Tropical Island
1 Tundra
1 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Gavony Township
1 Exotic Orchard
1 Sacred Foundry
1 Forbidden Orchard
1 Volrath's Stronghold
Zelda Decklist
General
1 Sliver Queen Angry Cucco
Main Cast
1 Forgotten Ancient Link, Champion of Hyrule
1 Elspeth, Sun's Champion Zelda, Sage of Time
1 Deathbringer Thoctar Ganon, King of Evil
Triforce
1 Sensei's Divining Top Triforce of Wisdom
1 Basalt Monolith Triforce of Power
1 Rings of Brighthearth Triforce of Courage
Supporting Characters
1 Purphorous, God of the Forge Din, Goddess of Power
1 Nylea, God of the Hunt Farore, Goddess of Courage
1 Thassa, God of the Sea Nayru, Goddess of Wisdom
1 Fertilid Kokiri Children
1 Seedborn Muse Great Deku Tree
1 Spike Weaver Tingle
1 Viral Drake Kaepora Gaebora
1 Gilder Bairn Syrup, the Great Witch
1 Vorel of the Hull Clade King Zora
1 Master Biomancer Lord Jabu-Jabu
1 High Sentinels of Arashin Great Fairy
1 Scavenging Ooze Poe Collector
1 Havengul Lich Dampe, the Gravedigger
1 Mindless Automaton Hero's Shade
1 Assemble the Legion Hyrule Soldiers
1 Enlightened Tutor Old Man
1 Guided Passage Royal Summons (Hyrule King)
1 Rhystic Study Navi
Sages
1 Ral Zarek Nabooru, Sage of Spirit
1 Liliana Vess Impa, Sage of Shadow
1 Xenagos, the Reveler Darunia, Sage of Fire
1 Ajani, Mentor of Heroes Rauru, Sage of Light
1 Kiora, the Crashing Wave Ruto, Sage of Water
1 Garruk Relentless Saria, Sage of Forest
Enemies
1 Taurean Mauler Dark Link
1 Ghave, Guru of Spores Queen Gohma
1 Retribution of the Ancients Like-Like
1 Kalonian Hydra Gleeok
1 Corpsejack Menace Dead Hand
1 Solemn Simulacrum Phantom Armor
1 Ob Nixilis, Unshackled Onox (in dragon form)
1 Orochi Hatchery Lever Trap
Items
1 Umezawa's Jitte Master Sword
1 Bow of Nylea Hyllian Bow
1 Doubling Season Kokiri Emereald
1 Clever Impersonator Zora Sapphire
1 Price of Glory Goron Ruby
1 Clockspinning Ocarina of Time
1 Contagion Clasp Magic Powder
1 Evolutoin Vat Power Bracelet
1 Cathars' Crusade Heart Container
1 Opposition - Hookshot
1 Glare of Subdual - Wooden Boomerang
1 Forcefield Hylian Shield
1 Merciless Eviction Mirror of Twilight
1 Maelstrom Pulse Bombs
1 Hardened Scales Blue Ring
1 Demonic Tutor Compass
1 Everflowing Chalice Purple Rupee
1 Coalition Relic Red Rupee
1 Fellwar Stone Green Rupee
1 Astral Cornucopia Gold Rupee
1 Chromatic Lantern Blue Rupee
Locations
1 Contagion Engine Clock Tower
1 Inexorable Tide Library
1 Wheel of Fortune Temple of Time
1 Mirrodin's Core Termina
1 Mystifying Maze Lost Woods
1 Homeward Path Hyrule Castle
1 Command Tower Labrynna
1 Reflecting Pool Holodrum
1 Breeding Pool Water Temple
1 Hallowed Fountain Light Temple
1 Watery Grave Shadow Temple
1 Blood Crypt Fire Temple
1 Overgrown Tomb Forest Temple
1 Badlands Death Mountain
1 Bayou Skull Woods
1 Plateau Gerudo Valley
1 Savannah Kakariko Village
1 Scrubland Arbiter's Grounds
1 Taiga Goron Mountain
1 Tropical Island Fishing Hole
1 Tundra Skyloft
1 Underground Sea Oceanside Spiderhouse
1 Volcanic Island Fire Mountain
1 Gavony Township Castle Town
1 Exotic Orchard Lorule
1 Sacred Foundry Spirit Temple
1 Forbidden Orchard The Graveyard
1 Volrath's Stronghold Room of Rites
3 Plains
2 Island
2 Swamp
3 Forest
2 Mountain
Card Interactions and Choices
Creatures:
Sliver Queen
Interacts with: Doubling Season, Thassa, God of the Sea, Archangel of Thune, Gavony Township, Purphoros, God of the Forge, Glare of Subdual, Seedborn Muse, Xenagos, the Reveler, Opposition, Master Biomancer.
Comments: I originally chose Sliver Queen as the general in order to make chump blockers for the planeswalkers in the deck. As the deck has evolved and fewer planeswalkers remain, her synergies have only grown.
Taurean Mauler
Interacts with: Thassa, God of the Sea, Nylea, God of the Hunt.
Comments: Most games Taurean Mauler is a distraction for opponents. If ignored he can occasionally kill someone when evasion/trample is added.
Ghave, Guru of Spores
Interacts with: Fertilid, Spike Weaver, Corpsejack Menace, Doubling Season, Rings of Brighthearth, Purphorous, God of the Forge, Glare of Subdual, Opposition.
Comments: Ghave can refill Fertilid or Spike Weaver as well as create creatures for Opposition/Glare of Subdual.
Fertilid
Interacts with: Volrath's Stronghold, Havengul Lich, Rings of Brighthearth, Ob Nixilis, Unshackled.
Comments: A fantastic on-theme way to color fix.
Seedborn Muse
Interacts with: Staff of Domination, Orochi Hatchery, Gavony Township, Clockspinning, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Evolution Vat, Coalition Relic, Bow of Nylea, Contagion Engine, Contagion Clasp, Viral Drake, Opposition, Glare of Subdual.
Comments: Adds repeatable use out of each of the above cards.
Spike Weaver
Comments: Easily refillable fog on a stick.
Viral Drake
Comments: Most commonly used to put planeswalkers in ultimate range. Repeatable proliferation is very useful in this deck. Infect is an option that is seldom used.
Forgotten Ancient
Interacts with: Thassa, God of the Sea.
Comments: As well as being a beater, this card refills many utility creatures in this deck.
Purphorous, God of the Forge
Interacts with: Sliver Queen, Ghave, Guru of Spores, Assemble the Legion, Elspeth, Sun’s Champion, Orochi Hatchery.
Comments: Too dumb not to play.
Nylea, God of the Hunt
Comments: This deck ‘can’ create very large creatures. This isn't the strongest card, but trample has ended games.
Thassa, God of the Sea
Comments: Great utility. It creates better top-deck potential and evasion for mid/late game beaters.
Kalonian Hydra
Interacts with: Thassa, God of the Sea, Nylea, God of The Hunt.
Comments: Refills and turns utility creatures into beaters.
Corpsejack Menace
Comments: This card accelerates most creatures in this deck into beater status.
Gilder Bairn
Interacts with: Staff of Domination, Glare of Subdual, Opposition, Evolution Vat, Ral Zarek.
Comments: Using any of the above cards to get multiple uses out of Gilder Bairn gets ridiculous when targeting planeswalkers or any other permanent with a counter on it.
Solemn Simulacrum
Comments: This card is and effective color fix in a five color deck.
Vorel of the Hull Clade
Comments: It is disappointing that this card does not work on planeswalkers. That being said, it is a reliable way to increase counters on any number of cards.
Master Biomancer
Interacts with: Elspeth, Sun's Champion, Assemble the Legion, Orochi Hatchery, Sliver Queen.
Comments: A relatively weak card in this deck so far. Its strong synergy with Sliver Queen is the only reason it has stayed.
High Sentinels of Arashin
Interacts with: Ghave, Guru of Spores, Spike Weaver, Fertilid.
Comments: This card is good at refilling counters on utility creatures.
Scavenging Ooze
Comments: This card's primary purpose is graveyard hate. Minor life gain and a beater are side benefits.
Havengul Lich
Comments: This card adds recursion to the deck.
Mindless Automaton
Comments: The added card draw and potential beater has been working well in the deck.
Deathbringer Thoctar
Comments: Deathbringer has been shining in my meta. Even when there isn't an army of 1/1's around, proliferating has kept this card relevant.
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled
Interacts with: Fertilid.
Comments: Absolutely disgusting in my meta. Aside from the strong combo with Fertilid, Ob Nixilis slows down land ramp and tutor/combo decks.
Clever Impersonator
Comments: A generically good card. I can copy the most useful permanent on the board at any given time.
Price of Glory
Comments: This is a meta call. For everyone who is tired of Seedborn Muse/Leyline of Anticipation, Prophet of Kruphix, Counterspell control decks... This is an option. Yes this card hurts me, but it should only be played when it hurts someone else more.
Glare of Subdual
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn.
Comments: Slows down aggro decks and combos with Gilder Bairn.
Opposition
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn.
Comments: Slows down aggro decks and combos with Gilder Bairn.
Rhystic Study
Comments: Card draw is good right?
Copy Enchantment
Interacts with: Assemble the Legion, Cathars' Crusade, Rhystic Study, Doubling Season, Inexorable Tide, Opponent's Enchantments.
Comments: Since there are only 5 solid choices to copy in my own deck, my hope is to copy my opponent's enchantments.
Assemble the Legion
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Viral Drake, Doubling Season, Contagion Engine, Contagion Clasp, Clockspinning, Inexorable Tide.
Comments: One card army, add time for best results.
Doubling Season
Interacts with: Any card with counters. Notably Planeswalkers.
Comments: Kicks the deck into double time.
Inexorable Tide
Interacts with: Clockspinning.
Comments: Solid way to add counters to permanents.
Bow of Nylea
Comments: I am a big fan of this card's final mode: put 4 cards from your graveyard back into your deck.
Hardened Scales
Interacts with: Deathbringer Thoctar.
Comments: There are many ways to add +1/+1 counters to creatures in this deck.
Retribution of the Ancients
Interacts with: Forgotten Ancient.
Comments: Strong removal card in this deck.
Cathars' Crusade
Interacts with: Sliver Queen, Orochi Hatchery, Assemble the Legion.
Comments: This is a new card to the deck, but I imagine it will work very well with the general.
Ajani, Mentor of Heroes
Comments: The first and second abilities are relevant. Ajani refills creatures that use +1/+1 counters and adds pseudo card draw to the deck.
Elspeth, Sun's Champion
Interacts with: Purphorous, God of the Forge, Master Biomancer, Opposition, Glare of Subdual, Cathars' Crusade, Xenagos, the Reveler, any card that adds counters.
Comments: All three abilities are relevant, Adding creatures for damage with Purphorous, attackers with Master Biomancer and Cathars' Crusade, Defense with Opposition and Glare of Subdual and mana with Xenagos, the Reveler. I run so few mass removal spells that Elspeth's partial wrath is sorely needed.
Kiora, the Crashing Wave
Comments: All three abilities are relevant. The first ability is rather narrow, but has proved useful against target-able aggro generals and pingers.
Garruk Relentless
Comments: This deck supplies 1/1's to flip Garruk and then 1/1's to sacrifice for his tutor.
Ral Zarek
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn.
Comments: Useful when dealing with a single threat, primary use is the ultimate.
Xenagos, the Reveler
Comments: The potentially explosive mana is useful with Sliver Queen's ability or when casting Orochi Hatchery, Astral Cornucopia or Everflowing Chalice.
Liliana Vess
Comments: While the primary use of this card is tutoring, I occasionally get to use the ultimate to great benefit.
Orochi Hatchery
Comments: The hatchery can be played at any point in the game and still be creating armies at mid and late game.
Contagion Clasp
Comments: Bad removal, but proliferate is the point.
Contagion Engine
Comments: It can quickly kill low defense armies. Proliferate is the point here as well.
Evolutoin Vat
Comments: Creates monsters out of nowhere (given enough mana).
Coalition Relic
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing and the counter can be temporarily increased.
Fellwar Stone
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing.
Astral Cornucopia
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing and the counter can be increased.
Chromatic Lantern
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Good at color fixing.
Everflowing Chalice
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Counters can be increased.
Basalt Monolith
Interacts with: Sensei's Divining Top, Rings of Brighthearth.
Comments: One of eight mana excel cards in this deck. Not great, but a combo piece.
Sensei's Divining Top
Interacts with: Basalt Monolith, Rings of Brighthearth.
Comments: Increases the card quality of draws each turn. There is a lack of instant speed removal and counterspells in this deck, making the draw less useful.
Rings of Brighthearth
Interacts with: Sensei's Divining Top, Basalt Monolith, Ghave, Guru of Spores, Fertilid, Viral Drake, Gilder Bairn, Vorel of the Hull Clade, Mindless Automaton, Deathbringer Thoctar, Bow of Nylea, All Planeswalkers, Orochi Hatchery, Contagion Engine, Contagion Clasp, Staff of Domination, Gavony Township.
Comments: So many cards in this deck benefit from Rings of Brighthearth.
Umezawa's Jitte
Comments: Usually used as removal, sometimes used as lifegain, and rarely used to pump a creature.
Forcefield
Comments: This card is great at slowing down General win conditions and buys enough time to get out from underneath a midrange aggro deck. Tokens run right over this card.
Staff of Domination
Interacts with: Gilder Bairn
Comments: I'm thinking about removing this card. It's an expensive version of Opposition and Glare of Subdual. I'm also not using this card to its fullest potential.
Maelstrom Pulse
Comments: This is great removal for token armies as well as single threats.
Clockspinning
Comments: A very strong card that, at instant speed, pushes one of my planeswalkers to ultimate or killed opponent's planeswalkers.
Enlightened Tutor
Comments: A large portion of this deck is artifact/enchantment.
Demonic Tutor
Comments: Since I don't run a lot of removal, being able to reach into my deck to get one is helpful.
Guided Passage
Comments: This has been the best tool for editing my deck. My opponent chooses what they view as the three least useful cards in my deck and hands them to me.
Wheel of Fortune
Comments: The upside is that I get a new hand... the downside is that my opponents do as well. If played carefully, this can be a political tool. If not...it could lose you the game.
Merciless Eviction
Comments: That fabled removal I spoke of. With so much recursion running around, exile is so very strong.
Mirrodin's Core
Comments: If I were to be honest, this card isn't very good. However, I couldn't resist playing at least one land that I could proliferate.
Mystifying Maze
Comments: Far slower than Maze of Ith, but it provides the threat I need for certain attackers while still tapping for mana.
Homeward Path
Comments: Has anyone ever had fun losing to their own creatures?
Gavony Township
Comments: This land refills utility creatures that use +1/+1 counters.
Volrath's Stronghold
Comments: Adds recursion to the deck.
Forbidden Orchard
Comments: A political and meta call. This is not for every playgroup.
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
As far as counter spells go, I just stick to Hinder and Spell Crumple for the most necessary countering.
WUBRGMy 12 Player EDH CubeWUBRG - Still working on expansion
Does Propaganda, Collective Restraint, Ghostly Prison extend to protect planeswalkers? I only ask because Norn's Annex specifically states it.
Lightning Reaver was fun, but I agree with you about taking it out. If Propaganda type cards work to protect planeswalkers, then those would be the natural replacement.
I don't seem to have much difficulty getting Sorin Markov into play with BBB. I think I can squeeze Garruk, Primal Hunter and its GGG
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
I find only those two counters to be worth playing in this deck because they are the best counters in this format and just nice to have in case, but you don't need to waste too many slots with counters.
In all my years of playing EDH, I have never come across the ruling for planeswalkers and Propaganda effects before but you are right, they do not protect them like Norn's Annex would. So scratch those from the add list lol
Copy Enchantment would be a good add since enchantments are pretty common and it can copy them as well as your own enchantments like Doubling Season.
WUBRGMy 12 Player EDH CubeWUBRG - Still working on expansion
I would also add more artifact mana. I've played against quite a few 5c PW decks, and most of them run 15-20 walkers. Gilded Lotus, Mana Vault, etc.
I can see your point about Legacy Weapon. The only times I use it are when I have the mana to play it and use it in the same turn. I never expect it to stay around long and I never search it up again. Perhaps a spell version along the lines of Vindicate would be an appropriate replacement.
I havnt noticed a problem with my mana or a need for more artifact mana, but my playgroup leaves this deck alone for the most part...not something I want to depend on. There are enough high cost spells in the deck to justify more mana excel. I'll give it a try and post how it turns out
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Added:
+Luminarch Ascension
(testing its flying defense qualities)
+Gilder Bairn
(will probably only work once, but I want to test)
+Protean Hydra
(early,mid,late game viable with proliferate)
+Sentinel
(<3 blocker)
+Norn's Annex
(anti token nuts)
+Vein Drinker
(kill utility, proliferate to kill anything)
+Spiritmonger
(blocker, proliferate appropriate)
Removed:
-Azorius Guildmage
(less effective in meta)
-Lightning Reaver
(attracts too much hate to accomplish anything productive)
-Titan Forge
(too slow)
-Elspeth Tirel
(swapping out for something more in line with the deck)
-Jace Beleren
(did its job, swapping to test other cards...may put it back later)
-Lux Cannon
(too slow)
-Venser, the Sojourner
(no longer interacts with deck in current build)
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
but on another note i think maybe etched monstrosity because he is a very powerful 5c card and bringer of the black dawn
also ghave, guru of spores does dumb things with proliferate
maybe run aura shards as well because of your leader
skullclamp??
privileged position giving yourself some hexproof guys is crazy also if you have copy enchantment it makes everything you have hexproof
i would also add tons of search but thats me
anyways i hope this helps
EDIT: I posted a rules question asking about propaganda i'll get you your answer soon
EDIT to the EDIT: http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=357194 for the forum and the answer is your PW's are not safe behind ghostly prison, propaganda, etc...
Banner By Rivenor at Miraculous Recovery Signatures
BUR"> 3rd Turn Thraxi! RUB
BR Kaervek's Suicide RB
UW "> Grand Arbiter Lockdown WU
RG Wort, The Token Mother GR
RUG Riku of Twins GUR
BUGDamia DredgeGUB
BW Life is My Resource WB
GUW Build your Own WUG
BWR Angel, Demons, & Dragons! OH MY RWB
BURWG Scion Unfinished Help GWRUB
I shy away from etched monstrosity in favor of etched oracle. Monstrosity doesnt benifit as much from proliferating 8-30 times a turn.
I kinda like bring of the black dawn. He's something to block with. Recurring tutors is fun...and his alternate cost isnt overly difficult to pay in this deck.
ghave, guru of spores makes me grin.
While Aura shards and skullclamp are solid cards, I typically play my general as a last resort. I know Plaguemaw Beast is subject to the same limitation, but there are only so many proliferate cards :P.
Priviledged Position and Copy Enchantment definitly have a home in this deck thank you
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
hehe well i play a meta where enchantments and artifacts are played all over the place so i look for everychance to blow them up in their face and well who doesnt love cards for 3 mana but those are my thoughts
Banner By Rivenor at Miraculous Recovery Signatures
BUR"> 3rd Turn Thraxi! RUB
BR Kaervek's Suicide RB
UW "> Grand Arbiter Lockdown WU
RG Wort, The Token Mother GR
RUG Riku of Twins GUR
BUGDamia DredgeGUB
BW Life is My Resource WB
GUW Build your Own WUG
BWR Angel, Demons, & Dragons! OH MY RWB
BURWG Scion Unfinished Help GWRUB
avenger of zendikar (also proliferateable)
bringer of the green dawn
brood sliver (only if you wanna be aggressive with your tokens the queen makes)
flurry of wings (same as brood sliver)
grave titan
hornet queen
kazuul, tyrant of the cliffs
kher keep
emeria angel
thats all i can think of atm
Banner By Rivenor at Miraculous Recovery Signatures
BUR"> 3rd Turn Thraxi! RUB
BR Kaervek's Suicide RB
UW "> Grand Arbiter Lockdown WU
RG Wort, The Token Mother GR
RUG Riku of Twins GUR
BUGDamia DredgeGUB
BW Life is My Resource WB
GUW Build your Own WUG
BWR Angel, Demons, & Dragons! OH MY RWB
BURWG Scion Unfinished Help GWRUB
I like kazuul, tyrant of the cliffs
and avenger of zendikar
I prefer the immediate defense these two provide. The rest work better only if I attack or are just slower than I would like.
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Banner By Rivenor at Miraculous Recovery Signatures
BUR"> 3rd Turn Thraxi! RUB
BR Kaervek's Suicide RB
UW "> Grand Arbiter Lockdown WU
RG Wort, The Token Mother GR
RUG Riku of Twins GUR
BUGDamia DredgeGUB
BW Life is My Resource WB
GUW Build your Own WUG
BWR Angel, Demons, & Dragons! OH MY RWB
BURWG Scion Unfinished Help GWRUB
Good news! Its time to shift the deck to be more aggressive! I've been eyeballing Predatory Advantage for a while now and I really like it. I just dont know how to fit it in.
I'm looking for 4 more creatures to put in the deck. I would like creatures that are good on their own and only get better with proliferation. I am open to non proliferate creatures, but would prefer something that benefits from the deck's subtheme.
Maybe:
Lightning Reaver
Ashling the Pilgrim
Molten Hydra.
Balefire Dragon
Ludevic's Test Subject
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Change Log:
Removed:
Ajani Vengeant (with no intention of ulting, something else would be better)
Garruk Wildspeaker (no need for further mana excel/fixing, the overrun will be a loss with all the new creatures)
Sorin Markov (underpowered and unliked, exploring other routes)
Tezzeret the Seeker (underpowered in current build)
Black Sun's Zenith (Shouldn't remove ^^)
Norn's Annex
Voltaic Key
Saproling Burst
Luminarch Ascension (powerful, exploring other routes)
Sentinel
Protean Hydra
Plaguemaw Beast
Myojin of Night's Reach (powerful, exploring other routes)
Added:
Garruk, Primal Hunter
Venser, the Sojourner
Cytoplast Manipulator
Bringer of the Black Dawn
Dragon Broodmother
Grave Titan
Avenger of Zendikar
Pentavus
Myojin of Life's Web (for a specific reason that I wont tell you until later /evilgrin)
Evil Twin
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Copy Enchantment
Cathars' Crusade
Mindless Automaton
Deathbringer Thoctar
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled
Removed:
Wall of Denial
Erebos, God of the Dead
Lightning Reaver
Karmic Justice
Dictate of Kruphix
Ob Nixilis, Unshackled has been absolutely ridiculous. Fertilid now has late game value. I haven't had the opportunity to try Mindless Automaton and Deathbringer Thoctar yet, but I have high hopes for both.
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
Clever Impersonator
Retribution of the Ancients
Hardened Scales
High Sentinels of Arashin
Removed:
Staff of Domination: I wasn't using this card to its full potential and what I was using it for is accomplished more effectively through Opposition and Glare of Subdual.
Copy Enchantment: Upgraded to Clever Impersonator.
Archangel of Thune: A strong card, but relying on combat to add +1/+1 counters to creatures is something I would like to get away from.
Bane of the Living: This card has become too slow for the local meta.
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme
I think proliferate is in general too weak to be worth including in the list. Inexorable Tide is probably my favorite of the ones in your list but the others make me really question how valuable they would be.
Havengul Lich has always reminded me of a really bad Geth, Lord of the Vault because of the timing restrictions of your own turn only. It can get your own creatures back but I honestly have never been very impressed by it.
High Sentinels of Arashin I suspect its not strong enough.
Glare of Subdual / Opposition it doesnt actually feel like your are token enough in build design for these to be great. I love these cards but generally when I am playing a heavier token plan.
Bow of Nylea outside of getting mass trample + this or running heavy tokens I dont feel like it pays off enough.
Lots of the walkers feel a bit so so here to me.
Clockspinning even with buyback I dont really see myself wanting to pay 4 mana for a single counter plus it has the downside of fizzling if anyone has instant speed responses.
Overall though... there are tons of interesting cards in here. I put together an Anafenza, the Foremost list that is counter based this morning and this should give me some good ideas on cards I missed in my first pass. You might take a look at my list as well as it might give you some ideas as well.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
I agree and have been considering taking them out for a while now. Purpheros, God of the Forge worked better in previous versions of the build that had more tokens, but the current build is going in a different direction. I was convinced that Thassa, God of the Sea would be great as a singleton and while she has been somewhat useful... I don't use her to the fullest. Nylea, God of the Hunt ... I never liked her but for the sake of the other two I wanted to give her a shot. As you might guess, she never carried her weight. I have two cards picked out to replace Thassa, God of the Sea and Nylea, God of the Hunt. What do you think of Mycoloth (I saw it on your list and have always been a fan of the card)? I had it in previous builds but removed it because I didn't have enough tokens to devour. Does my current build provide enough 'add a +1/+1 counter' that I can still cast Mycoloth when I don't have anything to devour? I would remove Thassa, God of the Sea and put Glen Elendra Archmage in her place. Doubling Season is the only card that non-bos with her, but I think it's worth the risk.
I agree that proliferate is and has been weak for a long time. That being said, this list has been an experiment with proliferation for so long that I feel I would be lost without it haha. I enjoy using a mechanic that not many others use. The mechanic is unassuming and often flies under the radar. There are certain people who know where these cards lead (given enough time) and destroy them, but the amount of things with counters in this deck still makes me believe proliferate is worth holding onto.
Good point. I run Havengul Lich because it can target by own graveyard as well as others. I've noticed in recent games that I have no interest in other player's creatures/graveyards as they don't normally provide any benefit to my game plan (at least in my playgroup). Perhaps replacing Havengul Lich with Phyrexian Reclamation?
I suspect you are right, but I would like to test anyway. I'm interested to see how the 'add a +1/+1 counter' effect (outside of combat) will play out.
Three creatures seems to be the magic number for these cards in this build. Since I play this deck defensively, being able to tap down a few creatures here or there is all I need (but not great). What I'm really after is Gilder Bairn with these two. I would like to find a way to make these cards great in the deck. Increasing the token makers seems to be the only way.
Nylea, God of the Hunt is the mass trample card here(planning to remove >.>). That aside, the Bow still adds a counter (I'm experimenting to see the value of adding 1 counter at a time) as well as providing a little protection against mill which is becoming a threat in the local meta.
Yep haha. I'm constantly re-evaluating the planeswalkers and how they interact with the rest of the deck. I've got my eye on a few that need replacing but havn't found the right replacement yet. Unfortunately I trapped myself into using exactly 7 for theme purposes. I imagine I will always be looking for the better choice when it comes to these 7 cards.
At face value I agree. This card is just a toy
I looked at it and I liked what I saw :D. I snagged a couple cards from your list and am mulling them over for this list :P. I had forgotten about Cauldron of souls which made me think ofCauldron Haze. They're both bad when Doubling Season is in play but when that's not around they seem very strong. I would like to add one or both.
G Yisan, the Wanderer Bard
BW Teysa, Orzhov Scion
BU Phenax, God of Deception
WGR Hazezon Tamar
WUBRG Sliver Queen - Zelda Theme