Its place is on any creature for G, making it 2 power greater and giving it trample.
It's pressure.
It makes threats more threatening.
It makes Thragtusk more threatening.
It makes Boros Reckoner more threatening.
It makes anything more threatening.
In my mono green, I usually drop it as often as I can since I run plenty of undying creatures and fatties. The card is nuts, and just running it as a one-of makes it just as useful as running four in a deck since it will return to your hand after whatever is enchanted is removed.
Ghor-Clan Rampager is a different kind of pump. It's a one time trick that's played to reach into game or to bring down bigger creatures while making your aggressor creatures more survivable. It's a great card, but the consistency of Rancor vs the Rampager is a local meta call.
doesn't actually get worse by reckoners if a player knows how to assign trample damage.
though blocking does get worse.
What I meant via "worsened by Reckoner" was the side effect of the increase in popularity of spot removal, such as Abrupt Decay, Victim of Night and Dreadbore due to Reckoners, and 2 of the above-mentioned will make attempts to stick Rancor much harder and possibly 2 for 1 CA you in response to attaching.
At least this was what I observed everytime I had a Rancor in hand, I wished it was something else, just because the opponent has removal mana open.
Thus the question, do I only stick it on regeneration dudes with regeneration mana open to avoid potential 2-for-1? Or simply forgo this card altogether?
I ran rancor in my flashy deck; it's cheap enough that after I flash out a threat on their end step, I can drop a rancor on my turn and still have mana open for another threat/counterspell. It really improves the clock I put in play, while usually not causing card disadvantage. For example, making your 3/x into a 5/x changes your clock from a 7 turn clock to a 4 turn clock, it's kind of a big deal. It helps make it so you don't have to overextend with your creatures. (Not to mention it's the only aura to synergize with restoration angel.)
Rancor is still so good. It makes everything twice as scary and you once that creatures dies you just get it back. Invisible Stalker also really likes Rancor.
I am just not of the belief that if you run Green you have to run Rancor. I post a mono green elf list and the first thing out of someones mouth is WHAT no Rancors. You are not trying to push through dmg with one creature with Elves, instead that when you attack with elves your attacking with a swarm, rancor is not going to help you much there.
Rancor is best used when you are trying to race, in decks that wants to attack in the early turns with smaller creatures, to put your opponent on a serious clock. It does not want to be in every deck that runs green.
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This but he loves ghor too. Rancor is an amazing card but unless you are running like 18 land I just think ghor is much harder to play defence against and better (at least for agro).
I see aggro lists running Rancor as a 4-of with 20+ small creatures.
I see aggro lists opting to run the one-time-Super-Rancor ala Ghor-Clan Rampager instead.
I see some mid-range lists running 2-of with the reasoning behind insufficient creatures to support 4-of.
Where is this card's place in this spot-removal filled meta, if any?(Possibly worsened by Reckoners)
It's actually better against Reckoners because you only have to assign 3 damage to them if they block you and it makes little dudes scary while they try to trade down.
Ghor Clan is really good at attacking into Reckoner though, for the same reason that Rancor does well with the trample mechanic and because it protects the primary target from getting killed by a single damage source from Reckoner.
I don't think cheap targeted instant speed removal is all that prevalent or reckoner wouldn't be nearly as useful. And a lot of the time with rancor you are either on the play or have a 1 drop and it gets cast in first under 2 mana removal, then it gets hit with the removal the turn after it's already resolved and gotten in damage and you get it back to either cast again right away or even if they get to untap they rarely have multiple removal spells to be spending on cheap creatures, 2 for 1 or not, because bigger more important targets then this 4/2 rakdos cackler like a hellrider or the infamous reckoner might be coming and you need to save 1 removal for that.
I also don't see rancor as competing with ghor-clan rampager. A recursive aura and a pump spell are for 2 different niches. They may both focus on punishing blocks and pushing damage but generally rancor is a small continual bonus to either weenies or vanilla creatures that lack evasion while ghor-clan is a 1 time blowout, punishing a flash restoration angel block or double block or making a double striker suddenly unstoppable and lethal.
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OP, Rancor is a very good card for what it does and it probably deserves its place in your main deck if you have the creatures to stick it on. If you are having trouble with getting 2-for-1'd in response to casting Rancor, I would just side it out. Unless you've kept track of how many games you've had this happen, I'm guessing it hasn't happened that often and the times it has are just particularly salient to you. That's why I recommend not taking it out of your main list. Next time you play at an event, keep track of what you side out or what percentage of the times you cast Rancor to see it countered then reassess.
I usually cast it then attack. Idk though. Seems like a pretty simple card to use. I guess not putting it on your best guy could be smart. Make removal a little worse.
I've become a little underwhelmed by this card lately. It may be just because I'm running R/g and only have one source of green or so per game and I much rather be casting Rampager than this to end the game faster/trample over a Reckoner and survive.
I think it ironically has more of a place in Naya/Bant/Ooze decks than it does aggro. Aggro doesn't care all that much about card advantage so Rancor returning isn't always the best thing.
Also having two of them sitting in your hand after all your creatures were removed and not having two more threats instead is really depressing.
I am starting to like Giant growth better, because it saves your creatures from spears and stuff and Rampager+GG is sweet for pump.
So yeah Rancor does have a place in this meta, but I DON"T think its any list that runs green and creatures... I think we need to build decks with rancor in mind rather than just "auto-include"
It is what Angelic Destiny ought to be. It increases the clock of your creatures while you don't get 2-for-1. That's what Rancor helps with.
In all honesty though, there are better cards to play in some decks. I mean, Kessig Wolf Run is like a land version of what Rancor does, and you could always play more creatures. Still, Rancor's advantage, once you land it, is without question, pressure.
Ever saw a 5/1 Pligrim bashing people on turn 2? That's what Rancor is about, pressure. Suddenly everything can be a threat for just G. That's the effectiveness of Rancor.
It makes threats more threatening.
It makes Thragtusk more threatening.
It makes Boros Reckoner more threatening.
It makes anything more threatening.
If a list has Thragtusk/Reckoner and Rancor in the same deck, it is a bad deck. Rancor takes decks in a totally different direction than Thragtusk/Reckoner.
Rancor makes every creature you play a legitimate threat.
Saying "Rancor makes every creature you play a legitimate threat." is about as effective as saying "It gives a creature of your choice +2/+0 and Trample". Everyone knows what +2/+0 and Trample does and I doubt the OP had any doubt that it makes a creature of your choice a more significant threat.
Advocating Rancor with Midrange threats is very misleading in a thread seeking advice and insight. Rancor + Reckoner in a hyper-aggressive Gruul Aggro is fine actually, but not Thragtusk.
To answer the original question:
In addition to the obvious (Making one creature stronger and tramply), the role that Rancor plays is to allow an aggressive deck to add material to the board without overextending to board sweepers. If you have three creatures on the board when your opponent casts Supreme Verdict or Miracle Bonfire of the Damned, you get 3-for-1'ed. If you have two creatures on the board and a Rancor on one of them, you only lose two cards since Rancor returns to your hand. Basically, it makes the opponent's sweepers less valuable.
Despite what many people think, Rancor isn't necessarily appropriate for just any deck with forests and creatures. Rancor in a midrange deck (Naya or Jund) is a total waste of a deck slot.
I ran rancor in my flashy deck; it's cheap enough that after I flash out a threat on their end step, I can drop a rancor on my turn and still have mana open for another threat/counterspell. It really improves the clock I put in play, while usually not causing card disadvantage. For example, making your 3/x into a 5/x changes your clock from a 7 turn clock to a 4 turn clock, it's kind of a big deal. It helps make it so you don't have to overextend with your creatures. (Not to mention it's the only aura to synergize with restoration angel.)
I've become a little underwhelmed by this card lately. It may be just because I'm running R/g and only have one source of green or so per game and I much rather be casting Rampager than this to end the game faster/trample over a Reckoner and survive.
I think it ironically has more of a place in Naya/Bant/Ooze decks than it does aggro. Aggro doesn't care all that much about card advantage so Rancor returning isn't always the best thing.
Also having two of them sitting in your hand after all your creatures were removed and not having two more threats instead is really depressing.
I am starting to like Giant growth better, because it saves your creatures from spears and stuff and Rampager+GG is sweet for pump.
So yeah Rancor does have a place in this meta, but I DON"T think its any list that runs green and creatures... I think we need to build decks with rancor in mind rather than just "auto-include"
I'm running R/g also. How many total G sources do you have? I'm running a slightly different build with 20 total lands. 4 Stomping Ground, 4 Rootbound Crag, 2 Temple Garden (helps with Reckoner casting), and 10 Mountains. Plus 4 BTEs. I haven't been running into a lack of G sources.
More importantly, though, is that you don't HAVE to cast it. If you have Rancor and Ghor-Clan in your hand and want to attack, feel free to Ghor-Clan instead. Stick Rancor on next turn if applicable.
I also don't mind seeing multiple Rancor in hand and few creatures on board. Sure, you always want to keep threat density, but a lot of people don't realize they can put multiple Rancors on 1 creature. No such thing as "double trample" of course, but if you're threat-light the +4/+0 helps a lot and you'll likely get them both back by the time you top-deck other threats.
I see aggro lists running Rancor as a 4-of with 20+ small creatures.
I see aggro lists opting to run the one-time-Super-Rancor ala Ghor-Clan Rampager instead.
I see some mid-range lists running 2-of with the reasoning behind insufficient creatures to support 4-of.
Where is this card's place in this spot-removal filled meta, if any?(Possibly worsened by Reckoners)
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It's pressure.
It makes threats more threatening.
It makes Thragtusk more threatening.
It makes Boros Reckoner more threatening.
It makes anything more threatening.
In my mono green, I usually drop it as often as I can since I run plenty of undying creatures and fatties. The card is nuts, and just running it as a one-of makes it just as useful as running four in a deck since it will return to your hand after whatever is enchanted is removed.
Ghor-Clan Rampager is a different kind of pump. It's a one time trick that's played to reach into game or to bring down bigger creatures while making your aggressor creatures more survivable. It's a great card, but the consistency of Rancor vs the Rampager is a local meta call.
though blocking does get worse.
What I meant via "worsened by Reckoner" was the side effect of the increase in popularity of spot removal, such as Abrupt Decay, Victim of Night and Dreadbore due to Reckoners, and 2 of the above-mentioned will make attempts to stick Rancor much harder and possibly 2 for 1 CA you in response to attaching.
At least this was what I observed everytime I had a Rancor in hand, I wished it was something else, just because the opponent has removal mana open.
Thus the question, do I only stick it on regeneration dudes with regeneration mana open to avoid potential 2-for-1? Or simply forgo this card altogether?
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Rancor is best used when you are trying to race, in decks that wants to attack in the early turns with smaller creatures, to put your opponent on a serious clock. It does not want to be in every deck that runs green.
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This but he loves ghor too. Rancor is an amazing card but unless you are running like 18 land I just think ghor is much harder to play defence against and better (at least for agro).
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Rancor is the card most equipment wishes it could be.
It's actually better against Reckoners because you only have to assign 3 damage to them if they block you and it makes little dudes scary while they try to trade down.
Ghor Clan is really good at attacking into Reckoner though, for the same reason that Rancor does well with the trample mechanic and because it protects the primary target from getting killed by a single damage source from Reckoner.
1) Tap green source of mana
2) Attach to any creatuer that you plan on swinging with
3) After that creature dies rinse and repeate
I also don't see rancor as competing with ghor-clan rampager. A recursive aura and a pump spell are for 2 different niches. They may both focus on punishing blocks and pushing damage but generally rancor is a small continual bonus to either weenies or vanilla creatures that lack evasion while ghor-clan is a 1 time blowout, punishing a flash restoration angel block or double block or making a double striker suddenly unstoppable and lethal.
Good two and one drops, maybe bloodlust spells as well.
I think it ironically has more of a place in Naya/Bant/Ooze decks than it does aggro. Aggro doesn't care all that much about card advantage so Rancor returning isn't always the best thing.
Also having two of them sitting in your hand after all your creatures were removed and not having two more threats instead is really depressing.
I am starting to like Giant growth better, because it saves your creatures from spears and stuff and Rampager+GG is sweet for pump.
So yeah Rancor does have a place in this meta, but I DON"T think its any list that runs green and creatures... I think we need to build decks with rancor in mind rather than just "auto-include"
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In all honesty though, there are better cards to play in some decks. I mean, Kessig Wolf Run is like a land version of what Rancor does, and you could always play more creatures. Still, Rancor's advantage, once you land it, is without question, pressure.
Ever saw a 5/1 Pligrim bashing people on turn 2? That's what Rancor is about, pressure. Suddenly everything can be a threat for just G. That's the effectiveness of Rancor.
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If a list has Thragtusk/Reckoner and Rancor in the same deck, it is a bad deck. Rancor takes decks in a totally different direction than Thragtusk/Reckoner.
You don't know what you're talking about.
Saying "Rancor makes every creature you play a legitimate threat." is about as effective as saying "It gives a creature of your choice +2/+0 and Trample". Everyone knows what +2/+0 and Trample does and I doubt the OP had any doubt that it makes a creature of your choice a more significant threat.
Advocating Rancor with Midrange threats is very misleading in a thread seeking advice and insight. Rancor + Reckoner in a hyper-aggressive Gruul Aggro is fine actually, but not Thragtusk.
To answer the original question:
In addition to the obvious (Making one creature stronger and tramply), the role that Rancor plays is to allow an aggressive deck to add material to the board without overextending to board sweepers. If you have three creatures on the board when your opponent casts Supreme Verdict or Miracle Bonfire of the Damned, you get 3-for-1'ed. If you have two creatures on the board and a Rancor on one of them, you only lose two cards since Rancor returns to your hand. Basically, it makes the opponent's sweepers less valuable.
Despite what many people think, Rancor isn't necessarily appropriate for just any deck with forests and creatures. Rancor in a midrange deck (Naya or Jund) is a total waste of a deck slot.
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I'm running R/g also. How many total G sources do you have? I'm running a slightly different build with 20 total lands. 4 Stomping Ground, 4 Rootbound Crag, 2 Temple Garden (helps with Reckoner casting), and 10 Mountains. Plus 4 BTEs. I haven't been running into a lack of G sources.
More importantly, though, is that you don't HAVE to cast it. If you have Rancor and Ghor-Clan in your hand and want to attack, feel free to Ghor-Clan instead. Stick Rancor on next turn if applicable.
I also don't mind seeing multiple Rancor in hand and few creatures on board. Sure, you always want to keep threat density, but a lot of people don't realize they can put multiple Rancors on 1 creature. No such thing as "double trample" of course, but if you're threat-light the +4/+0 helps a lot and you'll likely get them both back by the time you top-deck other threats.
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