This card is sick! I'm guessing something with Nivmagus Elemental for ALPHA STRIKE win or/and Fling it after damage step or in response to targeted removal! bahahaha!
^hehehe I like the card. Gives a U/R Delver deck a late game option and you can dual cast it...Say make X=4 and then dual cast it. You get the top 8 cards of your deck cast for free for 7 mana but Infernal plunge exists so we would only need 5 mana and a creature to sac to get the top 8 cards of our deck for free. Seems good.
With a Guttersnipe on board if one of these goes off your opponent isn't going to like it.
Obviously viable with Ritual/Storm combos in Legacy. In standard this just isn't going to be competitive. The card people are going to want to compare this to is Genesis Wave, and because that card was viable... then this must have a shot as well.
The problem is, the reason Genesis Wave worked was because the engine that got it into play fast and for a large amount X was Elves and Elves were creatures themselves that got put into play with Genesis Wave. In order to have a similar thing happen in Standard, you are going to need a similar amount of ritual spells. You cant use creatures because that takes away from the number of instants and sorceries needed for the deck to work.
BTW how does this work with X cost spells? If a put 4 on its casting cost and come across a fireball, I cast a 3 damage fireball?
X would be 0 in those cases. Which kind of brings me to exhibit B for why this card won't work in Standard: You aren't going to be able to chain Experiments together. For free at least, you could let it fall to the graveyard and then Snapcaster it back. But that brings us back to exhibit A which is that this combo isn't going to work without ritual spells. Otherwise you are going to be tapping 8 lands to cast it for X=6 and hoping you get 3 free instants out of it.
The irony is that this card actually needs sorceries and instants that produce tokens if it wants to have a chance at standard playability. Sucks call of the herd wasn't an innistrad card...
Regardless, this plus guttersnipe is pretty cute, though my bet is on this card only seeing fringe play until the rest of the block is released.
This is my basic list for the rituals/burn at the stake thingy deck... needs some work but has a possible turn 3 win.
Skip krenko and reforge the soul, add in talrand's invocation and izzet charm. Also, Epic Experiment needs to be a 4-of if you want anything approaching redundancy, and guttersnipe wouldn't hurt either. Electromancer doesn't really do anything. Think Twice wouldn't hurt the deck. Here's what it would look like.
Reforge the soul is what allows you to combo... The above list is a combo deck that can't even come close to supporting double blue and 4cmc spells. Electromancers....
I don't think you understand what a combo deck does and combo definitely doesn't run 25 land.
Reforge the soul is what allows you to combo... The above list is a combo deck that can't even come close to supporting double blue and 4cmc spells. Electromancers....
I don't think you understand what a combo deck does and combo definitely doesn't run 25 land.
...You're serious, aren't you. The deck needs lands, because you need 4 lands by turn 4, period. Your list is running zero card filtering beyond reforge the soul. Ask yourself if your deck even functions if it can't miracle a reforge (hint- it can't). Spouting idiocy about land count because you've seen legacy combo lists with 19 lands makes your opinion invalid. You need the lands, period. Guttersnipe provides redundancy, augur gives you consistency and filtering on top of a decent blocker. This is basic stuff, man.
This is the kind of spell that would go well with Past in Flames and a bunch of low CMC spells. Shame we will be losing phyrexian mana. BV 2-of anyone?
EDIT: Just saw the "exile" part. Yeah, never gonna play this.
This is the kind of spell that would go well with Past in Flames and a bunch of low CMC spells. Shame we will be losing phyrexian mana. BV 2-of anyone?
EDIT: Just saw the "exile" part. Yeah, never gonna play this.
Im pretty sure everything with this card goes to the graveyard...
"Spells you do not play to the graveyard" and when you play a spell from exile, you are still playing it, so the normal response would happen.
How long do we have to repeat in every thread that those spells are only exiled "for a while". When they are casted they go on a stack and they act as normal spells.
Conclusion: everything you reveal thanks to Epic Experiment goes to graveyard finally (unless it is Temporal Mastery that exiles itself as a part of an effect)
Thanks for confirming my belief. But just throwing it out there, if you are playing this alongside a 7 cmc card you are doing it wrong. Just like when someone mentioned worldfire in another thread. Though that would be the funniest way to win i can imagine, worldfire from exile followed by a burnspell from exile.
I think this should be played alongside some mana ramp for sure, and if you can get up to 5 or more, you should win the game.
All 3 damage burnspells paired with cantrips should make this work. You could also use non-bonfire sweepers. Unfortunately this card does not work well with overload as its an alternate casting cost (would have worked well with kicker though) or x spells :(.
yes.
you cast the spell...
it exiles (for example 5 cards, 3 are instant or sorcery)
from exile you cast them.
the other 2 cards (creatures or whatever) go to graveyard.
This card goes to graveyard.
then all the spells you cast from exile go to graveyard.
In a potential Storm-type deck, how would Epic Experiment work with token-producing spells and Burn at the Stake? Say that you cast Epic Experiment for X=5 and hit a Krenko's Command, a Thatcher Revolt, a Gather the Townsfolk, and a Burn at the Stake. Can you stack the spells so that the token-producers resolve before you cast Burn at the Stake? I assume not, since Burn at the Stake says "As an additional cost to cast."
Since you have to cast the spell while Epic Experiment is resolving you have to pay all costs at that time. None of the other spells will have resolved yet to have created those tokens.
Rule 601 details paying costs
601.2e The player determines the total cost of the spell. Usually this is just the mana cost. Some spells have additional or alternative costs. Some effects may increase or reduce the cost to pay, or may provide other alternative costs. Costs may include paying mana, tapping permanents, sacrificing permanents, discarding cards, and so on. The total cost is the mana cost or alternative cost (as determined in rule 601.2b), plus all additional costs and cost increases, and minus all cost reductions. If the mana component of the total cost is reduced to nothing by cost reduction effects, it is considered to be {0}. It can’t be reduced to less than {0}. Once the total cost is determined, any effects that directly affect the total cost are applied. Then the resulting total cost becomes “locked in.” If effects would change the total cost after this time, they have no effect.
601.2g The player pays the total cost in any order. Partial payments are not allowed. Unpayable costs can’t be paid.
I see this being a great Grixis final card with guttersnipe on the field. lots of bounce/kill/draw/and burn spells are needed for this to work out well.
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This card is sick! I'm guessing something with Nivmagus Elemental for ALPHA STRIKE win or/and Fling it after damage step or in response to targeted removal! bahahaha!
With a Guttersnipe on board if one of these goes off your opponent isn't going to like it.
GR Ramp Happy Valakut GR
I agree that it is best abused in the legacy, modern formats.
GR Ramp Happy Valakut GR
The problem is, the reason Genesis Wave worked was because the engine that got it into play fast and for a large amount X was Elves and Elves were creatures themselves that got put into play with Genesis Wave. In order to have a similar thing happen in Standard, you are going to need a similar amount of ritual spells. You cant use creatures because that takes away from the number of instants and sorceries needed for the deck to work.
X would be 0 in those cases. Which kind of brings me to exhibit B for why this card won't work in Standard: You aren't going to be able to chain Experiments together. For free at least, you could let it fall to the graveyard and then Snapcaster it back. But that brings us back to exhibit A which is that this combo isn't going to work without ritual spells. Otherwise you are going to be tapping 8 lands to cast it for X=6 and hoping you get 3 free instants out of it.
Regardless, this plus guttersnipe is pretty cute, though my bet is on this card only seeing fringe play until the rest of the block is released.
Xcmc
1 Epic Experiment
1cmc 12
4 Goblin Arsonist
4 Infernal Plunge
2cmc 12
4 Battle Hymn
4 Krenko’s Command
4 Goblin Electromancer
4 Thatcher Revolt
4cmc 4
3 Krenko, Mob Boss
5cmc/Xcmc Win Con 1
1 Burn at the Stake
Gas 7
3 Past in Flames
4 Reforge the Soul
6 Mountain
5 Island
4 Sulfur Falls
4 Steam Vent
This is my basic list for the rituals/burn at the stake thingy deck... needs some work but has a possible turn 3 win.
GR Ramp Happy Valakut GR
Skip krenko and reforge the soul, add in talrand's invocation and izzet charm. Also, Epic Experiment needs to be a 4-of if you want anything approaching redundancy, and guttersnipe wouldn't hurt either. Electromancer doesn't really do anything. Think Twice wouldn't hurt the deck. Here's what it would look like.
4 Guttersnipe
4 Auger of Bolas
Sorceries
4 Krenko's Command
4 Thatcher Revolt
4 Epic Experiment
2 Burn at the Stake
1 Devil's Play
1 Past in Flames
3 Izzet Charm
4 Think Twice
4 Battle Hymn
Lands
25 Lands
Now the list has some redundancy, some card filtering, and at least a couple dudes that prevent an aggro deck from goldfishing a win against you.
I don't think you understand what a combo deck does and combo definitely doesn't run 25 land.
GR Ramp Happy Valakut GR
...You're serious, aren't you. The deck needs lands, because you need 4 lands by turn 4, period. Your list is running zero card filtering beyond reforge the soul. Ask yourself if your deck even functions if it can't miracle a reforge (hint- it can't). Spouting idiocy about land count because you've seen legacy combo lists with 19 lands makes your opinion invalid. You need the lands, period. Guttersnipe provides redundancy, augur gives you consistency and filtering on top of a decent blocker. This is basic stuff, man.
EDIT: Just saw the "exile" part. Yeah, never gonna play this.
Im pretty sure everything with this card goes to the graveyard...
"Spells you do not play to the graveyard" and when you play a spell from exile, you are still playing it, so the normal response would happen.
Thanks for confirming my belief. But just throwing it out there, if you are playing this alongside a 7 cmc card you are doing it wrong. Just like when someone mentioned worldfire in another thread. Though that would be the funniest way to win i can imagine, worldfire from exile followed by a burnspell from exile.
I think this should be played alongside some mana ramp for sure, and if you can get up to 5 or more, you should win the game.
All 3 damage burnspells paired with cantrips should make this work. You could also use non-bonfire sweepers. Unfortunately this card does not work well with overload as its an alternate casting cost (would have worked well with kicker though) or x spells :(.
I highly doubt it will see standard play with no forms of acceleration in blue/red.
you cast the spell...
it exiles (for example 5 cards, 3 are instant or sorcery)
from exile you cast them.
the other 2 cards (creatures or whatever) go to graveyard.
This card goes to graveyard.
then all the spells you cast from exile go to graveyard.
Past in flames BONKERSness
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Rule 601 details paying costs
601.2e The player determines the total cost of the spell. Usually this is just the mana cost. Some spells have additional or alternative costs. Some effects may increase or reduce the cost to pay, or may provide other alternative costs. Costs may include paying mana, tapping permanents, sacrificing permanents, discarding cards, and so on. The total cost is the mana cost or alternative cost (as determined in rule 601.2b), plus all additional costs and cost increases, and minus all cost reductions. If the mana component of the total cost is reduced to nothing by cost reduction effects, it is considered to be {0}. It can’t be reduced to less than {0}. Once the total cost is determined, any effects that directly affect the total cost are applied. Then the resulting total cost becomes “locked in.” If effects would change the total cost after this time, they have no effect.
601.2g The player pays the total cost in any order. Partial payments are not allowed. Unpayable costs can’t be paid.