MTG Salvation

Quote from Hardened

Fair points. Perhaps I like it less than most because I like the format's various pings more than most.

A counterpoint is that pings aren't as good in this format as they have been in others. You don't often see people maindecking them without a good reason.

Quote from pierrebai

Let me get this straight: it's good because it makes you unable to block when your opponent was tryign to lure so that he could alpha strike you?

It's good because if you're behind and being ripped by the siren, you avoid the effect once?

I'm still not understanding the interest the card has. I still haven't read anyone explain away why I don't like it: that you need an untapped, capable of tapping guy for it to do anything at all. You only get tempo by not using a creature as an attacker, so you either untempo'ed yourself or were already losing. Will you keep a guy back just to play this if you're ahead?

Basically, helix is card that, if your losing, you'll be losing a slightly bit less for a turn. I suppose voltrons will dominate enough that it will still be playable nonetheless.

Sorry, I wasn't clear. I didn't mean the Lure creature (Noble Quarry). I meant Culling Mark but didn't look up the name. it 100% counters Culling Mark.

Shipwreck Singer was a stretch though, I'm sorry.

Quote from Semantics

This is a good point. Helix might not be as good as Voyage's End in a vacuum, but it stones an otherwise fine removal spell AND provides tempo. Also, bounce becomes a lot better now that we're getting one fewer pack of Lightning Strikes and are replacing them with Fall of the Hammer.

Helix is actually pretty useful vs several spells. In addition to asphyxiate, it counters the green "must block" spell, as well as Shipwreck Singer.

Quote from jhneoh

Lol ok, Grab the Reins is still better. Perhaps I should have said "creature bomb".

Oxidda Scrapmelter is the only other uncommon creature in recent memory that comes close.

• Thundercloud Shaman
  
• Hatchet Bully
  
• Brimstone Mage
  
• Cunning Sparkmage
  
• Kuldotha Flamefiend
  

Not sure I'd ever want to play it in an average deck.

If I had synergy, like what Uthwithian suggested, I'd consider playing it. But history tells us that fairly expensive equipment that doesn't give power and toughness boosts don't play very well.

The uncommon Eidolon cycles seem pretty insane, as well as the Uncommon Tribute fliers (especially the white/blue ones).

Some individual responses.

Acolyte's Reward - Kor Chant/Shining Shoal effects are always pretty bomby in limited.
Ghostblade Eidolon - Maybe a bit expensive, but Double Strike is always a terrifying ability.
Glimpse the Sun God - This one is more speculative, but this format leads to board stalls a decent amount of the time. Far less powerful than Sea God's Revenge, but I think this might be a sleeper.
Ornitharch - One of the best Tribute cards. Neither side is ever dead (like the removal tributes).

Eternity Snare - VERY expensive, but handles a massive 3-4 bestow guy exceptionally.
Flitterstep Eidolon - Good at carrying Bestows and obviously a great finisher
Floodtide Serpent - Super interesting and possibly very powerful/hard to play against.
Oracle's Insight - Slow but pretty impossible to beat after a couple turns. Not always good.
Siren of the Fanged Coast - Very strong. Its pretty small if they don't pay, which makes it pretty bad on an empty board (unlike Ornitharch)

Asphyxiate - Really strong. Very cheap and not super conditional. Especially good against vigilance (obviously)
Bile Blight - Obviously good, but 3 isn't always enough in this format.
Charm of Erebos - This whole cycle is interesting to me. With the right inspired cards I'd consider this.
Forlorn Pseudamma - Expensive but creates a good advantage over time.

Stormcaller of Kerenos - If you're in R/U, this card can be a pretty great late-game mana sink.

Mischief and Mayhem - Thats a lot of power and heroic triggers.
Noble Quarry - Two or more turns of Lure is really good.
Raised by Wolves - This card is good but it gives small removal late-game value.

All of the gold uncommons appear to be very strong
Siren Song Lyre - Really strong card. Slow, but another more or less hard removal for a Bestowed guy that doesn't give them their enchantment back. Also obviously an inspired enabler.

While writing this - There is a lot to do with your mana. Lots of incremental advantages and lots of ways to get extra cards over time.

My deck would have to be much worse, and his deck would absolutely NEED Nylea's Presence to function before I'd bring it in.

In fairness, Ephara's static ability is much more powerful and interesting than most of the THS gods. It makes up for it being her only ability, in my opinion.

The card is completely unbeatable once its in play. There is no situation involving creatures that your opponent cant leave profitably, assuming you have cards in hand.

Yes, you can.

Lets look at the stack:

Centaur's triggered ability
Shock targeting Centaur
Lightning Bolt targeting Centaur

So the first thing that resolves is the trigger, making centaur a 6/6.

Then your shock, putting 2 damage on him.

Then lightning bolt, putting 3 damage on him, making the total 5.

I'd say they're close to unplayable outside of mono-color. The red and white ones seem possibly good enough in their respective aggro decks.

Quote from urafever

The card is honestly kind of slow for the format at this point. There's a decent amount of enchantment removal, as well as cards like beetleform mage that just don't care if you're making a horde of tokens.

You are aware that rotisserie is very different from "the format," right?

Quote from bateleur

Assemble the Legion

In Rotisserie there's a very low density of cards capable of removing it. It's certainly slow, but I'm guessing the format as a whole would be slow enough for it to trump most things.

(If Assemble is indeed too slow then my choice would be Teleportal.)

I don't like Mortars as a pick. It's hugely powerful in theory, but Red's a weak control colour in DGR and you're only going to draw the Mortars slightly over one game in three.

I am a fan of this logic. I'm thinking a deck with more colors will be best in this format, and there is plentiful 3 drop acceleration. Assemble gives up a great finisher and speed bumb that a control deck wants and we can cast it on turn 4 pretty regularly if we want to.

I don't think we should be arguing what the second best card in DGR is. We should try to figure out what guild(s) we want to be in. Then we should try to send the strongest signal as fast as we can.

Since we know the whole pool, we can figure out our most desirable set of 23 (within reason). We can then spend our picks building that.

Now, I'm not sure what that set of cards is, but I think that's where the discussion should go.

Beyond the turn, realize what your deck's expected mana per game is. Errant Ephemeron is not really castable in some decks, so you might have to suspend it even if you have 5 mana available.