You can play around it with Burning Anger depending when you draw it, you can shoot for smaller increments at a time so they won't kill you if they have it.
I was seriously stunned when I found this deck.. worked at all. And yes, consistently.
That said, when not goldfishing, I tended to die to the mantis rider/rabblemaster build of Jeskai before I got going. Eventually I made a hybrid of this and the helix version, featuring simply the helix and the briber's purse. Maindecking aggro answers like that are going a long way for me.
I'm also considering moving 2 swan song to the main..
Hmm, that seems very reasonable. Helix is perfectly fine mid-combo, allowing you to bounce a Dragon Mantle to go infinite, and Briber's Purse could do some work against Rabble Red, although they do tend to go wide, and you normally want to use all your mana, so I'm not sure. I wonder if there's a build out there with Retraction Helix as a value spell and Heliod's Presence as a cantrip that also goes infinite with Helix and Ascendancy. Something like that might be better than Briber's Purse, as Helix + Ascendancy is gonna win the game so often that you don't need to run a poor card just for that case, and Heliod's Presence goes infinite with Helix while still being not awful against aggro. I've also considered maining one or two Swan Songs, although I'm scared of weakening our goldfish, since we really need every last spell we can get. Maybe we can shave a couple lands or mana dorks? The trick is that you really want Swan Song against control, and you really want removal against aggro, and you really really don't want it vice versa, and you don't want to run both because that dilutes the deck too much, which is why it's all relegated to the sideboard in the OP. But it's definitely worth trying, and I keep going back and forth on a single Swan Song, so that against control our plan can be to slam Ascendancy when they tap out and then combo off the next turn holding up Swan Song to counter their counterspell/removal.
Lands (21)
1x Bloodstained Mire
1x Forest
2x Mountain
4x Mystic Monastery
2x Plains
1x Swamp
3x Temple of Epiphany
3x Windswept Heath
3x Wooded Foothills
1x Mana Confluence
Interesting, are you getting consistent turn 4 combos with this? On paper it looks like you have no ways to generate card advantage, and you'll always run out of cards in hand mid-combo. It can certainly lead to some explosive turns, though, so if it works in practice it could hold promise.
In builds playing the Altar mill plan I think that Swan Song is probably a more consistent counterspell option than Subborn Denial for the purposes of this deck.
I've ran this the past 3 weeks in a row at our local $200 weekly modern tournaments. Top 4 split with it each time. Deck is really good. Also went 6-2 at the Tampa Modern PTQ losing round 1 and 7. Deck is really sweet.
Yeah I already planned on Chained to the rocks. I think we decided we might want Renounce the Guilds over Glare since it hits Blood Baron too and besides that, they both hit Detention Sphere. God's Willing is solid but I feel like its a blowout if I need to ever need to Call Prowhite although it shouldnt be an issue. Hoplite was considered but we wanted to keep the 1 drops enchantment creature at the moment if possible. Hero was just too good not to be abused though. This was originally monowhite and a bit slower, but we realized we could focus more on this decks aggro plan by adding Boros Charm for Double Strike and Indestructibility and another 1 drop enchantment creature.
Still shifting around the land base but this has had great results for a friend and I. Preferably didn't want to max out on Temples because this is a very fast deck, but it might be unavoidable.
It's very hard for you to lose if you ever draw a copy of Ethereal Armor. And if you draw 2 copies of Ethereal Armor, it is almost always a turn 3 kill:
-Any of 12 1 drop creatures.
-2 Ethereal Armor hit for 7.
-One of 4 Ajani's or of 4 Boros Charm's double strike for 14 for game.
P.S. I was not sure what this deck is classified under. It's enchantment based, but is not Hexproof. It looked a lot more like the W/R Hero builds so I put it in here.
So, I haven't posted in a while, mostly because I haven't had much new to report. However, I have been play testing the deck. I made a couple of changes to the mainboard, mainly taking out Akroma's Memorial and Eldrazi Monument for a 4th Thassa and a 3rd Slate of Ancestry.
Most of the deck's matchups are surprisingly good, though it does seem to struggle vs aggro decks. Midrange is probably my best matchup, since it is nearly impossible for them to kill all of my threats, I run enough cards to stall their threats, and I can build up my board faster than they can. Control is my second best matchup, since I have dudes who are counterspells, so if I can Aether Vial one of them in, it makes it really awkward for them to use their mana efficiently. In addition, two of my main threats, Molten-tail Masticore and Thassa, don't die to Supreme Verdict. Combo ranks 3rd in my matchup list, only because my creature counters can often slow them down long enough for me to develop my board and win. But if I don't draw those creatures, or it takes too long for me to develop my board, I lose. Finally, aggro matchups in general are bad for me. Death & Taxes is probably my best aggro matchup; my worst aggro matchup is a tie between Mono-red Burn and Merfolk. If on the play, I can win if I curve perfectly; otherwise, I probably lose. Affinity is awkward, but outside of their best hands, I can possibly race them, and post-board I get Hurkyl's Recall.
I agree with Akroma for Slate, but you really think we need the 4th Thassa? Also the Eldrazi Monument can be very useful, but I understand removing it.
edit: what about a 4th Metamorph instead of Thassa?
Unfortunate that you lost in Top4, but great job doing so well. That last hand it sounds like you just got extremely unlucky. I haven't had much of a chance to play against affinity yet, so I would be curious what you chose to sideboard in in that matchup (I noticed Hurkyl's Recall and Wurmcoil Engine, but I don't know if something else in the board was also worth boarding in).
I would also be interested in the sideboard for the other matchups as well. Also, were there cards that didn't feel like they pulled their weight in any of the matchups.
I tried the sideboard you had.
Affinity I did: -2 Voidmage, -2 Kami, -1 Slate, for 3 Recall, and 2 Wurmcoil.
Tron: -2 Kami, -1 Akroma's Memorial, +2 Pithing Needle, +1 Mindslaver (wasnt sure about Recall in that matchup)
Merfolk: I couldn't find anything that I wanted to side besides Wurmcoil so -2 Voidmage + 2 Wurmcoil
Monored: -2 Voidmage, -2 Kami(wasn't sure on this because its a 1/3) +2 Spellskite +2Wurmcoil, probably could have sided some combination of Swan Song and Spell Pierce too.
I did test games though vs Storm and American Control and the Voidmages were amazing. Also I find Kami a very good filler before sidedecking, even though it gets removed many game 2/3s.
I was slightly unimpressed by the Wurmcoil against Affinity though.
Cool, I'll be looking forward to the feedback. The main thing is remaining in control of the games tempo. Against combo decks, sit on your creature counterspells; against midrange, go heavy on getting a board established. The deck doesn't have a lot of catchup, so make sure not to get behind. That's all the advice I have. Good Luck.
On the subjec of Nykthos, the main reason I have it in the deck in the first place is to make sure that I can use the decks artifacts in the situation where I can't draw Grand Architect. When I have Grand Architect, it is a nice bonus; when I don't have GA, it helps put me in a position where I don't fall behind.
I lost in top4 to affinity. Won game 1 fairly easily. Game 2 he drew a Ravager for exactly game on the turn before I had lethal. Game 3 I mulled to 6 with Familiar, Omenspeaker, Wurmcoil, Recall, Island, and Nykthos. And proceeded to only draw lands and until he was able to kill me.
I beat Auras pretty easily, same with Blue Tron (I didn't get paired vs the red/green one). Also beat Merfolk with ease.
The deck Is really powerful. I really like the performance of it.
That is the primary reason I looked at putting voidmage into the deck. I had tested for a little bit without Sage of Epityr, and I wasn't liking how it was going, so I decided to find some ways of making my scry cards do more work. Voidmage Prodigy seems like the perfect card since my combo matchup seems bad, while my midrange matchup seems favorable. The only thing is that my LGS seems to favor midrange at the moment, so he hasn't been able to put in much work yet.
That is a good point. Ideally I could put either of those creatures into play with Aether Vial, though I know that people are likely to blow up Aether Vial if possible. I generally don't like playing Kami without Vial, since it is a 2-for-1 if they remove it before I draw off of it. But I do see what you are saying, so I may go to just two Nykthos.
I think I'm going to give the deck a shot at a Modern GPT tonight, I'll let you know how it goes.
So, I adjusted my deck for the modern tournament at my LGS last night (+1 Thassa, God of he Sea, +2x Voidmage Prodigy, -1x Venser, Shaper Savant, -1x Kira, Great Glass Spinner, -1x Eldrazi Monument). Here's the current list:
With this list I was able to go 2-0-1 to make Top 8 (it is a relatively small modern tournamnet with about 12 people) and then I won the Top 8 round. Top 4 chose to split to get $25 store credit apiece.
Round 1 GB Dredgevine (2-1): Game 1, we each get a relatively slow start, but I am able to recover with a turn 4 Thassa.Eventually I get ahead on board and drop Master of Waves with a Slate of Ancestry. After I drew 11 cards, my opponent scooped.
Sideboard: -2x Voidmage Prodigy, -2x Kami of the Crescent Moon, -1x Eldrazi Monument; +2x Wurmcoil Engine, +2x Spellskite, +1x Relic of Progenitus.
Game 2, I keep a double Nykthos hand because it has Aether Vial and some one drops. My opponent proceeds to Abrupt Decay my Aether Vial. I do draw a blue source, but I am so far behind at that point that he was able to kill me with ease.
Game 3, my opponent kept a sketchy hand and missed land drops while I drop a turn 3 Thassa, followed by Spellskite. After I get Wurmcoil Engine out, it's over.
Round 2 Doran Midrange (2-1): Game 1, he gets out an early Spellskite and Doran and puts me on a relatively short clock. I did draw a Molten-tail Masticore, but because I didn't have Grand Architect, I didn't have enough mana to make good use of it, so I lost.
Sideboard: -2x Voidmage Prodigy, -2x Kami of the Crescent Moon, -1x Eldrazi Monument, -1x Akroma's Memorial; +2x Wurmcoil Engine, +2x Spellskite, +2x Spell Pierce.
Game 2, he kept a land light hand and got punished. I curved perfectly with a turn 3 Grand Architect, Phyrexian Metamorph (Grand Architect), and turn 4 Master of Waves, Phyrexian Metamorph (Master of Waves).
Game 3, he mulled to 6 and kept another land light hand and I curved well again.
Round 3 Junk Midrange (draw into Top 8). We did decide to play for fun and I won the match 2-0 in additon to splitting even on two extra games. My sideboard in that matchup was -2x Voidmage Prodigy, -1x Eldrazi Monument, -1x Akroma's Memorial, -3x Martyr of Frost; + 1x Kira, Great Glass Spinner, +2x Spell Pierce, + 2x Wurmcoil Engine, +2x Spellskite.
Top 8 Junk Pod (2-0): Game 1, I curve a turn 3 Grand Architect, Phyrexian Metamorph (Grand Architect) into a turn 4 Akroma's Memorial. Two turns later it's over.
Sideboard: -2x Kami of the Crescent Moon, -1x Eldrazi Monument, -1x Akroma's Memorial; +2x Wurmcoil Engine, +2x Pithing Needle.
Game 2, he kills my turn 1 Aether Vial with Decay. I manage to play a turn 3 Thassa, but I am behind on the board. However, I eventually was able to get set up behind Sage of Epityr + Voidmage Prodigy. Eventually I get in enough unblockable Thassa beats to win the game.
Overall it was a great night. Thassa once again proved her merit in the deck. Even though she doesn't necessarily help Grand Architect, she does a great job of putting me in a position to win the game. I think I only lost one game in which I played her. In addition, she's a safer play turn 3 over Grand Architect, since she requires less protection. Playing Thassa turn 3, playing Master of Waves and using Aether Vial for Grand Architect turn 4 is usually the best way of winning. Voidmage Prodigy was a little disappointing, but I feel like the primary problem was that these were bad matchups for that card. Against control, I expect it to do much better.
I really love the inclusion of voidmage in here. I think it will really show its strength vs control and combo.
With him and Kami costing UU though I kinda feel the number of Nykthos shrine should maybe be cut down for mana consistency. It normally doesn't ram be much mana regardless unless I'm winning.
Jeskai has to happen first. Jeskai happens before the spell resolves.
4 jeskai ascendancy
4 retraction helix
2 astral cornucopia
2 altar of the brood
3 springleaf drum
3 briber's purse
4 Taigam's scheming
3 Dig through time
4 ornithopter
4 chief engineer
4 omenspeaker
Lands
4 Shivan Reef
4 Battlefield Forge
6 island
3 plains
2 mountain
4 Mana Confluence
I was testing this and it was fairly consistent. Obviously weak to killspells but doesn't seem like a way of avoiding that with this deck.
4 Visions of Beyond
4 Glimpse the Unthinkable
2 Mind Funeral
3 Surgical Extraction
4 Breaking // Entering
2 Mesmeric Orb
3 Crypt Incursion
4 Archive Trap
4 Path to Exile
1 Island
1 Plains
2 Ghost Quarter
3 Shelldock Isle
4 Marsh Flats
3 Misty Rainforest
1 Watery Grave
1 Godless Shrine
2 Hallowed Fountain
3 Darkslick Shores
2 Engineered Explosives
3 Ravenous Trap
2 Stony Silence
2 Disenchant
2 Echoing Truth
1 Surgical Extraction
3 Darkness
Yeah I already planned on Chained to the rocks. I think we decided we might want Renounce the Guilds over Glare since it hits Blood Baron too and besides that, they both hit Detention Sphere. God's Willing is solid but I feel like its a blowout if I need to ever need to Call Prowhite although it shouldnt be an issue. Hoplite was considered but we wanted to keep the 1 drops enchantment creature at the moment if possible. Hero was just too good not to be abused though. This was originally monowhite and a bit slower, but we realized we could focus more on this decks aggro plan by adding Boros Charm for Double Strike and Indestructibility and another 1 drop enchantment creature.
4 Hopeful Eidolon
4 Nyxborn Shieldmate
4 Nyxborn Rollicker
4 Hero of Iroas
4 Spirit of the Labyrinth
2 Eidolon of Countless Battles
4 Ajani, Caller of the Pride
Instants
4 Boros Charm
Enchantments
4 Ethereal Armor
4 Madcap Skills
10 Plains
4 Sacred Foundry
2 Temple of Triumph
6 Mountain
Still shifting around the land base but this has had great results for a friend and I. Preferably didn't want to max out on Temples because this is a very fast deck, but it might be unavoidable.
It's very hard for you to lose if you ever draw a copy of Ethereal Armor. And if you draw 2 copies of Ethereal Armor, it is almost always a turn 3 kill:
-Any of 12 1 drop creatures.
-2 Ethereal Armor hit for 7.
-One of 4 Ajani's or of 4 Boros Charm's double strike for 14 for game.
P.S. I was not sure what this deck is classified under. It's enchantment based, but is not Hexproof. It looked a lot more like the W/R Hero builds so I put it in here.
I agree with Akroma for Slate, but you really think we need the 4th Thassa? Also the Eldrazi Monument can be very useful, but I understand removing it.
edit: what about a 4th Metamorph instead of Thassa?
I tried the sideboard you had.
Affinity I did: -2 Voidmage, -2 Kami, -1 Slate, for 3 Recall, and 2 Wurmcoil.
Tron: -2 Kami, -1 Akroma's Memorial, +2 Pithing Needle, +1 Mindslaver (wasnt sure about Recall in that matchup)
Merfolk: I couldn't find anything that I wanted to side besides Wurmcoil so -2 Voidmage + 2 Wurmcoil
Auras: -2 Voidmage, -2 Kami, +2 Spell Pierce +2 Spellskite(they played Path's)
Monored: -2 Voidmage, -2 Kami(wasn't sure on this because its a 1/3) +2 Spellskite +2Wurmcoil, probably could have sided some combination of Swan Song and Spell Pierce too.
I did test games though vs Storm and American Control and the Voidmages were amazing. Also I find Kami a very good filler before sidedecking, even though it gets removed many game 2/3s.
I was slightly unimpressed by the Wurmcoil against Affinity though.
I lost in top4 to affinity. Won game 1 fairly easily. Game 2 he drew a Ravager for exactly game on the turn before I had lethal. Game 3 I mulled to 6 with Familiar, Omenspeaker, Wurmcoil, Recall, Island, and Nykthos. And proceeded to only draw lands and until he was able to kill me.
I beat Auras pretty easily, same with Blue Tron (I didn't get paired vs the red/green one). Also beat Merfolk with ease.
The deck Is really powerful. I really like the performance of it.
I think I'm going to give the deck a shot at a Modern GPT tonight, I'll let you know how it goes.
I really love the inclusion of voidmage in here. I think it will really show its strength vs control and combo.
With him and Kami costing UU though I kinda feel the number of Nykthos shrine should maybe be cut down for mana consistency. It normally doesn't ram be much mana regardless unless I'm winning.