Here's one idea I was going to propose if no one else got around to it - you miss a vote, you give everyone else a point. Three people miss a vote, the other 27 get three points.
Here's one idea I was going to propose if no one else got around to it - you miss a vote, you give everyone else a point. Three people miss a vote, the other 27 get three points.
Or instead, one point FOR voting. That way if you miss too many you fall behind.
Then again, your way may promote more consistent voting. Because if people who are always voting start pulling away because of all the missed votes points, others will see the more they miss, the more the point leaders pull away.
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banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
I already have two proposals, one dealing with nonvoters so they don't become an obstruction, and one dealing with rewards for people who are participating.
I should be up in about a week.
Unless of course casualdecman or someone else beats me to my proposals.
I currerntly have drafts of proposals for issues on points being awarded or deducted if proposal passes/fails; penalties for non participation; and what is needed for a proposal to pass(potential majority vs actual majority). Not to mention a few immutable rules that should be transmuted soon.
Here's one idea I was going to propose if no one else got around to it - you miss a vote, you give everyone else a point. Three people miss a vote, the other 27 get three points.
I think this would be slightly less broken as miss a vote, lose a point. That way, you're not artificially accelerating the game by not voting. It also makes Vote: Abstain actually a usable idea.
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Hey all... I'm retired, not dead. Check out what I'm doing these days (and beg me to come back if you want):
I think this would be slightly less broken as miss a vote, lose a point. That way, you're not artificially accelerating the game by not voting. It also makes Vote: Abstain actually a usable idea.
Valid point. However, by accelerating the game by not voting(giving everyone who did vote 1 point) it gives actual incentive to vote every time and be dedicated. Also, would abstaining from voting be considered not voting? If you post in the thread that you choose to abstain, that might be as good as voting. There are no rules either way on this one, so could a mod clarify this? This might prove more relevant if the voting changes soon.
Sorry, but firstly I'm on a different time zone, secondly I did not want to vote on the last rule
p.s My poll also doesn't seem to show to some people :s so I pm'd binary.
Yeah, your post didn't have a poll. I can edit a poll that was created but I can't create one if the post didn't already have it. If you can repost it with the poll (make sure to set "Public Votes" when you create the poll) before the deadline that would be fine, otherwise I'll post it myself using the text from your original post. You won't be penalized for the technical error of failing to click the poll button.
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I am no longer on MTGS staff, so please don't contact me asking me to do staff things. :|
Every player that voted gets 1 point.
Every player that voted for the the winning side gets a total of two points.
Every player that does not vote gets -1 point.
If the proposal passes, the player that proposed it gets 1 extra point.
If the proposal fails, the player that proposed it gets -1 point.
Still working on the wording. I'm not set on the whole thing. Any suggestions or comments are greatly received.
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banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
Every player that voted gets 1 point.
Every player that voted for the the winning side gets a total of two points.
Every player that does not vote gets -1 point.
If the proposal passes, the player that proposed it gets 1 extra point.
If the proposal fails, the player that proposed it gets -1 point.
Still working on the wording. I'm not set on the whole thing. Any suggestions or comments are greatly received.
Honestly, that sounds like it should be two different rules, but it's up to the players in the game. Technically, you can have any rule as long as the players vote for it. Just be careful with the phrasing. That's all I have to say.
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If you're town and I'm mafia, you've already lost. You just don't know it yet.
Every player that voted gets 1 point.
Every player that voted for the the winning side gets a total of two points.
Every player that does not vote gets -1 point.
If the proposal passes, the player that proposed it gets 1 extra point.
If the proposal fails, the player that proposed it gets -1 point.
Still working on the wording. I'm not set on the whole thing. Any suggestions or comments are greatly received.
This could probably be simplified to: At the end of voting, each player who voted gets 1 point; if a player's vote is in the majority, he or she gets 2 points instead.
Nonvoters losing points is redundant here, as is the proponent gaining/losing extra points.
This could probably be simplified to: At the end of voting, all players who voted get 1 point; if a player's vote is in the majority, he or she gets 1 additional point.
Nonvoters losing points is redundant here, as is the proponent gaining/losing extra points.
Your wording is more clear. But I don't see how the gaining/losing points is redundant. Maybe for the person that proposed it, but I think that the nonvoter part is spot on. That way the people that are voting are pulling away from those that are not voting. Oh well.
EDIT: Also I still do not know how to include abstaining in the rule. If to have points awarded/deducted/not awarded, or any kind of affect on the actual vote.
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banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
Your wording is more clear. But I don't see how the gaining/losing points is redundant. Maybe for the person that proposed it, but I think that the nonvoter part is spot on. That way the people that are voting are pulling away from those that are not voting. Oh well.
The voters will still pull away since they gain a point that the nonvoters don't. If you want the difference to be larger, give voters 2 points, and 3 for majority.
Edit: You could include something like: (abstaining counts as a vote). Even though there would be no reason to abstain rather than vote no.
The voters will still pull away since they gain a point that the nonvoters don't. If you want the difference to be larger, give voters 2 points, and 3 for majority.
But it will provide penalty for not voting. It seems from our first two props, that people need a reason to participate. Here you are providing incentive to vote, and punishment for not voting. Its more than just pulling away and adding more points to those that do vote, its about consequence for not voting.
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banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
But it will provide penalty for not voting. It seems from our first two props, that people need a reason to participate. Here you are providing incentive to vote, and punishment for not voting. Its more than just pulling away and adding more points to those that do vote, its about consequence for not voting.
The consequence would be the same. If we are tied, I vote and gain a point, you nonvote and lose a point: I'm ahead by 2. If we're tied, I vote and gain 2 points, you nonvote gaining 0 points: I'm still ahead by 2 and you are still down by that same 2. Same result, one is just more complicated to reach.
The consequence would be the same. If we are tied, I vote and gain a point, you nonvote and lose a point: I'm ahead by 2. If we're tied, I vote and gain 2 points, you nonvote gaining 0 points: I'm still ahead by 2 and you are still down by that same 2. Same result, one is just more complicated to reach.
But with my scenario, we're tied, I don't vote three times in a row, you do vote. I'm -3, your +3. I took a penalty for not being here to vote. I don't get to come back to my same score, I come back to a reduced score from when I left. It is not just about the point difference, it is about the penalty.
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banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
But with my scenario, we're tied, I don't vote three times in a row, you do vote. I'm -3, your +3. I took a penalty for not being here to vote. I don't get to come back to my same score, I come back to a reduced score from when I left. It is not just about the point difference, it is about the penalty.
Sure, your score will technically look the same as when you stopped voting, but everyone else will be ahead 6 points, so you've still been penalised and are still in a hole.
It's like a race: saying you start 2 seconds later is the same as giving everyone else a 2 second head start, and the same as giving everyone else a 1 sec head start while giving you a 1 sec penalty. All the same, some are just simpler.
Sure, your score will technically look the same as when you stopped voting, but everyone else will be ahead 6 points, so you've still been penalised and are still in a hole.
It's like a race: saying you start 2 seconds later is the same as giving everyone else a 2 second head start, and the same as giving everyone else a 1 sec head start while giving you a 1 sec penalty. All the same, some are just simpler.
I think a 1 point bonus for voting is more than enough though. So while there is still the same difference between all players, +1 point for voting takes that much longer to reach a 100 points than +2 does.
I think a 1 point bonus for voting is more than enough though. So while there is still the same difference between all players, +1 point for voting takes that much longer to reach a 100 points than +2 does.
That's a good point.
But with that in mind, would a 2 point swing really be needed for each missed vote? Just giving everyone a point for voting should be enough to encourage minimal participation.
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Or instead, one point FOR voting. That way if you miss too many you fall behind.
Then again, your way may promote more consistent voting. Because if people who are always voting start pulling away because of all the missed votes points, others will see the more they miss, the more the point leaders pull away.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
I should be up in about a week.
Unless of course casualdecman or someone else beats me to my proposals.
Avatar by Grey. Banner by spiderboy4 from High~Light Studios
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
This worries me.
I think this would be slightly less broken as miss a vote, lose a point. That way, you're not artificially accelerating the game by not voting. It also makes Vote: Abstain actually a usable idea.
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Valid point. However, by accelerating the game by not voting(giving everyone who did vote 1 point) it gives actual incentive to vote every time and be dedicated. Also, would abstaining from voting be considered not voting? If you post in the thread that you choose to abstain, that might be as good as voting. There are no rules either way on this one, so could a mod clarify this? This might prove more relevant if the voting changes soon.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
Yeah, your post didn't have a poll. I can edit a poll that was created but I can't create one if the post didn't already have it. If you can repost it with the poll (make sure to set "Public Votes" when you create the poll) before the deadline that would be fine, otherwise I'll post it myself using the text from your original post. You won't be penalized for the technical error of failing to click the poll button.
We don't need one, yet. If someone proposes a points-for-voting rule, I believe abstaining should be covered within that rule.
There is currently no provision in the rules allowing for abstention.
Would you not vote for an abstain option if the points-for-voting was not included in it?
Avatar by Grey. Banner by spiderboy4 from High~Light Studios
It would depend on the exact proposal and the other rules at the time.
Every player that voted gets 1 point.
Every player that voted for the the winning side gets a total of two points.
Every player that does not vote gets -1 point.
If the proposal passes, the player that proposed it gets 1 extra point.
If the proposal fails, the player that proposed it gets -1 point.
Still working on the wording. I'm not set on the whole thing. Any suggestions or comments are greatly received.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
Honestly, that sounds like it should be two different rules, but it's up to the players in the game. Technically, you can have any rule as long as the players vote for it. Just be careful with the phrasing. That's all I have to say.
This could probably be simplified to: At the end of voting, each player who voted gets 1 point; if a player's vote is in the majority, he or she gets 2 points instead.
Nonvoters losing points is redundant here, as is the proponent gaining/losing extra points.
Your wording is more clear. But I don't see how the gaining/losing points is redundant. Maybe for the person that proposed it, but I think that the nonvoter part is spot on. That way the people that are voting are pulling away from those that are not voting. Oh well.
EDIT: Also I still do not know how to include abstaining in the rule. If to have points awarded/deducted/not awarded, or any kind of affect on the actual vote.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
The voters will still pull away since they gain a point that the nonvoters don't. If you want the difference to be larger, give voters 2 points, and 3 for majority.
Edit: You could include something like: (abstaining counts as a vote). Even though there would be no reason to abstain rather than vote no.
But it will provide penalty for not voting. It seems from our first two props, that people need a reason to participate. Here you are providing incentive to vote, and punishment for not voting. Its more than just pulling away and adding more points to those that do vote, its about consequence for not voting.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
The consequence would be the same. If we are tied, I vote and gain a point, you nonvote and lose a point: I'm ahead by 2. If we're tied, I vote and gain 2 points, you nonvote gaining 0 points: I'm still ahead by 2 and you are still down by that same 2. Same result, one is just more complicated to reach.
But with my scenario, we're tied, I don't vote three times in a row, you do vote. I'm -3, your +3. I took a penalty for not being here to vote. I don't get to come back to my same score, I come back to a reduced score from when I left. It is not just about the point difference, it is about the penalty.
banner by god child. he'd make you one too, if you weren't so bad at posting.
Sure, your score will technically look the same as when you stopped voting, but everyone else will be ahead 6 points, so you've still been penalised and are still in a hole.
It's like a race: saying you start 2 seconds later is the same as giving everyone else a 2 second head start, and the same as giving everyone else a 1 sec head start while giving you a 1 sec penalty. All the same, some are just simpler.
I think a 1 point bonus for voting is more than enough though. So while there is still the same difference between all players, +1 point for voting takes that much longer to reach a 100 points than +2 does.
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That's a good point.
But with that in mind, would a 2 point swing really be needed for each missed vote? Just giving everyone a point for voting should be enough to encourage minimal participation.