The SB is rough and just to give an idea of some sort of non-transformational SB (although it does allow for some sort of man-plan post board.)
I think people are looking at BR for a variety of reasons:
1: LSV did something with a BR list...if LSV does something people pay attention.
2: UR PA doesnt give a lot of room for innovating so people who like to tinker are playing around.
3: People realize that UR is only Tier 1.5 and because they really like the card/deck they are trying really hard to find something that might make it viable.
that's not taking into account the opponent might be playing a super fast agrro/burn deck.
While the deck can do too much to itself, PA can actually do pretty good against fast aggro..8 bolts and md volcanic fallout combined with either counters for blue or hand disruption for black actually give you pretty decent game.
PA did okay at worlds, but you have to realize that Worlds was not a very strong field. Yes amazing players and deck buildiers blah blah blah...but there was no truly established meta game. Even so PA wasnt really even that amazing at that point.
That said, no I wouldnt take it to a PTQ...although id certainly take it to FNM or other smaller Extended tournament. I find the deck extremely fun to play and outside of maybe Wargate probably the most interesting deck availible to play, CounterBurn with a "combo" built in is just good times.
I played PA at GP Atlanta and went 3-3 drop. It wasn't the best deck by a long shot but it performed well for me. I probably would've done better than 3-3 if I hadn't gotten a game loss in round 4 for accidentally drawing extra cards, but it probably would've only been 4-3 or something.
Slagstorm seems like an obvious inclusion to this deck. It helps you survive the pyro activation and with pyro online it can either clear the board with 6 damage or it can help finish the game with 6 player damage.
Slagstorm seems like an obvious inclusion to this deck. It helps you survive the pyro activation and with pyro online it can either clear the board with 6 damage or it can help finish the game with 6 player damage.
What 3 toughness creatures are in the format right now that you are worried about. If you have an active ascension, you dont need any help to win
Nyarlathotep must all things be told
for he is the messenger between the spheres
and the traveler between the realms of the living and the dead.
He shall summon forth the ancient ones
and wake them from their deathly slumber
then shall the elder signs be shattered. Trade Thread
I run it and suggest it. It is great to have the opponent have lethal damage on the board or for them to tap out their control deck countering your instant speed spell only to time warp ftw. With an active ascension it reads: "5cc: You win." Without an ascension, it reads "untap all your mana, draw a card, you may play an additional land this turn" etc.
Nonetheless, I only run 2...and also run call to mind, which helps to make the combo infinite.
Anyway, the Denver Ext PTQ is Sunday. I think I am going to take this deck.
What are the good SB cards given the current ext meta?
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Current favorite decks:
Standard
Blows
Modern BWUTeachingsBWU GUGU TempoGU WLifeW RWValakut ControlRW UBModern MillUB
Legacy UMUCU BPoxB BWRTokensBWR
Pauper UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant
I decided to run a switchboard that turns into a very very aggressive version of the Runeflare Trap combo, It just wrecks control in every game I've playtested. They can't really do anything with all of the extra cards. Also the 4 Volcanic Fallouts for the obvious reasons.
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The Problem with the human gene pool is there are no lifeguards
Volcanic fallout sb seemed like my best option but in retrospect having a mb answer would be nice. Spell pierce would do it but the question then is what do I take.out?
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The Problem with the human gene pool is there are no lifeguards
I took this build to the PTQ in San Antonio last Saturday. Made the top 8 and lost out to a bant aggro. If I could rebuild it and go again I would definately change the sideboard to make a bigger transition into a normal RUG build. I anticipated the enchantment hate post-board but I did not realize how much trouble I would have with the enchantment hate + Red removal hate and that's what got me. Changing out the pyro package for a RUG build would have given me much better game post-board against any deck with white in it.
Valakut was definitely the hardest matchup, pre-board I was around 40%. Boarding out the Fallouts, Bolts and Jace to bring in the trap package brings the matchup up to a good 70% in my favor.
Faeries was the second hardest matchup in testing but I dodged it in the PTQ.
UQ Mystic and Bant was a blowout game 1 in every match, game 2 with bant was difficult but UW had nothing for me post board.
The biggest thing the green splash does it give me a very consistent turn 4-5 win with the added cantrip and ramp from Explore. It's much easier to go off on the combo when the extra lands I draw go into play instead of into the graveyard or back into the library, I can't stress enough how much the explores make the deck work in the current environment.
Edit: I almost forgot, the 1 off Red Sun was a lifesaver. It won the game multiple times when I had to use my bolts/fallouts to stabilize and the exile/shuffle clauses are amazing in this deck. On two different occasions I used it for removal and won the game with it the next turn when I dug it back out with cantrips and once it exiled a Vengevine to buy me an extra turn to win. Also the 1 Ravenous trap kept me from losing a game 3 vs Valakut when he pulled Kozilek in from the board, respond to the Koz trigger with Trapmaker's Snare to dig it out and victory.
@Wei (piggyboy1) - play a different deck. It's horribly positioned given the # of aggro-control decks in the meta-game (UW, Fae, Bant are all variants) ... they all have a natural advantage against combo decks and there's really no strategic reason to pilot Pyro in Melbourne's meta-game (which is roughly 60% those 3 decks, though not coming to Meta Games you're prob. not aware of that).
Your biggest problem is lack of pro-active plays; 4 Pyro only. Splinter-Twin is horrendous against the removal and counter-suites available (and being played) against those decks.
Boros, for instance, is a much better choice, or even RDW, if you're intention is to win the event and not merely make up the #s.
@mj look at the questions i asked
Its about those decks so i have an idea about the meta.
I will be playing what i am comfortable playing and think will win.
I have experience playing the deck so i was asking questions.
@mj look at the questions i asked
Its about those decks so i have an idea about the meta.
I will be playing what i am comfortable playing and think will win.
I have experience playing the deck so i was asking questions.
When the 2 best players in the country don't like the deck, maybe that ought to tell you something ... so should asking for SB'ing advice for the top 3 decks, 1 week before the PTQ.
Regardless, I'm not trying to put you on tilt, merely offer an informed view of the local metagame.
I played the same list as Blackrabite in a recent extended tournament. 4 rounds of swiss. My list differed slightly. -2 Jace +2 call to mind. Also i tried the polymorph transitional sideboard which simply doesn't work. Turning it into a RUG control with titans/sphinx as your wincons seems a better option.
Round 1, fae Lost 2-1. G1 comboed out fairly early after ramping with explore.
G2 (was using the polymorph strat with only a single Emrakul as a target) and i drew emrakul turn 3 (was the 4th card after my ponder) I had 0 wincons at this point so i spent 3 turns draw-going til i could discard it. Still managed to draw into poly+spawning breath but the breath was countered when i tried to hit a clique with it. Scooped then.
G3 (back to ascension plan). Game totally under control. Thoughtseized turn 1 but i had 2 ascensions so he took a manamorphose. Turn 2 bitterblossom followed by turn 3 tectonic edge on my cascade bluffs left me with no red source. Finished the game with 3 fallouts and 2 bolts in hand as i died to 1/1 tokens. Couldnt draw a red source or manamorphose in about 5 turns of cantrips and drawing.
Round 2 vs Boros. G1 i combo off to fast. He scoops when i start taking infinite turns.
G2. Lynx, gob guide + lynx with fetches all the way kills me fast as i cant get a foothold.
G3 i combo off to fast. Boros is a very easy match if you play call to mind and time warp. Use your bolts to stay in the game then go infinite and win.
Round 3. Some random standard U/W control deck. I combo out twice and win 2-0 easily.
Round 4 Boros again. G1 I win easily, cryptic command kept me going til i combo off.
G2 In total control, taking infinite turns, and i draw 1 too many cards accidentally off a cantrip and get a game loss.
G3 frustrated at myself, i tilted badly and lose. Made a series of misplays that were very ugly. If not i could have won. This round should have ended 2-0 if i didnt stuff up myself when comboing off in G2.
In my opinion the deck is pretty resilient. More so than it seems on paper. You run enough removal and control that anything except super aggro starts from RDW or Boros is a fair match. Didnt play valakut but i think post board they cant beat us. And with some well timed leaks and cryptics G1 can still go our way. Fae seems hard but it isnt too bad. On the play i would put the match in our favour. Just remember to hide your ascensions with ponder once they've brought in thoughtsieze/IoK and its not too bad. With the green splash you can bring in natures claim for their bitterblossom. Once you stabilise your CA puts you in a strong position.
Someone got any idea if trying Noxius Revival or Gitaxian Probe would be good. Both are technically free, which is always useful.
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Nyarlathotep must all things be told
for he is the messenger between the spheres
and the traveler between the realms of the living and the dead.
He shall summon forth the ancient ones
and wake them from their deathly slumber
then shall the elder signs be shattered. Trade Thread
This was the last deck I played beofre M10 and the Alara block cycled out. I'm wondering what a build without Ponder and Preordain would be like, since they are both banned in Extended, would be like. Ideas?
This was the last deck I played beofre M10 and the Alara block cycled out. I'm wondering what a build without Ponder and Preordain would be like, since they are both banned in Extended, would be like. Ideas?
extended is pretty much a dead format. thats the only problem. I wish it had a purpose but without a PTQ season there is no reason to play the format when compared to modern
Hey, im building a PA deck and was wondering if this would be a good idea, and if anyone has tested it. (im new to the extended format)
Put in Archive Traps, as well as traumatizes. And since there are a lot of fetch lands forcing your opponent to search their library, then you can cast archive trap for free, so then once PA has enough couners you could potentially mill your opponent? or at least take key parts of the deck out, and put them in the graveyard.
??? Are you asking for a list that we would take if we went to a PTQ?
4x Lightning Bolt
4x Burst Lightning
4x Volcanic Fallout
4x Mana Leak
4x Cryptic Command
4x Preordain
4x Ponder
2x See Beyond
4x Manamorphose
4x Pyromancer Ascension
4x Cascade Bluffs
4x Scalding Tarn
2x Halimar Depths
6x Island
6x Mountain
3x Spell Pierce
2x Into the Roil
2x Sphinx of Jwar Isle
3x Vendilion Clique
2x Jace Beleren
2x Flashfreeze
1x Deprive
The SB is rough and just to give an idea of some sort of non-transformational SB (although it does allow for some sort of man-plan post board.)
I think people are looking at BR for a variety of reasons:
1: LSV did something with a BR list...if LSV does something people pay attention.
2: UR PA doesnt give a lot of room for innovating so people who like to tinker are playing around.
3: People realize that UR is only Tier 1.5 and because they really like the card/deck they are trying really hard to find something that might make it viable.
While the deck can do too much to itself, PA can actually do pretty good against fast aggro..8 bolts and md volcanic fallout combined with either counters for blue or hand disruption for black actually give you pretty decent game.
PA did okay at worlds, but you have to realize that Worlds was not a very strong field. Yes amazing players and deck buildiers blah blah blah...but there was no truly established meta game. Even so PA wasnt really even that amazing at that point.
That said, no I wouldnt take it to a PTQ...although id certainly take it to FNM or other smaller Extended tournament. I find the deck extremely fun to play and outside of maybe Wargate probably the most interesting deck availible to play, CounterBurn with a "combo" built in is just good times.
I love PA and I wont stop playing it, but yah...for a GP probably just not going to cut it...still love it though, love the feel of the deck.
What 3 toughness creatures are in the format right now that you are worried about. If you have an active ascension, you dont need any help to win
for he is the messenger between the spheres
and the traveler between the realms of the living and the dead.
He shall summon forth the ancient ones
and wake them from their deathly slumber
then shall the elder signs be shattered.
Trade Thread
Nonetheless, I only run 2...and also run call to mind, which helps to make the combo infinite.
Anyway, the Denver Ext PTQ is Sunday. I think I am going to take this deck.
What are the good SB cards given the current ext meta?
Standard
Blows
Modern
BWUTeachingsBWU
GUGU TempoGU
WLifeW
RWValakut ControlRW
UBModern MillUB
Legacy
UMUCU
BPoxB
BWRTokensBWR
Pauper
UBGRW Domain UBGRW
Vintage
RVise-Burn!R
"Out of the crooked timber of humanity, nothing straight was ever made" - Immanuel Kant
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Cascade Bluffs
7 Mountains
8 Islands
Enchantments:
4 Pyromancer Ascension
Spells:
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Burst Lightning
4 Manamorphose
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
4 Into the Roil
4 Cryptic Command
3 Call to Mind
2 Time Warp
4 Volcanic Fallout
4 Howling Mine
4 Runeflare Trap
3 Font of Mythos
I decided to run a switchboard that turns into a very very aggressive version of the Runeflare Trap combo, It just wrecks control in every game I've playtested. They can't really do anything with all of the extra cards. Also the 4 Volcanic Fallouts for the obvious reasons.
Standard: In Transition
Modern: RG Urzatron
Legacy: W Mighty Quinn
UW Stoneblade
Vintage: GWU "Classic" Angel Oath
GW Enchantress
It seems a bit weak there as you cant really deal with a bitterblossom
Standard
Goblins
Extended
Nothing
Legacy
Spring tide
MY twitter
Http://twitter.com/Piggyboy1
Standard: In Transition
Modern: RG Urzatron
Legacy: W Mighty Quinn
UW Stoneblade
Vintage: GWU "Classic" Angel Oath
GW Enchantress
3 Cascade Bluffs
2 Flooded Grove
1 Forest
4 Island
4 Misty Rainforest
3 Mountain
4 Scalding Tarn
Instant:
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Mana Leak
2 Volcanic Fallout
4 Manamorphose
4 Cryptic Command
4 Ponder
4 Preordain
1 Red Sun's Zenith
4 Explore
2 Time Warp
Other:
4 Pyromancer Ascension
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
3 Nature's Claim
3 Trapmaker's Snare
1 Volcanic Fallout
1 Ravenous Trap
4 Archive Trap
1 Time Warp
2 Inferno Titan
I took this build to the PTQ in San Antonio last Saturday. Made the top 8 and lost out to a bant aggro. If I could rebuild it and go again I would definately change the sideboard to make a bigger transition into a normal RUG build. I anticipated the enchantment hate post-board but I did not realize how much trouble I would have with the enchantment hate + Red removal hate and that's what got me. Changing out the pyro package for a RUG build would have given me much better game post-board against any deck with white in it.
Valakut was definitely the hardest matchup, pre-board I was around 40%. Boarding out the Fallouts, Bolts and Jace to bring in the trap package brings the matchup up to a good 70% in my favor.
Faeries was the second hardest matchup in testing but I dodged it in the PTQ.
UQ Mystic and Bant was a blowout game 1 in every match, game 2 with bant was difficult but UW had nothing for me post board.
The biggest thing the green splash does it give me a very consistent turn 4-5 win with the added cantrip and ramp from Explore. It's much easier to go off on the combo when the extra lands I draw go into play instead of into the graveyard or back into the library, I can't stress enough how much the explores make the deck work in the current environment.
Edit: I almost forgot, the 1 off Red Sun was a lifesaver. It won the game multiple times when I had to use my bolts/fallouts to stabilize and the exile/shuffle clauses are amazing in this deck. On two different occasions I used it for removal and won the game with it the next turn when I dug it back out with cantrips and once it exiled a Vengevine to buy me an extra turn to win. Also the 1 Ravenous trap kept me from losing a game 3 vs Valakut when he pulled Kozilek in from the board, respond to the Koz trigger with Trapmaker's Snare to dig it out and victory.
How do you beat uw and Bant?
Fae is about resolving a win con and protecting it correct?
com
Standard
Goblins
Extended
Nothing
Legacy
Spring tide
MY twitter
Http://twitter.com/Piggyboy1
Your biggest problem is lack of pro-active plays; 4 Pyro only. Splinter-Twin is horrendous against the removal and counter-suites available (and being played) against those decks.
Boros, for instance, is a much better choice, or even RDW, if you're intention is to win the event and not merely make up the #s.
-TEAM REVOLUTION
Its about those decks so i have an idea about the meta.
I will be playing what i am comfortable playing and think will win.
I have experience playing the deck so i was asking questions.
Standard
Goblins
Extended
Nothing
Legacy
Spring tide
MY twitter
Http://twitter.com/Piggyboy1
When the 2 best players in the country don't like the deck, maybe that ought to tell you something ... so should asking for SB'ing advice for the top 3 decks, 1 week before the PTQ.
Regardless, I'm not trying to put you on tilt, merely offer an informed view of the local metagame.
-TEAM REVOLUTION
Round 1, fae Lost 2-1. G1 comboed out fairly early after ramping with explore.
G2 (was using the polymorph strat with only a single Emrakul as a target) and i drew emrakul turn 3 (was the 4th card after my ponder) I had 0 wincons at this point so i spent 3 turns draw-going til i could discard it. Still managed to draw into poly+spawning breath but the breath was countered when i tried to hit a clique with it. Scooped then.
G3 (back to ascension plan). Game totally under control. Thoughtseized turn 1 but i had 2 ascensions so he took a manamorphose. Turn 2 bitterblossom followed by turn 3 tectonic edge on my cascade bluffs left me with no red source. Finished the game with 3 fallouts and 2 bolts in hand as i died to 1/1 tokens. Couldnt draw a red source or manamorphose in about 5 turns of cantrips and drawing.
Round 2 vs Boros. G1 i combo off to fast. He scoops when i start taking infinite turns.
G2. Lynx, gob guide + lynx with fetches all the way kills me fast as i cant get a foothold.
G3 i combo off to fast. Boros is a very easy match if you play call to mind and time warp. Use your bolts to stay in the game then go infinite and win.
Round 3. Some random standard U/W control deck. I combo out twice and win 2-0 easily.
Round 4 Boros again. G1 I win easily, cryptic command kept me going til i combo off.
G2 In total control, taking infinite turns, and i draw 1 too many cards accidentally off a cantrip and get a game loss.
G3 frustrated at myself, i tilted badly and lose. Made a series of misplays that were very ugly. If not i could have won. This round should have ended 2-0 if i didnt stuff up myself when comboing off in G2.
In my opinion the deck is pretty resilient. More so than it seems on paper. You run enough removal and control that anything except super aggro starts from RDW or Boros is a fair match. Didnt play valakut but i think post board they cant beat us. And with some well timed leaks and cryptics G1 can still go our way. Fae seems hard but it isnt too bad. On the play i would put the match in our favour. Just remember to hide your ascensions with ponder once they've brought in thoughtsieze/IoK and its not too bad. With the green splash you can bring in natures claim for their bitterblossom. Once you stabilise your CA puts you in a strong position.
for he is the messenger between the spheres
and the traveler between the realms of the living and the dead.
He shall summon forth the ancient ones
and wake them from their deathly slumber
then shall the elder signs be shattered.
Trade Thread
www.moi-rai.com
Gitaxian Probe, See Beyond, Forbidden Alchemy, Think Twice could all work
Alchemy seems really good since you both fill up your graveyard while digging 4 cards deep for your Ascension. It will make the deck slower though.
Standard
Goblins
Extended
Nothing
Legacy
Spring tide
MY twitter
Http://twitter.com/Piggyboy1
Put in Archive Traps, as well as traumatizes. And since there are a lot of fetch lands forcing your opponent to search their library, then you can cast archive trap for free, so then once PA has enough couners you could potentially mill your opponent? or at least take key parts of the deck out, and put them in the graveyard.
still deciding haha
TRADERS!
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=9149559#post9149559