Jund is a four letter world in the Magic world. If you didn't play Magic at all in 2009, you missed a Standard format absolutely centralized around beating the "bad guy," Jund.
Now Jund is trying to play the format's uneasy anti-hero, eschewing the gaudy Vengevines of Standard by adding a much-needed two-drop, Fauna Shaman, to the deck to fetch recursive one-card creature combo Demigod of Revenge. Faeries may be able to bounce back after a Volcanic Fallout, they may be able to counter one Demigod, but they simply cannot deal with the other 3 swinging at them... at least not unless they were more or less already clear to win the match.
Will Jund become our Dark Knight? Or our Harvey Dent? Tension! Thrills! Chills! Suspense!
I like this list but my concern is how does it rebuild itself after say a DOJ or a hallowed burial?
Also I'd like to see the number of tap lands go down and the number of reflecting pools go from 1 to 4. Any help or advice on why this my not be optimal would be ideal.
Fauna shaman seems like it'd be a perfect candidate to be a 2-of. Don't want to rely on him too much. More like an "oops, i win with stupid double demi/bloodbraid" for the later game if you couldn't quite get there with the first wave. I have to test it a little to know for sure though.
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The inclusion of Fauna Shaman adds so much to the deck while taking away practically nothing. The opportunity cost of tossing a couple in is basically free, all the while adding another half a playset of two-drops and smoothing out Jund's infi-three-drop curve immensely. The beauty of Fauna Shaman in the deck is the fact that it can still function close to optimal if it never sees one. Jund is not a 'Fauna Shaman deck', but its inclusion is pretty much free, and I hear turning every creature you draw into a Bloodbraid Elf is some-good. Cascading into it is inconvenient at times, but i've been so impressed by it that i'm up to three now, and have considered cutting Leeches for a full set. Unfortunately, Scapeshift variants are pretty popular in my meta, and Shaman chains are a wee bit slow there.
I brought this up before the thread was reset, but I was wondering, how has Volcanic Fallout been performing for you guys? I have been unimpressed, and view Fallout as unnecessary, but i'm at a stage in testing where it may be time to give a couple another shot.
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Is imposible to cut off putrid leech card, I always Wanted in tuurn 2 , but I think I always wanted...
Fauna Shaman jund's is more consistent but more slow, and perhaps the "discard demigod>seek anathamancer or another demigod" is the way to win 5cc/4cc, faeries, in aggro matchups, and even mirror matchups is more worthy putrid leech, boggarg, bloodbraid elf: because shaman is a must kill target, jund can do it and he fauna shaman player keeps a hand with demigods and the mos probable part is when he use it, he have to defend his life score with demigods, and putrid leech take down one of those.
I don't notice a difference in the velocity of Fauna Shaman Jund variants. In fact, i'd argue the builds that run both Fauna Shaman and Putrid are faster AND more consistent because they hit their two-drop more consistently. One of Jund's past problems is that if they hit an opening hand with no T2 leech, they are way behind their opponent in development and spend the rest of the game playing catch-up (which, thanks to BBE, is entirely possible). Against control and combo, I find many situations where it is beneficial to throw out Fauna Shaman just as a beater. What people need to understand is that Fauna Shaman is not meant to function solely as Survival of the Fittest. The key to playing Fauna Shaman correctly is knowing when to attack, and knowing when it is best to stunt your development to set up for future turns. Example:
T2 Fauna Shaman, T3 Finks, attack for two
OR
T2 Fauna Shaman, T3 Putrid Leech, activate Shaman, discarding Finks for Bloodbraid Elf. (for the record, T2 leech is probably the ideal play. This is for example's sake. But there are times...)
Neither one is correct in a vacuum. The beauty is that Fauna Shaman gives you that choice.
Realistically, Fauna Shaman will die. The reality is, I usualy don't care. I am playing Jund. This deck is built for the very purpose of burying opponents hoping to win games with 1-for-1 trades.
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We are the middle children of history. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War is a spiritual war... our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off.
I agree witth more 2 drops for Jund, sometines is very dificult to put pression (jund best weapon) with no 2 drops.
And the volcanic discussion, for me seems to be irremplazable, I have 4 sb and 4 great Sable too, that to faerie is terrible, and with that and all you still can lose the game. I can imagine Jund Charm against Fae.
also Skinrender is great for mirror and all decks running kitchen finks, horrible against fae...
If someone want to put the records and what match is in jund favor and wich don't I will be very gratefull. thinks is a well choice to open a jund threath and help people running it.
Are the Jund Charm for fae? I'm asking the question specifically for the fae matchup, since I have found more success with instant hard removal and Bituminous Blast. I lose more games to Wurmcoils, Walls of Tanglecord, Tar Pits, and Clique shenanigans than I do to Bitterblossom tokens, though admittedly i've been doing quite well against fae without Fallout.
@Kristain
I'm not a fan of Skinrender. Spot removal in the Jund mirror is terrible as-is, and Shriekmaw is just better against any other creature-based strategy.
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We are the middle children of history. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War is a spiritual war... our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off.
All is reduced to the strategy of jund MD plan's, Skinrender kill Kithchen finks, Shriekmaw too but you don't want to have it back, also kill leech, boggart, reduce 2/1 demigod, and don't have the "no black target" condition.
Other card people tell me is good is Consume The Meek to the sb. But I have my doubt because practicly kill my entire creatures.
Recently I played against Mythics and lost, I dont have sb for them, is a trouble match, speaking for myself.
I really like the lists here. I am also runing Jund Charm as well. Fallout is only needed in the fae MU and that's it. I like the versitiliy of JC. I was debating on making some cuts. I was thinking of cutting the bolts for more stuff and the 4th JC. Or cutting JC and playing the 4th bolt and stuff. I have no fae players to test against. How well do we do against fae and others without some kind of pyroclasm effect? Or bolt? I'm running x3 of both right now but have thought of cutting one or the other.
I really don't see any reason to run Jund Charm over Fallout.
A) Jund Charm is incredible mana intensive, and while it is fairly easy to hit our colors, I don't want to risk stumbling.
B) Jund Charm and Fallout are equally good against Elves!, Tempered Steel, and other weenie styles. However, Fallout is much, much, much better against Faeries.
C) The reason to run Jund Charm is for it's other abilities. However, those other abilities are rarely used. The Tormod's Crypt ability is fairly good, but it is only good against a handful of decks... which we already have a good matchup against. The most popular one would be Necrotic Ooze, and let's face it. We have so much removal they will never assemble the combo (and Jund Charm is really bad against them since they will just color screw us).
Did u erase the 48 pages of awesome info that was on here?
*edit: The list u posted got 3rd, not second.
No. I started a new thread specifically because 48 pages of info, much of which was posted prior to the Extended season actually starting, is an immense amount of often outdated or incorrect information to have to read through for a new poster.
All threads in Competitive are moved to the Extended Archives, where you can still read, take data from, and discuss old topics.
@kristain i agree with you i think demigod is the nutlow and not worth playing i have haveing to get to 5 mana to play my win card
i think chameleon colossus is much better and iv been playing cloudthresher and its been so good not even as a hard cast monster but hust evokeing is good vs faires
im working on a list for a ptq this week so ill post soon
I really don't see any reason to run Jund Charm over Fallout.
A) Jund Charm is incredible mana intensive, and while it is fairly easy to hit our colors, I don't want to risk stumbling.
If your manabase is already built to support T2 Leech consistently, the difference between hitting RGB versus 1RR doesn't seem all that significant to me.
So to me, it's more about whether you want the card that's significantly better against Fae or the card that does extra against everyone else in your main deck.
@kristain i agree with you i think demigod is the nutlow and not worth playing i have haveing to get to 5 mana to play my win card
i think chameleon colossus is much better and iv been playing cloudthresher and its been so good not even as a hard cast monster but hust evokeing is good vs faires
im working on a list for a ptq this week so ill post soon
You dont like waitingto get to 5 mana but you want to play cloudthresher?
well in my personal opinion when Fauna shaman is played its just way to vunirable to everything spell pierce, lighning bolt and so on its just a lil to much of a gamble to me.
Now Jund is trying to play the format's uneasy anti-hero, eschewing the gaudy Vengevines of Standard by adding a much-needed two-drop, Fauna Shaman, to the deck to fetch recursive one-card creature combo Demigod of Revenge. Faeries may be able to bounce back after a Volcanic Fallout, they may be able to counter one Demigod, but they simply cannot deal with the other 3 swinging at them... at least not unless they were more or less already clear to win the match.
Will Jund become our Dark Knight? Or our Harvey Dent? Tension! Thrills! Chills! Suspense!
3 Blackcleave Cliffs
3 Copperline Gorge
1 Fire-Lit Thicket
1 Forest
1 Graven Cairns
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mountain
4 Raging Ravine
1 Reflecting Pool
4 Savage Lands
2 Swamp
4 Twilight Mire
3 Anathemancer
4 Bloodbraid Elf
4 Demigod of Revenge
3 Fauna Shaman
4 Kitchen Finks
4 Putrid Leech
Spells
4 Blightning
4 Lightning Bolt
4 Maelstrom Pulse
3 Nature's Claim
3 Obstinate Baloth
1 Shriekmaw
4 Thoughtseize
4 Volcanic Fallout
Please keep all comments on topic!
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Also I'd like to see the number of tap lands go down and the number of reflecting pools go from 1 to 4. Any help or advice on why this my not be optimal would be ideal.
What about Vengevine? Why isnt she on this list?
Standard: RUG Humans
Modern: Delver RUG
*Legacy: Zoo
*edit: The list u posted got 3rd, not second.
A couple of us were wondering why Putrid Leech is bad. I ALWAYS want leech 2nd turn. Seems like the key to beating Wargate and Faeries.
I brought this up before the thread was reset, but I was wondering, how has Volcanic Fallout been performing for you guys? I have been unimpressed, and view Fallout as unnecessary, but i'm at a stage in testing where it may be time to give a couple another shot.
Fauna Shaman jund's is more consistent but more slow, and perhaps the "discard demigod>seek anathamancer or another demigod" is the way to win 5cc/4cc, faeries, in aggro matchups, and even mirror matchups is more worthy putrid leech, boggarg, bloodbraid elf: because shaman is a must kill target, jund can do it and he fauna shaman player keeps a hand with demigods and the mos probable part is when he use it, he have to defend his life score with demigods, and putrid leech take down one of those.
T2 Fauna Shaman, T3 Finks, attack for two
OR
T2 Fauna Shaman, T3 Putrid Leech, activate Shaman, discarding Finks for Bloodbraid Elf. (for the record, T2 leech is probably the ideal play. This is for example's sake. But there are times...)
Neither one is correct in a vacuum. The beauty is that Fauna Shaman gives you that choice.
Realistically, Fauna Shaman will die. The reality is, I usualy don't care. I am playing Jund. This deck is built for the very purpose of burying opponents hoping to win games with 1-for-1 trades.
As for the fallout discussion, I just like Jund Charm's versatility a lot more and am running 3 atm.
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And the volcanic discussion, for me seems to be irremplazable, I have 4 sb and 4 great Sable too, that to faerie is terrible, and with that and all you still can lose the game. I can imagine Jund Charm against Fae.
also Skinrender is great for mirror and all decks running kitchen finks, horrible against fae...
If someone want to put the records and what match is in jund favor and wich don't I will be very gratefull. thinks is a well choice to open a jund threath and help people running it.
Are the Jund Charm for fae? I'm asking the question specifically for the fae matchup, since I have found more success with instant hard removal and Bituminous Blast. I lose more games to Wurmcoils, Walls of Tanglecord, Tar Pits, and Clique shenanigans than I do to Bitterblossom tokens, though admittedly i've been doing quite well against fae without Fallout.
@Kristain
I'm not a fan of Skinrender. Spot removal in the Jund mirror is terrible as-is, and Shriekmaw is just better against any other creature-based strategy.
Other card people tell me is good is Consume The Meek to the sb. But I have my doubt because practicly kill my entire creatures.
Recently I played against Mythics and lost, I dont have sb for them, is a trouble match, speaking for myself.
A) Jund Charm is incredible mana intensive, and while it is fairly easy to hit our colors, I don't want to risk stumbling.
B) Jund Charm and Fallout are equally good against Elves!, Tempered Steel, and other weenie styles. However, Fallout is much, much, much better against Faeries.
C) The reason to run Jund Charm is for it's other abilities. However, those other abilities are rarely used. The Tormod's Crypt ability is fairly good, but it is only good against a handful of decks... which we already have a good matchup against. The most popular one would be Necrotic Ooze, and let's face it. We have so much removal they will never assemble the combo (and Jund Charm is really bad against them since they will just color screw us).
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UBRGLegacy StormGRBU
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that depends. Do you like a card that's really good against fae/4cc?
No. I started a new thread specifically because 48 pages of info, much of which was posted prior to the Extended season actually starting, is an immense amount of often outdated or incorrect information to have to read through for a new poster.
All threads in Competitive are moved to the Extended Archives, where you can still read, take data from, and discuss old topics.
Common sense and a search function go a long way.
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That's socratic method!
Answer: Yeah! But, like anathemancer too, and 3 thoughseize MD. I think thats my hole plan. I note fauna jund a bit slowy then original jund.
i think chameleon colossus is much better and iv been playing cloudthresher and its been so good not even as a hard cast monster but hust evokeing is good vs faires
im working on a list for a ptq this week so ill post soon
If your manabase is already built to support T2 Leech consistently, the difference between hitting RGB versus 1RR doesn't seem all that significant to me.
So to me, it's more about whether you want the card that's significantly better against Fae or the card that does extra against everyone else in your main deck.
You dont like waitingto get to 5 mana but you want to play cloudthresher?
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