Definitely a meta call. I think you stated this a little missleadingly... you should play which ever you would sb out less. In my case the correct move is to play Nighthawk actually
What meta do you like nighthawk?
I only brought it in against boros and elves
I kept it sb against bant, mirror, control.
Since bant and mirror are the tricky matchups md vendillion over nighthawk is going to be the right call the majority of the time.
I like him vs Boros, Elves, but also Red, Tempered Steel, and WW. I see more Red than Bant around here I drop Jace and one Thoughtseize for another IoK and a singleton Cancel. In a more developed meta, Nighthawk is not the right choice, but I think it's important to point out sometimes it is.
I like him vs Boros, Elves, but also Red, Tempered Steel, and WW. I see more Red than Bant around here I drop Jace and one Thoughtseize for another IoK and a singleton Cancel. In a more developed meta, Nighthawk is not the right choice, but I think it's important to point out sometimes it is.
I agree, in a defined meta in your area, you obv can make the necessary changes.
I like him vs Boros, Elves, but also Red, Tempered Steel, and WW. I see more Red than Bant around here I drop Jace and one Thoughtseize for another IoK and a singleton Cancel. In a more developed meta, Nighthawk is not the right choice, but I think it's important to point out sometimes it is.
That is true but my problem is all else equal clique is the better choice. Clique allows you to outplay your opponent even in matchups where it isn't as good. It gives you options, nighthawk does not. In a control deck like faeries I will always pick the increase options.
I don't think md a solution to rdw and boros is worth losing a valuable tool against bant and naya which are arguably some of our worse matchups. I also think tempered steel aggro is ultimately just jank and clique keeping tezz off the board plus some well timed tempo is game against that deck.
Nighthawk is good against elves but not amazing, in that matchup clique is only barely worse.
That is true but my problem is all else equal clique is the better choice. Clique allows you to outplay your opponent even in matchups where it isn't as good. It gives you options, nighthawk does not. In a control deck like faeries I will always pick the increase options.
I don't think md a solution to rdw and boros is worth losing a valuable tool against bant and naya which are arguably some of our worse matchups. I also think tempered steel aggro is ultimately just jank and clique keeping tezz off the board plus some well timed tempo is game against that deck.
Nighthawk is good against elves but not amazing, in that matchup clique is only barely worse.
You make some good points. I don't find Bant that bad though, after sb I have 4 discard spells, 3x Clique, 4x Disfigure, 3x Flashfreeze, and 2x Unsummon to deal with it.
Steel Aggro is definitely not "just Jank". The list I play against (which I designed) is this:
Hehe I just came here to post about Into the Roil. Seems I was beaten to the punch. Into the Roil is a nice versatile cantrip, allows you to play a more tempo based game combined with your Cryptic Commands and solves a lot of problems this deck has when combined with discard spells and Vendilion Cliques (i.e bouce Sword of Feast and Famine ((or Bitterblossom, or Mirran Crusader, or Prismatic Omen....)) eot, Inquisition of Kozilek on your turn etc.) I am also running a couple Preordains to help tie this plan together and because I am getting sick of how inconsistent this deck can be. I've went top 8, 1-2 drop, top 8, 2-2 drop in my last 4 PTQ's. My list:
I was down to 1 Mana Leak. It's not that great right now. I figured at that point a hard counter would just be better, especially if I'm planning on bounce/countering things in the mid game. I'm down to 4 removal spells main so I figured I needed them to be able to kill whatever needed to be killed, no questions asked, so I went with Go for the Throat. However Disfigure fits the tempo plan better but in the end I went with the more powerful spell. I'll be in Philly this weekend PTQing, if anyone's going i'll see you there.
Hehe I just came here to post about Into the Roil. Seems I was beaten to the punch. Into the Roil is a nice versatile cantrip, allows you to play a more tempo based game combined with your Cryptic Commands and solves a lot of problems this deck has when combined with discard spells and Vendilion Cliques (i.e bouce Sword of Feast and Famine ((or Bitterblossom, or Mirran Crusader, or Prismatic Omen....)) eot, Inquisition of Kozilek on your turn etc.) I am also running a couple Preordains to help tie this plan together and because I am getting sick of how inconsistent this deck can be. I've went top 8, 1-2 drop, top 8, 2-2 drop in my last 4 PTQ's. My list:
I was down to 1 Mana Leak. It's not that great right now. I figured at that point a hard counter would just be better, especially if I'm planning on bounce/countering things in the mid game. I'm down to 4 removal spells main so I figured I needed them to be able to kill whatever needed to be killed, no questions asked, so I went with Go for the Throat. However Disfigure fits the tempo plan better but in the end I went with the more powerful spell. I'll be in Philly this weekend PTQing, if anyone's going i'll see you there.
I had planned on going to the convention center but it's 4 hours away so I'm not going to male the trip. Good luck and let us know how u do!
Hehe I just came here to post about Into the Roil. Seems I was beaten to the punch. Into the Roil is a nice versatile cantrip, allows you to play a more tempo based game combined with your Cryptic Commands and solves a lot of problems this deck has when combined with discard spells and Vendilion Cliques (i.e bouce Sword of Feast and Famine ((or Bitterblossom, or Mirran Crusader, or Prismatic Omen....)) eot, Inquisition of Kozilek on your turn etc.) I am also running a couple Preordains to help tie this plan together and because I am getting sick of how inconsistent this deck can be. I've went top 8, 1-2 drop, top 8, 2-2 drop in my last 4 PTQ's. My list:
I was down to 1 Mana Leak. It's not that great right now. I figured at that point a hard counter would just be better, especially if I'm planning on bounce/countering things in the mid game. I'm down to 4 removal spells main so I figured I needed them to be able to kill whatever needed to be killed, no questions asked, so I went with Go for the Throat. However Disfigure fits the tempo plan better but in the end I went with the more powerful spell. I'll be in Philly this weekend PTQing, if anyone's going i'll see you there.
Blocking great sable stag and mirran crusader, as well as other random sworded guys. It's also not that bad against vengevine decks and certain builds of mono-red and boros.
Blocking great sable stag and mirran crusader, as well as other random sworded guys. It's also not that bad against vengevine decks and certain builds of mono-red and boros.
This is completely correct. Blocks GSS and Crusader for the most value.
It only seems bad. In practice, it won't be killed. Not many players would be willing to waste their best removal on a 0/1 creature, and would rather use it on anything but.
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"If you don't wear your seatbelt, the police will shoot you in the head."
- To my youngest sister when she was 6.
Everyone knows that good luck and good game are such insincere terms that any man who does not connect his right hook with the offender's jaw on the very utterance of such a phrase is no man I would consider as such.
Why would Myr be better than Wall if Tanglecord? Also, I think Unsummon may be better than Roil because bouncing a creature sets someone back more than a sword that can be cheated in for 1W, since except for Bant they are creature lite. The lesser cost may be relevant to counter a recast, and Disfigure/GFtT is a nice reply to re-equipping the sword
Why would Myr be better than Wall if Tanglecord? Also, I think Unsummon may be better than Roil because bouncing a creature sets someone back more than a sword that can be cheated in for 1W, since except for Bant they are creature lite. The lesser cost may be relevant to counter a recast, and Disfigure/GFtT is a nice reply to re-equipping the sword
Myr just won't die all that often, and can block everything the Wall can, and live. You can't keep blocking a Titan with a Wall, but with a Myr you can.
If they want to deal with Darksteel Myr, they have to go to greater lengths than they would have to against the Wall. They can't just throw removal at it like with the Wall of Tanglecord.
On top of that, it can attack. After you wipe the field with Consume the Meek. While wielding a Sword. Really, the only detractor is his cost of three.
Into the Roil is a better than Unsummon. I mean, in every way. Your example of why it is bad is just really poor use. Of course a car is bad if you ram it into a tree. In your example, you think bouncing Mystic is a better play than bouncing the Sword? I'll let that sink in. Hint: paying up to five mana and tapping a creature is slow as ☺☺☺☺.
Not only does Into the Roil allow you to bounce ANYTHING, it also can draw you a card. So, it does everything Unsummon does, along with a ☺☺☺☺ tonne of stuff it can't. For one mana more.
*Why would you bounce something when they can recast it? Just do what everyone else does, and bounce it at the EOT.
Everyone knows that good luck and good game are such insincere terms that any man who does not connect his right hook with the offender's jaw on the very utterance of such a phrase is no man I would consider as such.
Hay everyone, I'm a longtime reader of this thread, but I've only just signed up to make this post actually. I was at an event here in London, England, and my backpack with all my cards was stolen. I've done everything I can to find it, but nothing. The only cards I really cared about were my Faeries deck. Does anyone know anyone who is selling their deck? Or possibly a solid backbone? If you do, please message me. Thank you.
Okay, I've been playtesting Fae for a week plus now, and I'm stuck on a few decisions. Input is appreciated.
Thoughts on: Sword of War and Peace. I've seen lists run Sword of Feast and Famine, and I think the reason is obvious there, but War and Peace brings some good things to the table, most specifically the lifegain to counteract the loss from Bitterblossom. Run both? Run only F&F? Run neither?
Dismember mainboard? I currently run Dismember in the sb, but what are thoughts on it having a place in the mb?
I'll put up a decklist soon. Constantly switching cards in and out, so any list I put up now won't be accurate tomorrow
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"If all the world's a stage, then I'm the temperamental actor refusing to leave his trailer until his ridiculous demands are met." ~Me UBR - Grixis Control UB - Faeries G - Eldrazi U - Surge Node Control RU - Dragonstorm
EDH: G - Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger
Key is remembering tactical use of shades. If you must double-bolt a Rhox War Monk, for instance, the phrase "I guess this time <puts on shades> lightning DID strike twice."
What meta do you like nighthawk?
I only brought it in against boros and elves
I kept it sb against bant, mirror, control.
Since bant and mirror are the tricky matchups md vendillion over nighthawk is going to be the right call the majority of the time.
Anyway my list for reference
3 Mistbind Clique
3 Vendillion clique
3 Spellstutter Sprite
Spells
4 Cryptic
1 Jace the mind sculptor
3 Mana Leak
2 Black sun's zenith
2 Go for the Throat
1 Inquisition of Koziliek
3 thoughseize
3 disfigure
4 bitterblossom
artifacts
2 sword of feast and famin
land
2 tectonic edge
4 mutavault
4 creeping tar pit
4 darkslick shores
4 Secluded Glen
2 Sunken Ruins
3 Drowned catacombs
2 swamp
1 island
2 Sower of temptation
1 spellstutter sprite
2 spell pierce
3 vampire nighthawk
1 thoughtseize
1 disfigure
2 Gatekeeper of malakir
2 wurmcoil engine
1 tectonic edge
Level 1 Judge
Currently Playing:
W Death and Taxes
BGR ScapeWish Nic Fit
BGR Punishing Nic Fit
I agree, in a defined meta in your area, you obv can make the necessary changes.
That is true but my problem is all else equal clique is the better choice. Clique allows you to outplay your opponent even in matchups where it isn't as good. It gives you options, nighthawk does not. In a control deck like faeries I will always pick the increase options.
I don't think md a solution to rdw and boros is worth losing a valuable tool against bant and naya which are arguably some of our worse matchups. I also think tempered steel aggro is ultimately just jank and clique keeping tezz off the board plus some well timed tempo is game against that deck.
Nighthawk is good against elves but not amazing, in that matchup clique is only barely worse.
You make some good points. I don't find Bant that bad though, after sb I have 4 discard spells, 3x Clique, 4x Disfigure, 3x Flashfreeze, and 2x Unsummon to deal with it.
Steel Aggro is definitely not "just Jank". The list I play against (which I designed) is this:
4x Memnite
4x Steel Overseer
4x Court Homunculus
4x Signal Pest
2x Etched Champion
4x Ornithopter
4x Master of Etherium
4x Tidehollow Sculler
3x Mox Opal
3x Springleaf Drum
2x Infiltration Lens
3x Tempered Steel
3x Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas
Land:
2x Plains
2x Swamp
4x Darkslick Shores
4x Marsh Flats
4x Seachrome Coast
Relevant sb cards are Disfigure, Zealous Persecution, and Spell Pierce.
Its a rather good list that I often have trouble with.
My Fae list:
3 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Mistbind Clique
3 Vampire Nighthawk
Spells
4 Cryptic Command
3 Mana Leak
2 Black Sun's Zenith
2 Go for the Throat
2 Inquisition of Koziliek
2 Thoughseize
3 Disfigure
4 Bitterblossom
Artifacts:
2 Sword of Feast and Famine
Lands:
2 Tectonic Edge
4 Mutavault
4 Creeping Tar Pits
4 Darkslick Shores
4 Secluded Glen
2 Sunken Ruins
3 Drowned catacombs
2 swamp
1 island
2 Unsummon
3 Flashfreeze
3 Vendillion Clique
2 Sower of Temptation
2 Spell Pierce
1 Disfigure
2 Wurmcoil Engine
Unsummon is something new I am testing but has been a good out vs SoFaF
Level 1 Judge
Currently Playing:
W Death and Taxes
BGR ScapeWish Nic Fit
BGR Punishing Nic Fit
into the roil is a lot better.
3 Spellstutter Sprite
3 Mistbind Clique
3 Vendilion Clique
Enchantments:
4 Bitterblossom
Card Draw/Filter:
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
2 Preordain
Atrifacts:
1 Sword of Feast and Famine
Utility:
4 Cryptic Command
2 Into the Roil
1 Deprive
3 Thoughtseize
2 Inquisition of Kozilek
Removal:
4 Go for the Throat
Land:
4 Mutavault
4 Creeping Tarpit
4 Secluded Glen
4 Darkslick Shores
2 Sunken Ruins
4 Island
2 Swamp
2 Tectonic Edge
3 Darksteel Myr
3 Sower of Temptation
3 Consume the Meek
2 Wurmcoil Engine
1 Tectonic Edge
2 Flashfreeze
1 Thoughtseize
I was down to 1 Mana Leak. It's not that great right now. I figured at that point a hard counter would just be better, especially if I'm planning on bounce/countering things in the mid game. I'm down to 4 removal spells main so I figured I needed them to be able to kill whatever needed to be killed, no questions asked, so I went with Go for the Throat. However Disfigure fits the tempo plan better but in the end I went with the more powerful spell. I'll be in Philly this weekend PTQing, if anyone's going i'll see you there.
I had planned on going to the convention center but it's 4 hours away so I'm not going to male the trip. Good luck and let us know how u do!
What is Darksteel Myr for?
Level 1 Judge
Currently Playing:
W Death and Taxes
BGR ScapeWish Nic Fit
BGR Punishing Nic Fit
This is completely correct. Blocks GSS and Crusader for the most value.
Well thanks for being bold. Anyways it is actually Pretty good to be honest. It is just too loose of a card for my taste that's all.
It only seems bad. In practice, it won't be killed. Not many players would be willing to waste their best removal on a 0/1 creature, and would rather use it on anything but.
- To my youngest sister when she was 6.
Level 1 Judge
Currently Playing:
W Death and Taxes
BGR ScapeWish Nic Fit
BGR Punishing Nic Fit
Why? Besides the sword/a sworded creature, is there anything you would bounce? I mean, maybe Wurmcoil or something...
Level 1 Judge
Currently Playing:
W Death and Taxes
BGR ScapeWish Nic Fit
BGR Punishing Nic Fit
Myr just won't die all that often, and can block everything the Wall can, and live. You can't keep blocking a Titan with a Wall, but with a Myr you can.
If they want to deal with Darksteel Myr, they have to go to greater lengths than they would have to against the Wall. They can't just throw removal at it like with the Wall of Tanglecord.
On top of that, it can attack. After you wipe the field with Consume the Meek. While wielding a Sword. Really, the only detractor is his cost of three.
Into the Roil is a better than Unsummon. I mean, in every way. Your example of why it is bad is just really poor use. Of course a car is bad if you ram it into a tree. In your example, you think bouncing Mystic is a better play than bouncing the Sword? I'll let that sink in. Hint: paying up to five mana and tapping a creature is slow as ☺☺☺☺.
Not only does Into the Roil allow you to bounce ANYTHING, it also can draw you a card. So, it does everything Unsummon does, along with a ☺☺☺☺ tonne of stuff it can't. For one mana more.
*Why would you bounce something when they can recast it? Just do what everyone else does, and bounce it at the EOT.
- To my youngest sister when she was 6.
Thoughts on:
Sword of War and Peace. I've seen lists run Sword of Feast and Famine, and I think the reason is obvious there, but War and Peace brings some good things to the table, most specifically the lifegain to counteract the loss from Bitterblossom. Run both? Run only F&F? Run neither?
Dismember mainboard? I currently run Dismember in the sb, but what are thoughts on it having a place in the mb?
I'll put up a decklist soon. Constantly switching cards in and out, so any list I put up now won't be accurate tomorrow
UBR - Grixis Control
UB - Faeries
G - Eldrazi
U - Surge Node Control
RU - Dragonstorm
EDH: G - Vorinclex, Voice of Hunger