At least if you hit a Bushwhacker after turn 4, you have a good chance to kick him, which would be a very good play if you have a decent board. Warcaller, on the other, won't be spectacular being played for 3RGG. Bushwhacker can even pick up the Axe for some extra beefiness since he's on the small side.
Except the Warcaller can be a lord if it's pumped. But hard casting I'm liking the bushwacker and moving toward a more 1-2 mana cost deck.
I think the curve its got so far is almost perfect.
2 sets of 1drops (nettle and tattermunge)
2 sets of 2drops (paragon and vanquisher)
2 sets of 3drops (ramgang and giantbaiting)
2 sets of 4drops (bloodbraid and liege)
if you don't miss a drop you win against almost any deck. its so sick it makes mono red look slow.
I'm running a few scenarios thru in my head. It seems like the axes are needed. 2-3 perhaps. I'm thinking paragon and axe in play. Cast Keldon, they take one, then swing for 6 trample, haste. That's so brutal. I even like it with Ruinous Minotaur, 8 damage trample, haste, free if you BBE into it. If you are playing Minotaur then fill up your 3 slot with Countryside Crushers. Which is also a warrior!
the Stingscourger isn't good enough. its basically only useful as a 2 cost bounce and there are better cards that could fit.
likewise, the Viashino Slaughtermaster wouldn't make it because hes not very useful unless he gets a pump. without one he just does the same thing as one of the 1drops but costs as much as a 2drop. our 2drops are already way better.
the Thunder-Thrash Elder can't be considered because he has to eat up our creatures which are all awesome and they will just block/remove him after that so I really don't like him.
the Rip-Clan Crasher and Radha, Heir to Keld look viable and could possibly take the place of the vanquisher. I'd probably be more likely to take the crasher just for the extra damage turn 2. the Heir is cool but you don't get that mana until after you attack. all our finishers (bloodbraid, liege, giantbaiting) we need to cast before attacking. its nice for casting extra burn but unless your opponent is on the verge of death you'd want to save the burn anyway. he'd be really nice to have out turn 2 if you have 2 4drops in your hand.
Ruinous Minotaur is an interesting choice and he might actually have a place in the deck. you can cast him turn 3 and then cast your 4drop next turn before you have to sac a land. I'd sac a land if they'd take 5 more damage sure thing. maybe take out 1 baiting or sarkan for him.
Ok I know you don't like ramgang but I think you need to give it a shot. IMO hes miles better than the crusher and minotuar. Mainly because he always easy to get out turn 3 and has haste. once you bloodbraid into ramgang your opponent will cry.
I know the axe looks good in theory but in play I think its too slow. you have to give up your other awesome play for turn 3, mainly giantbaiting or ramgang or 2 little guys. sure, you can put out a really big crusher or minotaur next turn but they can just block it and that axe is wasted unless you have a paragon out. in a blitz deck like this I'd rather have more creatures out to attack with than stack my resources into one creature.
I also don't like these crushers and minotaurs killing land when we've got 4drops we want to bring out. If you play a crusher and need another land after that you'll be waiting a while. also kind of sucks that if you have a paragon out they can block your minotaur, then take a little trample damage and you still have to sac your land. seems like you could screw yourself with those guys sometimes.
I just can't bring myself to pay 4 for Twinclaws. There are better options. Colossus, Liege, and BBE.
Are you telling me a 4/5 Double Striker haste is worse than a goblin riding a pig? I think it is a devastating card in certain match ups and if you are running War-Axe, you should consider playing Twinclaws.
I think you can play Warrior Elves or Warriors, either seems very strong.
By the way, this deck placed decently (i think 5th or 6th) in a magic league event, I think its relevant to the idea of the deck, even if its not RG:
The mono green version looks like it is a nice alternative deck build, obviously heavy on the elf theme. It looks like the type of deck that can really benefit from the axe and be pretty powerful on turns 4-6 (of earlier if drop T1 mana dork). I don't think it is going to be as explosive out of the gate on average. Lordfat is right, Boggart Ram-Gang seems broken in this deck a lot of the time. There aren't many decks that can deal with bloodbraid into one if there is a paragon or liege out.
I agree with possible dropping Sarkhan to streamline the deck a little more. What if take out Sarkhan and the two burst lightnings for 3 Flame Javelin? We already have 4 1CMC burn spells in lightning bolts to pick off early threats or finish with. The flame jav would usually cost less to do 4 damage than the Burst Lightning. Of course bloodbraid can't hit it, which is a pretty big negative.
I don't think you should take out Wren's Run Vanquisher for the Rip-Clan Crasher. The deathouch on the vanquisher gives her so much utility. Thy synergy with deathtouch and trample effect from paragon make her extremely difficult to ever block profitably. The two hasty damage would be nice but I'd almost rather take out the burst lightnings/sarkhan than take out the vanquisher if I wanted to include the thrasher.
I don't think you should take out Wren's Run Vanquisher for the Rip-Clan Crasher. The deathouch on the vanquisher gives her so much utility. Thy synergy with deathtouch and trample effect from paragon make her extremely difficult to ever block profitably. The two hasty damage would be nice but I'd almost rather take out the burst lightnings/sarkhan than take out the vanquisher if I wanted to include the thrasher.
Taking out the Vanquisher was in reference to dropping the elf theme, I believe.
Indeed it is. I've never not casted the card revealed with BBE so I kinda thought it was a must effect.My mistake. As a may effect then it's totally fine.
likewise, the Viashino Slaughtermaster wouldn't make it because hes not very useful unless he gets a pump. without one he just does the same thing as one of the 1drops but costs as much as a 2drop. our 2drops are already way better.
Agreed. This card needs more pump for it to be effective.
the Thunder-Thrash Elder can't be considered because he has to eat up our creatures which are all awesome and they will just block/remove him after that so I really don't like him.
Was just a consideration. Not a very good one, but thought maybe I could bring it up and someone else could expand on it... Guess not. Case Closed. lol
the Rip-Clan Crasher and Radha, Heir to Keld look viable and could possibly take the place of the vanquisher. I'd probably be more likely to take the crasher just for the extra damage turn 2. the Heir is cool but you don't get that mana until after you attack. all our finishers (bloodbraid, liege, giantbaiting) we need to cast before attacking. its nice for casting extra burn but unless your opponent is on the verge of death you'd want to save the burn anyway. he'd be really nice to have out turn 2 if you have 2 4drops in your hand.
Can't agree with you on that one. Radha is much better imo. Basically she is all around good. You can cast her T2 then T3 BBE or Colossus or something. She also enables you to run Flame Javs with relative ease. But since you wouldn't run 4 of them then the Crasher could take up the rest of the places for vanquisher.
Ruinous Minotaur is an interesting choice and he might actually have a place in the deck. you can cast him turn 3 and then cast your 4drop next turn before you have to sac a land. I'd sac a land if they'd take 5 more damage sure thing. maybe take out 1 baiting or sarkan for him.
It really doesn't have that much of a down side. Games where he comes down early he often gets in for a few damage if the opp wants you to loose some lands or gets chumped. Rarely do I see a bad trade with it happening. Worse case scenario is you cast it and they burn it out or block with bb tokens. None of those are that bad when you consider the bb tokens won't be blocking other things or attacking you. Burning a 3 drop is not the end of the world.
Ok I know you don't like ramgang but I think you need to give it a shot. IMO hes miles better than the crusher and minotuar. Mainly because he always easy to get out turn 3 and has haste. once you bloodbraid into ramgang your opponent will cry.
Ramgang is better then alot of choices. It just doesn't have the power that I'm looking for. Paragon into Ramgang is awesome and very hard to overcome. Yes. Crusher can come down after they sweep your board and then next turn get surprise trample whenever you play a paragon. I would prefer a creature that is has more power and doesn't have to have certain plays to set it up whenever possible. matter of opinion again I suppose.
I know the axe looks good in theory but in play I think its too slow. you have to give up your other awesome play for turn 3, mainly giantbaiting or ramgang or 2 little guys. sure, you can put out a really big crusher or minotaur next turn but they can just block it and that axe is wasted unless you have a paragon out. in a blitz deck like this I'd rather have more creatures out to attack with than stack my resources into one creature.
T1 play Nettle, T2 play Radha (18), T3 play Axe and Tattermunge equip axe and swing for 6 (12). T4 BBE into something and swing, burn out blockers and win(-3 or so life). Pretty strong possible play. T2 Radha is something we should really attempt to do. Late game axe in play is ideal. They sweep you then you play something stupid like a Minotaur or whatever and smash them into fine matter. If no sweepers then it's fine. Every creature you play is an immediate threat, no need to wait a around a turn for it.
The Turn 2 Battle-Axe is devastating (especially followed by a turn 3 Colossus or Packmaster). I've also enjoyed playing Imperious Perfect, attaching the Axe, and making a token and then attaching the battle axe to that for a nice 4/3 hasted elf. The sideboard would be up in the air and I don't like having removal that red gives but still provides some heavy beats.
T1 play Nettle, T2 play Radha (18), T3 play Axe and Tattermunge equip axe and swing for 6 (12). T4 BBE into something and swing, burn out blockers and win(-3 or so life). Pretty strong possible play. T2 Radha is something we should really attempt to do.
Except you couldn't swing for 4 with the tattermunge because you don't get that mana until after you attack. Much less amazing. Not only that, but they can easily have out a 2/2 to trade for radha whereas the vanquisher is much harder to kill early.
Except you couldn't swing for 4 with the tattermunge because you don't get that mana until after you attack. Much less amazing. Not only that, but they can easily have out a 2/2 to trade for radha whereas the vanquisher is much harder to kill early.
I agree with possible dropping Sarkhan to streamline the deck a little more. What if take out Sarkhan and the two burst lightnings for 3 Flame Javelin? We already have 4 1CMC burn spells in lightning bolts to pick off early threats or finish with. The flame jav would usually cost less to do 4 damage than the Burst Lightning. Of course bloodbraid can't hit it, which is a pretty big negative.
I'd consider BBE not hitting it to be a positive, since skipping flame jav for something else is better than hitting a 2 point burst lightening. Although I'd probably still go with burst lightening just because the option to use it on something early outweighs the benefit of spending 4 on it instead of 5 (even with 4 bolts). we already have plenty of stuff to play for 4.
I used to have a R/G Warrior Deck featuring Giants. But it didn't manage to work as well as I wanted it to. It used Bramblewood Paragon, Taurean Mauler, Stonebrow, Krosan Hero and Hamlethback Goliath and the likes. I changed it to a Giant Deck instead.
But after seeing this thread, my love for the warriors came back! I decided to go the mono green / elf warriors route this time:
Well, I'll just move over here.
I've been trying out a creature heavy double strike theme with Viashino Slaughtermaster and Marisi's Twinclaws. I don't have a SB yet, but this seems solid to me.
I have yet to create a sideboard (I'm thinking something along the lines of Guttural Responses, Volcanic Fallouts, Firespouts, and Vithian Renegades). I'm thinking about putting in Sarkhan for the Gougers, and I'm trying to try and fit in a Liege/Colossus somewhere.
However, in today's culture of Justin Bieber, Jersey Shore, and Twilight, where every song on the radio, every program on television and every site on the internet is just another monument to the pinnacle of human stupidity, it's certainly not the worst thing that people could be watching.
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I think the curve its got so far is almost perfect.
2 sets of 1drops (nettle and tattermunge)
2 sets of 2drops (paragon and vanquisher)
2 sets of 3drops (ramgang and giantbaiting)
2 sets of 4drops (bloodbraid and liege)
if you don't miss a drop you win against almost any deck. its so sick it makes mono red look slow.
Other potential cards if we drop the elf theme - Rip-Clan Crasher, Ruinous Minotaur, Stingscourger, Thunder-Thrash Elder, Viashino Slaughtermaster
I just can't bring myself to pay 4 for Twinclaws. There are better options. Colossus, Liege, and BBE.
2 Tattermunge Maniac
3 Lightning Bolt
3 Burst Lightning
4 Keldon Marauders
2 Radha, Heir to Keld
3 Giantbaiting
3 Countryside Crusher
2 Ruinous Minotaur
2 Obsidian Battle-Axe
3 Boartusk Liege
can't drop the BBE thats crazy talk.
the Stingscourger isn't good enough. its basically only useful as a 2 cost bounce and there are better cards that could fit.
likewise, the Viashino Slaughtermaster wouldn't make it because hes not very useful unless he gets a pump. without one he just does the same thing as one of the 1drops but costs as much as a 2drop. our 2drops are already way better.
the Thunder-Thrash Elder can't be considered because he has to eat up our creatures which are all awesome and they will just block/remove him after that so I really don't like him.
the Rip-Clan Crasher and Radha, Heir to Keld look viable and could possibly take the place of the vanquisher. I'd probably be more likely to take the crasher just for the extra damage turn 2. the Heir is cool but you don't get that mana until after you attack. all our finishers (bloodbraid, liege, giantbaiting) we need to cast before attacking. its nice for casting extra burn but unless your opponent is on the verge of death you'd want to save the burn anyway. he'd be really nice to have out turn 2 if you have 2 4drops in your hand.
Ruinous Minotaur is an interesting choice and he might actually have a place in the deck. you can cast him turn 3 and then cast your 4drop next turn before you have to sac a land. I'd sac a land if they'd take 5 more damage sure thing. maybe take out 1 baiting or sarkan for him.
Ok I know you don't like ramgang but I think you need to give it a shot. IMO hes miles better than the crusher and minotuar. Mainly because he always easy to get out turn 3 and has haste. once you bloodbraid into ramgang your opponent will cry.
I know the axe looks good in theory but in play I think its too slow. you have to give up your other awesome play for turn 3, mainly giantbaiting or ramgang or 2 little guys. sure, you can put out a really big crusher or minotaur next turn but they can just block it and that axe is wasted unless you have a paragon out. in a blitz deck like this I'd rather have more creatures out to attack with than stack my resources into one creature.
I also don't like these crushers and minotaurs killing land when we've got 4drops we want to bring out. If you play a crusher and need another land after that you'll be waiting a while. also kind of sucks that if you have a paragon out they can block your minotaur, then take a little trample damage and you still have to sac your land. seems like you could screw yourself with those guys sometimes.
Are you telling me a 4/5 Double Striker haste is worse than a goblin riding a pig? I think it is a devastating card in certain match ups and if you are running War-Axe, you should consider playing Twinclaws.
I think you can play Warrior Elves or Warriors, either seems very strong.
By the way, this deck placed decently (i think 5th or 6th) in a magic league event, I think its relevant to the idea of the deck, even if its not RG:
13 Forest
4 Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
4 Mutavault
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Joraga Warcaller
4 Imperious Perfect
2 Arbor Elf
4 Wren's Run Vanquisher
4 Bramblewood Paragon
2 Chameleon Colossus
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Hunting Triad
3 Tower Above
1 Tower Above
2 Scattershot Archer
2 Guttural Response
2 Elvish Champion
3 Wilt-Leaf Liege
3 Nature's Claim
2 Plummet
You can always add BBE to it.
The mono green version looks like it is a nice alternative deck build, obviously heavy on the elf theme. It looks like the type of deck that can really benefit from the axe and be pretty powerful on turns 4-6 (of earlier if drop T1 mana dork). I don't think it is going to be as explosive out of the gate on average. Lordfat is right, Boggart Ram-Gang seems broken in this deck a lot of the time. There aren't many decks that can deal with bloodbraid into one if there is a paragon or liege out.
I agree with possible dropping Sarkhan to streamline the deck a little more. What if take out Sarkhan and the two burst lightnings for 3 Flame Javelin? We already have 4 1CMC burn spells in lightning bolts to pick off early threats or finish with. The flame jav would usually cost less to do 4 damage than the Burst Lightning. Of course bloodbraid can't hit it, which is a pretty big negative.
I don't think you should take out Wren's Run Vanquisher for the Rip-Clan Crasher. The deathouch on the vanquisher gives her so much utility. Thy synergy with deathtouch and trample effect from paragon make her extremely difficult to ever block profitably. The two hasty damage would be nice but I'd almost rather take out the burst lightnings/sarkhan than take out the vanquisher if I wanted to include the thrasher.
Indeed it is. I've never not casted the card revealed with BBE so I kinda thought it was a must effect.My mistake. As a may effect then it's totally fine.
I was thinking that a build using axe could use this as it would bounce a threat and swing for 4-5 haste before considering the echo cost.
Agreed. This card needs more pump for it to be effective.
Was just a consideration. Not a very good one, but thought maybe I could bring it up and someone else could expand on it... Guess not. Case Closed. lol
Can't agree with you on that one. Radha is much better imo. Basically she is all around good. You can cast her T2 then T3 BBE or Colossus or something. She also enables you to run Flame Javs with relative ease. But since you wouldn't run 4 of them then the Crasher could take up the rest of the places for vanquisher.
It really doesn't have that much of a down side. Games where he comes down early he often gets in for a few damage if the opp wants you to loose some lands or gets chumped. Rarely do I see a bad trade with it happening. Worse case scenario is you cast it and they burn it out or block with bb tokens. None of those are that bad when you consider the bb tokens won't be blocking other things or attacking you. Burning a 3 drop is not the end of the world.
Ramgang is better then alot of choices. It just doesn't have the power that I'm looking for. Paragon into Ramgang is awesome and very hard to overcome. Yes. Crusher can come down after they sweep your board and then next turn get surprise trample whenever you play a paragon. I would prefer a creature that is has more power and doesn't have to have certain plays to set it up whenever possible. matter of opinion again I suppose.
T1 play Nettle, T2 play Radha (18), T3 play Axe and Tattermunge equip axe and swing for 6 (12). T4 BBE into something and swing, burn out blockers and win(-3 or so life). Pretty strong possible play. T2 Radha is something we should really attempt to do. Late game axe in play is ideal. They sweep you then you play something stupid like a Minotaur or whatever and smash them into fine matter. If no sweepers then it's fine. Every creature you play is an immediate threat, no need to wait a around a turn for it.
4 Arbor Elf
4 Wren's Run Vanquisher
4 Imperious Perfect
2 Chameleon Colossus
4 Civic Wayfinder
4 Bramblewood Paragon
3 Wren's Run Packmaster
2 Joraga War Caller
2 Overrun
17 Forest
4 Treetop Village
2 Oran-Reif, The Vastwood
The Turn 2 Battle-Axe is devastating (especially followed by a turn 3 Colossus or Packmaster). I've also enjoyed playing Imperious Perfect, attaching the Axe, and making a token and then attaching the battle axe to that for a nice 4/3 hasted elf. The sideboard would be up in the air and I don't like having removal that red gives but still provides some heavy beats.
4 Arbor Elf
4 Nettle Sentinel
3 Joraga War Caller
2 Fauna Shaman
4 Wren's Run Vanquisher
4 Bramblewood Paragon
2 Nissa's Chosen
4 Imperious Perfect
1 Chameleon Colossus
3 Obsidian Battle-Axe
3 nissa revane
15 Forest
4 Treetop Village
2 Oran-Reif, The Vastwood
3 Scattershot Archer
3 Guttural Response
4 Wilt-Leaf Liege
3 Nature's Claim
2 Plummet
Except you couldn't swing for 4 with the tattermunge because you don't get that mana until after you attack. Much less amazing. Not only that, but they can easily have out a 2/2 to trade for radha whereas the vanquisher is much harder to kill early.
3 Lands and Radha make 4 mana.
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOHH I SEE :cool2::symgr::symgr::symgr:
I'd consider BBE not hitting it to be a positive, since skipping flame jav for something else is better than hitting a 2 point burst lightening. Although I'd probably still go with burst lightening just because the option to use it on something early outweighs the benefit of spending 4 on it instead of 5 (even with 4 bolts). we already have plenty of stuff to play for 4.
But after seeing this thread, my love for the warriors came back! I decided to go the mono green / elf warriors route this time:
I've been trying out a creature heavy double strike theme with Viashino Slaughtermaster and Marisi's Twinclaws. I don't have a SB yet, but this seems solid to me.
3x Llanowar Elf
4x Bramblewood Paragon
2x Goblin Bushwhacker
4x Boggart Ram-Gang
2x Ashenmoor Gouger
4x Marisi's Twinclaws
4x Bloodbraid Elf
4x Lightning Bolt
Artifacts:
4x Obsidian Battle Axe
Sorceries:
3x Giantbaiting
Lands:
4x Fire-Lit Thicket
2x Rootbound Crag
4x Raging Ravine
7x Mountain
5x Forest
I have yet to create a sideboard (I'm thinking something along the lines of Guttural Responses, Volcanic Fallouts, Firespouts, and Vithian Renegades). I'm thinking about putting in Sarkhan for the Gougers, and I'm trying to try and fit in a Liege/Colossus somewhere.
I'm Da_Man on Cockatrice