I said I was going to track Rhand yesterday, hawk. You were voting Rhand until you decided to switch to me, dismissing the usefulness of my track because there was a '50% chance' I was scum. So knowing I was going to track Rhand, you try to use his death to discredit me? I don't think so.
Vote: 7hawk77
Obzedat is back. That's cool. Did it contact you last night, Axel?
Surely AE, hawk, and Taredas can't all be scum, Hunt.
I swear, I halfway think that Rhand was killed just to rub it in my face how off base I was yesterday.
Why are you answering questions from AE? He opens the day not by posting who HE thinks is scum and should be lynched, but who YOU think it should be.
I wanted to see if he would stay consistent.
Notice how Zindabad has called me scum all game, yet refrained from shooting me? If he did at the time eyes would have without a doubt been on him the next day. Now it's all opportunistic. He can come back tomorrow and say "oh well, he wasn't doing anything anyways" as an excuse.
Hawk if I'm lynched make sure you get the town to lynch Zindabad. Or Scarbo.
Who said it yesterday, Rhand? WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD HAWK OR MYSELF USE BATTALION WHEN WE WOULD HAVE BEEN KILLED INSTEAD???? ANSWER THIS!!!!!
I agree Scarbo. But I have no idea which one it could be... My point is simply that I will follow either direction. I am a little gun shy after I was so set on Rhand and was so wrong.
I actually didn't notice Obzedat at first. Thank you for pointing that out.
Obzedat had nothing to say to me last night. Apparently he still thinks I'm scum. Joy.
If I were inclined to lynch a Boros person it would be AE. Zindabad's point is well taken. I do not disagree that he's been basically useless the whole game. My issue there is vague feelings/rememberings that this is not atypical for AE.
I'd do a re-read, but considering how well that turned out in the case of Rhand, I'm not sure I even want to bother anymore. Throwing darts seems like an equally likely method to hit.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Hawk if I'm lynched make sure you get the town to lynch Zindabad. Or Scarbo.
Who said it yesterday, Rhand? WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD HAWK OR MYSELF USE BATTALION WHEN WE WOULD HAVE BEEN KILLED INSTEAD???? ANSWER THIS!!!!!
Thats why Rhand was killed.
Thanks for tell us why you killed Rhand, but what happened to either me or Atog being scum? Atog flipped town, and now your scum read on me evaporated? Might that be because you don't need to kill a gruul to effectively nerf Zinda's ability anymore? Now you just want to kill him off for good measure, or Scarbo, who was our other last PR left? I am not buying this. Your read on me should not have flipped 180 like that overnight.
The whole idea of it. We'd be sacrificing ourselves.
Yeah... But the upshot is the person protected would be confirmed town, which would mean the other Boros is town for protecting the same person, and if there's a bomb between you, that would kill the scum as well, no? Am I misunderstanding something?
One of the Boros is supposedly a Bomb. I have been assuming they (whoever) has been using it to try and predict scum kills. And I'm guessing that may be at least one reason why the scum appear to be trying hard to be unpredictable. For fear of this role. So, in my mind, that might further pseudo-clear the Boros that is the bomb. So if it's AE, maybe he should go ahead and claim it?
I don't know.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
The whole idea of it. We'd be sacrificing ourselves.
Yeah... But the upshot is the person protected would be confirmed town, which would mean the other Boros is town for protecting the same person, and if there's a bomb between you, that would kill the scum as well, no? Am I misunderstanding something?
Why would scum want to confirm a townie? That makes no sense. Now your making roles up too? Lol, keep talking.
You are Aurelia, the Warleader, the guildmaster of the Boros Legion Boros
Abilities:
1. You may vote.
2. Battalion: Each Night, you may target another player. If at least one other Boros player targets that same person with Battalion, the target will be protected in some fashion. More Boros results in stronger protection:
Two: Protect from the first killing ability, but if that player is targeted to be killed, one of the Boros players (chosen at random) will die instead.
Three: Protect from the first killing ability.
Four+: Protect from all abilities.
3. You begin the game with 4 points. Whenever a town player dies, you gain a point.
4. Legion's Initiative: Each Night that you are using Battallion, you may spend X points. X Boros players that are already using Battalion on a different player, chosen at random, will target the player you chose instead. If you overspend points, they will be wasted. (Boros players who are already targeting the player you chose will be excluded from the randomization, as will Boros players who are not using Battalion for whatever reason.)
5. When you die, I will give you a list of other living Boros players, but not their alignments. Choose one of them. That player will gain the following ability: "Target another player at Night. If that player is targeted to be killed, instead you will die, and so will the killer."
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Excellent information. That does make it more likely that the bomb is town. Rhand's bizarre NK after he was all but certain to be mislynch fodder today can also be partially explained by that.
On the other hand, why weren't the scum just killing Boros? If the bomb is NKed, his ability won't work. Unless there's no scum in Boros, and they couldn't be sure which one of AE and Hawk is the bomb, and thought the bomb might logically protect the other Boros player.
actually, re: Obzedat, apparently it doesn't matter. we lynch it, it takes a hiatus, comes back. it wants axel lynched, but we don't know why. I think it's a safe assumption that it's not scum-aligned, so why get rid of it when we can watch its reads evolve?
Oh! It probably wants Axel lynched because he's the last Orzhov, and if there's two scum in Orzhov it has to be him.
Still I don't know. I'm kind of surprised Axel didn't receive a message. I mean sure even if DCIII/Sepi thinks Axel is scum it's not like sending him a message would do any harm. Then again if he is scum we can't really trust him to tell the truth whether he received a message... We can find out though.
@Obzedat: If you communicated with Axel last night, vote yourself. If you did not, vote me. Keep your vote there until the next vote count.
actually, re: Obzedat, apparently it doesn't matter. we lynch it, it takes a hiatus, comes back. it wants axel lynched, but we don't know why. I think it's a safe assumption that it's not scum-aligned, so why get rid of it when we can watch its reads evolve?
I just didn't want it to be able to hammer like it did itself. I feel that we as the actual in game players should reserve that right. But you are correct, it isn't hurting anything. I am just afraid it's reads are NOT going to evolve, and the whole time it will just want to lynch Axel. Which seems really silly to me because of Axel's seemingly obvious towniness to all of us.
If Obz has something to tell us, I would hope it would have tried to send a message to us last night. But Axel says no, it didn't...
@Obz...
If you sent a message to someone, than please vote me by the next votecount. Thank you...
I don't understand why, if one were inclined to vote for a Boros person, you would vote for Hawk over the guy who has lurked the most and done the absolute least this game. Which is AE.
What I am trying to figure right now is the likelyhood of 2 scum vs. 1 scum. I don't know if this can be figured. Seems like there are reasons why they could go for Rhand last night under either scenario, though, I think it somewhat leans more towards the two-scum hypothesis. Because I think one scum would want to keep the Rhand mislynch possibility alive longer, whereas two scum might figure they have enough leeway to shoot a guy who they could probably get lynched the next day.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
And, you know, I would have to be pretty dumb to not pass on an Obzedat message even if I was scum.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
AE's play strikes me as just flat-out bad, not scummy. Hawk, especially today, has been so full of bull***** I can't believe even he believes what he's said.
So, since clearly I'm not going to solve this by looking at individual people anymore, I'm just theorycrafting/metagaming now.
It is possible for there to be an additional Boros scum. Even though that would make 2 scum 1 Neutral out of six total Boros, when one scum already had the ability to ignore the Doc protection. It's possible, and the Guildleader ability to override Boros choices and redirect people could even have been designed to account for this imbalance.
Similarly, it is possible for there to be another scum in Gruul. Even though that makes 2 scum in a guild where votes can get multiplied. It's possible, and the Guildleader ability to basically control all the Gruul people and unilaterlally lynch someone could have been designed to account for this issue.
What I won't believe is that both of these things are true. I don't think I can accept two scum, one remaining in Boros AND one remaining in Gruul. If that's the case, I think I get to be justified afterwards in throwing up my hands and saying this game was bull----. That's without even knowing what kind of over-powered BS role I'm sure Lazhov is.
What I think I'm saying is, if there are still two scum left, I think one of them must be Scarbo.
I think Scarbo may be my safety lynch choice of the day. Because even if that one is wrong, we don't just lose (unless the above BS situation turns out to be true.)
So that may be where I am. This may not help anyone else who is still factoring that I can still be scum here, but it's my worldview.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
The Strike Gold Vote Count 6.3 (As of post #2071)
scarbo (2): 7hawk77, Archmage Eternal
Archmage Eternal (2): Zindabad, Huntzilla
7hawk77 (1): Scarbo
Axelrod (1): Obzedat
For whatever it's worth, this vote count also strongly suggests that if Scarbo is scum (and not the last one) then the other scum is probably in Gruul. Whereas if Scarbo is Town (and we don't just flat out lose with his lynch) the scum is probably Boros.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
I already said Obzedat said nothing to me. I don't know if he could "re-direct" a scum Boros such that ZDS's kill would not have happened. ZDS's role doesn't say that it ignores redirection. maybe the person stil dies, it's just not the person ZDS was shooting for, it's whoever the guildleader was trying to protect. Maybe it didn't work that way, I don't know, but the larger point is that the Guildleader ability would at least somewhat mitigate if there were two scum Boros. Are you just maintaining that two Boros mafia is an impossibility because...that seems like too much scum?
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
The problem is the way things worked out, if one of me and ae were scum, the other would basically know and definitely would have gotten rid of the inherited power role. You can try and speculate that we are both scum but I don't see how that's even a remote possibility.
Voting for boros is blatantly anti town. It's getting rid of or exposing the town bomb.
I still think hunt is town but now I'm torn on zinda.
Axel, why do you think obzedat voted you?
I still think scarbo is scum and is currently my preferred lynch.
Vote: 7hawk77
Obzedat is back. That's cool. Did it contact you last night, Axel?
Surely AE, hawk, and Taredas can't all be scum, Hunt.
I wanted to see if he would stay consistent.
Notice how Zindabad has called me scum all game, yet refrained from shooting me? If he did at the time eyes would have without a doubt been on him the next day. Now it's all opportunistic. He can come back tomorrow and say "oh well, he wasn't doing anything anyways" as an excuse.
Hawk if I'm lynched make sure you get the town to lynch Zindabad. Or Scarbo.
Who said it yesterday, Rhand? WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD HAWK OR MYSELF USE BATTALION WHEN WE WOULD HAVE BEEN KILLED INSTEAD???? ANSWER THIS!!!!!
Thats why Rhand was killed.
They hate us cause they ain't us.
I actually didn't notice Obzedat at first. Thank you for pointing that out.
Obz still is set on Axelrod.
If I were inclined to lynch a Boros person it would be AE. Zindabad's point is well taken. I do not disagree that he's been basically useless the whole game. My issue there is vague feelings/rememberings that this is not atypical for AE.
I'd do a re-read, but considering how well that turned out in the case of Rhand, I'm not sure I even want to bother anymore. Throwing darts seems like an equally likely method to hit.
I'm having a hard time parsing this. Use battalion on whom?
They hate us cause they ain't us.
Thanks for tell us why you killed Rhand, but what happened to either me or Atog being scum? Atog flipped town, and now your scum read on me evaporated? Might that be because you don't need to kill a gruul to effectively nerf Zinda's ability anymore? Now you just want to kill him off for good measure, or Scarbo, who was our other last PR left? I am not buying this. Your read on me should not have flipped 180 like that overnight.
Yeah... But the upshot is the person protected would be confirmed town, which would mean the other Boros is town for protecting the same person, and if there's a bomb between you, that would kill the scum as well, no? Am I misunderstanding something?
I don't know.
Where did this bomb information suddenly come from?
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
Why would scum want to confirm a townie? That makes no sense. Now your making roles up too? Lol, keep talking.
They hate us cause they ain't us.
What ******* bomb? Where the hell did this come from?
On the other hand, why weren't the scum just killing Boros? If the bomb is NKed, his ability won't work. Unless there's no scum in Boros, and they couldn't be sure which one of AE and Hawk is the bomb, and thought the bomb might logically protect the other Boros player.
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
Thank you Axel for dredging that up for us.
Now can we lynch scarbo?
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I will vote:
AE
Hawk
Scarbo
Will not vote:
Zindabad
Axel
Myself...
Does that sum up the game state?
Should we lynch Obzedat to get rid of that random vote again?
we should lynch hawk.
Still I don't know. I'm kind of surprised Axel didn't receive a message. I mean sure even if DCIII/Sepi thinks Axel is scum it's not like sending him a message would do any harm. Then again if he is scum we can't really trust him to tell the truth whether he received a message... We can find out though.
@Obzedat: If you communicated with Axel last night, vote yourself. If you did not, vote me. Keep your vote there until the next vote count.
I just didn't want it to be able to hammer like it did itself. I feel that we as the actual in game players should reserve that right. But you are correct, it isn't hurting anything. I am just afraid it's reads are NOT going to evolve, and the whole time it will just want to lynch Axel. Which seems really silly to me because of Axel's seemingly obvious towniness to all of us.
If Obz has something to tell us, I would hope it would have tried to send a message to us last night. But Axel says no, it didn't...
@Obz...
If you sent a message to someone, than please vote me by the next votecount. Thank you...
Obzedat I'm pretty sure can only communicate with other Orzhov. There's not reason for it to vote you.
Hawk- what do you think about AE's thoughts re: using battalion?
I want him to vote me if he sent Axel a message and he thinks Axel is lying to us about receiving it.
I had missed that post. I must have got "nathed," is it? Where did that term come from anyway?
Nevermind @Obz. Listen to Scarbo.
Then again, that's pretty much the same as waiting for Hawk or AE to provide content - more likely, actually.
"...a talisman against all evil, so long as you obey me."
They hate us cause they ain't us.
The Strike Gold Vote Count 6.2 (As of post #2064)
scarbo (2): 7hawk77, Obzedat
Archmage Eternal (2): Zindabad, Huntzilla
7hawk77 (1): Scarbo
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They hate us cause they ain't us.
Have you not been reading anything we've been discussing? That was not the plan.
What I am trying to figure right now is the likelyhood of 2 scum vs. 1 scum. I don't know if this can be figured. Seems like there are reasons why they could go for Rhand last night under either scenario, though, I think it somewhat leans more towards the two-scum hypothesis. Because I think one scum would want to keep the Rhand mislynch possibility alive longer, whereas two scum might figure they have enough leeway to shoot a guy who they could probably get lynched the next day.
scarbo (2): 7hawk77, Archmage Eternal
Archmage Eternal (2): Zindabad, Huntzilla
7hawk77 (1): Scarbo
Axelrod (1): Obzedat
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It is possible for there to be an additional Boros scum. Even though that would make 2 scum 1 Neutral out of six total Boros, when one scum already had the ability to ignore the Doc protection. It's possible, and the Guildleader ability to override Boros choices and redirect people could even have been designed to account for this imbalance.
Similarly, it is possible for there to be another scum in Gruul. Even though that makes 2 scum in a guild where votes can get multiplied. It's possible, and the Guildleader ability to basically control all the Gruul people and unilaterlally lynch someone could have been designed to account for this issue.
What I won't believe is that both of these things are true. I don't think I can accept two scum, one remaining in Boros AND one remaining in Gruul. If that's the case, I think I get to be justified afterwards in throwing up my hands and saying this game was bull----. That's without even knowing what kind of over-powered BS role I'm sure Lazhov is.
What I think I'm saying is, if there are still two scum left, I think one of them must be Scarbo.
I think Scarbo may be my safety lynch choice of the day. Because even if that one is wrong, we don't just lose (unless the above BS situation turns out to be true.)
So that may be where I am. This may not help anyone else who is still factoring that I can still be scum here, but it's my worldview.
For whatever it's worth, this vote count also strongly suggests that if Scarbo is scum (and not the last one) then the other scum is probably in Gruul. Whereas if Scarbo is Town (and we don't just flat out lose with his lynch) the scum is probably Boros.
Did obzedat contact you?
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Voting for boros is blatantly anti town. It's getting rid of or exposing the town bomb.
I still think hunt is town but now I'm torn on zinda.
Axel, why do you think obzedat voted you?
I still think scarbo is scum and is currently my preferred lynch.
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