Hey AI: Did you know I was mimiccing my town play in RtR?
You think I'm scum because you claim I played like this in RtR, but give me a recent game of mine where I DIDN'T play like this Day 1. I think you'll be very hard pressed.
You shouldn't attempt to cover up your omgus with a shoddy attempt at metagaming off one example. It makes you look even worse. Just give it to us straight, you want me dead because I'm voting you.
Maybe he just doesn't like people with Sir in their name.
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Hey AI: Did you know I was mimiccing my town play in RtR?
You think I'm scum because you claim I played like this in RtR, but give me a recent game of mine where I DIDN'T play like this Day 1. I think you'll be very hard pressed.
You shouldn't attempt to cover up your omgus with a shoddy attempt at metagaming off one example. It makes you look even worse. Just give it to us straight, you want me dead because I'm voting you.
By that logic no one should be considered scum because everyone is playing to their town meta.
You avoided showing me another recent game of mine where I haven't played the same way Day 1.
All of my Day 1s of both alignments have been the same lately. Calling me scum off meta from ONE game is a complete cop-out excuse and is not a viable reason.
Hey AI: Did you know I was mimiccing my town play in RtR?
You think I'm scum because you claim I played like this in RtR, but give me a recent game of mine where I DIDN'T play like this Day 1. I think you'll be very hard pressed.
You shouldn't attempt to cover up your omgus with a shoddy attempt at metagaming off one example. It makes you look even worse. Just give it to us straight, you want me dead because I'm voting you.
By that logic no one should be considered scum because everyone is playing to their town meta.
But all you have is meta, right?
(to answer your question to me, I honestly don't remember.)
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
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Pretty sure this is a scumslip for a number of reasons.
Also, I'm relatively certain that I, in fact, named five people in my post. As for why, the OP literally says "3 Celestials, Yblisa, and Voes" at some point.
@killjoy: DCIII answered the question as well as I would've, minus one thing: You forgetting to include yourself as a scum player in your mind is what I believe resulted in the "4?" post. It all came across to me as, "Hey, Iso, there are 5 of us, not 4!"
Alternate possibility: I named 4 scum correctly and you slipped HARD.
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Megiddo- All of his really short posts at towards the beginning were pretty meh, but then I thought that he had some really good posts like #234 and much of #314. I thought that in these, he is very rational and incisive.
AsianInvasion- I think that a lot of the flak that AI has gotten has been pretty unwarranted. I agree with his reasoning to do a massclaim, and he is likely town for suggesting it.
Arian- I know that he hasn't had a huge impact on this game, but I really liked his super big location post. I don't think that scum would give such a detailed account of why the location that many people wanted to travel to D1 was not the optimal choice. I just thought that the post was coming from a very good and genuine perspective, which seems to contradict the scum Arian that I have seen in the past.
DC- #285 was such a good post. I don't really think that AI is scum, but the case strongly reminded me of the town DC that I have seen a few times before. Though are you able to point me towards the most recent game where you were scum? I don't think that I am familiar with any of your scum games.
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Is there any reason why we haven't changed location yet?
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"I'm a compulsive liar no matter what team I play on, but I'm trying to get better about it."
Iso: I fail to see how you can put my in the mindset of correcting you when you my hypothetical scum team size wrong. Why would I correct you when you having it wrong benefits me?
Hans: We vote today, then change after Night. Not that Day.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
@DC, it's not only that he got defensive. It's the way he went about defending himself. He tried to explain what he meant, clarifying his thought processes, in a very calm and rational way.
Calm and rational? I'm not sure I got that impression the first time round.
What did you think about his stated reasons for calling out Cythare, anyway? (If you said it before, list the post number, please.)
Wildfire is probably town. Too many questionable people were piled on him at one point. Won't be sure until I untangle abovementioned cluster a bit, though.
Please list the questionable people as you see it right now.
Sir Chris and Karn, off the top of my head. The latter for simply jumping on with zero input, just as the wagon was gaining traction.
@dC: Yeah, I think him making a post like that is a scumtell. However, I don't think the post was wrong, and he convinced me that going to Ruchperion makes sense. You agreed yourself, right? But yeah, I find it unlikely that his post is laying out some scum plan or anything. Put another way, I have no problem with the content of the post, but the fact that he made it at all raised my eyebrow.
...I still don't get this. Yes, I agreed with the plan, and you agreed with the plan, because it made sense. In that case why in the world does someone doing the research and laying out a plan that makes perfect sense make you raise your eyebrow?
Speaking of said plan.
Vote: Move to Ruchperion
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desCoures - I think the issue Megiddo has with Arian's huge, well-researched post about where to move is this: it's a great way to look active, engaged, and pro-town, when in reality, you are completely ignoring scumhunting.
I'm not sure if I agree with the assessment that it is necessarily scum, because I love me some mechanic-gaming myself, but if it's something that's meta-indicative of scum!arian (which I'm still waiting for a response on), then it's worth calling out.
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Meg: It's a thing I do. I try not to do it, but I end up doing it a few times a game anyways.
You want to give us any more information about how Arian's post is (specifically to him) a scumslip?
Also, I'm pretty sure we change at the end of the day, not at the end of the night, because otherwise we're guaranteed to lose 25% of our vitality, as the first halls will collapse at the end of the current day.
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Yes. Take a look at Marvel Madness 2 and Deus Ex
It particularly seems to be a problem of mine in games with Generic, as he tends to ask questions that seem (to me, at least) to have obvious answers, I guess in an attempt to get the person he's asking to say something incongrous.
Got any meta on Arian and mechanic posting as a scumslip for us?
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Megiddo- All of his really short posts at towards the beginning were pretty meh, but then I thought that he had some really good posts like #234 and much of #314. I thought that in these, he is very rational and incisive.
AsianInvasion- I think that a lot of the flak that AI has gotten has been pretty unwarranted. I agree with his reasoning to do a massclaim, and he is likely town for suggesting it.
Arian- I know that he hasn't had a huge impact on this game, but I really liked his super big location post. I don't think that scum would give such a detailed account of why the location that many people wanted to travel to D1 was not the optimal choice. I just thought that the post was coming from a very good and genuine perspective, which seems to contradict the scum Arian that I have seen in the past.
DC- #285 was such a good post. I don't really think that AI is scum, but the case strongly reminded me of the town DC that I have seen a few times before. Though are you able to point me towards the most recent game where you were scum? I don't think that I am familiar with any of your scum games.
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Is there any reason why we haven't changed location yet?
1. How the hell do you have a town read on AI?
2. If you're not familiar with scumdC, then how does his play remind you of his town game? You basically just asked him to give you a reason he's town.
Iso: I fail to see how you can put my in the mindset of correcting you when you my hypothetical scum team size wrong. Why would I correct you when you having it wrong benefits me?
People have been known to post without thinking about what they're posting, before - that's how scumslips are made. I also could've caught you off guard.
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desCoures - I think the issue Megiddo has with Arian's huge, well-researched post about where to move is this: it's a great way to look active, engaged, and pro-town, when in reality, you are completely ignoring scumhunting.
I'm not sure if I agree with the assessment that it is necessarily scum, because I love me some mechanic-gaming myself, but if it's something that's meta-indicative of scum!arian (which I'm still waiting for a response on), then it's worth calling out.
In case you were wondering why I changed the subject, it's because you answered this point for me already.
Don't do it again. It's poor play at best and actually scummy at worst (as you stole words from another player, which makes you look good and them bad).
@DC, I don't agree with Chris's case on Cythare, but I think Megiddo's "Cythare has been clamming up after being called out" is being borne out.
Re: I don't recall Karn having an awesome scum game. So town!Karn is a bigger asset than scum!Karn is a liability.
By the time Niv actually catches up, it's going to be Day 2.
1. I feel like AI was the one who made that point originally. I don't remember saying it? Maybe I did though.
2. I think Karn's scumgame is pretty good. It's better than mine, and I'm like 4-1 as scum or something now. Also this logic is pretty bad. Are you trying to figure out his alignment at all?
@Meg, yes, I am trying to figure out his alignment. But DC was posting a question to one of my responses to a question from Seppel. Seppel asked if I wanted to lynch Karn today, and I said not yet because I don't think he is slam dunk scum, and he is a strong town player. Then DC asked me about scum!Karn, hence my answer.
In fact, I feel like the only person trying to figure out Karn's alignment. No one else has been interacting with him, though that could because it seems only half the playerbase is posting regularly.
Karn's one of those players who tends not to be super helpful day 1 regardless of alignment. Much like Seppel and Iso. And (normal) Megs. I've played with Town Karn a few times and he gets better as time goes on, and so far I'm not seeing many incongruities. I'd advocate against his day 1 lynch, and hopefully his true nature will become clearer as the game progresses.
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Karn's one of those players who tends not to be super helpful day 1 regardless of alignment. Much like Seppel and Iso. And (normal) Megs. I've played with Town Karn a few times and he gets better as time goes on, and so far I'm not seeing many incongruities. I'd advocate against his day 1 lynch, and hopefully his true nature will become clearer as the game progresses.
I'm assuming Megs was fishing for a reaction either from me or from someone else.
AI is tilting. Chris and Wildfire are both looking better. Cythare has vanished.
Unvote. I need to check something.
Cythare is V/LA.
Why is Chris looking better?
Based on what you know of our interactions when I've been town, do you think I was fishing for a reaction from you?[/quote]
RE Chris: He feels more confidant now, and he seems like he's more actively hunting. It's mostly a gut thing at this stage. He's still near the top of my list for once I have some interactions to go over as we get flips. I'm less interested for toDay.
RE you/me: I do, actually. I tend to be a pretty defensive player, and I think you were looking to get me to tilt off while defending my planes mechanics post. Whether just for a read or for something more pernicious, I dunno. I trust it'll come out in the wash, though.
RE Cythare: something someone said in the last page or two sparked a memory, so I went back and looked at Empire of Astarte, where Cythare flipped scum on D2. His play this game has been almost exactly the same, from the passive sniping question posts to the periodic disappearances (what Seppel called "Manders busy").
I know that he hasn't had a huge impact on this game, but I really liked his super big location post. I don't think that scum would give such a detailed account of why the location that many people wanted to travel to D1 was not the optimal choice. I just thought that the post was coming from a very good and genuine perspective, which seems to contradict the scum Arian that I have seen in the past.
I'm not sure what you're talking about, but is the optimal play beneficial for town only, or beneficial for all players?
Given that Zinda said that if all the worlds run out, the game is a draw, then it's beneficial for all players (including scum) to pick the right world to go to.
Also, I think you could make the argument that we're fine feeding Ruchperion later in the game, and it'd be better for town to go to Mirrored Domain toNight, but that's less clear-cut.
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Here's a conversation starter. If your name appears in this post, I expect you to reply in your next post! (hint: I'm addressing something to everybody)
Also: general note for everybody: please vote for a location or tell me why you aren't voting for one. I want to lock in the move ASAP. I will not vote for any players until we have decided on a move.
Prophylaxis: What is my alignment and why? Who is your top scumread and why? I currently am leaning scum on you because you went V/LA for longer than you said you were going to; any reaction to that?
AsianInvasion: I feel like you are phoning in your play this game. I've seen you be much more engaged with your play before. Why did you admit that you are not a good player?
Cythare: Hey scumbo.
hansanator: I definitely second Iso's question about your read on AI. In particular, please elaborate on why you agree with him on a massclaim. Also, you have not yet voted for a location to move to despite asking why we haven't moved yet. Where would you like to go? Please place a vote. Also, give me your top 3 scumreads with reasons.
EtR: I need you to place a vote. How do you currently feel about wildfire?
Arianrhod: You're doing ok actually. Keep it up. IGMEOY because of your location post but literally everything you've posted I've agreed with so far, and that doesn't happen when you are scum. I also just noticed that you didn't place an RVS vote at all this game, but after Winterfell this is no longer a tell for you.
Sir Chris: I don't really have anything in particular for you right now.
Rhand: You know what I want from you.
HookerPunch: Top3town/scumreads with reasons. Please also respond to the case against you.
Killjoy: Did I ask you to do some meandering errand post yet this game? Why did you think that location shift happens after Night ends? Why did you think that rezombad's opening vote wasn't RVS?
Iso: Is there any reason you're playing so differently from normal? Also I know you already explained the killjoy thing but I really don't get it. You said something to the effect that it's a slip because he "failed to consider himself as scum" or something. How is that slip? Explain like I've never played mafia before.
Wildfire393: You're fine. If you're town you need to stop being bad, though. ewp I think you're probably scum now.
Sir Karn: I'm actually liking you for town so far. Do more.
LnGrrrR: I feel like you're fluffing. I will be monitoring you. Give me some more meaty posts I can analyze.
Seppel: Hi seppel are you town
kpaca: I'm not expecting much here, but uh... reads? Or anything, really.
rezombied: You're probably town. But give me your t3town/t3scum reads pls.
Niv: Dude. Seriously. This is just sad by now.
DCIII: Remember what I said to you in Xymande scumchat? Well, guess what I'm noticing this game.
desCoures: To answer your question to me directly, I find problem with it because it's busywork. It's useful busywork, but busywork nonetheless. However, Arian has contributed plenty of actual analysis posts and that outweighs the one strike against him. Why are you hammering on this point so much when I do not actually have a scumread on him? (to be fair I may not have articulated my stance until recently. HOWEVER, this is a relatively minor point, so I'm curious as to why you're giving it so much weight).
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I recommend we proceed with the Cythare wagon. I will join it myself when we have decided on a location move, barring the emergence of a better wagon.
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Can we have Megiddo removed from the forum forever please?
i'm pretty sure i can find your ***** online within 3 minutes
You think I'm scum because you claim I played like this in RtR, but give me a recent game of mine where I DIDN'T play like this Day 1. I think you'll be very hard pressed.
You shouldn't attempt to cover up your omgus with a shoddy attempt at metagaming off one example. It makes you look even worse. Just give it to us straight, you want me dead because I'm voting you.
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By that logic no one should be considered scum because everyone is playing to their town meta.
All of my Day 1s of both alignments have been the same lately. Calling me scum off meta from ONE game is a complete cop-out excuse and is not a viable reason.
(to answer your question to me, I honestly don't remember.)
did you not see my reasoning when I posted it
I mean I haven't done much else, so I find it hard to believe you've missed it if you've read the whole game up to this point (I haven't)
goodvote is good
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And I didn't like post #14.
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Your alignment (scum) aside, it does make you sound very pretentious.
Give me your abilities.
Megiddo- All of his really short posts at towards the beginning were pretty meh, but then I thought that he had some really good posts like #234 and much of #314. I thought that in these, he is very rational and incisive.
AsianInvasion- I think that a lot of the flak that AI has gotten has been pretty unwarranted. I agree with his reasoning to do a massclaim, and he is likely town for suggesting it.
Arian- I know that he hasn't had a huge impact on this game, but I really liked his super big location post. I don't think that scum would give such a detailed account of why the location that many people wanted to travel to D1 was not the optimal choice. I just thought that the post was coming from a very good and genuine perspective, which seems to contradict the scum Arian that I have seen in the past.
DC- #285 was such a good post. I don't really think that AI is scum, but the case strongly reminded me of the town DC that I have seen a few times before. Though are you able to point me towards the most recent game where you were scum? I don't think that I am familiar with any of your scum games.
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Is there any reason why we haven't changed location yet?
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Hans: We vote today, then change after Night. Not that Day.
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@LnGrrrR
Calm and rational? I'm not sure I got that impression the first time round.
What did you think about his stated reasons for calling out Cythare, anyway? (If you said it before, list the post number, please.)
...so then what is a scum!Karn, hmmm?
@Seppel
Sir Chris and Karn, off the top of my head. The latter for simply jumping on with zero input, just as the wagon was gaining traction.
@Megiddo
...I still don't get this. Yes, I agreed with the plan, and you agreed with the plan, because it made sense. In that case why in the world does someone doing the research and laying out a plan that makes perfect sense make you raise your eyebrow?
Speaking of said plan.
Vote: Move to Ruchperion
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I'm not sure if I agree with the assessment that it is necessarily scum, because I love me some mechanic-gaming myself, but if it's something that's meta-indicative of scum!arian (which I'm still waiting for a response on), then it's worth calling out.
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You want to give us any more information about how Arian's post is (specifically to him) a scumslip?
Also, I'm pretty sure we change at the end of the day, not at the end of the night, because otherwise we're guaranteed to lose 25% of our vitality, as the first halls will collapse at the end of the current day.
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Karn is trying less hard than he did at the beginning of that game while still taking stances, which is probably a good sign.
@Hans if you don't think AI is scum then why do you think my post was good? Why do you disagree? My games are in my sig and labeled on alignment.
Sir Chris's comment that he likes me feels a lot like Dag in Deus Ex after I was on him early and backed off.
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It particularly seems to be a problem of mine in games with Generic, as he tends to ask questions that seem (to me, at least) to have obvious answers, I guess in an attempt to get the person he's asking to say something incongrous.
Got any meta on Arian and mechanic posting as a scumslip for us?
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>Posts about weird pants instead of scumhunting
(Also I saw the pants because you posted a link elsewhere)
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Re: I don't recall Karn having an awesome scum game. So town!Karn is a bigger asset than scum!Karn is a liability.
By the time Niv actually catches up, it's going to be Day 2.
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AI is tilting. Chris and Wildfire are both looking better. Cythare has vanished.
Unvote. I need to check something.
I guess I'm just doing all sorts of things out of character this game, aren't I?
1. How the hell do you have a town read on AI?
2. If you're not familiar with scumdC, then how does his play remind you of his town game? You basically just asked him to give you a reason he's town.
People have been known to post without thinking about what they're posting, before - that's how scumslips are made. I also could've caught you off guard.
#Megiddo
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Don't do it again. It's poor play at best and actually scummy at worst (as you stole words from another player, which makes you look good and them bad).
1. I feel like AI was the one who made that point originally. I don't remember saying it? Maybe I did though.
2. I think Karn's scumgame is pretty good. It's better than mine, and I'm like 4-1 as scum or something now. Also this logic is pretty bad. Are you trying to figure out his alignment at all?
Cythare is V/LA.
Why is Chris looking better?
Based on what you know of our interactions when I've been town, do you think I was fishing for a reaction from you?
In fact, I feel like the only person trying to figure out Karn's alignment. No one else has been interacting with him, though that could because it seems only half the playerbase is posting regularly.
@Meg, thoughts on Karn this game?
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I also agree re: the playerbase. Seriously, if you have fewer posts than Zindabad (who is a very hands-off mod), you are an embarrassment.
/barn this.
@Megs:
Cythare is V/LA.
Why is Chris looking better?
Based on what you know of our interactions when I've been town, do you think I was fishing for a reaction from you?[/quote]
RE Chris: He feels more confidant now, and he seems like he's more actively hunting. It's mostly a gut thing at this stage. He's still near the top of my list for once I have some interactions to go over as we get flips. I'm less interested for toDay.
RE you/me: I do, actually. I tend to be a pretty defensive player, and I think you were looking to get me to tilt off while defending my planes mechanics post. Whether just for a read or for something more pernicious, I dunno. I trust it'll come out in the wash, though.
RE Cythare: something someone said in the last page or two sparked a memory, so I went back and looked at Empire of Astarte, where Cythare flipped scum on D2. His play this game has been almost exactly the same, from the passive sniping question posts to the periodic disappearances (what Seppel called "Manders busy").
Vote Cythare. No brakes.
Speaking of V/LA, proph has disappeared entirely.
Also @Rhand I still haven't forgotten about you. Still waiting.
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Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
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I'm not sure what you're talking about, but is the optimal play beneficial for town only, or beneficial for all players?
Also, I think you could make the argument that we're fine feeding Ruchperion later in the game, and it'd be better for town to go to Mirrored Domain toNight, but that's less clear-cut.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Wildfire is back in my scum pile now.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Also: general note for everybody: please vote for a location or tell me why you aren't voting for one. I want to lock in the move ASAP. I will not vote for any players until we have decided on a move.
Prophylaxis: What is my alignment and why? Who is your top scumread and why? I currently am leaning scum on you because you went V/LA for longer than you said you were going to; any reaction to that?
AsianInvasion: I feel like you are phoning in your play this game. I've seen you be much more engaged with your play before. Why did you admit that you are not a good player?
Cythare: Hey scumbo.
hansanator: I definitely second Iso's question about your read on AI. In particular, please elaborate on why you agree with him on a massclaim. Also, you have not yet voted for a location to move to despite asking why we haven't moved yet. Where would you like to go? Please place a vote. Also, give me your top 3 scumreads with reasons.
EtR: I need you to place a vote. How do you currently feel about wildfire?
Arianrhod: You're doing ok actually. Keep it up. IGMEOY because of your location post but literally everything you've posted I've agreed with so far, and that doesn't happen when you are scum. I also just noticed that you didn't place an RVS vote at all this game, but after Winterfell this is no longer a tell for you.
Sir Chris: I don't really have anything in particular for you right now.
Rhand: You know what I want from you.
HookerPunch: Top3town/scumreads with reasons. Please also respond to the case against you.
Killjoy: Did I ask you to do some meandering errand post yet this game? Why did you think that location shift happens after Night ends? Why did you think that rezombad's opening vote wasn't RVS?
Iso: Is there any reason you're playing so differently from normal? Also I know you already explained the killjoy thing but I really don't get it. You said something to the effect that it's a slip because he "failed to consider himself as scum" or something. How is that slip? Explain like I've never played mafia before.
Wildfire393: You're fine. If you're town you need to stop being bad, though. ewp I think you're probably scum now.
Sir Karn: I'm actually liking you for town so far. Do more.
LnGrrrR: I feel like you're fluffing. I will be monitoring you. Give me some more meaty posts I can analyze.
Seppel: Hi seppel are you town
kpaca: I'm not expecting much here, but uh... reads? Or anything, really.
rezombied: You're probably town. But give me your t3town/t3scum reads pls.
Niv: Dude. Seriously. This is just sad by now.
DCIII: Remember what I said to you in Xymande scumchat? Well, guess what I'm noticing this game.
desCoures: To answer your question to me directly, I find problem with it because it's busywork. It's useful busywork, but busywork nonetheless. However, Arian has contributed plenty of actual analysis posts and that outweighs the one strike against him. Why are you hammering on this point so much when I do not actually have a scumread on him? (to be fair I may not have articulated my stance until recently. HOWEVER, this is a relatively minor point, so I'm curious as to why you're giving it so much weight).
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I recommend we proceed with the Cythare wagon. I will join it myself when we have decided on a location move, barring the emergence of a better wagon.
>Here's a post where I ask everyone a question
>No question for Wildfire
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!