IIRC, in Seasons there were only two things that couldn't be scum: both Masons together (because they also had some stupid powerful abilities like dayvigging every other day), and the SK.
But yeah, KJ, get your claim on. At this point, it's that or you can tell us all about it in Ghostlands.
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IIRC, in Seasons there were only two things that couldn't be scum: both Masons together (because they also had some stupid powerful abilities like dayvigging every other day), and the SK.
But yeah, KJ, get your claim on. At this point, it's that or you can tell us all about it in Ghostlands.
This passive agressiveness of yours seems new. Point me to your scumgames please?
Thank you for your helpfulness. I figured it would be in the lore.
Anyway, I am Demernae’s Suspicion. I'm Town. I have one active ability, and one passive one.
Active: I can target a player at night and they lose Vitality for a few nights. The number of Vitality they lose is equal to 3 minus the number of times I've used this ability.
Passive: Whenever I target a player, that player's Vitality can no longer be seen publicly while I'm alive.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
IIRC, in Seasons there were only two things that couldn't be scum: both Masons together (because they also had some stupid powerful abilities like dayvigging every other day), and the SK.
But yeah, KJ, get your claim on. At this point, it's that or you can tell us all about it in Ghostlands.
This passive agressiveness of yours seems new. Point me to your scumgames please?
"Passive aggressiveness"?
Okay.
My only (real) scumgame is Night Mafia. It ended pretty recently, so it's not hard to find.
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Does the first player you target keep losing 3 vitality all nights your ability lasts, even if you use it again next night?
Your ability is terrible. You want to use the vitality loss on scum, but it doesn't kill them. And the passive hides info town needs, especially on scummy people.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
I wasn't planning on using it on scummy people. I was going to use it on town to keep that info out of scum eyes. If they're town, we can trust them to be honest about their Vitality scores anyway.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
Uh... I'm going to vote against using that ability on Megs.
Despite the fact that I've been townreading him, his vitality is a major wildcard at the moment. I'd rather not see it go hidden.
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An example of why:
Let's say he has an ability he can use to kill somebody and steal a percentage of their vitality. We may be able to deduce that that is indeed what he is doing by comparing his vitality gains to the losses of the dead.
But yeah, I don't see this ability as conftown. Then again, I don't see scum having this ability and thinking "this seems like a much more pro-town ability than pro-scum so I could try emphasizing that".
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He reads very much like WWE Arian. The long wall post about realms was correct mathematically, but at the end of the day it is IIoA in the vein of "oh hey, I'm being super helpful!". It reminds me of Seppel in Majora's Mask when he was going out of his way to keep track of all claimed actions/abilities/roles. He has mostly lurked since, except to pop in and throw out some brief/bland reasoning on a huge mass of players. And, looking back over his posts, he has actually put a lot more effort into defending players (AI, Seppel, Killjoy, DCIII, Meg) rather than scumhunting.
I've played with you and Seppel enough by now to have learned to just ignore you two on day 1. Nothing good ever comes of me scrutinizing either of you this early in the game.
Not "nothing good ever comes of scrutinizing you", but "nothing good comes of ME scrutinizing you". This is a textbook example of trying not to make waves.
Note that Arian has pushed on, and voted, Cythare for playing "exactly" as she did in another game as scum, but has twice since diminished the signficance of his own push by calling it "tenuous" and "gut".
Oh, apparently I'm scum in Megs's book now? That's nice. I say the same thing to you that I said to DK (in the post you quoted, nonetheless): lynch me and I'll be back as confirmed town when we get to Ghostlands anyway. It's irrelevant to me other than being a waste of a lynch.
I've said my peace toDay. Half the game is lurking through and these wagons are molasses as a result. Killjoy's 1157 is more of what I would have expected Killjoy to be doing all along, and it does read in earnest to me, but realistically it's too little, too late. There's enough marks against him that I believe he is still the correct lynch toDay (although I could still get behind Cythare or LnG as well).
Oh, yeah. DKings's 1104 is pretty bad, too. He does have a good point regarding dC, but I can't agree with his opinion on the AI wagon. It reads like a very scummy attempt at redirecting pressure back on to AI after it began slipping. Gut reaction: scum!dk subtly calling out scum!dC while redirecting focus to town!AI.
OK, seriously... I want everyone who has a town read on Arian to articulate why.
Everything in this post is wishy-washy. Killjoy's post reads "in earnest", but too little too late? My post is pretty bad, but I have a good point about dC?
Not to mention that this is the second time Arian has firmly stated a scum read (Cythare earlier, myself here) and gone back with passive language to lessen the impact of his opinion later. Here he says his gut reaction is that I'm scum calling out a buddy, and then later he says he "doesn't know if there is anything there". Earlier in the day he invoked "No brakes" on his Cythare vote, then later came back and diminished the importance of his own case by calling it "tenuous" and "gut".
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
IIRC, in Seasons there were only two things that couldn't be scum: both Masons together (because they also had some stupid powerful abilities like dayvigging every other day), and the SK.
But yeah, KJ, get your claim on. At this point, it's that or you can tell us all about it in Ghostlands.
This passive agressiveness of yours seems new. Point me to your scumgames please?
"Passive aggressiveness"?
Okay.
My only (real) scumgame is Night Mafia. It ended pretty recently, so it's not hard to find.
Thx. I haven't seen you do it there apart from one small thing.
So it's probably null.
But yeah, I don't see this ability as conftown. Then again, I don't see scum having this ability and thinking "this seems like a much more pro-town ability than pro-scum so I could try emphasizing that".
I completely agree. Can we lynch someone else please?
Also, I think someone else articulated this before, but the KJ wagon sprung up very quickly and very quietly. Iso has been vocal about it for a while, but that's pretty much it. Very few of the other players voting KJ have actually directly engaged him or said much about him at all.
The same could be said for all wagons. Are you being serious? I've been LOUD and I've talked directly to KingJames... I mean KillJoy. Iso doesn't get all the credit.
Also I think Iso's reason for voting Killjoy is crap, but I won't turn down his vote. If he's scum, he's invested far too much in bussing.
@Killjoy: Megs says he's the best target. You're scumreading him, bug you don't want to attack him. You want to attack people you think are town so you can hide their vitality... and you think you're trying to act town with this plan.
I really don't know what to say. This sounds so absurd.
Can you please confirm that the above is true? Or if you want to change your claim at all?
Did you miss the part where I said I couldn't see a scum!Killjoy thinking his ability couldn't be scum and trying to play that up?
Asian got a bit of a reprieve with the focus on the KJ wagon, and he used it to basically disappear. I'm not liking that too much, so my vote's going back there.
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Walk me through this then. You're KJ, and you get your ability PM, as scum. Your mindset is that the ability is SO USELESS for you as scum, that your best bet is to try to sell it as something that only town could get?
Coupled with his whole "the concealing Vitality thing is more useful than the damage" thing, I'm really thinking he's just misguided town.
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Wildfire, yes. Spinning an ability as obviously townie in form and function is a common ploy, especially in high level games like this where the normal townie response is to overly inflate how townie your ability is.
You should be asking yourself how legit his act is. Remember, this is his last ditch effort to get the wagon off of him. How did he spin his ability and how he plans on using it?
I have issues with the presentation of his claim. Look at my previous post and tell me if Killjoy's actions appear either smart or rational.
@Killjoy: Megs says he's the best target. You're scumreading him, bug you don't want to attack him. You want to attack people you think are town so you can hide their vitality... and you think you're trying to act town with this plan.
I really don't know what to say. This sounds so absurd.
Can you please confirm that the above is true? Or if you want to change your claim at all?
That's a very slanted interpretation of my claim.
1. I don't trust Meg. Doesn't matter if he says he's the best target. I don't trust him.
2. Given my scum read of him, I want to keep his vitality public. He would be my target if that wasn't my other ability.
3.I'm not trying to act town. That's my ability. That's how I interpreted it.
KoolKoal: Feel free to take this with a grain of salt since self meta isn't particularly helpful, but I think I get scumread mostly for style over substance, but also for a certain lack of substance over style. It's not so much what I AM posting most of the time (though sometimes that can seem bad) but what I'm NOT posting. I've been told I come to non-obvious conclusions a lot, so when I post, quite a bit of the time there's jumps in logic that people can't follow and they think that's scummy. I get that accusation about a lot of questions I ask specifically. People call them "busy work" when the questions are legit etc.
As far as things to ignore, I can't think of anything. I would suggest you focus less on what I'm doing and more on how I'm doing it. That's probably more likely to be accurate. Like I've just said, what I do tends to come off a little weird, but if you look for how I do it, mindset comes into play and maybe you figure out something useful.
He also put a bit too much thought into the scum applications of his ability for my taste.
I feel like it's the opposite. I feel like he hasn't even considered the primary scum application of the ability (making somebody more likely to die via passive vitality loss), and he's only focusing on the hiding of vitality.
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@KillJoy: does the person you targetted get informed about his own vitality when it's no longer visible in thread?
How many days does the bleeding last?
I'm still torn on Killjoy. I can definitely see how a town mindset would draw the conclusions he drew, and I'm having trouble seeing how a scum mindset could lead him there. But that latter statement is still up for debate, and the arguments against it make some good points.
I'm still willing to see him swing.
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@Killjoy: Megs says he's the best target. You're scumreading him, bug you don't want to attack him. You want to attack people you think are town so you can hide their vitality... and you think you're trying to act town with this plan.
I really don't know what to say. This sounds so absurd.
Can you please confirm that the above is true? Or if you want to change your claim at all?
That's a very slanted interpretation of my claim.
1. I don't trust Meg. Doesn't matter if he says he's the best target. I don't trust him.
2. Given my scum read of him, I want to keep his vitality public. He would be my target if that wasn't my other ability.
3.I'm not trying to act town. That's my ability. That's how I interpreted it.
Your ability could kill him in what, 3 days? I don't see why you wouldn't want a slowvig on a scum.
Which makes claiming relevant.
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StaffBut yeah, KJ, get your claim on. At this point, it's that or you can tell us all about it in Ghostlands.
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This passive agressiveness of yours seems new. Point me to your scumgames please?
Anyway, I am Demernae’s Suspicion. I'm Town. I have one active ability, and one passive one.
Active: I can target a player at night and they lose Vitality for a few nights. The number of Vitality they lose is equal to 3 minus the number of times I've used this ability.
Passive: Whenever I target a player, that player's Vitality can no longer be seen publicly while I'm alive.
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Staff"Passive aggressiveness"?
Okay.
My only (real) scumgame is Night Mafia. It ended pretty recently, so it's not hard to find.
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Your ability is terrible. You want to use the vitality loss on scum, but it doesn't kill them. And the passive hides info town needs, especially on scummy people.
How did you see this as a pro-town ability?
AS EXPECTED the claim is null.
If you live and want to verify your ability, use it on me.
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StaffDespite the fact that I've been townreading him, his vitality is a major wildcard at the moment. I'd rather not see it go hidden.
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StaffLet's say he has an ability he can use to kill somebody and steal a percentage of their vitality. We may be able to deduce that that is indeed what he is doing by comparing his vitality gains to the losses of the dead.
But yeah, I don't see this ability as conftown. Then again, I don't see scum having this ability and thinking "this seems like a much more pro-town ability than pro-scum so I could try emphasizing that".
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Yes, I have mentioned my problems with Arian.
I would also like the answer to this question. KJ's description of his active ability doesn't make this clear.
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StaffIs there a reason you want a townread to lose vitality?
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If you live through the day, DO NOT USE THIS ABILITY ON ME.
If my vitality becomes hidden, my role is useless.
I don't. But it's either that or let a scumread get his abilities hidden.
A third option is I just not use it at all to target anyone, but then I'm useless.
Thx. I haven't seen you do it there apart from one small thing.
So it's probably null.
I completely agree. Can we lynch someone else please?
I'm ok with being the target for that. Makes sense.
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The same could be said for all wagons. Are you being serious? I've been LOUD and I've talked directly to KingJames... I mean KillJoy. Iso doesn't get all the credit.
Also I think Iso's reason for voting Killjoy is crap, but I won't turn down his vote. If he's scum, he's invested far too much in bussing.
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StaffWe're back to this I guess.
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@Killjoy: Megs says he's the best target. You're scumreading him, bug you don't want to attack him. You want to attack people you think are town so you can hide their vitality... and you think you're trying to act town with this plan.
I really don't know what to say. This sounds so absurd.
Can you please confirm that the above is true? Or if you want to change your claim at all?
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StaffAsian got a bit of a reprieve with the focus on the KJ wagon, and he used it to basically disappear. I'm not liking that too much, so my vote's going back there.
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StaffCoupled with his whole "the concealing Vitality thing is more useful than the damage" thing, I'm really thinking he's just misguided town.
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You should be asking yourself how legit his act is. Remember, this is his last ditch effort to get the wagon off of him. How did he spin his ability and how he plans on using it?
I have issues with the presentation of his claim. Look at my previous post and tell me if Killjoy's actions appear either smart or rational.
That's a very slanted interpretation of my claim.
1. I don't trust Meg. Doesn't matter if he says he's the best target. I don't trust him.
2. Given my scum read of him, I want to keep his vitality public. He would be my target if that wasn't my other ability.
3.I'm not trying to act town. That's my ability. That's how I interpreted it.
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Curse Premium@killjoy: Can you claim your ability names and flavor?
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StaffI feel like it's the opposite. I feel like he hasn't even considered the primary scum application of the ability (making somebody more likely to die via passive vitality loss), and he's only focusing on the hiding of vitality.
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Show how. Because I don't see this.
I'm not entirely clear on how the ability works. Please clarify what would happen if you target a player and don't target any other players.
How many days does the bleeding last?
You just told him that you're obviously the best town target because it's obvious how your ability works and now this?
Right...
unvote, vote megiddo
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StaffI'm still willing to see him swing.
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I'd love it if everyone would give their input before we lynch him.
Your ability could kill him in what, 3 days? I don't see why you wouldn't want a slowvig on a scum.
Masterful defense.