As a quick aside, is there any way to expand the reply window (like on the old forums)? It's so much easier to see everything when the window is larger than 11 lines.
Re: Void - I think it's a null tell he replaced. He clearly was frustrated that that much focus was put on him for something he felt was semantics. Not participating in a meaningful way is scumtells 101 and anyone that has played would know to avoid doing so. Pushing Void so much for it reads as scummy to me as it's opportunistic and such an easy case to make on someone. It's all WIFOM and whatnot of course, but I think it got blown out of proportion and Void stepped out before it took over the Day.
Cantrip's post where he says "Wow, that's really good theory" sounds like sarcasm, but he actually unvotes. I don't like that post at all.
I said "Wow, that's really good reasoning", and it wasn't sarcasm. I wasn't expecting the in-depth logic that TK applied in his response; I don't think that a scum mentality would push that kind of angle over continuing to (at least) suspect Dagaen.
For the last time. I did not say I wasn't going to participate. I said there wasn't anything Scummy to comment on. There is a world of difference there.
PTAP before I get a infraction.
So, yeah, the idea that this would make me decide to unvote is laughable. I realize he has now jumped ship, but you can consider my vote on the replacement. Sorry, dude. You got a little hole to dig yourself out of.
This is the crappiest attack and justification I've seen in a long time.
Re: Void - I think it's a null tell he replaced. He clearly was frustrated that that much focus was put on him for something he felt was semantics. Not participating in a meaningful way is scumtells 101 and anyone that has played would know to avoid doing so. Pushing Void so much for it reads as scummy to me as it's opportunistic and such an easy case to make on someone. It's all WIFOM and whatnot of course, but I think it got blown out of proportion and Void stepped out before it took over the Day.
I think Void had all of 2 votes on him. Two. And most of the discussion has been about other people so far, not Void. Who's blowing what out of proportion here? I also think - and this is more meta - that a Townie bowing out there would have said something else. His (apparent) rage at being called out for doing something he says he wasn't doing would have meritted either (1) more of a rant from an upset Townie or (2) more of an explanation from a non-upset Townie about why he needs to be bowing out there. A scum, on the other hand, who didn't want to deal with the pressure of being scum (a feeling I know well) could and probably would bow out just like that, without saying anything.
Unless this is townie indignation, which is what I got.
As a quick aside, is there any way to expand the reply window (like on the old forums)? It's so much easier to see everything when the window is larger than 11 lines.
Personally, I use notepad and copy-paste for large posts.
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I'll bet you wish you had a non-unglued/unhinged card that shared your first name.
Nothing? You think we can't find scum with good, old-fashioned behavioral analysis? We have nothing if we don't mass claim something, meaning we need to mass claim in order to catch scum?
Oh we can find scum the old fashioned way. But what happens when they claim a nice juicy role? Yup, everyone forgets about behavior and continues on somewhere else. Speaking of behavior, I'm not liking AI's. Holding my vote till I finish figuring him out.
I guess it's a bit suspect that he was reluctant to claim whether he got his guild choice and then immediately gave that information up, but that's hardly a smoking gun.
Here is my reasoning here. lets see if this list thing works:
Axelrod initially not wishing to claim what choice he got gave me the vibe that he was trying to hide something and was worried that something would go wrong because of what he said. If he were scum and was afraid that at some point later in the game this could tie him into an uncomfortable situation because of a fake claim this would certainly be a possible feeling.
Your initial premise is wrong. I did not "not wish to claim." I was completely indifferent to the question. Because it was a request that appeared to have no purpose. It appeared to me - and I am still quite certain this is true - that whether or not one received their "first choice" of guilds in this game could not possibly tell us anything useful. It made me slightly more suspicious of RR for even asking the question in the first place. Seemed like busywork. Asking a question to try and appear like one is doing something useful, without actually doing anything useful. Which is a possible scum mindset. But, I am also allowing for the possibility that RR thought it could possibly have some significance and just didn't think it all the way through. So I just ignored it.
So I don't know where you are getting this "vibe" from, given that I didn't say what you seem to believe I said. And also, please think it through for yourself and see that this question could not possibly have made anyone nervous (as scum).
It seems like you may be confusing not wanting to claim if I received my "first choice" of guilds with not wanting to participate in a mass guild claim. I did say I wasn't interested in mass claiming guilds. As far as I'm concerned the risks of that currently outweigh the benefits. I'm allowing for the possibility for someone to change my mind on that, but I suspect the Mod. wouldn't have made it such that this was a good idea right off the top.
Now scum would be more paranoid here then town. If your favorite guild is Rakdos and you are town and you said you got your pick you would probably think it was possible someone could look through your post history and find out you PROBABLY picked Rakdos but it wouldn't bother you too much. Pretty much no scum team is going to go through that much effort. (I am quite good as scum and I would never bother. Just too lazy)
Now however, suppose you were scum. At some point in the game after you claim it's going to come up why you chose that guild. What do you say? You would have to think of something. Something could go wrong.
There is more stress in claiming first choice as scum. Scum would be worried more could go wrong
(Side corollary: This could also be true if the person was a doctor, and a paranoid person in general, but this mafia nothing is ever absolute I admit that)
This is insane. For anyone to be afraid of that. Like, I'm going to say "I got my first choice" and then, someone's going to go do research on me to find out if I have ever said anywhere what Ravkica Guild I like, and then assume that (obviously) I must have requested that one, and now (horror) I've actually claimed my guild, and, oh no, what am I (as scum) going to do?
Do you see how crazy that is? How much you are stretching to try and make this point? There's no way someone would be afraid of that. Because it's dumb.
I'm pretty sure your basic premise is faulty also. Because I'm pretty sure that Guilds and alignment don't correlate this game. And I feel pretty sure in saying that because it basically says that in my role PM. Does yours not?
Now we are in the future with Axelrod. I press him on it. I tell him I want him to claim his guild. What does he do?
Just pointing out that you did not "press" me on anything. You politely asked me - with a rather strong implication that you had a reason for asking. "Pressing" me would have been something like demanding I answer the question and then, like, voting me for not complying. Apparently, you were trying to be sneaky? I'm afraid the form of your request defeated it's purpose in that case.
Well lets talk about what a town person who was paranoid would do. If someone was town and they didn't want to claim their guild because they were power or something, what would happen if one random person reiterate they wanted them to claim if they got their first choice? Well a town person who was nicely asked would again probably politely refuse. Town person is hiding their power. They don't want anyone to know it. One dude asking a second time does not change this
See, who's paranoid? You've invented a mindset here. If I had ever said in any way shape or form that I didn't want to claim whether I got my first choice of guilds (for any reason) then I guess maybe that could be Townie paranoia. But, given that I didn't say this, and didn't feel this, your assumption about what a "paranoid Townie" would do if faced with that rather innocuous question is irrelevant.
Now what about if that person was scum? Well then all of a sudden that scum person starts thinking about what they would do as town. They realize that being abrasive to the first choice or not claim is probably not town like (true) and so they freely admit they got their first choice.
So what just happened here? Axelrod initially answered the request for a first choice or not as most likely town power/ scum. After I pressed him on that he gave a response that was town vanilla/scum. This change in thinking is odd.
Not even slightly. And I still haven't "changed" my thinking. You implied you had a reason for asking, so I gave you the benefit of the doubt and answered - because it didn't matter - but I also asked why you wanted to know (remember). This was to (hopefully) give me insight into your thought process.
And I guess I got my answer. It's all wrong. But the thought process seems more consistent with a wrong-headed Townie than scum trying to set some incredibly clumsy trap.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
For the last time. I did not say I wasn't going to participate. I said there wasn't anything Scummy to comment on. There is a world of difference there.
PTAP before I get a infraction.
So, yeah, the idea that this would make me decide to unvote is laughable. I realize he has now jumped ship, but you can consider my vote on the replacement. Sorry, dude. You got a little hole to dig yourself out of.
This is the crappiest attack and justification I've seen in a long time.
Vote Axelrod
Uh, that wasn't an attack. Or a justification. I already gave those. Remember? This was my remarking on Void's "comeback" post after I've been critical of him. And I'm suggesting that this "comeback" is less than worthless. Which it is. He has (again) completely ignored the actual point with handwaving while responding to a point that no one (or at least not me) was arguing. I'm saying that the replacement player doesn't get to come in on a clean slate (which, for some reason some people seem to think should be the case, but that's not me).
Please go back and tell me what was wrong with the actual vote. I'd love to hear your issues.
Re: Void - I think it's a null tell he replaced. He clearly was frustrated that that much focus was put on him for something he felt was semantics. Not participating in a meaningful way is scumtells 101 and anyone that has played would know to avoid doing so. Pushing Void so much for it reads as scummy to me as it's opportunistic and such an easy case to make on someone. It's all WIFOM and whatnot of course, but I think it got blown out of proportion and Void stepped out before it took over the Day.
I think Void had all of 2 votes on him. Two. And most of the discussion has been about other people so far, not Void. Who's blowing what out of proportion here? I also think - and this is more meta - that a Townie bowing out there would have said something else. His (apparent) rage at being called out for doing something he says he wasn't doing would have meritted either (1) more of a rant from an upset Townie or (2) more of an explanation from a non-upset Townie about why he needs to be bowing out there. A scum, on the other hand, who didn't want to deal with the pressure of being scum (a feeling I know well) could and probably would bow out just like that, without saying anything.
Unless this is townie indignation, which is what I got.
You got that Void quit the game because of "townie indignation?"
Really?
I have a hard time seeing that - given what was actually posted in the thread. His jumping ship came from completely out of left field. He got one more vote on him, and immediately quit? Without saying "this is complete BS, I'm out," or ranting, or cursing us out, or something?
No way.
Man, the more I think about it the more confident I feel.
And the replacement coming in and immediately excusing himself until the weekend really didn't help things.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
That was a much much longer response then I expected.
Hello. We haven't met before, have we?
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Why would a replacement immediately coming in and excusing himself be more likely scum then town
that makes no sense
Sure it does. Think about it.
It's not like a smoking gun or anything, but it definitely doesn't help his case.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
@Axel, would it make you feel better if I told you I'm town?
I have a life, and it's a busy week at work. I wi respond to current events, but I won't have time to read the whole thread and give notes until the weekend.
Your logic is asinine. Just because I offered to replace in doesn't mean that I have a few hours open tonight to get my reading done. Please explain to me what you would expect a town player to say upon replace in?
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Oh and the reason I haven't sunk right into posting is because 1) obviously avoid did something that threw suspicion onto this slot and 2) I haven gotten to that yet. (I'm on the 4th page or so.) When I figure out what happened, I will comment then.
I know some people have the theory "town don't have to worry about being stupid and carefree with their posting!" but I disagree completely. As an example, many people have said as town they sometimes cut out language they normally use (to be honest/honestly for one) because they don't want to attract suspicion and sidetrack the town.
Excepting power roles, which have a reason to not look super town, it's a vanilla's job to draw a NK, whether by pulling off a successful gambit, identifying scum successfully, or just looking super obvtown.
I have no desire to say something stupid, get a wagon run up on me for saying said stupid thing, and then getting mislynched. If you still think I am scum after the reread, cool that's your choice. But saying "LOL he is taking time to read = scum" means you're pretty much tunnelling and aren't going to pay attention anyways.
The implication that "he can't respond to the accusations against him so he is scum!" Uhmm yeah I can't respond because I don't know what avoid got run up for. Given the last page or so I'm assuming it's some modgaming thing about guilds, but until I get to that point in the reread I don't know.
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Obviously I misunderstood you. I explained what I thought you meant. Now it's your turn to clarify.
Another example of bad logic is on page 5. If scum wanted to sit back, do you think they would be so dumb as to ANNOUNCE THE FACT THAT THEY ARE SITTING BACK? I mean, do you have so little respect for Void as a player? If he actually wanted to sit back, he could've barned something, thrown out a useless question etc etc.
My first game here I said something similar, and got run up to, even though I was town. I mean, WIFOM and all, but getting early attention on you, with a comment that is pretty much universally seen as scummy, that seems pretty ridiculously suicidey for a mafioso.
@Cantripmancer: Void is not experienced in the sense that Axelrod is, for instance, but he's experienced enough to understand the basic dynamics of the game. He's certainly experienced enough to realize that taking a nap and hanging up a sign that says "Do Not Disturb (Unless Someone Claims Scum)" is a huge red flag. So unless you think he's town misplaying deliberately, I'm not sure where the confusion lies.
Ok, so right here. AI says, "Void is experienced enough to know this comment is seen as super scmmy." So what does AI conclude? That Void, knowing that comment would make him sound scummy... Did it anyways and is scum? Like, that makes no sense to me, unless you think Void's IQ is roughly equivalent to the temperature at Santa's Workshop.
Obviously I misunderstood you. I explained what I thought you meant. Now it's your turn to clarify.
Well, actually, you're the one who called my "logic" "asinine" without apparently having read the thread, so I think it was appropriate to ask what you were talking about. It appears you are saying that (you believed?) I was arguing that you were scum because you were failing to immediately answer the points against Void? Is that what you were saying was "asinine?"
Another example of bad logic is on page 5. If scum wanted to sit back, do you think they would be so dumb as to ANNOUNCE THE FACT THAT THEY ARE SITTING BACK? I mean, do you have so little respect for Void as a player? If he actually wanted to sit back, he could've barned something, thrown out a useless question etc etc.
I've got no opinion at all of Void as a player. Yet.
And let me ask you this because it's actually important. Do you think Void was (as you say here in all caps) ANNOUNCING THE FACT THAT HE WAS SITTING BACK?
My first game here I said something similar, and got run up to, even though I was town. I mean, WIFOM and all, but getting early attention on you, with a comment that is pretty much universally seen as scummy, that seems pretty ridiculously suicidey for a mafioso.
Which game was that? That sounds like something I'd be interested in looking up.
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Quote from Bateleur »
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
Ambush Krotiq makes me laugh so much. I keep rereading the card and it keeps not having Flash. In what sense is this an ambush again? I just have visions of this huge Krotiq poorly concealed in some bushes, feeling slightly sad that his carefully planned ambushes never seem to work.
@Axel, that was House mafia. Basic 75. Almost the same exact situation really.
About your logic, yes. That's partially due to the fact you misread my original comment; not having time to read the full thread =/= ignoring the thread. Are you saying that my comment that I wouldn't have time to read WASN'T looked at as scummy by you?
Ah are you dancing around explaining yourself? I already told you how I understood it, and then instead of explaining clearly, you ask more questions.
Of course he was announcing the fact that he was sitting back. I mean, he said it in thread; that's why people jumped on him. If you are trying to imply something, maybe you should stop and just come out with it.
@Axel, that's a math joke, not a dig. Ln = natural lot of grrrr= gr to the 4th power.
Fwiw, I have Cantrip as a town read. He was the only one to point out SNL's scummy "On an early wagon, isn't one of the three people scum?" comment. Not only did SNL this that out, he didn't add which one he thought it was, and when challenged on it completely dropped it instead of trying to remember where he heard that from, or justifying it in any fashion. Felt like a "hey town who can we mislynch?" comment. Surprised more people didn't comment. That post series of posts shouldn't have flown under the radar as much as they did.
And regarding guild claims, I didn't get my first choice
Town
KoolKoal - for posting in Japanese
Dagaen - for being easy to read (I think)
scarbo - for taking a run at Axelrod based on almost nothing
masterplum - for the way he is talking during his second game, and brainstorming roles publicly
Cantripmancer - for making mistakes (this goes away if scarbo is scum)
Archmage Eternal - for not pushing as hard as he can
scum:
Hunger - for seeming to have an agenda
Void - for WIFOMingly saying he wasn't going to participate, thus trying to score townie points
Axelrod - for accepting Void's post at face value
TK - for fishing on Dagaen
Sorry to all for the wall of posts, but I have some time and motivation to post now so I want to get it in while AI can.
@TK, you said Dag felt a lot more self-conscious. But I think it's weird that you didn't bring up the fact that Dag had Proph vouching for him as a townread that game. Considering Proph was a townread himself (especially D2 onwards due to the cop shot), I imagine that would make one less nervous.
I only know AI by reputation, so I assume he's a good player. Does AI consistently underestimate people?
@LnGrrrR: Yes, but I don't think I read any of Dag's posts after Day 1. I'm pretty certain that I mentioned D1 that I was near positive that Dag was town. I only compared Dag's D1 read (because I was quite literal with that first sentence) to toDay. That would be before he knew he was considered town by Proph (and by me).
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She wants a ride on the pony, dude.
Mafia Stats
Kill shot: BB
Issue with my shooting? Please visit my helpdesk and help me learn to aim!
@Cantripmancer: Void is not experienced in the sense that Axelrod is, for instance, but he's experienced enough to understand the basic dynamics of the game. He's certainly experienced enough to realize that taking a nap and hanging up a sign that says "Do Not Disturb (Unless Someone Claims Scum)" is a huge red flag. So unless you think he's town misplaying deliberately, I'm not sure where the confusion lies.
Ok, so right here. AI says, "Void is experienced enough to know this comment is seen as super scmmy." So what does AI conclude? That Void, knowing that comment would make him sound scummy... Did it anyways and is scum? Like, that makes no sense to me, unless you think Void's IQ is roughly equivalent to the temperature at Santa's Workshop.
What conclusion would you have me draw? That Void was playing in an anti-town manner on purpose...as a townie? Occam's Razor indicates otherwise.
@Cantripmancer: Void is not experienced in the sense that Axelrod is, for instance, but he's experienced enough to understand the basic dynamics of the game. He's certainly experienced enough to realize that taking a nap and hanging up a sign that says "Do Not Disturb (Unless Someone Claims Scum)" is a huge red flag. So unless you think he's town misplaying deliberately, I'm not sure where the confusion lies.
Ok, so right here. AI says, "Void is experienced enough to know this comment is seen as super scmmy." So what does AI conclude? That Void, knowing that comment would make him sound scummy... Did it anyways and is scum? Like, that makes no sense to me, unless you think Void's IQ is roughly equivalent to the temperature at Santa's Workshop.
What conclusion would you have me draw? That Void was playing in an anti-town manner on purpose...as a townie? Occam's Razor indicates otherwise.
Ok, a few questions:
1) Do you think Void knew in advance that coment was specifically scummy?
2) Do you think scum!Void would be dumb enough to point out how he is actively lurking, drawing attention to it?
I was under the impression that you did not realize who LnGrrrR had replaced (something you'd presumably notice if you were scumbuddies), but you've conveniently side-stepped any claim of ignorance, so there goes that theory.
A vanilla wouldn't care if his guild was found out at all. Would probably not matter.
/barn
I said "Wow, that's really good reasoning", and it wasn't sarcasm. I wasn't expecting the in-depth logic that TK applied in his response; I don't think that a scum mentality would push that kind of angle over continuing to (at least) suspect Dagaen.
This is the crappiest attack and justification I've seen in a long time.
Vote Axelrod
Unless this is townie indignation, which is what I got.
I am telling you right now that this is untrue.
Oh we can find scum the old fashioned way. But what happens when they claim a nice juicy role? Yup, everyone forgets about behavior and continues on somewhere else. Speaking of behavior, I'm not liking AI's. Holding my vote till I finish figuring him out.
They hate us cause they ain't us.
Very well, that doesn't change most of the argument. His mindset still flipped between posts
Hold on a sec
Define vanilla for me
@Cantrip/masterplum: You two have reads on each other yet?
And sure it's not a smoking gun. But what is in mafia? If we were waiting for a day 1 smoking gun we would be waiting here a long time most likely
Your initial premise is wrong. I did not "not wish to claim." I was completely indifferent to the question. Because it was a request that appeared to have no purpose. It appeared to me - and I am still quite certain this is true - that whether or not one received their "first choice" of guilds in this game could not possibly tell us anything useful. It made me slightly more suspicious of RR for even asking the question in the first place. Seemed like busywork. Asking a question to try and appear like one is doing something useful, without actually doing anything useful. Which is a possible scum mindset. But, I am also allowing for the possibility that RR thought it could possibly have some significance and just didn't think it all the way through. So I just ignored it.
So I don't know where you are getting this "vibe" from, given that I didn't say what you seem to believe I said. And also, please think it through for yourself and see that this question could not possibly have made anyone nervous (as scum).
It seems like you may be confusing not wanting to claim if I received my "first choice" of guilds with not wanting to participate in a mass guild claim. I did say I wasn't interested in mass claiming guilds. As far as I'm concerned the risks of that currently outweigh the benefits. I'm allowing for the possibility for someone to change my mind on that, but I suspect the Mod. wouldn't have made it such that this was a good idea right off the top.
This is insane. For anyone to be afraid of that. Like, I'm going to say "I got my first choice" and then, someone's going to go do research on me to find out if I have ever said anywhere what Ravkica Guild I like, and then assume that (obviously) I must have requested that one, and now (horror) I've actually claimed my guild, and, oh no, what am I (as scum) going to do?
Do you see how crazy that is? How much you are stretching to try and make this point? There's no way someone would be afraid of that. Because it's dumb.
I'm pretty sure your basic premise is faulty also. Because I'm pretty sure that Guilds and alignment don't correlate this game. And I feel pretty sure in saying that because it basically says that in my role PM. Does yours not?
Just pointing out that you did not "press" me on anything. You politely asked me - with a rather strong implication that you had a reason for asking. "Pressing" me would have been something like demanding I answer the question and then, like, voting me for not complying. Apparently, you were trying to be sneaky? I'm afraid the form of your request defeated it's purpose in that case.
See, who's paranoid? You've invented a mindset here. If I had ever said in any way shape or form that I didn't want to claim whether I got my first choice of guilds (for any reason) then I guess maybe that could be Townie paranoia. But, given that I didn't say this, and didn't feel this, your assumption about what a "paranoid Townie" would do if faced with that rather innocuous question is irrelevant.
Not even slightly. And I still haven't "changed" my thinking. You implied you had a reason for asking, so I gave you the benefit of the doubt and answered - because it didn't matter - but I also asked why you wanted to know (remember). This was to (hopefully) give me insight into your thought process.
And I guess I got my answer. It's all wrong. But the thought process seems more consistent with a wrong-headed Townie than scum trying to set some incredibly clumsy trap.
Uh, that wasn't an attack. Or a justification. I already gave those. Remember? This was my remarking on Void's "comeback" post after I've been critical of him. And I'm suggesting that this "comeback" is less than worthless. Which it is. He has (again) completely ignored the actual point with handwaving while responding to a point that no one (or at least not me) was arguing. I'm saying that the replacement player doesn't get to come in on a clean slate (which, for some reason some people seem to think should be the case, but that's not me).
Please go back and tell me what was wrong with the actual vote. I'd love to hear your issues.
You got that Void quit the game because of "townie indignation?"
Really?
I have a hard time seeing that - given what was actually posted in the thread. His jumping ship came from completely out of left field. He got one more vote on him, and immediately quit? Without saying "this is complete BS, I'm out," or ranting, or cursing us out, or something?
No way.
Man, the more I think about it the more confident I feel.
And the replacement coming in and immediately excusing himself until the weekend really didn't help things.
that makes no sense
Hello. We haven't met before, have we?
Sure it does. Think about it.
It's not like a smoking gun or anything, but it definitely doesn't help his case.
I have a life, and it's a busy week at work. I wi respond to current events, but I won't have time to read the whole thread and give notes until the weekend.
Your logic is asinine. Just because I offered to replace in doesn't mean that I have a few hours open tonight to get my reading done. Please explain to me what you would expect a town player to say upon replace in?
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
I know some people have the theory "town don't have to worry about being stupid and carefree with their posting!" but I disagree completely. As an example, many people have said as town they sometimes cut out language they normally use (to be honest/honestly for one) because they don't want to attract suspicion and sidetrack the town.
Excepting power roles, which have a reason to not look super town, it's a vanilla's job to draw a NK, whether by pulling off a successful gambit, identifying scum successfully, or just looking super obvtown.
I have no desire to say something stupid, get a wagon run up on me for saying said stupid thing, and then getting mislynched. If you still think I am scum after the reread, cool that's your choice. But saying "LOL he is taking time to read = scum" means you're pretty much tunnelling and aren't going to pay attention anyways.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
The implication that "he can't respond to the accusations against him so he is scum!" Uhmm yeah I can't respond because I don't know what avoid got run up for. Given the last page or so I'm assuming it's some modgaming thing about guilds, but until I get to that point in the reread I don't know.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
Try again?
Another example of bad logic is on page 5. If scum wanted to sit back, do you think they would be so dumb as to ANNOUNCE THE FACT THAT THEY ARE SITTING BACK? I mean, do you have so little respect for Void as a player? If he actually wanted to sit back, he could've barned something, thrown out a useless question etc etc.
My first game here I said something similar, and got run up to, even though I was town. I mean, WIFOM and all, but getting early attention on you, with a comment that is pretty much universally seen as scummy, that seems pretty ridiculously suicidey for a mafioso.
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Town:
Dagaen
Koal
Tentatively Town:
Natural Log man
Scum:
Axelrod
I do say, these longer days do give me more time to make reads. That is kind of a nice thing about them.
Why not?
Ok, so right here. AI says, "Void is experienced enough to know this comment is seen as super scmmy." So what does AI conclude? That Void, knowing that comment would make him sound scummy... Did it anyways and is scum? Like, that makes no sense to me, unless you think Void's IQ is roughly equivalent to the temperature at Santa's Workshop.
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Well, I'm not sure what they would be called. Random words on a message board or something.
There are people I have played mafia with for years that I refuse to ever make a read on because they are quite good.
Completely depends
PLUM READS UPDATED
Town:
Dagaen
Koal
Tentatively Town:
Natural Log man
Temtatively Scum:
AI
Scum:
Axelrod
Well, actually, you're the one who called my "logic" "asinine" without apparently having read the thread, so I think it was appropriate to ask what you were talking about. It appears you are saying that (you believed?) I was arguing that you were scum because you were failing to immediately answer the points against Void? Is that what you were saying was "asinine?"
I've got no opinion at all of Void as a player. Yet.
And let me ask you this because it's actually important. Do you think Void was (as you say here in all caps) ANNOUNCING THE FACT THAT HE WAS SITTING BACK?
Do you think he was?
Which game was that? That sounds like something I'd be interested in looking up.
Is this a dig?
Seriously, I don't know.
About your logic, yes. That's partially due to the fact you misread my original comment; not having time to read the full thread =/= ignoring the thread. Are you saying that my comment that I wouldn't have time to read WASN'T looked at as scummy by you?
Ah are you dancing around explaining yourself? I already told you how I understood it, and then instead of explaining clearly, you ask more questions.
Of course he was announcing the fact that he was sitting back. I mean, he said it in thread; that's why people jumped on him. If you are trying to imply something, maybe you should stop and just come out with it.
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Fwiw, I have Cantrip as a town read. He was the only one to point out SNL's scummy "On an early wagon, isn't one of the three people scum?" comment. Not only did SNL this that out, he didn't add which one he thought it was, and when challenged on it completely dropped it instead of trying to remember where he heard that from, or justifying it in any fashion. Felt like a "hey town who can we mislynch?" comment. Surprised more people didn't comment. That post series of posts shouldn't have flown under the radar as much as they did.
And regarding guild claims, I didn't get my first choice
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Why isn't AI in this list?
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@TK, you said Dag felt a lot more self-conscious. But I think it's weird that you didn't bring up the fact that Dag had Proph vouching for him as a townread that game. Considering Proph was a townread himself (especially D2 onwards due to the cop shot), I imagine that would make one less nervous.
@Dag, Proph said you sucked as scum. Why?
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@LnGrrrR: Yes, but I don't think I read any of Dag's posts after Day 1. I'm pretty certain that I mentioned D1 that I was near positive that Dag was town. I only compared Dag's D1 read (because I was quite literal with that first sentence) to toDay. That would be before he knew he was considered town by Proph (and by me).
Mafia Stats
Kill shot: BB
Issue with my shooting? Please visit my helpdesk and help me learn to aim!
What conclusion would you have me draw? That Void was playing in an anti-town manner on purpose...as a townie? Occam's Razor indicates otherwise.
Ok, a few questions:
1) Do you think Void knew in advance that coment was specifically scummy?
2) Do you think scum!Void would be dumb enough to point out how he is actively lurking, drawing attention to it?
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Before it was pointed out to him? Probably on some level, but obviously not to the point where it stopped him from posting it.
There is no polite way to answer this question.
Why are you so preoccupied with AI's opinion of Void?