The whole point of responding back to cases is to show that you are town, and to prove that you had solid town reasoning. You should know this. Ignoring his post doesn't help your case.
I disagree.
Golf is scum to me. As such, it is actually more logical for me to not attempt to argue with him. Further argument will only be a useless endeavor as it will give him more attempts to obfuscate and add more noise to the thread for town to have to sift through. I've stated why Golf is scum. If his wagon doesn't gain any traction in the immediate future, I'll appeal further. I'd like to think his play is speaking for itself, anyway.
Golf is scum to me. As such, it is actually more logical for me to not attempt to argue with him. Further argument will only be a useless endeavor as it will give him more attempts to obfuscate and add more noise to the thread for town to have to sift through. I've stated why Golf is scum. If his wagon doesn't gain any traction in the immediate future, I'll appeal further. I'd like to think his play is speaking for itself, anyway.
You don't have to argue but seriously, he accuses you of having no arguments or opinions and you respond with a thumbs up. That's just weak.
@SEM-Golf - Still looking for an answer here, was it RVS, a reaction post or something more? Your answer looks like your trying to brush me off.
The whole point of responding back to cases is to show that you are town, and to prove that you had solid town reasoning. You should know this. Ignoring his post doesn't help your case.
He said that asking everyone what they thought about something, without giving your insight, was scummy. And then instead of explaining the mindset (and your opinion), you just thumbs up his post.
I can see how you interpreted Uniform's comment, so I retract that statement. (I read it as the posts in which you multi-quoted sounded nervous and scummy, but it could also be read as multi quoting posts in itself is nervous and scummy.)
Uniform, could you clarify what you meant by that post?
The multi-posting thing is just a small factor. Xi is responding to only half of the cases on him, and his defenses don't make any sense. He seems nervous and illogical.
You can call me lazy if you please, as I'm sure someone will, but the less time scum have on the soapbox the better.
That is completely wrong. The more we hear from the scum, the easier we can identify and catch them. Scum "having the soapbox" is only a bad thing if they are leading the Town and everyone is doing what they say without listening to them.
If I had known how many votes were on me, why would I ask for a votecount?:rolleyes:
There appear to be only four votes on you, G,A,L,U (The whole phonetic gonna make abb. easier) and I got that pretty quickly since there was a vote count only like 50 posts ago.
Calling Uniform scum plays into the OMGUS of what you accused Golf of when he voted for you. Uniform's done nothing here but questioned your refusal to defend yourself fully, something all players should do.
9 heads on this hydra? This is ridiculous. Suppose this means there's a tenth somewhere out there - would make for 1 post per person per day.
Xi, you're really not looking good here: defensiveness without substance, accusing anyone pressuring you of being scum and a disproportionate reaction to the pressure on you. Not liking this at all. I wanna see you claim, so let's ratchet up the pressure with a Vote: Xi.
@Papa: Why do you want to see him claim? I want to see him dead.
I don't trust all this hydra shenanigans and the beast is well over it's post count for the Day already. I also have trouble believing we easily filled this game with 35 players.
@Papa: Why do you want to see him claim? I want to see him dead.
Pressure somebody, see how they react, run them up to claim range, then evaluate their claim; isn't that usually how a wagon works? Behavioral analysis is the best tool to catch scum, but not the only tool. I like to use all the tools in my toolbelt, after all :cool:.
I've clarified with the mod and we've went over our posting threshold for the day, so we can post as many times as we wish until this IRL day ends and the posting threshold begins again. I will be taking advantage of this time, so expect me to post a lot.
So I was bored and compiled a post, which I can present to you all right now instead of tomorrow.
Seeing as I'm limited to one post per day and I'm apparently losing my grip on this game, I will try my strategy of analyzing each player in depth. I have used this strategy in the past in large games where large posts are few and far between, and I think this game fits that category quite well. It also gives me a measurable baseline to evaluate a player before the thread spirals out of control.
But before we get to that, let's get down to some behavioral analysis, shall we?
@Xi: I will be keeping a close watch on you for the time being - proposing a geolocation claim is suspicious, but it's not enough for me to dunk you into the scum category yet. Or we shall see what your rating is when I actually look at your posts in great detail.
For the "where's your vote" - will it mean anything to place a vote if one of the other heads will just unvote it later?
@Whiskey: Okay. Good luck on your endeavors, and I will remind of that fact when the time comes.
@KISSARMY: You frustrate me. Like as November said, why are you trying to minimize our impact on the game? You're playing here to win, so how you come you don't sit down, analyze the game, and actually do something rather than keep us bound by lock and key?
Which of the heads do you agree with the most?
@November: Being first to mention neutrals. Noted.
I agree with most of the sentiments expressed by our other head, Arcadia, especially the sentiment regarding the inexperience of our playerbase.
I'm not sure about Golf - that OMGUS vote makes me think he's town but he's randomly fluffposting, which is concerning.
@Cartman: I would agree if we had a private daychat thread we could talk in, but we have to communicate our information publicly. I wish we had daychat, as this is extremely frustrating.
@Uniform: Please answer me.
Now that I've finished the catching-up part of my post, let's get to the meat of it.
His cryptic way of posting makes getting to the heart of each post rather difficult, but I liked his initial attack on Victor (neutral hunting) and he's moving his vote haphazardly. That indicates a townie mindset because scum like to keep their vote on someone and push mislynches while townies feel freer to use their vote in all sorts of purposes.
Has only posted about our hydra so far, with no analysis. I'm leaning scum on this slot.
Has not posted.
First few posts are role-fishing and an RVS post that rubs me the wrong way. Until he provides content, I'm nullish-scum on this slot.
I've detailed why he's scum before - I dislike that he unvoted his RVS post immediately and had the "interesing" tell on Alpha's posting restriction. Also clearing Alpha far too quickly for one post. I want this slot dead soon.
Has an unusual fixation on the mechanics of the game. Posts contain absolutely zero analysis so far. Leaning scum on this slot.
My gut's telling me that he's some sort of low-hanging townie fruit. I like his OMGUS but I don't know why people are voting Golf and ignoring the legions of players that have posted fluff so far. I like his attitude towards the game and his analysis post on Xi, and I'm feeling nullish-town when we're looking at his posts at a whole.
I want to know if he can make up gifs. If he can't, he should quote this and post that infamous "NO" lolcat popularized by Guardman in Kitteh Trek. From there, we can use the game-winning zindabad Arithmetic strategy. Someone should also post those up sooner rather than later.
Like I said, I disliked her initial RVS post and the lust for information. The "this game is going to be a lot of messed up color tags" also reads passively. I want India to respond to the "scumslip!" question to November. Leaning scum because zero analysis.
I think I know this man's identity, but I agree with almost all of his posts. Leaning town.
I have no problem with his posts thus far, but I haven't seem towntells. I'm not a fan of his attacks toward Xi.
Nothing thus far.
I don't see the purported "scumtell" pointed out from India, but his posts have zero analysis thus far. He's an active lurker, plain and simple. Lynch it.
Has only posted one post with talk about mechanics and nothing about analysis. Need to see more from him.
I disliked his first post (feels ~weird). Also dislike his hop on the Xi wagon.
Hasn't contributed much.
First post is passive, don't like her second post. Has posted nothing thus far. Leaning scum.
Zilch, nada.
Dislike his speculation of an "SK type role". Null for now.
Dislike how he says post #69 is the worst post in the game yet doesn't vote. Null for now, I guess.
Watching because geolocation claim got a bag of worms. I do like how he's analyzing the responses to the geolocation claim, though. I really feel like his wagon is bad. We have much more scummier players and the isn't something I'd expect to see from a scum mindset. Yeah, his wagon is really bad and I'm not a fan of it. Actually revising the Lima read - dislike how so many people are hopping on his wagon opportunistically. Thinking Golf and Xi are town vs. town.
Absolutely nothing.
To sum up:
UNQUESTIONABLY TOWN THUS FAR: Romeo
I'M NOT COMFORTABLE WITH LYNCHING: Alpha, Golf, Kilo, Xi
I'M OKAY WITH LYNCHING: Charlie, Delta, Hotel, Mike, Oscar, Quebec, Tango, Zulu, Victor, Whiskey
DIE DIE DIE: Bravo, Echo, Foxtrot, India, Lima, November, Papa, Sierra
I will be controlling our vote until the IRL day is over.
Unvote
Vote Papa HoS: Everyone on the DIE DIE DIE slot
To be frank, I am disappointed at the general skill level of this playerbase. Maybe it's a byproduct of playing through gimmick accounts, but I'm expecting more analysis and I'm surprised why so many players are posting short, snippy posts when RVS is over. It feels like most of the mafiascum players decided to migrate and play here, which is weird. This level of posting wouldn't even fly in a basic, so I'm surprised that so many players are still posting fluff.
The whole point of responding back to cases is to show that you are town, and to prove that you had solid town reasoning. You should know this. Ignoring his post doesn't help your case.
He said that asking everyone what they thought about something, without giving your insight, was scummy. And then instead of explaining the mindset (and your opinion), you just thumbs up his post.
Like this is such an unbearable pool of overjustification and IIoA my nulltown read of Lima collapsed after this post.
Seriously how nervous are you? A SECOND vote is placed on you and you instantly call for a vote count?
Unvote
Vote Xi
FoS November
Another opportunistic vote. I dislike how he's trying to find additional reasons to barn the wagon and I don't like how he's forming a correlation between the vote count request and the number of votes on Xi.
9 heads on this hydra? This is ridiculous. Suppose this means there's a tenth somewhere out there - would make for 1 post per person per day.
Xi, you're really not looking good here: defensiveness without substance, accusing anyone pressuring you of being scum and a disproportionate reaction to the pressure on you. Not liking this at all. I wanna see you claim, so let's ratchet up the pressure with aVote: Xi.
I'm literally laughing.
This guy is just sheeping the Xi wagon and he said "I wanna see you claim" which is a scum mindset - he's just fishing for claims. It's also pretty overexplanatory.
This wagon on Xi is LOLWORTHY and absolutely terrible. On the plus side, I caught some stupid scum looking to drive a mislynch, so good for me.
People should argue with me right now. I'm in my full, un-restricted state and I will figure out the game Day 1.
[COLOR=Olive]@The group: So one thing we SHOULD discuss at some point is the PRISM Database. How should we go about possibly obtaining the info? Do we even want to go and unlock it? As of now I am really on the fence if it is going to be worth the hassle to unlock it. On one hand it is most likely more info to work with, but on the other it is more info scum could use against us.[/COLOR]
Personally, I am leaning towards the against claiming camp. I am torn enough though by the potential net positive though that if someone can think of a really damn good reason to try and crack the PW I could be swayed.[/COLOR]
+ scum for not reading the game and answering others questions.
[COLOR=Blue]I shouldn't have brought post #2 up. But, to elucidate a little, #2 and #122 have a very...interesting coincidence, considering they were written by opposing heads. I could just be spouting epileptic trees here, but maybe not.[/COLOR]
What are you getting at?[/COLOR]
Whiskey is over-negative about accepting things as they are and is asking too many questions while making too many assumptions.
Posting styles are not alignment-indicative.[/COLOR]
Active discredit of posting style not being indicitive of alignment. Posting styles and flow can and have been proven to be useful in finding alignments. +Scum point.
I thumb-up'd his post because I'm not interested in arguing with scum, I'm interested in lynching it. Wasting words on him is useless. Not like I can convince him to vote himself, yeah?
Active discredit of his posting style and how it reads. Anaylsis of self is overprotective and is actually nervous. + Scum Point
Indicates that he has no use for the dialogue of those he considers scummy. History indicates that talking with scum proves their alignment and forces them to prove their alignment by continuing posting. By actively ignoring a suspect that is seen as scum, he is actively hindering his productive play and his ability to actually discover scum. + 2 Scum points
[COLOR=Sienna]
I don't trust all this hydra shenanigans and the beast is well over it's post count for the Day already. I also have trouble believing we easily filled this game with 35 players.[/COLOR]
Do you not consider the chance that one or more of the hydra heads might control a single account?
Charlie believes he knows 3 of the hydra users. Charlie also believes that the hydra is confirmed town based on the latest mod post. Probability is low that a hydra who's punishment for a post restriction is ease to lynch would secretly contain a scum.
Compiling Scum points, Xi is at 4. 4 Qualifies as a vote.
Vote Xi.
(p.s.) This is not a post restriction this is a roleplay. I will keep it readable and i would prefer to continue using it.[/COLOR]
I am think I know enough to VOTE: VICTOR My goal is to boa constrictor
I must thinking something of which I'm sure
His role PM certainly containing no azure
Unrelated to the vote since it seemed to clear itself up, do you have to post in a specific meter of rhyme?
@The group: So one thing we SHOULD discuss at some point is the PRISM Database. How should we go about possibly obtaining the info? Do we even want to go and unlock it? As of now I am really on the fence if it is going to be worth the hassle to unlock it. On one hand it is most likely more info to work with, but on the other it is more info scum could use against us.
I think this is better discussion for future days when we can actually have a chance to assemble the code. I think it might also be some form of bait.
See Seppel's previous game Kill Bill Mafia. When I read through that, a bunch of players had the goal of making it to X number of post to earn a day kill, but at the same time, every 100 posts the neutral was able to make a kill.
// @XI - Why did you suggest a geolocation claim? Would you be able to make use of this information somehow?
I have explained this several times now and I refuse to do so again. Please read more thoroughly.
All you said was for reactions, which you then proceeded to not really talk about. I believe that you genuinely wanted this claim to happen and now you are trying to give the old "reactions" excuse as a way to back out of it.
Unvote: Quebec Sepple missed it earlier. Planning on voting Xi when I get to a vote count.
I would like to point out that I approve of KISS' idea. You guys were being really stupid earlier on.
Today = 4
This is starting to get ridiculous. I feel like we are never going to get anything helpful out of Romeo. It's going to end up being a town tree stump - too much infighting.
What does my experience have to do with asking a question?
Golf seems to have pointed out a legitimate issue and you are just flipping and flopping all over. Asking why a faked PR is a benefit to either side while you are throwing out things like IIoA and what not shows that you are being choosy with when to use your preexisting mafia knowledge.
Romeo's lynch threshold is now 12 votes instead of 13.
Post count related I assume? Feel free not to clarify Romeo, just something to note for later.
@Romeo(Lain) - how do you figure I'm role fishing? Post restriction fishing sure, but role, no. And that is because if we know what peoples restrictions truly are we can help them make the most of them. For example in...I forget which game...someone had a post restriction where they could only use people's quotes to make their posts. So KCC made a huge post of all sorts of quotes that they could cut and snip together to make whole sentences.
How is discrediting a certain posting style scummy? Give me the scum motivation for this, since I've never even heard about it.
And "Indicates that he has no use for the dialogue of those he considers scummy" I usually find to be a null tell. Xi is entirely correct in his reasoning for not talking to players he finds scummy. It's simply just a playstyle difference and it's silly to wagon someone up for that.
@Delta: I find fishing for all sorts of information scummy. You're asking a question that doesn't help move the gamestate along at all. That said, you're not on my DIE DIE DIE list yet, so feel free to scumhunt and maybe put yourself on my NOT COMFORTABLE WITH LYNCHING category.
And the winning strategy in Arithmetic Mafia is exactly what I propose to help people like Hotel. As soon as Hotel confirms he can't make his own memes then someone should copy+paste those links.
(Though I find it likely he's just faking it, as a game filled with gimmicks is an ample time to test out a fun posting restriction or a new playstyle)
@Romeo: Fair enough. I forgot your slot is basically in the throes of infighting.
Also, am I correct in interpreting your reads on lurkers as advocating a "Lynch all Lurkers" policy?
@Charile: There is nothing alignment-indicative about posting style and your logic is bad.
We obviously disagree on how to interface with scumreads and that's okay. It's been made perfectly clear my viewpoint here is not popular. Don't care.
@Delta: Read the thread. I've answered about the Geolocation stuffs.
What are your views on the Meme-pic PR?
Admittedly I didn't get anything I wasn't expecting as far as the Geolocation claim question is concerned. It was more about stirring the pot than getting reads at that point. There was so much useless IIoA discussion and it was making my eyes glaze over.
Again, what do my questions have to do with my experience?
I'm getting these votes because Scum are Alpha-Striking my slot and the rest of the town is apparently a bunch of sheep save a few.
Oh wait I did get one decent reaction out of that Geo claim thing, and that was from November. He jumped right on me and I thought that was pretty trigger-happy.
Personally, I am leaning towards the against claiming camp. I am torn enough though by the potential net positive though that if someone can think of a really damn good reason to try and crack the PW I could be swayed.[/COLOR]
+ scum for not reading the game and answering others questions.[/COLOR]
What the actual ****. You just fabricated a quote from me, linked it to an actual post I made that said nothing of the sort, and then called me scum for saying it.
[COLOR=DarkOrchid]@Romeo: Fair enough. I forgot your slot is basically in the throes of infighting.
Also, am I correct in interpreting your reads on lurkers as advocating a "Lynch all Lurkers" policy?
I want them to post. Until then, they're null and I would not mind lynching them if we decided to lynch one of them, though I would prefer lynching actively scummy players, of course.
Quote from SEM-XI »
You guys are seriously borking up.
If I see myself flip I'm not going to forgive.
And I'm not going to forget.
This is a legit townie reaction. Scum would be like "Why are you voting me? Give me reasons so I can defend myself!" while Xi's reaction here is "Why are you guys so dumb?"
Active discredit of posting style not being indicitive of alignment. Posting styles and flow can and have been proven to be useful in finding alignments. +Scum point.
This has got to be one of the worst reasons to vote someone I have ever seen.
[QUOTE=SEM-Xi;/comments/12602267]
I'm not posting nervous and/or scummy.
I thumb-up'd his post because I'm not interested in arguing with scum, I'm interested in lynching it. Wasting words on him is useless. Not like I can convince him to vote himself, yeah?
Active discredit of his posting style and how it reads. Anaylsis of self is overprotective and is actually nervous. + Scum Point
Where is he discrediting his post style? I agree that he is posting nervous though.
@SEM-Uniform: It's my handle in which I will be using to publicly discourse, though I'd imagine that most of you would have found out about that already.
Also, you think OMGUS is a scumtell? I've seen it be a towntell in the past, personally. Can you explain why OMGUS indicates a scummy mindset, besides laughing it off? And why are you townreading Foxtrot for #83?
I've clarified with the mod and we've went over our posting threshold for the day, so we can post as many times as we wish until this IRL day ends and the posting threshold begins again. I will be taking advantage of this time, so expect me to post a lot.
To be frank, I am disappointed at the general skill level of this playerbase. Maybe it's a byproduct of playing through gimmick accounts, but I'm expecting more analysis and I'm surprised why so many players are posting short, snippy posts when RVS is over. It feels like most of the mafiascum players decided to migrate and play here, which is weird. This level of posting wouldn't even fly in a basic, so I'm surprised that so many players are still posting fluff.
Alt games are always going to "off" due to the necessary extra layers of fluff--you have to protect your identity as well as the little things like constantly logging in and logging out making people put a little *extra* effort into posting. As for the mafiascum people...well, let's just say that's partially Iso's fault, partially the Cross-Town game garnering interest in both communities and partially my fault. RE: your mention of neutrals, I would be...exceedingly surprised if this game was completely TvM, so it is something to keep in mind going forward and your hydra is *prime* third party material mechanicaly speaking.
But nonetheless, I am disappointed that people apparently think I've provided little analysis--it's going to be one of my main troubles throughout this game I can tell--but, whatever, I will survive. At risk of giving away my identity even more, I don't *do* wall posts(they're boring and more likely to lose their point in the fluff), but I will try to move from my abbreviated style towards something else.
So, here are my sorta thoughts to this point.
Xi Wagon: Bad. I unvoted for a reason--I believe he really was reaction testing with the geolocation thing--and his reactions from that point all scream towards a townie under scrutiny as opposed to someone to hide.
Golf: I don't even know what he's playing at. I'm watching him, but I can't say he's in either direction at the moment. I will say I don't find fluff to be a scumtell, though.
Papa: I'm going to be legit, he's pretty ****ing scummy at the moment. First, he advocates looking at the PRISM database, which I think until we know more, is unanimously a Bad Thing. His second real post is just a super-****ty hop onto the already-bad Xi wagon. I'm actually confident enough to Vote: Papa
Post restrictions(in general): Romeo's is pretty much confirmed at this point. I would actually advocate our other two(Alpha/Hotel) posting out-of-restriction exactly once so we could possibly get mod-confirmation that their restrictions are as stated(of course, this does assume they have the same punishment as Romeo)--being Hated on Day One is really not a big deal, especially in the case of Alpha, who's a golden beautiful town flower. I'm not going to state that a person who is faking a post restriction is scum--although they do have significant reason to do so--because this game is an alt game with a focus on hidden information: I considered adopting a post restriction myself to help conceal my identity.
That's enough for the moment--I have trouble reading rainbow-colored quote walls.
Okay, so this is our disconnect, Lady Lain(I'm having flashbacks already btw), what constitutes as "analysis"? Actually, scratch that--nothing useful can come of this conversation.
My wagon was an RVS wagon of sorts, people got mad that I called someone out on being from mafiascum. I wasn't intending for it to be more than a tease, but w/e there. You've already asked the question I want to know the most--what is this scumtell that India said I commited. I would extend another question to Uniform to "Why does he think that I ended the RVS early?" Otherwise, I have no interest in that wagon when we have much more useful wagons to pursue--or do you propose that a page one wagon like mine is telling of those players alignments?
I want to lynch Xi, but I agree that Papa's logic jumping on the wagon was extremely sketchy. His explanation when I questioned him didn't help much.
@Romeo: OMGUS is a scum tell when it's part of a failing attitude. Striking out and trying to discredit anyone voting you without logic or bothering to defend yourself.
In #83 Foxtrot points and and investigates a scummy action I also noticed and then cautiously starts a conversation on a dangerous topic. Scumhunting + advancing the game in a profitable manner. Obviously this description is somewhat hyperbolic but that is what you get when you try to pry intensely into an offhanded feeling of towniness.
Papa: I'm going to be legit, he's pretty ****ing scummy at the moment. First, he advocates looking at the PRISM database, which I think until we know more, is unanimously a Bad Thing. His second real post is just a super-****ty hop onto the already-bad Xi wagon. I'm actually confident enough to Vote: Papa
So, I guess this game started. Yeesh. Hydras, poems and colors oh my!
As for the PRISM stuff, I'm against working on that for the moment; without knowing what's inside it seems too risky to work on that now and open it up to scum shenanigans.
Reading is tech. If you're gonna vote me, I'd at least appreciate it if you didn't outright lie about my positions. FoS: November. Town put effort into their posts. Mafia lie, misdirect and misrepresent, like you did here.
Hydra confirmed town for picking up on my terrible wagon vote. Unvote.
[COLOR=Blue]
Papa: I'm going to be legit, he's pretty ****ing scummy at the moment. First, he advocates looking at the PRISM database, which I think until we know more, is unanimously a Bad Thing. His second real post is just a super-****ty hop onto the already-bad Xi wagon. I'm actually confident enough to Vote: Papa
[/COLOR]
[COLOR=DarkOliveGreen]So, I guess this game started. Yeesh. Hydras, poems and colors oh my!
As for the PRISM stuff, I'm against working on that for the moment; without knowing what's inside it seems too risky to work on that now and open it up to scum shenanigans.[/COLOR]
Reading is tech. If you're gonna vote me, I'd at least appreciate it if you didn't outright lie about my positions. FoS: November. Town put effort into their posts. Mafia lie, misdirect and misrepresent, like you did here.
Disagree. Townies tend to make more mistakes than scum. Scum are detail-oriented and tend to try to make sure their posts "sound townie" before they submit them.
Reading is tech. If you're gonna vote me, I'd at least appreciate it if you didn't outright lie about my positions. FoS: November. Town put effort into their posts. Mafia lie, misdirect and misrepresent, like you did here.
Hydra confirmed town for picking up on my terrible wagon vote. Unvote.[/COLOR]
This is terrible.
You're too scared to put a vote onto November and you unvote at the same time, which means that you're moving away from the Xi wagon just as we're about to dismantle it. Also buddies with me.
Town put effort into their posts. Mafia lie, misdirect and misrepresent, like you did here.
Also, if we're going to play fun & games with theory--this is a really bad position to take. If anything, scum should be putting more effort into their posts than town that scum, because they naturally are attempting to hide their alignment, while town should naturally have to put less effort into appearing townie, since they are, y'know, town.
Not that I think this has anything to do with anything.
Okay, so this is our disconnect, Lady Lain(I'm having flashbacks already btw), what constitutes as "analysis"? Actually, scratch that--nothing useful can come of this conversation.
My wagon was an RVS wagon of sorts, people got mad that I called someone out on being from mafiascum. I wasn't intending for it to be more than a tease, but w/e there. You've already asked the question I want to know the most--what is this scumtell that India said I commited. I would extend another question to Uniform to "Why does he think that I ended the RVS early?" Otherwise, I have no interest in that wagon when we have much more useful wagons to pursue--or do you propose that a page one wagon like mine is telling of those players alignments?
I'm sorry, but I proposed that question to Xi but you ninja'd your post right in front of me. Sorry for the miscommunication.
I disagree.
Golf is scum to me. As such, it is actually more logical for me to not attempt to argue with him. Further argument will only be a useless endeavor as it will give him more attempts to obfuscate and add more noise to the thread for town to have to sift through. I've stated why Golf is scum. If his wagon doesn't gain any traction in the immediate future, I'll appeal further. I'd like to think his play is speaking for itself, anyway.
You don't have to argue but seriously, he accuses you of having no arguments or opinions and you respond with a thumbs up. That's just weak.
@SEM-Golf - Still looking for an answer here, was it RVS, a reaction post or something more? Your answer looks like your trying to brush me off.
Seriously how nervous are you? A SECOND vote is placed on you and you instantly call for a vote count?
Unvote
Vote Xi
FoS November
The multi-posting thing is just a small factor. Xi is responding to only half of the cases on him, and his defenses don't make any sense. He seems nervous and illogical.
That is completely wrong. The more we hear from the scum, the easier we can identify and catch them. Scum "having the soapbox" is only a bad thing if they are leading the Town and everyone is doing what they say without listening to them.
Hey look another scum.
If I had known how many votes were on me, why would I ask for a votecount?:rolleyes:
Blink once for yes and twice for yes.
There appear to be only four votes on you, G,A,L,U (The whole phonetic gonna make abb. easier) and I got that pretty quickly since there was a vote count only like 50 posts ago.
Calling Uniform scum plays into the OMGUS of what you accused Golf of when he voted for you. Uniform's done nothing here but questioned your refusal to defend yourself fully, something all players should do.
Unvote, Vote Xi
Yay another vote for me!
Are you another misled townie or another scum? Such curiosity ensues~
I've enough experience. It's irrelevant. Though I will make mention that most of my experience is from another site.
Xi, you're really not looking good here: defensiveness without substance, accusing anyone pressuring you of being scum and a disproportionate reaction to the pressure on you. Not liking this at all. I wanna see you claim, so let's ratchet up the pressure with a Vote: Xi.
@Papa: Why do you want to see him claim? I want to see him dead.
I don't trust all this hydra shenanigans and the beast is well over it's post count for the Day already. I also have trouble believing we easily filled this game with 35 players.
Pressure somebody, see how they react, run them up to claim range, then evaluate their claim; isn't that usually how a wagon works? Behavioral analysis is the best tool to catch scum, but not the only tool. I like to use all the tools in my toolbelt, after all :cool:.
I've clarified with the mod and we've went over our posting threshold for the day, so we can post as many times as we wish until this IRL day ends and the posting threshold begins again. I will be taking advantage of this time, so expect me to post a lot.
So I was bored and compiled a post, which I can present to you all right now instead of tomorrow.
Seeing as I'm limited to one post per day and I'm apparently losing my grip on this game, I will try my strategy of analyzing each player in depth. I have used this strategy in the past in large games where large posts are few and far between, and I think this game fits that category quite well. It also gives me a measurable baseline to evaluate a player before the thread spirals out of control.
But before we get to that, let's get down to some behavioral analysis, shall we?
@Xi: I will be keeping a close watch on you for the time being - proposing a geolocation claim is suspicious, but it's not enough for me to dunk you into the scum category yet. Or we shall see what your rating is when I actually look at your posts in great detail.
For the "where's your vote" - will it mean anything to place a vote if one of the other heads will just unvote it later?
@Whiskey: Okay. Good luck on your endeavors, and I will remind of that fact when the time comes.
@KISSARMY: You frustrate me. Like as November said, why are you trying to minimize our impact on the game? You're playing here to win, so how you come you don't sit down, analyze the game, and actually do something rather than keep us bound by lock and key?
Which of the heads do you agree with the most?
@November: Being first to mention neutrals. Noted.
I agree with most of the sentiments expressed by our other head, Arcadia, especially the sentiment regarding the inexperience of our playerbase.
I'm not sure about Golf - that OMGUS vote makes me think he's town but he's randomly fluffposting, which is concerning.
@Cartman: I would agree if we had a private daychat thread we could talk in, but we have to communicate our information publicly. I wish we had daychat, as this is extremely frustrating.
@Uniform: Please answer me.
Now that I've finished the catching-up part of my post, let's get to the meat of it.
To sum up:
UNQUESTIONABLY TOWN THUS FAR: Romeo
I'M NOT COMFORTABLE WITH LYNCHING: Alpha, Golf, Kilo, Xi
I'M OKAY WITH LYNCHING: Charlie, Delta, Hotel, Mike, Oscar, Quebec, Tango, Zulu, Victor, Whiskey
DIE DIE DIE: Bravo, Echo, Foxtrot, India, Lima, November, Papa, Sierra
I will be controlling our vote until the IRL day is over.
Unvote
Vote Papa
HoS: Everyone on the DIE DIE DIE slot
To be frank, I am disappointed at the general skill level of this playerbase. Maybe it's a byproduct of playing through gimmick accounts, but I'm expecting more analysis and I'm surprised why so many players are posting short, snippy posts when RVS is over. It feels like most of the mafiascum players decided to migrate and play here, which is weird. This level of posting wouldn't even fly in a basic, so I'm surprised that so many players are still posting fluff.
(Lain)
Vote is so opportunistic it hurts.
You don't vote people for doing questionable things, you vote them for doing scummy things.
Like this is such an unbearable pool of overjustification and IIoA my nulltown read of Lima collapsed after this post.
Another opportunistic vote. I dislike how he's trying to find additional reasons to barn the wagon and I don't like how he's forming a correlation between the vote count request and the number of votes on Xi.
I'm literally laughing.
This guy is just sheeping the Xi wagon and he said "I wanna see you claim" which is a scum mindset - he's just fishing for claims. It's also pretty overexplanatory.
This wagon on Xi is LOLWORTHY and absolutely terrible. On the plus side, I caught some stupid scum looking to drive a mislynch, so good for me.
People should argue with me right now. I'm in my full, un-restricted state and I will figure out the game Day 1.
(Lain)
[COLOR=Purple]
..
+ scum for not reading the game and answering others questions.
Whiskey is over-negative about accepting things as they are and is asking too many questions while making too many assumptions.
Active discredit of posting style not being indicitive of alignment. Posting styles and flow can and have been proven to be useful in finding alignments. +Scum point.
Active discredit of his posting style and how it reads. Anaylsis of self is overprotective and is actually nervous. + Scum Point
Indicates that he has no use for the dialogue of those he considers scummy. History indicates that talking with scum proves their alignment and forces them to prove their alignment by continuing posting. By actively ignoring a suspect that is seen as scum, he is actively hindering his productive play and his ability to actually discover scum. + 2 Scum points
Do you not consider the chance that one or more of the hydra heads might control a single account?
Charlie believes he knows 3 of the hydra users. Charlie also believes that the hydra is confirmed town based on the latest mod post. Probability is low that a hydra who's punishment for a post restriction is ease to lynch would secretly contain a scum.
Compiling Scum points, Xi is at 4. 4 Qualifies as a vote.
Vote Xi.
(p.s.) This is not a post restriction this is a roleplay. I will keep it readable and i would prefer to continue using it.[/COLOR]
What was the point of this post?
Nope. Clearly revealing any type of information is bad. Why even suggest this?
Unrelated to the vote since it seemed to clear itself up, do you have to post in a specific meter of rhyme?
I think this is better discussion for future days when we can actually have a chance to assemble the code. I think it might also be some form of bait.
See Seppel's previous game Kill Bill Mafia. When I read through that, a bunch of players had the goal of making it to X number of post to earn a day kill, but at the same time, every 100 posts the neutral was able to make a kill.
Sigh.
Now that there's been 24 hours or so since your location proposal, what type of reactions did you receive that you think are worth discussing?
What makes you believe that Romeo is gambiting?
All you said was for reactions, which you then proceeded to not really talk about. I believe that you genuinely wanted this claim to happen and now you are trying to give the old "reactions" excuse as a way to back out of it.
Unvote: Quebec Sepple missed it earlier. Planning on voting Xi when I get to a vote count.
This is starting to get ridiculous. I feel like we are never going to get anything helpful out of Romeo. It's going to end up being a town tree stump - too much infighting.
Golf seems to have pointed out a legitimate issue and you are just flipping and flopping all over. Asking why a faked PR is a benefit to either side while you are throwing out things like IIoA and what not shows that you are being choosy with when to use your preexisting mafia knowledge.
At some point you need to step back and ask yourself why you are getting these votes.
Post count related I assume? Feel free not to clarify Romeo, just something to note for later.
@Romeo(Lain) - how do you figure I'm role fishing? Post restriction fishing sure, but role, no. And that is because if we know what peoples restrictions truly are we can help them make the most of them. For example in...I forget which game...someone had a post restriction where they could only use people's quotes to make their posts. So KCC made a huge post of all sorts of quotes that they could cut and snip together to make whole sentences.
How is discrediting a certain posting style scummy? Give me the scum motivation for this, since I've never even heard about it.
And "Indicates that he has no use for the dialogue of those he considers scummy" I usually find to be a null tell. Xi is entirely correct in his reasoning for not talking to players he finds scummy. It's simply just a playstyle difference and it's silly to wagon someone up for that.
@Delta: I find fishing for all sorts of information scummy. You're asking a question that doesn't help move the gamestate along at all. That said, you're not on my DIE DIE DIE list yet, so feel free to scumhunt and maybe put yourself on my NOT COMFORTABLE WITH LYNCHING category.
And the winning strategy in Arithmetic Mafia is exactly what I propose to help people like Hotel. As soon as Hotel confirms he can't make his own memes then someone should copy+paste those links.
(Though I find it likely he's just faking it, as a game filled with gimmicks is an ample time to test out a fun posting restriction or a new playstyle)
^above post written by Lain, Goddess of the Wired
Also, am I correct in interpreting your reads on lurkers as advocating a "Lynch all Lurkers" policy?
@Charile: There is nothing alignment-indicative about posting style and your logic is bad.
We obviously disagree on how to interface with scumreads and that's okay. It's been made perfectly clear my viewpoint here is not popular. Don't care.
@Delta: Read the thread. I've answered about the Geolocation stuffs.
What are your views on the Meme-pic PR?
Admittedly I didn't get anything I wasn't expecting as far as the Geolocation claim question is concerned. It was more about stirring the pot than getting reads at that point. There was so much useless IIoA discussion and it was making my eyes glaze over.
Again, what do my questions have to do with my experience?
I'm getting these votes because Scum are Alpha-Striking my slot and the rest of the town is apparently a bunch of sheep save a few.
--
You guys are seriously borking up.
If I see myself flip I'm not going to forgive.
And I'm not going to forget.
What the actual ****. You just fabricated a quote from me, linked it to an actual post I made that said nothing of the sort, and then called me scum for saying it.
Explain this.[/COLOR]
I forgot about you!
I'll give you a read later when I'm motivated to do so.
I want them to post. Until then, they're null and I would not mind lynching them if we decided to lynch one of them, though I would prefer lynching actively scummy players, of course.
This is a legit townie reaction. Scum would be like "Why are you voting me? Give me reasons so I can defend myself!" while Xi's reaction here is "Why are you guys so dumb?"
(Lain)[/COLOR]
Ctrl-F and search for the words "Vote"
(Lain)
Where is he discrediting his post style? I agree that he is posting nervous though.
FoS Charlie
We are in agreement here, Winter.
What do you think about my reads? I appreciate fleshing them out with a confirmed town player like yourself.
(Lain)
Enlighten the Wired with your response.
(Lain)
I'm not going to answer your question, Hotel.
Who do you want to lynch toDay and why?
(Lain)
Hopefully one of your other heads doesn't bork that jazz up.
Alt games are always going to "off" due to the necessary extra layers of fluff--you have to protect your identity as well as the little things like constantly logging in and logging out making people put a little *extra* effort into posting. As for the mafiascum people...well, let's just say that's partially Iso's fault, partially the Cross-Town game garnering interest in both communities and partially my fault. RE: your mention of neutrals, I would be...exceedingly surprised if this game was completely TvM, so it is something to keep in mind going forward and your hydra is *prime* third party material mechanicaly speaking.
But nonetheless, I am disappointed that people apparently think I've provided little analysis--it's going to be one of my main troubles throughout this game I can tell--but, whatever, I will survive. At risk of giving away my identity even more, I don't *do* wall posts(they're boring and more likely to lose their point in the fluff), but I will try to move from my abbreviated style towards something else.
So, here are my sorta thoughts to this point.
Xi Wagon: Bad. I unvoted for a reason--I believe he really was reaction testing with the geolocation thing--and his reactions from that point all scream towards a townie under scrutiny as opposed to someone to hide.
Golf: I don't even know what he's playing at. I'm watching him, but I can't say he's in either direction at the moment. I will say I don't find fluff to be a scumtell, though.
Papa: I'm going to be legit, he's pretty ****ing scummy at the moment. First, he advocates looking at the PRISM database, which I think until we know more, is unanimously a Bad Thing. His second real post is just a super-****ty hop onto the already-bad Xi wagon. I'm actually confident enough to Vote: Papa
Post restrictions(in general): Romeo's is pretty much confirmed at this point. I would actually advocate our other two(Alpha/Hotel) posting out-of-restriction exactly once so we could possibly get mod-confirmation that their restrictions are as stated(of course, this does assume they have the same punishment as Romeo)--being Hated on Day One is really not a big deal, especially in the case of Alpha, who's a golden beautiful town flower. I'm not going to state that a person who is faking a post restriction is scum--although they do have significant reason to do so--because this game is an alt game with a focus on hidden information: I considered adopting a post restriction myself to help conceal my identity.
That's enough for the moment--I have trouble reading rainbow-colored quote walls.
Do you want to analyze your wagon? (or post anything resembling analysis)
(Lain)
My wagon was an RVS wagon of sorts, people got mad that I called someone out on being from mafiascum. I wasn't intending for it to be more than a tease, but w/e there. You've already asked the question I want to know the most--what is this scumtell that India said I commited. I would extend another question to Uniform to "Why does he think that I ended the RVS early?" Otherwise, I have no interest in that wagon when we have much more useful wagons to pursue--or do you propose that a page one wagon like mine is telling of those players alignments?
@Romeo: OMGUS is a scum tell when it's part of a failing attitude. Striking out and trying to discredit anyone voting you without logic or bothering to defend yourself.
In #83 Foxtrot points and and investigates a scummy action I also noticed and then cautiously starts a conversation on a dangerous topic. Scumhunting + advancing the game in a profitable manner. Obviously this description is somewhat hyperbolic but that is what you get when you try to pry intensely into an offhanded feeling of towniness.
Reading is tech. If you're gonna vote me, I'd at least appreciate it if you didn't outright lie about my positions. FoS: November. Town put effort into their posts. Mafia lie, misdirect and misrepresent, like you did here.
Hydra confirmed town for picking up on my terrible wagon vote. Unvote.
Disagree. Townies tend to make more mistakes than scum. Scum are detail-oriented and tend to try to make sure their posts "sound townie" before they submit them.
lol what?[/COLOR]
This is terrible.
You're too scared to put a vote onto November and you unvote at the same time, which means that you're moving away from the Xi wagon just as we're about to dismantle it. Also buddies with me.
Lynch it. Confirm Vote
(Lain)[/COLOR]
Also, if we're going to play fun & games with theory--this is a really bad position to take. If anything, scum should be putting more effort into their posts than town that scum, because they naturally are attempting to hide their alignment, while town should naturally have to put less effort into appearing townie, since they are, y'know, town.
Not that I think this has anything to do with anything.
I'm sorry, but I proposed that question to Xi but you ninja'd your post right in front of me. Sorry for the miscommunication.
(Lain)
SEM-Romeo says thank you!
(I will respond to you, Uniform, once I have dismantled the Knights.)
(Lain)