What? Did you even read what I wrote in that post? I said the 2012 reboot was soulless, not the sequel. And I say this because the film essentially ignored everything you talked about and made it about conspiracies and sequels.
Character development? Interaction? The **** are you talking about? Did you SEE the reboot? What character development?
Capt. Stacy dies and makes this big emotional speech to Peter to stay away from his daughter because he'll inevitably get her in danger. What does he do? Mope about it for a while and then say one of the more disturbing lines in a superhero movies thus far to her. One that seemingly invalidates the emotional punch from Capt. Stacy's death and warning. Nope. No character development here. Just showing us that Peter is still a stupid teen.
And if you think Uncle Ben's death and "revenge" scenes had any emotional weight, then you're thinking silly imo. Yes, the basic setting is there- Uncle Ben dies because Peter failed to stop a man. He feels guilty about it and chooses to use his power for good. But a fight over a couple of cents? Really? It makes Peter and the shop-owner both seem incredibly petty. Peter going on a revenge hunt for the criminal but never finding him? And then the criminal never becoming an issue again, in both the reboot and the sequel?
The 2002 version gave us clear reasons why Peter chose to become Spider-man. Its not only because of his Uncle Ben's talk of "With great power comes great responsibility", but rather because he recognized just what happens when one ignores said responsibility. The fact that Peter actually faced the criminal who shot his uncle (I ignore Spider-man 3, **** that movie) and realized his mistake is an incredibly powerful scene in this regard. Even more-so when Peter kills him. Peter literally faced the consequences of his mistake, and it changes his life. This IS character development, not the tripe in the reboot.
In comparison to this, Peter hearing (iirc) from some random cop that the guy was the shop robber who Peter could have stopped and then going on a revenge quest is nothing. Peter becomes Spider-man for vengeance in this film, and then seems to continue to be Spider-man for reasons I cannot quite comprehend, since the movie never shows nor tells us besides that we need a Spider-man and so Peter becomes Spider-man.
In other words, the motives for the birth of Spider-man between the two films are incredibly different. There's a reason why Spider-man in the Raimi films doesn't seemingly care all that much about how the citizens of New York feel about him in the original film; it's not the point. He is not meant to bring hope to New York as the new film states; he does it out of penance and duty. He is sacrificing himself.
In the Marc Webb films, he started out for vengeance and later does it for fun. You tell me which more like Spider-man and fits better with character development. He keeps saying he has a duty to fight criminals, but I dunno where that motivation came from beside "Spider-man is a superhero and needs to be fighting criminals and helping people".
...
And if you're referring to my earlier post about my feelings towards the sequel, then you would have noticed that I said the interactions between Peter and Harry was fine; that Harry and his conflict in general is great, and that the best part of the film is the interactions between Gwen and Peter.
So, I saw ASM2 this weekend and... yeah. The cast was great (I mean, Sally Fields, people) but they couldn't save a muddled plot that once again couldn't juggle multiple villains.
On the plus side the Special Effects were great, and there are serious feels in the movie, but there were such lulls that at least one of my friends fell asleep halfway through and missed nothing.
Ultimately, it was better than the first ASM but worse than the first two Raimi Spider-man films.
My biggest issue with these movies continues to be how EVERYTHING is tied back to Oscorp, including Peter's origin. It's just way too much, things CAN happen independent of Oscorp.
Peter and Gwen were believable and given the appropriate amount of screen time. Even with everything else being 'meh', the final scenes were very impactful.
Way too many cameos: Felicia Hardy (an assistant working for Oscorp?), Alastair Smythe, not to mention all the projects going on at Oscorp.
Electro has a weird almost dubstep soundtrack and while Jaime Fox was delightfully hammy, he was just kind of there in the movie and his motivations were rather pathetic. I wish they had just kept him as a common criminal instead of a pathetic creep. That way they wouldn't have needed to devote nearly so much time to him becoming unhinged and they could have made Harry's turn more believable.
And the less said about Dr. Kafka the better. This movie took a serious turn for the uber-cheesy, out cheesing any moment in the original Spider-man trilogy.
Harry Osborn probably shouldn't have even been in the movie at all. If this was the edited version of the movie, the first cut must have been four hours long. The tacked-on 'I'm dying' subplot really, really sucked, and I didn't believe Peter and Harry's awkward friendship for a moment. He took up too much screen time for what ended up being a small Green Goblin appearance at the very end of the movie, showing up just in time for another major death to happen.
And the conspiracy angle was just dumb. It could have been cut completely and the movie would have been perfectly fine, but instead we get 5-10 minutes of the Parkers before their plane crash and a good 20-30 minutes of the movie angsting about it. The only good thing to come out of it was a great scene with Sally Fields/Aunt May.
Ending on a high note, I will say that Paul Giamatti was delightful (yes, delightful) as the Rhino. I mean, he was only in about ten minutes of the movie, a few at the start and a few at the end, but him in the Rhino suit at the end was hilarious and ended the movie on a high note.
Really, this movie could have been good if they cut another 30 minutes from the middle of the film, it's already clear they cut a lot since some scenes in the trailer don't even appear (like Peter being under surveillance and Harry telling/showing him).
as a spider man fanboy, this movie was ****. electro's origin story and motives were just stupid, and five seconds after spidey beat him, the green goblin came to kick his ass. then after the person was killed ( i wont say whome) we didnt see the goblin again. no wrap up, or explanation or anything. then i felt the movie came to a natural close and it would have been fine if they ended it there. but no. they crammed in the rhino at the end, and it felt to rushed and.. like spiderman three. they could have done an end credits scene with harry in the cell telling the dude to hire the rhino, and that would'v been great. but, nope. then the end credits scene had this jank rap song, which was stupid. and why was electro so associated with dubstep? whenever he was around, DUBSTEP!! when he battled spiderman in the water turbines, DUBSTEP!! i thought it was stupid.
Please do not try to circumvent the censor in any way. It's there for a reason. Type the word and let the censor do its job. Those who don't mind seeing it can turn the censor off for themselves. The others don't need clues to what the word is.
-Feyd
I enjoyed this one. This last week I watched both Amazing Spider-Man 2 and Spider-Man 2 and the difference was night and day. Sam Raimi is good at what he does, making B-Flicks. Spider-Man 2 was so cheezy compared to this and Tobey McGuire Spider-Man was so much more WHINY! than Andrew Garfield. I went with my girlfriend and we were quite literally the only people who laughed at the "Itsy Bitsy Spider" part. I don't think anyone else got that was what was happening. My girlfriend also cried at the end, especially since she doesn't read the comics. Overall, I would give this one a solid B compared to Spider-Man 2 which is definitely the C- category.
Ultimately, I think the original movies are better overall, but the cast is worse. The new movies have Peter/Spider-man's personality down, it's just the plotting that is blech.
I'm not sure where the hate for the recent movies come from. I feel the ASM series is many levels above the original trilogy. The cast is better, the plot is better, the storyline is better. I dont get the hate for the quieter moments or fight scenes. What do people want? Some people ***** that there are too many explosions, non-stop action, no storyline (Michael Bay) and others ***** that there is too much story. I felt this movie had a really good balance of them. Garfield makes a much better Spiderman and I feel this series is worlds better.
This movie would have been so much better if they would have just left the green goblin story marinate a little more. I had no problem with them introducing Harry as a character. What I did have a problem with was them shoving Harry in my face, telling me to feel the love between him and Peter and to get emotionally attached to it so I can feel something during the inevitable betrayal. However, it is all too rushed. I don't get the time that I need to feel something about their bond, something that I DO feel between Peter and Gwen.
I would have honestly been happier if Gwen dies because Electro somehow gets her into the same situation (she is falling and peter fails to save her). It would have made the film more rounded even if it would have deviated from the source material
Character development? Interaction? The **** are you talking about? Did you SEE the reboot? What character development?
Capt. Stacy dies and makes this big emotional speech to Peter to stay away from his daughter because he'll inevitably get her in danger. What does he do? Mope about it for a while and then say one of the more disturbing lines in a superhero movies thus far to her. One that seemingly invalidates the emotional punch from Capt. Stacy's death and warning. Nope. No character development here. Just showing us that Peter is still a stupid teen.
And if you think Uncle Ben's death and "revenge" scenes had any emotional weight, then you're thinking silly imo. Yes, the basic setting is there- Uncle Ben dies because Peter failed to stop a man. He feels guilty about it and chooses to use his power for good. But a fight over a couple of cents? Really? It makes Peter and the shop-owner both seem incredibly petty. Peter going on a revenge hunt for the criminal but never finding him? And then the criminal never becoming an issue again, in both the reboot and the sequel?
The 2002 version gave us clear reasons why Peter chose to become Spider-man. Its not only because of his Uncle Ben's talk of "With great power comes great responsibility", but rather because he recognized just what happens when one ignores said responsibility. The fact that Peter actually faced the criminal who shot his uncle (I ignore Spider-man 3, **** that movie) and realized his mistake is an incredibly powerful scene in this regard. Even more-so when Peter kills him. Peter literally faced the consequences of his mistake, and it changes his life. This IS character development, not the tripe in the reboot.
In comparison to this, Peter hearing (iirc) from some random cop that the guy was the shop robber who Peter could have stopped and then going on a revenge quest is nothing. Peter becomes Spider-man for vengeance in this film, and then seems to continue to be Spider-man for reasons I cannot quite comprehend, since the movie never shows nor tells us besides that we need a Spider-man and so Peter becomes Spider-man.
In other words, the motives for the birth of Spider-man between the two films are incredibly different. There's a reason why Spider-man in the Raimi films doesn't seemingly care all that much about how the citizens of New York feel about him in the original film; it's not the point. He is not meant to bring hope to New York as the new film states; he does it out of penance and duty. He is sacrificing himself.
In the Marc Webb films, he started out for vengeance and later does it for fun. You tell me which more like Spider-man and fits better with character development. He keeps saying he has a duty to fight criminals, but I dunno where that motivation came from beside "Spider-man is a superhero and needs to be fighting criminals and helping people".
...
And if you're referring to my earlier post about my feelings towards the sequel, then you would have noticed that I said the interactions between Peter and Harry was fine; that Harry and his conflict in general is great, and that the best part of the film is the interactions between Gwen and Peter.
So... read the damned posts.
On the plus side the Special Effects were great, and there are serious feels in the movie, but there were such lulls that at least one of my friends fell asleep halfway through and missed nothing.
Ultimately, it was better than the first ASM but worse than the first two Raimi Spider-man films.
Peter and Gwen were believable and given the appropriate amount of screen time. Even with everything else being 'meh', the final scenes were very impactful.
Way too many cameos: Felicia Hardy (an assistant working for Oscorp?), Alastair Smythe, not to mention all the projects going on at Oscorp.
Electro has a weird almost dubstep soundtrack and while Jaime Fox was delightfully hammy, he was just kind of there in the movie and his motivations were rather pathetic. I wish they had just kept him as a common criminal instead of a pathetic creep. That way they wouldn't have needed to devote nearly so much time to him becoming unhinged and they could have made Harry's turn more believable.
And the less said about Dr. Kafka the better. This movie took a serious turn for the uber-cheesy, out cheesing any moment in the original Spider-man trilogy.
Harry Osborn probably shouldn't have even been in the movie at all. If this was the edited version of the movie, the first cut must have been four hours long. The tacked-on 'I'm dying' subplot really, really sucked, and I didn't believe Peter and Harry's awkward friendship for a moment. He took up too much screen time for what ended up being a small Green Goblin appearance at the very end of the movie, showing up just in time for another major death to happen.
And the conspiracy angle was just dumb. It could have been cut completely and the movie would have been perfectly fine, but instead we get 5-10 minutes of the Parkers before their plane crash and a good 20-30 minutes of the movie angsting about it. The only good thing to come out of it was a great scene with Sally Fields/Aunt May.
Ending on a high note, I will say that Paul Giamatti was delightful (yes, delightful) as the Rhino. I mean, he was only in about ten minutes of the movie, a few at the start and a few at the end, but him in the Rhino suit at the end was hilarious and ended the movie on a high note.
Really, this movie could have been good if they cut another 30 minutes from the middle of the film, it's already clear they cut a lot since some scenes in the trailer don't even appear (like Peter being under surveillance and Harry telling/showing him).
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Please do not try to circumvent the censor in any way. It's there for a reason. Type the word and let the censor do its job. Those who don't mind seeing it can turn the censor off for themselves. The others don't need clues to what the word is.
-Feyd
TerribleBad at Magic since 1998.A Vorthos Guide to Magic Story | Twitter | Tumblr
[Primer] Krenko | Azor | Kess | Zacama | Kumena | Sram | The Ur-Dragon | Edgar Markov | Daretti | Marath
Thanks to Rivenor for the awesome Signature!
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I would have honestly been happier if Gwen dies because Electro somehow gets her into the same situation (she is falling and peter fails to save her). It would have made the film more rounded even if it would have deviated from the source material
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