Not a lot of info yet, but I guess there are laws there that basically say "if you raise the price of something you cannot keep producing it." I can keep updating, or if a Spanish speaker can fill us in on what they may know.
Basically, they said that Wizards and their spanish outlet are breaching a law called "defense of the competition" because they're setting all the prices for cards.
It then goes into history of magic, how you get the cards, how long it's been around, and then uses black lotus as an example of how expensive some cards have gotten.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Even if the author is silenced, the performance is stopped, the story will not end.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
That seems stupid, because the secondary market (aka what actually sets card prices) isn't under wizards direct control. Sure, it's under their indirect control, however it's not like they have price gouged booster costs. Also, how in the hell can you have competition for a card game like this? Do they expect wizards to just let anybody print magic cards?
panda can you post the link to the original article? i can read spanish and would love to read.
EWP: before someone says the google translation has a link to the original article, i cant see it as its actually blocked here.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The game is not being dumbed down. Control is doing fine; Draw-Go is not the only kind of control. Aggro is doing fine; Red Deck Wins is not the only kind of aggro. Creature combat is an important core concept and belongs in every color. Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
the problem with devir iberia as well as devir latin america is not related with the secondary market...
the problem is related to the high prices of sealed product and the restrictions for other people to import magic stuff...
in chile, my country, you cant import sealed product, first, because of wizards policy, and then if you are able to do it (by friends living in the states or having a mail box in the us that allows you to buy and receive the product in chile without much problem, mainly because the retailer will think that you live in the US)...
it will be confiscated and will not pass through customs, because of devir being the exclusive authorized retailer for the product...
so you just cant compete against them and that was considered wrong by spanish lawmakers...
to have a reference you may find a booster box in spain for 136 euros, which is like US$160 in chile the situation is even worse Us$190/200... then you dont have to ask why magic is not so popular in latin america where incomes are lower than in fully developed countries...
I thought everything was printed in the same cartamundi (or whatever its spelled) place.
I know that there used to be a Magic card producing factory near where I live in Northeast Tennessee. I have a very good friend that used to work there. I'm pretty sure they only produced foreign cards, Italian IIRC, so workers would have less incentive/ability to spoil cards early. The same company made other playing cards too, such as a standard playing card deck, Uno, and Skip-Bo.
Personally I would be interested to know how much in fees the countries in question charge the distributors/wizards to import the cards for sale. I imagine that probably has something to do with the increased price (not the only reason though to be sure).
[..]
Basically, the announcement says that the comitee will investigate not only devir but also some other distributors of the game in Spain.
I am spanish, and at no point does that or any other outlet of official information about this, say anything about Devir. No distributors are named.
I really don't know, but isn't Devir the sole Magic distributor for Spain? So it has to be about distributors that buy to Devir. Middlemen at a lower level.
In fact, in this thread (in spanish), a Devir employee, active in the tabletop community, says that Devir wasn't being investigated, but they were informed about the investigation. He also says that Devir doesn't decide the price of booster boxes, so there wouldn't be any point in investigating them anyway.
That isn't an official announcement by the company by any means, but I see no reason to doubt it.
I'm pretty sure the charge being made is also illegal in the US and I bet in many other countries. It's "conspiracy to fix prices". When you meet with your competitors and agree to jack up prices. This obviously screws the consumers out of the benefits of competition, so it's illegal.
The product which price is allegedly being jacked up by some undisclosed distributors just happens to be MTG booster boxes.
This isn't about Wizards nor the secoundary market. According to that Devir employee, it's not even about Devir.
I look forward to seeing this get resolved, because it seems like high cost of Spanish language product has been a problem for as long as I can remember.
Now if they can also arrange to have the cards translated properly it might make Spanish and Portuguese Magic product preferred again on price AND quality. I think it's fun sometimes to play with Portuguese Stoic Rebuttals that don't actually do anything, but there are a lot of people who facepalm whenever a new set comes out because the sheer number of major errors and goofs make the cards almost unplayable.
I'm pretty sure the charge being made is also illegal in the US and I bet in many other countries. It's "conspiracy to fix prices". When you meet with your competitors and agree to jack up prices. This obviously screws the consumers out of the benefits of competition, so it's illegal.
What does this have to do with from the vault? In order for it to be illegal to jack up prices there has to be an agreement between the retailers to not go lower.
Raising your prices because of supply and demand is perfectly legal.
Raising your prices because of supply and demand is perfectly legal.
It is legal, yes. But the ethics of gouging 30-40$ extra for some of these boxed sets or commander decks is horrendous. I find it frustrating that I can't go to a couple different game stores and they all have vastly different prices for some products.
I found a 30$ difference in buying booster boxes from my hometown store to a store in a university town. Obviously there are differences in playerbases, but I don't know how my old LGS can charge that price when a store 1.5 hours away is charging that much less.
Oh well we live in a capitalist world, better get used to it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently Playing----------------------------- R/ Nasticore
the problem with devir iberia as well as devir latin america is not related with the secondary market...
the problem is related to the high prices of sealed product and the restrictions for other people to import magic stuff...
in chile, my country, you cant import sealed product, first, because of wizards policy, and then if you are able to do it (by friends living in the states or having a mail box in the us that allows you to buy and receive the product in chile without much problem, mainly because the retailer will think that you live in the US)...
it will be confiscated and will not pass through customs, because of devir being the exclusive authorized retailer for the product...
so you just cant compete against them and that was considered wrong by spanish lawmakers...
to have a reference you may find a booster box in spain for 136 euros, which is like US$160 in chile the situation is even worse Us$190/200... then you dont have to ask why magic is not so popular in latin america where incomes are lower than in fully developed countries...
That kind of limitation exists everythere you have local publishers for imported IP goods.
Take Steam and games i.e. ; most games published in your contry will not be avaiable through Steam. That's usually the first thing they put in (publishing) contracts, the exclusive rights of distribution.
Don't take me wrong, I'm Brazilian, I feel the pain of having really expensive Magic too. But it's not like Devir is the only one to blame. There are taxes, there are costs. Imported entertainment will always be expensiver then stuff made in our countries.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Alea iacta est
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
It is legal, yes. But the ethics of gouging 30-40$ extra for some of these boxed sets or commander decks is horrendous. I find it frustrating that I can't go to a couple different game stores and they all have vastly different prices for some products.
I found a 30$ difference in buying booster boxes from my hometown store to a store in a university town. Obviously there are differences in playerbases, but I don't know how my old LGS can charge that price when a store 1.5 hours away is charging that much less.
Oh well we live in a capitalist world, better get used to it.
How is it unethical to charge the highest price people are willing to pay? If you don't want to pay what a given store charges, you have this little thing called The Ability to Choose to find another store that charges less, or wait until the price drops (which in retail it inevitably does).
Oh, and from the standpoint of economics, putting a price ceiling on something only makes it and related items more expensive overall. Not a good idea.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I swear by my life and my love of it that I will never live for the sake of another man, nor ask another man to live for mine.
yeah, but is it because of shipping costs, or tariffs?
Shipping costs has nothing to do with it. I could order booster boxes on ebay for something like $80-90 including shipping. Except that American sellers are not allowed to ship overseas, so I have to pay ~$175 to buy them in Sweden.
The reason, I believe, is that there is some sort of exclusive distributor agreement for the entire Scandinavia, where they pay prizes for PTQ's, pays for nationals etc and similar things in exchange for being the only distributor.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
translated link, so not the best wording
Not a lot of info yet, but I guess there are laws there that basically say "if you raise the price of something you cannot keep producing it." I can keep updating, or if a Spanish speaker can fill us in on what they may know.
It then goes into history of magic, how you get the cards, how long it's been around, and then uses black lotus as an example of how expensive some cards have gotten.
Whether it's a comedy or a tragedy, if there is cheering, the story will continue on.
Just like the many lives.
For the us who are still in it and still in the journey, send warm blessings.
- We will continue to walk down this path until eternity.
EWP: before someone says the google translation has a link to the original article, i cant see it as its actually blocked here.
Mythic rarity is not destroying the game. People whine too much for no good reason. Magic is more popular than ever, so keep calm, brew some decks and play some damn cards.
the problem is related to the high prices of sealed product and the restrictions for other people to import magic stuff...
in chile, my country, you cant import sealed product, first, because of wizards policy, and then if you are able to do it (by friends living in the states or having a mail box in the us that allows you to buy and receive the product in chile without much problem, mainly because the retailer will think that you live in the US)...
it will be confiscated and will not pass through customs, because of devir being the exclusive authorized retailer for the product...
so you just cant compete against them and that was considered wrong by spanish lawmakers...
to have a reference you may find a booster box in spain for 136 euros, which is like US$160 in chile the situation is even worse Us$190/200... then you dont have to ask why magic is not so popular in latin america where incomes are lower than in fully developed countries...
Chile!
Chile!
I know that there used to be a Magic card producing factory near where I live in Northeast Tennessee. I have a very good friend that used to work there. I'm pretty sure they only produced foreign cards, Italian IIRC, so workers would have less incentive/ability to spoil cards early. The same company made other playing cards too, such as a standard playing card deck, Uno, and Skip-Bo.
I really don't know, but isn't Devir the sole Magic distributor for Spain? So it has to be about distributors that buy to Devir. Middlemen at a lower level.
In fact, in this thread (in spanish), a Devir employee, active in the tabletop community, says that Devir wasn't being investigated, but they were informed about the investigation. He also says that Devir doesn't decide the price of booster boxes, so there wouldn't be any point in investigating them anyway.
That isn't an official announcement by the company by any means, but I see no reason to doubt it.
I'm pretty sure the charge being made is also illegal in the US and I bet in many other countries. It's "conspiracy to fix prices". When you meet with your competitors and agree to jack up prices. This obviously screws the consumers out of the benefits of competition, so it's illegal.
The product which price is allegedly being jacked up by some undisclosed distributors just happens to be MTG booster boxes.
This isn't about Wizards nor the secoundary market. According to that Devir employee, it's not even about Devir.
Now if they can also arrange to have the cards translated properly it might make Spanish and Portuguese Magic product preferred again on price AND quality. I think it's fun sometimes to play with Portuguese Stoic Rebuttals that don't actually do anything, but there are a lot of people who facepalm whenever a new set comes out because the sheer number of major errors and goofs make the cards almost unplayable.
top4 ptq ravnica 5/26/12 Solar Flare
1st tcq deltona 5/12/12 RG aggro
1st tcq jax 4/2/12 Naya ramp
top4 silver tcq jax 4/21/12 GW ramp
top8 SCGIQ tallahassee 5/5/12 GW ramp
1st Gameday DKA RDW
2011 FL St. Champion 10/15 RG ramp
top4 1k jax 7/30/11 valakut
top4 tcq jax 3/5/11 valakut
top8 US nats q. 4/23/11 UB control
top4 tcq Kissimmee 4/16/11 UB control
top8 tcq jax 6/18/11 valakut
top4 tcq tampa 6/4/11 elfvine
top4 ptq phily 6/25/11 valakut
FTV anyone?
EDH Jhoira ||:symw::symu::symb: Triplets
EDH Baru ||:symw::symu::symg: Jenaral
:symr::symw::symb: EDH Oros!
What does this have to do with from the vault? In order for it to be illegal to jack up prices there has to be an agreement between the retailers to not go lower.
Raising your prices because of supply and demand is perfectly legal.
It is legal, yes. But the ethics of gouging 30-40$ extra for some of these boxed sets or commander decks is horrendous. I find it frustrating that I can't go to a couple different game stores and they all have vastly different prices for some products.
I found a 30$ difference in buying booster boxes from my hometown store to a store in a university town. Obviously there are differences in playerbases, but I don't know how my old LGS can charge that price when a store 1.5 hours away is charging that much less.
Oh well we live in a capitalist world, better get used to it.
R/ Nasticore
entry fee for GP sealed is US$50
Chile!
It's way more expensive than anywhere else. Still we have only one LGS in the capital and everyone comes to it.
Thanks to DNC at Heroes of the plane studios for this awesome sig and SGT_Chubbz for the awesome avy.
Check out the Shop Thread
That kind of limitation exists everythere you have local publishers for imported IP goods.
Take Steam and games i.e. ; most games published in your contry will not be avaiable through Steam. That's usually the first thing they put in (publishing) contracts, the exclusive rights of distribution.
Don't take me wrong, I'm Brazilian, I feel the pain of having really expensive Magic too. But it's not like Devir is the only one to blame. There are taxes, there are costs. Imported entertainment will always be expensiver then stuff made in our countries.
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
[Clan Flamingo]
How is it unethical to charge the highest price people are willing to pay? If you don't want to pay what a given store charges, you have this little thing called The Ability to Choose to find another store that charges less, or wait until the price drops (which in retail it inevitably does).
Oh, and from the standpoint of economics, putting a price ceiling on something only makes it and related items more expensive overall. Not a good idea.
I am John Galt.
Shipping costs has nothing to do with it. I could order booster boxes on ebay for something like $80-90 including shipping. Except that American sellers are not allowed to ship overseas, so I have to pay ~$175 to buy them in Sweden.
The reason, I believe, is that there is some sort of exclusive distributor agreement for the entire Scandinavia, where they pay prizes for PTQ's, pays for nationals etc and similar things in exchange for being the only distributor.