This thread is for the discussion of my latest article, Common Knowledge: We Begin With A Square. We would be grateful if you would let us know what you think, but please keep your comments on topic.
This was a solid article Lanxal and I love the series name. I've been thinking about making a pauper cube for a while and have had a basic list, but now I'm going to go back and redux it. MTGS really needs more article content and its a good thing we have another writer. Hopefully you keep this up, I hope you can do this on a semi-regular basis.
Thanks! It's awesome watching more people get into Pauper cubing. =D
I can't gurantee any semblance of regularity with articles, even though I did pick a series title. Final year of high school is just beginning, which does not bode well for my ability to churn words out. I may publish one or two others over the course of the next year, but any more might be a stretch. =P
I definitely think that Pauper cubes have a spin on them that makes them a different beast to manage and perfect than other cubes. It's great to have another person in the world who agrees with me! You should join our Pauper Cube community here on MTGS. =D
Nah no thanks. You can keep your nerd thug tactics. It is ridiculous that I cant trade MY cards using MY databased list which is easy to update and manage. The mod community here is the terrible, virtual MTG brownshirt club.
Hey- I was wondering if anyone has started debates on whether Sinkhole should be considered Pauper or not?
1) Clearly it's "been" a common, but unlike other upgrades from Common to Uncommon, this has been upgraded straight to a Rare, and would be MYTHIC Rare if it appeared in, say, Modern Master's (it can't, but if it did, Mythic for sure)
2) Only appears in Limited, Collector's, and MTGO Editions (not even any Duel Decks, Commander, or other special appearances)-- when Power Balance was way out of wack, and Demonic Tutor, another Rare or Mythic effect, was Uncommon.
3) Is bordering on a $100, which is quite distinctly gaping from Chain Lightning, and even from Alpha Lightning Bolt.
4) Chain Lightning conversely has more Reprints we can compare- if we count all the printings of Lightning Bolt, which has always been a Common, to support our case that Chain Lightning indeed should be 'Common'.
5) Common->Uncommon, Rare->Common, and Uncommon<-Common are reasonable "gray areas", because it's hard to imagine these doing anything to hurt the format, and Rare->Common actually is always a great boon, (when old, seriously underpowered, but functional for Limited cards get a Pauper card frame to go with the Pauper pricetag). Common vs. MYTHIC though, seems like a line that has to be drawn: Even if the card existed at Common, if you could imagine Sinkhole as a Mythic Rare, it should be at least suggested to Ban It. Right now the highest rarity it has is Rare, so it's not yet quite "obviously universally we must agree", but it does seem to be QUITE a different animal from Chain Lightning in a number of ways.
5) Cube is a Limited Format, and Limited should be kept in mind- Planeswalker Removal and Land Removal don't appear as 'Limited' Tech because those types aren't as Common or Powerful in modern Draft environments. (Lands in Limited tend to be Basic, or color-splashers, not say, monsters like Tolarian Academy) I suppose if your Cube has many (more than 7 or 8? 12+?) powerful Lands, you could justify your environment *Needs* Sinkhole- Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter are, after all, Real O.G. L.D. cards designed with knowledge of the Limited Formats allowed to be Uncommon, so that could be seen as "Yellow Light- Proceed with Caution" to have a Powerful L.D. spell at either Common or Uncommon, and I could be unaware of a very powerful Common Land. What are the Common Lands that people would say justify this being allowed?
===================================================
OK, that was a book. The short version is:
Case A
If there are sufficient powerful Common Lands, Sinkhole makes sense although it's one of the strangest cards to be legal in a Format when it looks like it shouldn't be.
Case B
If there AREN'T many Lands that can dominate the game, the Sinkhole should be Voted on to be Banned in Pauper Cube. I'm not crying for outright Ban, I'm asking for the Community to come together and consciously Vote, and let the majority rule even it says 'Legal'.
Taking a leaf out of Commander's Banned List for "Spirit of the Format", EVEN though this is a Casual Format that you could decide among your playgroup "we do what we find fun", many people still regard the "more like guidelines anyway" Banned List for Commander as GOOD guidelines, ones that should be known, distributed, and strongly encouraged be followed.
Also, as intellectual excercises, I really like bringing up the topic of Banned Lists for every format I know of. Debate is a good way to hone your Logic skills and also practice "socializing courteously under pressure" (Be around different opinions on topics you care about without starting a war.)
I am probably every color-combination it is possible to be, though it's really hard to figure out what it would mean to be 4-colored....it doesn't seem logical to be 4-colored without being 5-colored.
1. There should be no banned list for cubes, Pauper or otherwise, even if it could be enforced. Those choices should be left up to the cube designer.
2. I have Sinkhole in my cube and if it doesn't make it into someone's cube, power should have nothing to do with it. Price and the fact that it's actually only okay should be the only reasons. This is a prime example of a card that is much better in other cubes.
Sinkhole's not overpowered. In a format with only mildly okay fixing, a Sinkhole isn't going to break your back, especially when it comes out on turn 4. In the environment of the pauper cube, there are much better cards.
At any rate, the inclusion of cards in a cube should be up to exactly one person - the cube designer. Cube is the one format where there should never be any restrictions, because you are in effect creating another format.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
If you're having creature problems I feel bad for you son
You got 99 attackers but I'm blocking with 1.
The Winner is Judge | 7
This Winner is Also Judge | 6
Club Flamingo | Lots
Hey- I was wondering if anyone has started debates on whether Sinkhole should be considered Pauper or not?
1) Clearly it's "been" a common, but unlike other upgrades from Common to Uncommon, this has been upgraded straight to a Rare, and would be MYTHIC Rare if it appeared in, say, Modern Master's (it can't, but if it did, Mythic for sure)
2) Only appears in Limited, Collector's, and MTGO Editions (not even any Duel Decks, Commander, or other special appearances)-- when Power Balance was way out of wack, and Demonic Tutor, another Rare or Mythic effect, was Uncommon.
3) Is bordering on a $100, which is quite distinctly gaping from Chain Lightning, and even from Alpha Lightning Bolt.
4) Chain Lightning conversely has more Reprints we can compare- if we count all the printings of Lightning Bolt, which has always been a Common, to support our case that Chain Lightning indeed should be 'Common'.
5) Common->Uncommon, Rare->Common, and Uncommon<-Common are reasonable "gray areas", because it's hard to imagine these doing anything to hurt the format, and Rare->Common actually is always a great boon, (when old, seriously underpowered, but functional for Limited cards get a Pauper card frame to go with the Pauper pricetag). Common vs. MYTHIC though, seems like a line that has to be drawn: Even if the card existed at Common, if you could imagine Sinkhole as a Mythic Rare, it should be at least suggested to Ban It. Right now the highest rarity it has is Rare, so it's not yet quite "obviously universally we must agree", but it does seem to be QUITE a different animal from Chain Lightning in a number of ways.
5) Cube is a Limited Format, and Limited should be kept in mind- Planeswalker Removal and Land Removal don't appear as 'Limited' Tech because those types aren't as Common or Powerful in modern Draft environments. (Lands in Limited tend to be Basic, or color-splashers, not say, monsters like Tolarian Academy) I suppose if your Cube has many (more than 7 or 8? 12+?) powerful Lands, you could justify your environment *Needs* Sinkhole- Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter are, after all, Real O.G. L.D. cards designed with knowledge of the Limited Formats allowed to be Uncommon, so that could be seen as "Yellow Light- Proceed with Caution" to have a Powerful L.D. spell at either Common or Uncommon, and I could be unaware of a very powerful Common Land. What are the Common Lands that people would say justify this being allowed?
1) Like I said in the article, that's a personal thing. I make the distinct that if it's ever been a common, it's game.
2) /shrugs. This is bordering heavily on deciding what should be a common and what shouldn't, and really, the most powerful cards in Pauper Cube are all crazy and really should never have been printed at common, so I can't agree here for fear of jeopardising my cube. =P
3) Should this be a reason not to cube with Sinkhole? Sure. But I don't think it should affect whether Sinkhole is pauper or not.
5 (The Second One))This is actually a really good point. Sinkhole isn't that powreful in Pauper; It doesn't even make my Top 20 for Black. I really wouldn't be surprised if at some point I decided to ignore the epicness of it being Sinkhole and simply cut it for not being powerful enough.
Yeah, I can't really see the entirety of "cube" having a ban list. Ban lists apply to a format, and each cube is its own format, dictated by its creator. While I can agree Sinkhole's effect for its cost certainly seems rare to mythic, it's still not very good in this format.
Also, great article Lanxal. You covered everything masterfully.
Asking out a girl is like trying to cast a first turn Necropotence. Sometimes the other player will have the Force of Will to say no. You shouldn't let that stop you from trying it.
Evaluating cards is a complicated business and really hinges on experience with the card in your cube. Cards that are good in some formats can be bad in cube, and vice versa, and it can be difficult to tell when a card is good or bad in cube (as my latest article talks about). It's also about how many of those effects you have in cube, and balancing out when you have too much, like burn in red.
Haha, knowing what cards to keep for the collection is a bit complicated. There's no easy answer to it unfortunately. Personally I don't even keep the cards that aren't in my cube, unless they're foils; I have an easy enough time simply buying a second copy if I ever add such a card back to my cube.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Long live CLAN FLAMINGO
Make wall support cards or a legendary wall
Winner is also Judge = 2
Club Flamingo/Megiddo's Magic Pimp Shack = 4
I can't gurantee any semblance of regularity with articles, even though I did pick a series title. Final year of high school is just beginning, which does not bode well for my ability to churn words out. I may publish one or two others over the course of the next year, but any more might be a stretch. =P
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Thank you. =D
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Sig courtesy of Disappointing Signet Inc.
My Cubes:
Goblin Pile Shuffler's 360 Card Pauper Cube - updated 1/4/2014
Goblin Pile Shuffler's 270 Card One-Drop Cube - updated 1/4/2014
BBBClan Mono-Black's Ex-Disiple of The Order of
"The Order"BBB
Funniest thing ive heard on here.
Was told to update list with haves
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
1) Clearly it's "been" a common, but unlike other upgrades from Common to Uncommon, this has been upgraded straight to a Rare, and would be MYTHIC Rare if it appeared in, say, Modern Master's (it can't, but if it did, Mythic for sure)
2) Only appears in Limited, Collector's, and MTGO Editions (not even any Duel Decks, Commander, or other special appearances)-- when Power Balance was way out of wack, and Demonic Tutor, another Rare or Mythic effect, was Uncommon.
3) Is bordering on a $100, which is quite distinctly gaping from Chain Lightning, and even from Alpha Lightning Bolt.
4) Chain Lightning conversely has more Reprints we can compare- if we count all the printings of Lightning Bolt, which has always been a Common, to support our case that Chain Lightning indeed should be 'Common'.
5) Common->Uncommon, Rare->Common, and Uncommon<-Common are reasonable "gray areas", because it's hard to imagine these doing anything to hurt the format, and Rare->Common actually is always a great boon, (when old, seriously underpowered, but functional for Limited cards get a Pauper card frame to go with the Pauper pricetag). Common vs. MYTHIC though, seems like a line that has to be drawn: Even if the card existed at Common, if you could imagine Sinkhole as a Mythic Rare, it should be at least suggested to Ban It. Right now the highest rarity it has is Rare, so it's not yet quite "obviously universally we must agree", but it does seem to be QUITE a different animal from Chain Lightning in a number of ways.
5) Cube is a Limited Format, and Limited should be kept in mind- Planeswalker Removal and Land Removal don't appear as 'Limited' Tech because those types aren't as Common or Powerful in modern Draft environments. (Lands in Limited tend to be Basic, or color-splashers, not say, monsters like Tolarian Academy) I suppose if your Cube has many (more than 7 or 8? 12+?) powerful Lands, you could justify your environment *Needs* Sinkhole- Tectonic Edge and Ghost Quarter are, after all, Real O.G. L.D. cards designed with knowledge of the Limited Formats allowed to be Uncommon, so that could be seen as "Yellow Light- Proceed with Caution" to have a Powerful L.D. spell at either Common or Uncommon, and I could be unaware of a very powerful Common Land. What are the Common Lands that people would say justify this being allowed?
===================================================
OK, that was a book. The short version is:
Case A
If there are sufficient powerful Common Lands, Sinkhole makes sense although it's one of the strangest cards to be legal in a Format when it looks like it shouldn't be.
Case B
If there AREN'T many Lands that can dominate the game, the Sinkhole should be Voted on to be Banned in Pauper Cube. I'm not crying for outright Ban, I'm asking for the Community to come together and consciously Vote, and let the majority rule even it says 'Legal'.
Taking a leaf out of Commander's Banned List for "Spirit of the Format", EVEN though this is a Casual Format that you could decide among your playgroup "we do what we find fun", many people still regard the "more like guidelines anyway" Banned List for Commander as GOOD guidelines, ones that should be known, distributed, and strongly encouraged be followed.
Also, as intellectual excercises, I really like bringing up the topic of Banned Lists for every format I know of. Debate is a good way to hone your Logic skills and also practice "socializing courteously under pressure" (Be around different opinions on topics you care about without starting a war.)
Discuss!
People need to read this fanfiction, though:
www.hpmor.com
I am probably every color-combination it is possible to be, though it's really hard to figure out what it would mean to be 4-colored....it doesn't seem logical to be 4-colored without being 5-colored.
2. I have Sinkhole in my cube and if it doesn't make it into someone's cube, power should have nothing to do with it. Price and the fact that it's actually only okay should be the only reasons. This is a prime example of a card that is much better in other cubes.
3. Great article, Lanxal.
At any rate, the inclusion of cards in a cube should be up to exactly one person - the cube designer. Cube is the one format where there should never be any restrictions, because you are in effect creating another format.
You got 99 attackers but I'm blocking with 1.
The Winner is Judge | 7
This Winner is Also Judge | 6
Club Flamingo | Lots
1) Like I said in the article, that's a personal thing. I make the distinct that if it's ever been a common, it's game.
2) /shrugs. This is bordering heavily on deciding what should be a common and what shouldn't, and really, the most powerful cards in Pauper Cube are all crazy and really should never have been printed at common, so I can't agree here for fear of jeopardising my cube. =P
3) Should this be a reason not to cube with Sinkhole? Sure. But I don't think it should affect whether Sinkhole is pauper or not.
5 (The Second One))This is actually a really good point. Sinkhole isn't that powreful in Pauper; It doesn't even make my Top 20 for Black. I really wouldn't be surprised if at some point I decided to ignore the epicness of it being Sinkhole and simply cut it for not being powerful enough.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Also, great article Lanxal. You covered everything masterfully.
Level 1 DCI Judge
Check out my Commons Cube.
Evaluating cards is a complicated business and really hinges on experience with the card in your cube. Cards that are good in some formats can be bad in cube, and vice versa, and it can be difficult to tell when a card is good or bad in cube (as my latest article talks about). It's also about how many of those effects you have in cube, and balancing out when you have too much, like burn in red.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2
Haha, knowing what cards to keep for the collection is a bit complicated. There's no easy answer to it unfortunately. Personally I don't even keep the cards that aren't in my cube, unless they're foils; I have an easy enough time simply buying a second copy if I ever add such a card back to my cube.
My Pauper Cube ♤ The Pauper Cube Thread Common Knowledge — 1 2