There is plenty of evidence this isn't necessarily true. Cards like Llawan, Cephalid Empress[/CARD] for example shot up to $20+ when she was popular in legacy for a bit back 2011. Now you can get her for ~$7 easily and if you make an effort for about half of that.
If there is no demand the price won't stick. It may take a while but with no demand prices will drop. Maybe never as low as when it shot up but not quite as high as just after a run.
Yes, but Llawan was not a good card outside of a very specific matchup (Merfolk), so when the use behind the card dried up so did her price. Also, she was a bulk rare before her spike, she sees no play now, so the only reason she's not bulk again is price memory.
Yeah there's a bunch popping up at $50 now. It'll probably go down a bit from there, so all in all, this buyout seems like it wasn't very effective for whoever did it...
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I think ports will level out at $50, it seems weird to have it higher than wasteland...
tbh they're probably a bit more rarer than wasteland, rare from unpopular set vs common from popular set that been reprinted in mpr and judge. Sure wasteland tempest printing was a bit older but not really by that much.
tbh they're probably a bit more rarer than wasteland, rare from unpopular set vs common from popular set that been reprinted in mpr and judge. Sure wasteland tempest printing was a bit older but not really by that much.
Will your point has merit on the rarity, 2 things
A. Wasteland was an Uncommon in Tempest
B. Wasteland is played in a higher percentage of legacy decks than port is, making wastelands demand higher.
Yes, but Llawan was not a good card outside of a very specific matchup (Merfolk), so when the use behind the card dried up so did her price. Also, she was a bulk rare before her spike, she sees no play now, so the only reason she's not bulk again is price memory.
There are plenty of other cards which have crashed or come down from a bubble, morphling, wasteland, sword of fire and Ice ect...
The reason she is not bulk is speculation, if merfolk or some other blue creature deck gets going her price will shoot back up.
A 40 dollar mythic rare would constitute a must have 4 of that goes in many decks.
Stats About Mythics
-Mythics are on average 40% rarer than pre-mythic rares
(old blocks about 200 rares, Mythic blocks 35+ mythics)
-They are printing more new cards a year not less
(about 665 now vs. 630 in most pre-mythic block)
-To drop the value of a rare by $1 a mythic must go up $2
-In a 3 year time span deck prices doubled. I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause.
People are ruining a hobby that's meant to be played for the love of the game, not speculating and bull****
No, investors/speculators are not ruining this hobby. WotC is ruining the hobby by hanging on to a reserved list and otherwise refusing to exercise their right to print their own intellectual property in numbers sufficient to support the hobby.
This is the reason why cards are scarce, prices are high, and people are trying to make a buck off a commodity with a fixed supply and an ever increasing demand.
No, investors/speculators are not ruining this hobby. WotC is ruining the hobby by hanging on to a reserved list and otherwise refusing to exercise their right to print their own intellectual property in numbers sufficient to support the hobby.
This is the reason why cards are scarce, prices are high, and people are trying to make a buck off a commodity with a fixed supply and an ever increasing demand.
I get your concerns about secondary card prices, but Magic is the most popular it's ever been. I wouldn't exactly call that being ruined.
I think legacy will continue to get played forever as long as there is tournament support for it. It just doesn't have room to grow, which is unfortunate. But legacy staples are widely available and easy to get, if you can pay the cost.
I get your concerns about secondary card prices, but Magic is the most popular it's ever been. I wouldn't exactly call that being ruined.
I think legacy will continue to get played forever as long as there is tournament support for it. It just doesn't have room to grow, which is unfortunate. But legacy staples are widely available and easy to get, if you can pay the cost.
Legacy can grow still. As long as people have the cash (I suspect they do when cards like JTMS hit 150 despite being printed less than 5 years ago) they can buy into legacy because there will almost always be at least a playset of each dual on the market somewhere, it's nigh impossible for there not to be a playset of a given dual land on the market. Same holds true of every card printed that is legacy legal.
If scavenging ooze is a normal rare, prepare for the tanking of it. Normal rares aren't worth that much nowadays unless they're named snapcaster mage. Even deathrite shaman isn't worth that much despite being played in all the formats except standard.
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There are plenty of other cards which have crashed or come down from a bubble, morphling, wasteland, sword of fire and Ice ect...
The reason she is not bulk is speculation, if merfolk or some other blue creature deck gets going her price will shoot back up.
There's a big difference between Sword of Fire and Ice, Wasteland, Force, etc. and cards like Llawan. Everyone knows that Wasteland is a good card, so when it spikes in price (although we may see a bubble in the short term) long term the upward trend in price is a market correction. On the other hand, the price of Llawan is not rationally supported by market conditions - there is no demand for Llawan at $7. No one is speculating on it, and I could put one in my trade binder and it would rot there for years. The only reason that price exists is because people remember that it was once a $20 card. Price memory. Morphling is a good example too (although there is probably more demand because of the nostalgia factor) - Morphling cost far more than it ought to for a long time because people "remembered" how good of a card it once was.
No, investors/speculators are not ruining this hobby. WotC is ruining the hobby by hanging on to a reserved list and otherwise refusing to exercise their right to print their own intellectual property in numbers sufficient to support the hobby.
This is the reason why cards are scarce, prices are high, and people are trying to make a buck off a commodity with a fixed supply and an ever increasing demand.
WOTC would love to do away with the reserve list if it could, but for legal matters, it can not. It made a promise and it must honor that promise or face legal matters, which has the potential to be expensive.
WOTC would love to do away with the reserve list if it could, but for legal matters, it can not. It made a promise and it must honor that promise or face legal matters, which has the potential to be expensive.
Politicians have to honor their promises oh wait they don't. Are you suggesting we sue politicians for not following through on promises? Because that's exactly what your post suggests in regards to WotC having to retain the RL. Please stop propagating this rumor about legal issues, because there are none. It is almost certainly just a public relations matter, but the world may never know as MaRo and Forsythe cannot legally talk about it due to some non disclosure agreement.
It wasn't just merfolk that upped llawan's price. I've seen a fair amount of progenitus bounced with llawan back when progenitus was the best creature in the game. Now that doesn't happen because natural order is bad and griselbrand as well as emrakul have taken center stage. Racing progenitus isn't impossible either. Here's the problem. Progenitus isn't going to be a big contender in legacy ever again due to the powercreep WotC has going on in terms of the creatures they print. Merfolk isn't doing well either and shows no sign of picking up in numbers. As for wasteland and sword of fire and ice, both are powerful cards especially wasteland. It wouldn't surprise me to see SoFaI pick up in popularity later on down the road just by virtue of being a strong card. Llawan is very meta specific in a format that is typically very diverse. SoFaI is not super meta specific and wasteland will always be strong in legacy when people are running decks with 0-2 basics in their 75.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
Politicians have to honor their promises oh wait they don't. Are you suggesting we sue politicians for not following through on promises? Because that's exactly what your post suggests in regards to WotC having to retain the RL. Please stop propagating this rumor about legal issues, because there are none. It is almost certainly just a public relations matter, but the world may never know as MaRo and Forsythe cannot legally talk about it due to some non disclosure agreement.
If they break it, there will almost certainly be lawsuits. Those lawsuits are likely without merit, however, WotC/Hasbro will still have to expend resources on them. Companies don't like voluntarily exposing themselves to risk like that.
Politicians have to honor their promises oh wait they don't. Are you suggesting we sue politicians for not following through on promises? Because that's exactly what your post suggests in regards to WotC having to retain the RL. Please stop propagating this rumor about legal issues, because there are none. It is almost certainly just a public relations matter, but the world may never know as MaRo and Forsythe cannot legally talk about it due to some non disclosure agreement.
I don't want to derail our conversation regarding legacy, however, I feel obligated to respond. Politicians making a promise is drastically different than a company making a promise. Under business law, when a company makes a promise, they create a contract with whoever that promise is for. If they were to break said promise, a second year law student could easily make a case out of it. Now will these cases have merit, that is not what I am arguing, but the cost of litigation could far outweigh the profits WOTC could make. This isn't my opinion, this is understanding basic Business law in the United States.
Politicians have to honor their promises oh wait they don't. Are you suggesting we sue politicians for not following through on promises? Because that's exactly what your post suggests in regards to WotC having to retain the RL. Please stop propagating this rumor about legal issues, because there are none. It is almost certainly just a public relations matter, but the world may never know as MaRo and Forsythe cannot legally talk about it due to some non disclosure agreement.
It wasn't just merfolk that upped llawan's price. I've seen a fair amount of progenitus bounced with llawan back when progenitus was the best creature in the game. Now that doesn't happen because natural order is bad and griselbrand as well as emrakul have taken center stage. Racing progenitus isn't impossible either. Here's the problem. Progenitus isn't going to be a big contender in legacy ever again due to the powercreep WotC has going on in terms of the creatures they print. Merfolk isn't doing well either and shows no sign of picking up in numbers. As for wasteland and sword of fire and ice, both are powerful cards especially wasteland. It wouldn't surprise me to see SoFaI pick up in popularity later on down the road just by virtue of being a strong card. Llawan is very meta specific in a format that is typically very diverse. SoFaI is not super meta specific and wasteland will always be strong in legacy when people are running decks with 0-2 basics in their 75.
I'd like to point out that WOTC has options. The best one being Modern.
I don't think they even have to care about the Reserved List. The easiest thing to do would be to push Modern and leave the Reserved List where it is. If Legacy players are unhappy, so be it. Everyone will be playing Standard and Modern anyways. Leave Magic's past in its past. Dual lands and cards from Legends, Antiquities, etc. become "antiques." Legacy becomes a mystical format where "rich" people play. It sucks for the Legacy format and will ultimately lead to its demise, but I don't think anyone who doesn't play Legacy cares.
WOTC, for all its love of its playerbase, wants to care but ultimately will make the decision to abandon Legacy in its entirety. It comes down to weighing the headache that dealing with the Reserved List against the support of the Legacy players. With all the revenue Standard and Modern generate compared to Legacy... I don't think it's a hard choice.
-As a side note, I'm currently building Canadian Thresh. I said what I said because it's the truth, not because I harbor some odd hate towards Legacy.
Yes, but Llawan was not a good card outside of a very specific matchup (Merfolk), so when the use behind the card dried up so did her price. Also, she was a bulk rare before her spike, she sees no play now, so the only reason she's not bulk again is price memory.
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Probably won't be for long.
Edit: Also, the 22 Euro copies are HP Portuguese ones.
NM English copies on there are 30 euro and up.
I think ports will level out at $50, it seems weird to have it higher than wasteland...
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tbh they're probably a bit more rarer than wasteland, rare from unpopular set vs common from popular set that been reprinted in mpr and judge. Sure wasteland tempest printing was a bit older but not really by that much.
Will your point has merit on the rarity, 2 things
A. Wasteland was an Uncommon in Tempest
B. Wasteland is played in a higher percentage of legacy decks than port is, making wastelands demand higher.
There are plenty of other cards which have crashed or come down from a bubble, morphling, wasteland, sword of fire and Ice ect...
The reason she is not bulk is speculation, if merfolk or some other blue creature deck gets going her price will shoot back up.
Stats About Mythics
-Mythics are on average 40% rarer than pre-mythic rares
(old blocks about 200 rares, Mythic blocks 35+ mythics)
-They are printing more new cards a year not less
(about 665 now vs. 630 in most pre-mythic block)
-To drop the value of a rare by $1 a mythic must go up $2
-In a 3 year time span deck prices doubled.
I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause.
Jesus, that is going to KILL the value of Ooze. Well, maybe not, if it means it will see time Standard Legal.
Modern: Jund
Legacy: Pox
EDH: Chainer Reanimation and The Dragon Show, with Zirilan of the Claw
No, investors/speculators are not ruining this hobby. WotC is ruining the hobby by hanging on to a reserved list and otherwise refusing to exercise their right to print their own intellectual property in numbers sufficient to support the hobby.
This is the reason why cards are scarce, prices are high, and people are trying to make a buck off a commodity with a fixed supply and an ever increasing demand.
https://fieldmarshalshandbook.wordpress.com/
RUGLegacy Lands.dec
RUGBLegacy Lands.dec
RGLegacy Lands.dec
WUBRG EDH Lands.dec
UBR EDH Artificer Prodigy
B EDH Relentless Rats
I get your concerns about secondary card prices, but Magic is the most popular it's ever been. I wouldn't exactly call that being ruined.
I think legacy will continue to get played forever as long as there is tournament support for it. It just doesn't have room to grow, which is unfortunate. But legacy staples are widely available and easy to get, if you can pay the cost.
Legacy can grow still. As long as people have the cash (I suspect they do when cards like JTMS hit 150 despite being printed less than 5 years ago) they can buy into legacy because there will almost always be at least a playset of each dual on the market somewhere, it's nigh impossible for there not to be a playset of a given dual land on the market. Same holds true of every card printed that is legacy legal.
If scavenging ooze is a normal rare, prepare for the tanking of it. Normal rares aren't worth that much nowadays unless they're named snapcaster mage. Even deathrite shaman isn't worth that much despite being played in all the formats except standard.
Currently Playing:
Retired
There's a big difference between Sword of Fire and Ice, Wasteland, Force, etc. and cards like Llawan. Everyone knows that Wasteland is a good card, so when it spikes in price (although we may see a bubble in the short term) long term the upward trend in price is a market correction. On the other hand, the price of Llawan is not rationally supported by market conditions - there is no demand for Llawan at $7. No one is speculating on it, and I could put one in my trade binder and it would rot there for years. The only reason that price exists is because people remember that it was once a $20 card. Price memory. Morphling is a good example too (although there is probably more demand because of the nostalgia factor) - Morphling cost far more than it ought to for a long time because people "remembered" how good of a card it once was.
WOTC would love to do away with the reserve list if it could, but for legal matters, it can not. It made a promise and it must honor that promise or face legal matters, which has the potential to be expensive.
Politicians have to honor their promises oh wait they don't. Are you suggesting we sue politicians for not following through on promises? Because that's exactly what your post suggests in regards to WotC having to retain the RL. Please stop propagating this rumor about legal issues, because there are none. It is almost certainly just a public relations matter, but the world may never know as MaRo and Forsythe cannot legally talk about it due to some non disclosure agreement.
It wasn't just merfolk that upped llawan's price. I've seen a fair amount of progenitus bounced with llawan back when progenitus was the best creature in the game. Now that doesn't happen because natural order is bad and griselbrand as well as emrakul have taken center stage. Racing progenitus isn't impossible either. Here's the problem. Progenitus isn't going to be a big contender in legacy ever again due to the powercreep WotC has going on in terms of the creatures they print. Merfolk isn't doing well either and shows no sign of picking up in numbers. As for wasteland and sword of fire and ice, both are powerful cards especially wasteland. It wouldn't surprise me to see SoFaI pick up in popularity later on down the road just by virtue of being a strong card. Llawan is very meta specific in a format that is typically very diverse. SoFaI is not super meta specific and wasteland will always be strong in legacy when people are running decks with 0-2 basics in their 75.
Currently Playing:
Retired
If they break it, there will almost certainly be lawsuits. Those lawsuits are likely without merit, however, WotC/Hasbro will still have to expend resources on them. Companies don't like voluntarily exposing themselves to risk like that.
Current post- Grand Prix KC Modern Postmortem (7/7/13)
I don't want to derail our conversation regarding legacy, however, I feel obligated to respond. Politicians making a promise is drastically different than a company making a promise. Under business law, when a company makes a promise, they create a contract with whoever that promise is for. If they were to break said promise, a second year law student could easily make a case out of it. Now will these cases have merit, that is not what I am arguing, but the cost of litigation could far outweigh the profits WOTC could make. This isn't my opinion, this is understanding basic Business law in the United States.
I'd like to point out that WOTC has options. The best one being Modern.
I don't think they even have to care about the Reserved List. The easiest thing to do would be to push Modern and leave the Reserved List where it is. If Legacy players are unhappy, so be it. Everyone will be playing Standard and Modern anyways. Leave Magic's past in its past. Dual lands and cards from Legends, Antiquities, etc. become "antiques." Legacy becomes a mystical format where "rich" people play. It sucks for the Legacy format and will ultimately lead to its demise, but I don't think anyone who doesn't play Legacy cares.
WOTC, for all its love of its playerbase, wants to care but ultimately will make the decision to abandon Legacy in its entirety. It comes down to weighing the headache that dealing with the Reserved List against the support of the Legacy players. With all the revenue Standard and Modern generate compared to Legacy... I don't think it's a hard choice.
-As a side note, I'm currently building Canadian Thresh. I said what I said because it's the truth, not because I harbor some odd hate towards Legacy.