Is that real? If so, is it just due to that card only being in the PW set? Is it actually going to be playable?
Because Wizards made sure to say those sets would be objectively bad. I want to think that they could go at least one set before failing that standard.
Is that real? If so, is it just due to that card only being in the PW set? Is it actually going to be playable?
Because Wizards made sure to say those sets would be objectively bad. I want to think that they could go at least one set before failing that standard.
The exclusive cards from that set are either high or worthless. I would not trust any prices from those planeswalker decks.
If we live in a world where Lightning Blast is Constructed playable, I'm not sure I want to be playing Constructed.
It's a four-of in a $15 deck. You also get an exclusive planeswalker in that deck. I'm sure that it's preordering high, because collectors are worried that they might not be able to get a copy (and the art is pretty cool), but I anticipate that it'll be fifty cents in a month.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Along with many mods, I've moved shop over to MTGNexus. Come check us out!
Think it's worth picking up Gideon before the tournament season? He seems to be at an all time low.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
If we live in a world where Lightning Blast is Constructed playable, I'm not sure I want to be playing Constructed.
At least standard will be flooded with the suckers.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Still debating on picking up Chandra at release. She is going to need a lot of support to play.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Morning of Day 1 of Kaladesh release and prices are already dipping. 20% haircut on almost everything. Chandra is $30 and dropping.
Also worthy to mention that BFZ is one of the lowest EV sets I've ever seen. I haven't crunched the numbers myself, but Gideon is down to $14 tcglow. The next most expensive mythic is $10 for Ulamog, and then $4 for Ob Nixlis. Most expensive rare is Prairie Stream at $2. Ridiculous. Expedition depression is real.
Morning of Day 1 of Kaladesh release and prices are already dipping. 20% haircut on almost everything. Chandra is $30 and dropping.
Also worthy to mention that BFZ is one of the lowest EV sets I've ever seen. I haven't crunched the numbers myself, but Gideon is down to $14 tcglow. The next most expensive mythic is $10 for Ulamog, and then $4 for Ob Nixlis. Most expensive rare is Prairie Stream at $2. Ridiculous. Expedition depression is real.
While your point has some merit. It's day 1... PEAK supply. And technically Expeditions/Masterpieces are part of the EV so really it's pretty good.
Call me a bear but I think Kaladesh without Masterpieces with have a solid value - not a ton of great rares but a ton of great mythics. The Gearhulks are sooooooooooooooo under-rated and we haven't even opened the can of worms that is the energy mechanic in Standard yet. Anyone who thought the new Chandra would be more than $35 without huge play in Modern/Vintage is smoking some really good stuff so it seemed obvious she would settle down to $20-35 depending on how much she's played.
It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
... - not a ton of great rares but a ton of great mythics. The Gearhulks are sooooooooooooooo under-rated and we haven't even opened the can of worms that is the energy mechanic in Standard yet. Anyone who thought the new Chandra would be more than $35 without huge play in Modern/Vintage is smoking some really good stuff so it seemed obvious she would settle down to $20-35 depending on how much she's played.
This assessment is misguided.
For any Standard-legal set, the total box EV (for all components, including masterpieces) must reach an equilibrium below MSRP. Conceptually, whenever EV is higher than MSRP, boxes will be opened and singles will be sold until the supply of singles increases to the point that the equilibrium price falls below MSRP. Otherwise, people would just keep cracking boxes for value. In practice, the equilibrium number should be significantly lower than MSRP, because stores buy boxes for less than MSRP, and then sell the singles; while the average player might not be able to turn a profit at a box EV of $90, the average store definitely can.
With the addition of Masterpieces, the box EV still can't be higher than MSRP, for the reasons stated in the previous paragraph. As a result, the Masterpieces effectively "steal value" from all of the other cards in the set, most notably mythics and rares. That stolen value means that mythics and rares inevitably become cheaper than they otherwise would have been if the set didn't include Masterpieces.
There are two interesting things worth noting:
1) Aside from extremely low-value sets (e.g., Dragon's Maze), the box EV should be about the same for all in-print sets. In practice, there is a little bit of variation, but importantly, there is always an upper bound on the EV of a box, after a little bit of time passes (AKA, not on release day).
2) As long as Masterpieces remain valuable (which is likely), Masterpiece-seeking-players will end up subsidizing some the cost of the game for the rest of the Magic community. This happens because Masterpiece-seeking-players ensure that there is a relevant box EV contribution from the Masterpieces, which depresses the prices of mythics and rares, which brings down the cost of every format those mythics and rares are playable in (relative to the situation in which Masterpieces hadn't been printed for that set).
Playing millions of cards every turn... Slowly and systematically obliterating any chance my opponent has of winning... Clicking the multitude of locking mechanisms into place... Not even trying to win myself until turn 10+ once I have nigh absolute control... Watching my opponent desperately trying to navigate the labyrinthine prison that I've constructed... Seeing the light of hope fade and ultimately extinguished in an excruciatingly slow manner... THAT'S fun Magic.
We have 2-3 users that are dramatically making this thread incomprehensible and non-productive for anyone else to possibly join in the discussion. This needs to change.
Every time I see [ktkenshinx] post in here, I get the impression of a stern dad walking in on a bunch of kids trying to do something dumb and just shaking his head in disappointment.
Near Mint: The same as Slightly Played, but we threw some Altoids in the box we stored it in to cover up the scent of dead mice. Slightly Played: The base condition for all MTG cards. This card looks OK, but there’s one minor annoying ding in it that will always irritate and distract you whenever you draw it. Moderately Played: This card looks like it survived the Tet Offensive tucked inside the waistband of GI underwear. It may smell like it, too. Heavily Played: This card looks like the remains of Mohammed Atta’s passport after 9/11. It may be playable if you double-sleeve it to stop the chunks from falling out. The condition formerly known as "Washing Machine Grade" Damaged: This card is the unfortunate victim of a Mirrorweave/March of the Machines/Chaos Confetti/Mindslaver combo.
[M]aking counterfeit cards is the absolute height of dishonesty. Ask yourself this question: Since most people...are totally cool with the use of proxies...what purpose do [high] quality counterfeit cards serve?
Huh. So, making Mask of Riddles or Mask of Memory equip for free in exchange for summoning sickness makes it Standard playable, huh? I guess that's not too much of a stretch.
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
Huh. So, making Mask of Riddles or Mask of Memory equip for free in exchange for summoning sickness makes it Standard playable, huh? I guess that's not too much of a stretch.
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
I mean, think of it more like a hybrid of Skeleton Key and Lightning Greaves - it gives your dudes haste for free, a loot ability, evasion, and potentially even up to +2 power. That's a ton of value for a one-time mana commitment of just 2.
In other news, I'd keep an eye on Fleetwheel Cruiser. While it may not be making as big of a splash in Standard, it's absolutely brutal in Legacy and Vintage. If it picks up in Standard at all, it could easily maintain an $8-10 pricetag for the long-term.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
Ugh I gave in and got 2 Chandras at preorder prices a week ago, I hope it doesn't sink that bad since it didn't see much play at the open, I hate to have to get singles at such expensive prices just because I like to be competitive at game day :/
Ugh I gave in and got 2 Chandras at preorder prices a week ago, I hope it doesn't sink that bad since it didn't see much play at the open, I hate to have to get singles at such expensive prices just because I like to be competitive at game day :/
By the end of the day it is going to be a $10-$20 card.
While it may not be making as big of a splash in Standard, it's absolutely brutal in Legacy and Vintage. If it picks up in Standard at all, it could easily maintain an $8-10 pricetag for the long-term.
Huh. So, making Mask of Riddles or Mask of Memory equip for free in exchange for summoning sickness makes it Standard playable, huh? I guess that's not too much of a stretch.
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
I mean, think of it more like a hybrid of Skeleton Key and Lightning Greaves - it gives your dudes haste for free, a loot ability, evasion, and potentially even up to +2 power. That's a ton of value for a one-time mana commitment of just 2.
In other news, I'd keep an eye on Fleetwheel Cruiser. While it may not be making as big of a splash in Standard, it's absolutely brutal in Legacy and Vintage. If it picks up in Standard at all, it could easily maintain an $8-10 pricetag for the long-term.
Huh. So, making Mask of Riddles or Mask of Memory equip for free in exchange for summoning sickness makes it Standard playable, huh? I guess that's not too much of a stretch.
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
I'm a bit lost... what card is being referenced here?
Huh. So, making Mask of Riddles or Mask of Memory equip for free in exchange for summoning sickness makes it Standard playable, huh? I guess that's not too much of a stretch.
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
I'm a bit lost... what card is being referenced here?
Looking at the post before I'm guessing it's Smuggler's Copter. The comparison to Mask of Riddles puts an emphasis on evasion and card draw. I feel the comparison is pretty tenuous. Copter is colorless, crewing it doesn't cost mana, it's 3/3 on its own, the card is drawn upon attack, not when you hit; in exchange it's "loot" instead of draw and the copter has summoning sickness. I don't really think they're comparable.
Wildfire and Cracker were talking about Fleetwheel Crusier. That's what I was poo-pooing. But hey, I'm poo-pooing basically all of the CARZ except for Skyship, so whatever. Eternal 4 Lyfe.
Juggernaut + dependent on another creature + haste = ....?
Not seein' it. The only equipm-- er, vehicle I think is gonna make it in Vintage is the Skyship.
The only way this is like Juggernaut is that it is a 5/3 for 4. Unlike Fleetwheel Cruiser, Juggernaut doesn't have haste, trample, and must attack every turn if able, all of which are important when it comes to evaluating Fleetwheel. Additionally, Fleetwheel acts as a psuedo-Grafted Wargear for each other creature you play...except it doesn't kill the creature piloting it.
Give this card time, it's an incredible aggro curve-topper.
Is that real? If so, is it just due to that card only being in the PW set? Is it actually going to be playable?
Because Wizards made sure to say those sets would be objectively bad. I want to think that they could go at least one set before failing that standard.
The exclusive cards from that set are either high or worthless. I would not trust any prices from those planeswalker decks.
It's a four-of in a $15 deck. You also get an exclusive planeswalker in that deck. I'm sure that it's preordering high, because collectors are worried that they might not be able to get a copy (and the art is pretty cool), but I anticipate that it'll be fifty cents in a month.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I know I am. It's starting to look like B/W planeswalker control is going to be pretty strong, and he's a big part of it.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=11439737#post11439737
Reality is only what man allows it to be. Few shape it so that many may accept it.
At least standard will be flooded with the suckers.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Also worthy to mention that BFZ is one of the lowest EV sets I've ever seen. I haven't crunched the numbers myself, but Gideon is down to $14 tcglow. The next most expensive mythic is $10 for Ulamog, and then $4 for Ob Nixlis. Most expensive rare is Prairie Stream at $2. Ridiculous. Expedition depression is real.
Now if only I could get some Prozac for that ...
While your point has some merit. It's day 1... PEAK supply. And technically Expeditions/Masterpieces are part of the EV so really it's pretty good.
Call me a bear but I think Kaladesh without Masterpieces with have a solid value - not a ton of great rares but a ton of great mythics. The Gearhulks are sooooooooooooooo under-rated and we haven't even opened the can of worms that is the energy mechanic in Standard yet. Anyone who thought the new Chandra would be more than $35 without huge play in Modern/Vintage is smoking some really good stuff so it seemed obvious she would settle down to $20-35 depending on how much she's played.
That would make you a bull, not a bear.
This assessment is misguided.
For any Standard-legal set, the total box EV (for all components, including masterpieces) must reach an equilibrium below MSRP. Conceptually, whenever EV is higher than MSRP, boxes will be opened and singles will be sold until the supply of singles increases to the point that the equilibrium price falls below MSRP. Otherwise, people would just keep cracking boxes for value. In practice, the equilibrium number should be significantly lower than MSRP, because stores buy boxes for less than MSRP, and then sell the singles; while the average player might not be able to turn a profit at a box EV of $90, the average store definitely can.
With the addition of Masterpieces, the box EV still can't be higher than MSRP, for the reasons stated in the previous paragraph. As a result, the Masterpieces effectively "steal value" from all of the other cards in the set, most notably mythics and rares. That stolen value means that mythics and rares inevitably become cheaper than they otherwise would have been if the set didn't include Masterpieces.
There are two interesting things worth noting:
1) Aside from extremely low-value sets (e.g., Dragon's Maze), the box EV should be about the same for all in-print sets. In practice, there is a little bit of variation, but importantly, there is always an upper bound on the EV of a box, after a little bit of time passes (AKA, not on release day).
2) As long as Masterpieces remain valuable (which is likely), Masterpiece-seeking-players will end up subsidizing some the cost of the game for the rest of the Magic community. This happens because Masterpiece-seeking-players ensure that there is a relevant box EV contribution from the Masterpieces, which depresses the prices of mythics and rares, which brings down the cost of every format those mythics and rares are playable in (relative to the situation in which Masterpieces hadn't been printed for that set).
WUDeath&TaxesWG
Legacy
UBRGDredgeUBRG
UHigh TideU
URGLandsURG
WR Card Choice List
WUR American D&T
WUB Esper D&T
The Reserved List
Heat Maps
strong showing at the SCG Open this weekend
That's cool. Soak up the value, equipment, soak it up. Make all the sweet Johnny cards free, it's cool.
I mean, think of it more like a hybrid of Skeleton Key and Lightning Greaves - it gives your dudes haste for free, a loot ability, evasion, and potentially even up to +2 power. That's a ton of value for a one-time mana commitment of just 2.
In other news, I'd keep an eye on Fleetwheel Cruiser. While it may not be making as big of a splash in Standard, it's absolutely brutal in Legacy and Vintage. If it picks up in Standard at all, it could easily maintain an $8-10 pricetag for the long-term.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
By the end of the day it is going to be a $10-$20 card.
It's already at 45 at scg, I guess I shouldn't worry too much about it, I just have to learn to not give to the hype so easily lol
R.I.P. Slash Panther
He was a good kitty
Can you elaborate on how this is good in Legacy?
Not seein' it. The only equipm-- er, vehicle I think is gonna make it in Vintage is the Skyship.
I'm a bit lost... what card is being referenced here?
Looking at the post before I'm guessing it's Smuggler's Copter. The comparison to Mask of Riddles puts an emphasis on evasion and card draw. I feel the comparison is pretty tenuous. Copter is colorless, crewing it doesn't cost mana, it's 3/3 on its own, the card is drawn upon attack, not when you hit; in exchange it's "loot" instead of draw and the copter has summoning sickness. I don't really think they're comparable.
The only way this is like Juggernaut is that it is a 5/3 for 4. Unlike Fleetwheel Cruiser, Juggernaut doesn't have haste, trample, and must attack every turn if able, all of which are important when it comes to evaluating Fleetwheel. Additionally, Fleetwheel acts as a psuedo-Grafted Wargear for each other creature you play...except it doesn't kill the creature piloting it.
Give this card time, it's an incredible aggro curve-topper.