I am trying to get a read on Jace, Vryn's Prodigy. He's proven to be effective in Standard, Modern, and occasionally in the older formats. Is he up with Liliana of the Veil?
I'd like some for Modern, but I am uncertain if buying at the current value (~$66) is worthwhile. Liliana dropped at rotation, but picking her up for her mid-era price turned out to be reasonable for long term value.
Wait until JVP rotates, just like we did for Lili. If you see any at sub-$30, that's an easy pickup. I think he'll be less than $40 for quite some time, though.
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I think JVP is going to dip a little, but not a ton. The card on the surface looks like a "bad" Snapcaster, but there's a ton of situations where he's a lot better:
1) When you want a looter in your deck (Reanimator, for example)
2) When you are casting primarily sorceries, or at least non-Countermagic
3) When you have spells costing more than 2 mana that you want to consistently cast
4) When your deck is controlling enough that he can survive for several turns
5) When you are casting sweepers
6) When you are casting cards with alternative casting costs like Gush
Snapcaster is only really better if you're primarily casting cheap countermagic and maybe instant removal. So Jace is playable in literally every format at the moment.
Add that to the fact that the card has next to no avenue for reprinting, since it doesn't make sense in a non-Core set and can't be printed in a supplemental due to cost reasons, and it's going to gain a ton over time. It'll certainly dip on rotation, but after that expect a steady upward creep, much like LotV.
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I believe that Jace is the real deal in older formats. In standard his power level is limited by the power of the cards he can flash back, but in older formats the spells have much higher expected value. I've been generally very impressed by the smallest Jace in Modern, Legacy and Vintage. It can even be reasonaby argued that the looting is even better in Vintage than in other formats, when lot of cards are very powerful, but situational.
I will be picking few more foils up, hoping that they drop at some point. The foils are pretty safe from reprints, as double-sided foils are pretty hard to print, they need their own sheet. I doubt that WotC will go through the expense for a duel deck, but I might be wrong.
So if you want to play the card now just get them. If you want to make certain you have some for future, there should be a time when the card slips somewhat, but if it keeps being played, the price might not go as far down as some people believe.
I think Jace is a safe buy once it rotates just because of the fact he is under opened and is a good planeswalker card. In fact, a lot of the value cards from origin are going to be worth a pretty penny on the second hand market due to the pack openings just not happening as they should with that set. Hangarback walker is probably another safe investment as well, though that one has more opportunities for reprinting.
On the other hand, while wizards did axe core sets, they added a general modern reprint set in the form of modern masters, which just about anything can show up in. They just have to reprint the right cards in that set and at a low price to push the value down on a lot of cards. Heck, if wizards sold booster boxes strait from their website at MSRP, thereby skipping middlemen jacking up costs...
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think Jace is a safe buy once it rotates just because of the fact he is under opened and is a good planeswalker card. In fact, a lot of the value cards from origin are going to be worth a pretty penny on the second hand market due to the pack openings just not happening as they should with that set. Hangarback walker is probably another safe investment as well, though that one has more opportunities for reprinting.
On the other hand, while wizards did axe core sets, they added a general modern reprint set in the form of modern masters, which just about anything can show up in. They just have to reprint the right cards in that set and at a low price to push the value down on a lot of cards. Heck, if wizards sold booster boxes strait from their website at MSRP, thereby skipping middlemen jacking up costs...
I'm fairly certain MaRo has said that even card pack supplemental sets like Modern Masters and Conspiracy are ineligible for Dual-Faced Cards due to printing costs.
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I think Jace is a safe buy once it rotates just because of the fact he is under opened and is a good planeswalker card. In fact, a lot of the value cards from origin are going to be worth a pretty penny on the second hand market due to the pack openings just not happening as they should with that set. Hangarback walker is probably another safe investment as well, though that one has more opportunities for reprinting.
On the other hand, while wizards did axe core sets, they added a general modern reprint set in the form of modern masters, which just about anything can show up in. They just have to reprint the right cards in that set and at a low price to push the value down on a lot of cards. Heck, if wizards sold booster boxes strait from their website at MSRP, thereby skipping middlemen jacking up costs...
I'm fairly certain MaRo has said that even card pack supplemental sets like Modern Masters and Conspiracy are ineligible for Dual-Faced Cards due to printing costs.
I think Jace is a safe buy once it rotates just because of the fact he is under opened and is a good planeswalker card. In fact, a lot of the value cards from origin are going to be worth a pretty penny on the second hand market due to the pack openings just not happening as they should with that set. Hangarback walker is probably another safe investment as well, though that one has more opportunities for reprinting.
On the other hand, while wizards did axe core sets, they added a general modern reprint set in the form of modern masters, which just about anything can show up in. They just have to reprint the right cards in that set and at a low price to push the value down on a lot of cards. Heck, if wizards sold booster boxes strait from their website at MSRP, thereby skipping middlemen jacking up costs...
I'm fairly certain MaRo has said that even card pack supplemental sets like Modern Masters and Conspiracy are ineligible for Dual-Faced Cards due to printing costs.
It sounds like they made a big exception for Origins, despite whatever financial costs there were.
As soon as Origins rotates out, I'm going to be watching the DFC planeswalkers like a hawk.
I've always interpreted that as "We aren't doing what we did in Innistrad again" more than they are never going to do a reprint of a limited number of double faced cards every once in a while. Innistrad was just stuffed with double faced cards and that block alone is what prompted them to steer away from future double faced printings in bulk commons and uncommons. Since they don't have to do insanely big print runs of mythic rares they can get away with doing a reprinting of double sided planeswalkers.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I've always interpreted that as "We aren't doing what we did in Innistrad again" more than they are never going to do a reprint of a limited number of double faced cards every once in a while. Innistrad was just stuffed with double faced cards and that block alone is what prompted them to steer away from future double faced printings in bulk commons and uncommons. Since they don't have to do insanely big print runs of mythic rares they can get away with doing a reprinting of double sided planeswalkers.
Once they decide to print DFCs, WOTC has to make sure that the front and back match (finding a misprint in which they didn't would be AMAZING - I'd love to see, for example, Liliana flip into Chandra). Doesn't matter how many they make, QA has to make sure that the layout is perfect. 121 cards on a sheet - doesn't matter if they're packed full of mythics, or has a full range of rarities. Getting the layout perfect, rather than just "slap it on the 121 card backs like we always do", is probably a significant portion of the cost.
You may also be correct in that there's an likely also an increased handling fee on the part of the printer in order to process both sides correctly, and so they'll also incur a per-sheet cost, which would add up if doing a ton of commons and uncommons. But if that's the primary cost, MaRo would probably have mentioned that by only doing 5 mythics they'd abated the cost. He made no mention of cost reduction, only saying that they felt that the increased expense was worth it.
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Modern legal, popular for casual play, popular in EDH, and printed in only three sets Stronghold, 7th Edition, and 8th Edition. In other words very low supply. and reasonable demand = expensive card.
Possibly: however, the number of people playing UR in the Pro Tour who don't have a playset of Tarns is probably pretty small. The recent jump in Tarn's price is probably due to people spending their holiday $ on it since it started at around 12/19.
It's honestly kind of puzzling how Tarn stays so high. We know it's going to plummet to $20 in a few years' time, max. You can also replace it with the Khans fetches and experience minimal loss of function in many circumstances. Despite this, the card maintains a huge pricetag.
One day, speculators will make every rare from Zendikar have a double-digit pricetag, except Valakut. You will always be able to buy playsets of Valakuts for ten bucks, even if Scapeshift becomes Tier 1. The card is just 100% Speculator-B-Gone.
These days, some wizards are finding they have a little too much deck left at the end of their $$$.
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Possibly: however, the number of people playing UR in the Pro Tour who don't have a playset of Tarns is probably pretty small. The recent jump in Tarn's price is probably due to people spending their holiday $ on it since it started at around 12/19.
It's honestly kind of puzzling how Tarn stays so high. We know it's going to plummet to $20 in a few years' time, max. You can also replace it with the Khans fetches and experience minimal loss of function in many circumstances. Despite this, the card maintains a huge pricetag.
We'll probably for a similar reason foil Exarchs are $30 a pop. People just like playing U/R in modern. Grixis is enormously popular now as is Twin (never really "un"popular). Yes you can sub for other fetches, but it does affect win percentage points. When I'm playing UR twin being able to grab an island agains burn vs an untapped shock land can be the difference between win or loss.
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Possibly: however, the number of people playing UR in the Pro Tour who don't have a playset of Tarns is probably pretty small. The recent jump in Tarn's price is probably due to people spending their holiday $ on it since it started at around 12/19.
It's honestly kind of puzzling how Tarn stays so high. We know it's going to plummet to $20 in a few years' time, max. You can also replace it with the Khans fetches and experience minimal loss of function in many circumstances. Despite this, the card maintains a huge pricetag.
The decks running Tarn are often running Blood Moon and need to have the ability to search up Islands at will, there's no realistic substitute for Tarn when it comes to competitive play.
Modern legal, popular for casual play, popular in EDH, and printed in only three sets Stronghold, 7th Edition, and 8th Edition. In other words very low supply. and reasonable demand = expensive card.
Its original spike was due to Legacy, too.
Turns out it's a pretty nice thing to sideboard against Sneak and Show.
Opponent: "Show and Tell, Emrakul". You: "Ensnaring Bridge". Opponent: "Okay, start free turn, swing with Emra... oh, $&%$^!!!!".
Did Gaddock Teeg just get hit by a buyout? It's 69.99 on TCGPlayer with only 2 listings left. Which is stupid because it's still like €5 on MKM with plenty of units.
Did Gaddock Teeg just get hit by a buyout? It's 69.99 on TCGPlayer with only 2 listings left. Which is stupid because it's still like €5 on MKM with plenty of units.
Keep rising, my little Kithkin.
I think it's a buyout too, probably the buyer is hoping Stoneforge gets unbanned. Why? Maybe because a Stoneforge unbanning in Modern might make D&T Tier 1.
Did Gaddock Teeg just get hit by a buyout? It's 69.99 on TCGPlayer with only 2 listings left. Which is stupid because it's still like €5 on MKM with plenty of units.
Keep rising, my little Kithkin.
I think it's a buyout too, probably the buyer is hoping Stoneforge gets unbanned. Why? Maybe because a Stoneforge unbanning in Modern might make D&T Tier 1.
Cue Thalia buyout
I think it's more that with the popularity of Tron, Gaddock Teeg gets a lot better. GW Hatebears isn't a no-name deck in Modern. It has seen some minor success and Gaddock Teeg shuts down Tron pretty hard.
He doesn't stop Tron. Tron can still cast Newlamog, Emrakul, Wurmcoil, and O-Stone. He shuts down their walkers, but so does Pithing Needle.
He's even less useful against BW Eldrazi, where you might hit an All is Dust but pretty much nothing other than that.
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But he stops Karn while providing a 2/2 body within your colors, which Pithing Needle does not do. He also acts as splash hate against several other cards and decks in the format. Don't count him out because he isn't a one-card answer to everything in the format. I think $25 is more than fair for a Lorwyn rare that sees play in Commander, Modern, and Tiny Leaders. I see he's at $40 TCG Mid right now, which is a bit far fetched and obviously the result of a buyout, but I think him settling at a bit below $30 would be appropriate for his rarity and ability.
Feel free to discuss price changes for cards or potential rises or falls in card prices in Modern.
Old thread: http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/market-street/market-street-cafe/market-street-cafe-archive/388350-modern-huge-gainers
I'd like some for Modern, but I am uncertain if buying at the current value (~$66) is worthwhile. Liliana dropped at rotation, but picking her up for her mid-era price turned out to be reasonable for long term value.
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1) When you want a looter in your deck (Reanimator, for example)
2) When you are casting primarily sorceries, or at least non-Countermagic
3) When you have spells costing more than 2 mana that you want to consistently cast
4) When your deck is controlling enough that he can survive for several turns
5) When you are casting sweepers
6) When you are casting cards with alternative casting costs like Gush
Snapcaster is only really better if you're primarily casting cheap countermagic and maybe instant removal. So Jace is playable in literally every format at the moment.
Add that to the fact that the card has next to no avenue for reprinting, since it doesn't make sense in a non-Core set and can't be printed in a supplemental due to cost reasons, and it's going to gain a ton over time. It'll certainly dip on rotation, but after that expect a steady upward creep, much like LotV.
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I will be picking few more foils up, hoping that they drop at some point. The foils are pretty safe from reprints, as double-sided foils are pretty hard to print, they need their own sheet. I doubt that WotC will go through the expense for a duel deck, but I might be wrong.
So if you want to play the card now just get them. If you want to make certain you have some for future, there should be a time when the card slips somewhat, but if it keeps being played, the price might not go as far down as some people believe.
Set to default
On the other hand, while wizards did axe core sets, they added a general modern reprint set in the form of modern masters, which just about anything can show up in. They just have to reprint the right cards in that set and at a low price to push the value down on a lot of cards. Heck, if wizards sold booster boxes strait from their website at MSRP, thereby skipping middlemen jacking up costs...
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I'm fairly certain MaRo has said that even card pack supplemental sets like Modern Masters and Conspiracy are ineligible for Dual-Faced Cards due to printing costs.
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Just a quick search, and I found these three:
http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/120740773603/with-something-like-the-dfc-planeswalkers-how
http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/89388863758/why-cant-dfcs-be-evergreen-every-booster-pack
http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/118950722003/do-the-logisitcs-of-dfc-allow-dfcs-for-multiple
It sounds like they made a big exception for Origins, despite whatever financial costs there were.
As soon as Origins rotates out, I'm going to be watching the DFC planeswalkers like a hawk.
I've always interpreted that as "We aren't doing what we did in Innistrad again" more than they are never going to do a reprint of a limited number of double faced cards every once in a while. Innistrad was just stuffed with double faced cards and that block alone is what prompted them to steer away from future double faced printings in bulk commons and uncommons. Since they don't have to do insanely big print runs of mythic rares they can get away with doing a reprinting of double sided planeswalkers.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Once they decide to print DFCs, WOTC has to make sure that the front and back match (finding a misprint in which they didn't would be AMAZING - I'd love to see, for example, Liliana flip into Chandra). Doesn't matter how many they make, QA has to make sure that the layout is perfect. 121 cards on a sheet - doesn't matter if they're packed full of mythics, or has a full range of rarities. Getting the layout perfect, rather than just "slap it on the 121 card backs like we always do", is probably a significant portion of the cost.
You may also be correct in that there's an likely also an increased handling fee on the part of the printer in order to process both sides correctly, and so they'll also incur a per-sheet cost, which would add up if doing a ton of commons and uncommons. But if that's the primary cost, MaRo would probably have mentioned that by only doing 5 mythics they'd abated the cost. He made no mention of cost reduction, only saying that they felt that the increased expense was worth it.
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Modern legal, popular for casual play, popular in EDH, and printed in only three sets Stronghold, 7th Edition, and 8th Edition. In other words very low supply. and reasonable demand = expensive card.
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It's honestly kind of puzzling how Tarn stays so high. We know it's going to plummet to $20 in a few years' time, max. You can also replace it with the Khans fetches and experience minimal loss of function in many circumstances. Despite this, the card maintains a huge pricetag.
One day, speculators will make every rare from Zendikar have a double-digit pricetag, except Valakut. You will always be able to buy playsets of Valakuts for ten bucks, even if Scapeshift becomes Tier 1. The card is just 100% Speculator-B-Gone.
MTG finance guy- follow me on Twitter@RichArschmann or RichardArschmann on Reddit
We'll probably for a similar reason foil Exarchs are $30 a pop. People just like playing U/R in modern. Grixis is enormously popular now as is Twin (never really "un"popular). Yes you can sub for other fetches, but it does affect win percentage points. When I'm playing UR twin being able to grab an island agains burn vs an untapped shock land can be the difference between win or loss.
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Modern: Fish, JUND/Junk
--------
RIP Twin
The decks running Tarn are often running Blood Moon and need to have the ability to search up Islands at will, there's no realistic substitute for Tarn when it comes to competitive play.
Its original spike was due to Legacy, too.
Turns out it's a pretty nice thing to sideboard against Sneak and Show.
Opponent: "Show and Tell, Emrakul". You: "Ensnaring Bridge". Opponent: "Okay, start free turn, swing with Emra... oh, $&%$^!!!!".
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I think it's a buyout too, probably the buyer is hoping Stoneforge gets unbanned. Why? Maybe because a Stoneforge unbanning in Modern might make D&T Tier 1.
Cue Thalia buyout
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I think it's more that with the popularity of Tron, Gaddock Teeg gets a lot better. GW Hatebears isn't a no-name deck in Modern. It has seen some minor success and Gaddock Teeg shuts down Tron pretty hard.
He doesn't stop Tron. Tron can still cast Newlamog, Emrakul, Wurmcoil, and O-Stone. He shuts down their walkers, but so does Pithing Needle.
He's even less useful against BW Eldrazi, where you might hit an All is Dust but pretty much nothing other than that.
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