There was a topic a while back looking at it from the store's perspective here. But what about as a player? Would you rent cards if a store was willing to rent them out?
There was a topic a while back looking at it from the store's perspective here. But what about as a player? Would you rent cards if a store was willing to rent them out?
I would just borrow them from a friend. Doesn't everyone just do that anyway?
If I was a store, I'd keep several playsets of Standard commons/uncommons and rent them out for $1/set/event. Condition doesn't matter, the risks are low, the margins are excellent, and many would partake as they don't feel like spending $2 for a Flinthoof Boar.
If it wasn't too expensive, I might even rent a Standard deck every now and then so I could go to a couple FNMs without having to pay the Standard Tax every time a new set comes out.
Nope. Magic is too much of collectible, with far too much of it's value in condition- ESPECIALLY for the sort of cards you'd want to rent, and with differences in grading being a highly subjective matter.
Obviously anyone "renting" is going to have a penalty clause attached to the rental agreement, and I'd hate to be the person that gets dinged for 25%+ of a cards cost because they insist that a card loaned at NM/M was returned at SP.
I often rent out my Force's and Thoughtseizes to people traveling to Legacy events. But only if I trust them enough to pay me back if anything happens to them.
I charge $10 a playset for the weekend, and have paid for both playsets of cards already through rental fee's
If I was a store I'd have no problem running a rental business on the side. I'd just put a hold on a CC for the amount of the cards, and if they don't come back in the same condition I lent them out, congrats, you just bought them.
@dwiz it would be great if everyone had a friend with a huge collection. unfortunately, they always end up playing the same deck i do, and they don't have multiple playsets
what price does everyone think would make it worth renting instead of buying? would it be a percentage of the card price?
For me, i would do it, especially for things like legacy GPs. Sweeney has a great point though, if the people grading the cards aren't consistent you could get hit with a big bill... not sure how to get around that.
I've considered renting cards before, but even if I collected the money in advance, I would be out a TON if they decided not to return the cards. Unless I had their credit card information and could charge them the value of the cards, I don't think it's a good idea. Although, I have considered collecting a deposit that would be refunded. The problem is magic players, even at the ages of adults, can be very child like, and think something practical like this is just outrageous.
Ive thought about this at times and wondered how feasible it is. At a local level you could find a way. My LGS holds your credit card at the front counter if you are paying on the card and plan to make multiple purchases. You could do something like that. The only issue is if they give you a bum credit card or something and just leave
I've seen people lend cards taking collateral of equal value before, that has its own problems though (only can lend to people who already have money to an extent).
I've done alot of just lending for friends without actually renting. A few of the more invested players got together and talked about making a business from it but we decided it was too risky with too little gain to do it. There is likely a healthy market for it at a gp level but I don't know it it would be any more profitable than just being a store there.
The problem with this whole thing is theft of rented cards. There are ways it could all be done that would make sure all rented cards are returned, but it seems like it would be more of a hassle then anything. I could see there being something done in the future by vendors where it could be either "leave a major credit card as insurance or photo id" so they could charge you / know where you live to get there stuff back. The problem with this is it comes down to the fact that not to many players would want / be willing to do such things. At the end of the day it all comes down to magic is a game of money, you either budget and invest or play what you can afford.
An LGS could certainly do it, but I sure as hell would not be leaving my CC to the LGS as a player.
1: employee's at an LGS could easily steal your CC #, its not like you can't find another minimum wage job.
2: I would not want the LGS putting a hold on any money, especially as it could screw with you and cause problems if sudden real life costs arise.
3: I would be concerned with another player stealing the rented cards from ME, then I have to pay for them.
4: I would only "rent" cards for a large tournament.
If I was an LGS, I would certainly look into it as another form of cash flow. You could easily make decent money renting out certain cards (I would not rent out uncommons/commons; those need to be sold), or possibly even renting out decks an LGS keeps built.
It could really help an LGS that wants to increase its playerbase, it can attract new players who maybe dont want to purchase an entire deck and find they dislike it and it can allow players who maybe can't afford a standard deck to rent one.
An LGS could certainly do it, but I sure as hell would not be leaving my CC to the LGS as a player.
1: employee's at an LGS could easily steal your CC #, its not like you can't find another minimum wage job.
2: I would not want the LGS putting a hold on any money, especially as it could screw with you and cause problems if sudden real life costs arise.
3: I would be concerned with another player stealing the rented cards from ME, then I have to pay for them.
4: I would only "rent" cards for a large tournament.
If I was an LGS, I would certainly look into it as another form of cash flow. You could easily make decent money renting out certain cards (I would not rent out uncommons/commons; those need to be sold), or possibly even renting out decks an LGS keeps built.
It could really help an LGS that wants to increase its playerbase, it can attract new players who maybe dont want to purchase an entire deck and find they dislike it and it can allow players who maybe can't afford a standard deck to rent one.
That's the way the rental market works in plenty of instances. Just off the top of my head:
When you rent a room at a hotel, they put a hold on your card
When you rent a car, they put a hold on your card
When you rent a bicycle at the beach, they put a hold on your card.
Putting a hold on a CC for the value of a something you are renting is pretty standard practice for all sorts of rental agreements.
I agree I wouldn't want a LGS putting a hold my credit card. I just can't rely on a small shop to get it right every time. That said, I wouldn't want to rent cards from a LGS anyways. Too much potential for things going wrong.
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An LGS could certainly do it, but I sure as hell would not be leaving my CC to the LGS as a player.
1: employee's at an LGS could easily steal your CC #, its not like you can't find another minimum wage job.
2: I would not want the LGS putting a hold on any money, especially as it could screw with you and cause problems if sudden real life costs arise.
3: I would be concerned with another player stealing the rented cards from ME, then I have to pay for them.
4: I would only "rent" cards for a large tournament.
If I was an LGS, I would certainly look into it as another form of cash flow. You could easily make decent money renting out certain cards (I would not rent out uncommons/commons; those need to be sold), or possibly even renting out decks an LGS keeps built.
It could really help an LGS that wants to increase its playerbase, it can attract new players who maybe dont want to purchase an entire deck and find they dislike it and it can allow players who maybe can't afford a standard deck to rent one.
I've rented cards from my LGS owner before. He's very reluctant to lend cards for tournaments because it sets a bad incentive of players not buying stuff from them since they can just rent them. So, I offered to pay him $5.00 to lend me a playset of Chrome Moxes back in old extended, when they were about $20.00 apiece. Done it a few times since. Easiest money he's ever made. The downside is he can really only do it with people he trusts.
I often rent out my Force's and Thoughtseizes to people traveling to Legacy events. But only if I trust them enough to pay me back if anything happens to them.
I charge $10 a playset for the weekend, and have paid for both playsets of cards already through rental fee's
I would hope that you are not charging your good friends rental fees, just acquaintances. If a buddy came to me and wanted to borrow a couple of playsets for a tourney I would do it in a heartbeat. I could never charge a friend for such a thing. Then again my friends would come over and paint my whole house for me if I asked them to and the only payment they would accept is lunch and beverages. If I could not afford to do that they still would paint the house. I would do the same for them. These sorts of things tend to come back on you in one way or another.
No. This is kind of what killed drafting for a bit.
4-5 guys would go into a draft, pool their best cards by "trading" and then let the one guy win, and split the profits.
Renting would be the same. The guy with the deepest pockets who showed up early would be able to rent all his dual lands, mana crypts, etc, while everyone else would be pooched
It does open up interesting possibilities, but, only for massive stores like SCG that have the stock in cards to rent out.
I wouldn't rent any of my cards, because of the collateral thing. Say I rent a set of 4 wastelands, for $5. If I don't know the guy very well, how can I ensure he will return my wastelands?
I would hope that you are not charging your good friends rental fees, just acquaintances. If a buddy came to me and wanted to borrow a couple of playsets for a tourney I would do it in a heartbeat. I could never charge a friend for such a thing. Then again my friends would come over and paint my whole house for me if I asked them to and the only payment they would accept is lunch and beverages. If I could not afford to do that they still would paint the house. I would do the same for them. These sorts of things tend to come back on you in one way or another.
'm not "good friends" with anyone that plays MTG. These are long known acquaintances.
No. This is kind of what killed drafting for a bit.
4-5 guys would go into a draft, pool their best cards by "trading" and then let the one guy win, and split the profits.
Renting would be the same. The guy with the deepest pockets who showed up early would be able to rent all his dual lands, mana crypts, etc, while everyone else would be pooched
You can't do that. And if you had deep pockets you are going to have the cards you need anyway.
Of course I would. Want to borrow 4 mana drains? Ill need 550 bucks to hold onto till you give them back
Think ill get anyone interested in "renting"? Maybe I should lower it to 300 bucks? A promise to return them? I can see that ending in tears..
Edit: and the idea of letting the borrower hold onto your cc info seems a bit far fetched. I'd be surprised if half the players you come into contact with even have a cc. Half of those probably have a 500 dollar limit as well assuming they actually have a card and half of those probably have it maxed. Tears I say!
I would probably be willing to rent a card if I need one for a tournament but the renting fee would have have to be significantly less than the difference between the price I can get the card for and the price I think I can get it for eventually.
I would be willing to pay something between $5 and $10 for a Black Lotus and maybe $1 for Underground Sea. A lot of vintage tournament allows proxy for $1 each. I would be willing to rent cards for those tournament if I could get them for less than a dollar.
The biggest problem with a model like this is that demand spikes at the same time and is nonexistent the rest of the time. Say you've got a local game stare with a monthly Legacy tournament. Well, the only time people want to rent Candelabras is the one day of the tournament. The rest of the time, there's no interest, and your 600 playset sits there doing nothing for you. It would take years to make a single playset pay off.
So maybe you do Standard cards only? At least then you have a few more tournaments a month to collect rent, but here's the thing: a large portion of your business is already based on selling standard cards that people need prior to FNM/TNM/PTQs/GPTs, whatever. And if you're renting them out, you aren't selling them. Worse, you're probably renting to the same people that were previously buying, so guess what, you just cannabilized your own sale. Whoops.
Plus all the above issues of wear and tear, enforcing return, holding collateral, taking deposits, etc. There's a lot of overhead and it's hard to see a real benefit.
I would just borrow them from a friend. Doesn't everyone just do that anyway?
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If it wasn't too expensive, I might even rent a Standard deck every now and then so I could go to a couple FNMs without having to pay the Standard Tax every time a new set comes out.
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Obviously anyone "renting" is going to have a penalty clause attached to the rental agreement, and I'd hate to be the person that gets dinged for 25%+ of a cards cost because they insist that a card loaned at NM/M was returned at SP.
I charge $10 a playset for the weekend, and have paid for both playsets of cards already through rental fee's
If I was a store I'd have no problem running a rental business on the side. I'd just put a hold on a CC for the amount of the cards, and if they don't come back in the same condition I lent them out, congrats, you just bought them.
what price does everyone think would make it worth renting instead of buying? would it be a percentage of the card price?
For me, i would do it, especially for things like legacy GPs. Sweeney has a great point though, if the people grading the cards aren't consistent you could get hit with a big bill... not sure how to get around that.
I've done alot of just lending for friends without actually renting. A few of the more invested players got together and talked about making a business from it but we decided it was too risky with too little gain to do it. There is likely a healthy market for it at a gp level but I don't know it it would be any more profitable than just being a store there.
1: employee's at an LGS could easily steal your CC #, its not like you can't find another minimum wage job.
2: I would not want the LGS putting a hold on any money, especially as it could screw with you and cause problems if sudden real life costs arise.
3: I would be concerned with another player stealing the rented cards from ME, then I have to pay for them.
4: I would only "rent" cards for a large tournament.
If I was an LGS, I would certainly look into it as another form of cash flow. You could easily make decent money renting out certain cards (I would not rent out uncommons/commons; those need to be sold), or possibly even renting out decks an LGS keeps built.
It could really help an LGS that wants to increase its playerbase, it can attract new players who maybe dont want to purchase an entire deck and find they dislike it and it can allow players who maybe can't afford a standard deck to rent one.
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That's the way the rental market works in plenty of instances. Just off the top of my head:
When you rent a room at a hotel, they put a hold on your card
When you rent a car, they put a hold on your card
When you rent a bicycle at the beach, they put a hold on your card.
Putting a hold on a CC for the value of a something you are renting is pretty standard practice for all sorts of rental agreements.
Modern: Jund
Legacy: Pox
EDH: Chainer Reanimation and The Dragon Show, with Zirilan of the Claw
I've rented cards from my LGS owner before. He's very reluctant to lend cards for tournaments because it sets a bad incentive of players not buying stuff from them since they can just rent them. So, I offered to pay him $5.00 to lend me a playset of Chrome Moxes back in old extended, when they were about $20.00 apiece. Done it a few times since. Easiest money he's ever made. The downside is he can really only do it with people he trusts.
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
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PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
4-5 guys would go into a draft, pool their best cards by "trading" and then let the one guy win, and split the profits.
Renting would be the same. The guy with the deepest pockets who showed up early would be able to rent all his dual lands, mana crypts, etc, while everyone else would be pooched
It does open up interesting possibilities, but, only for massive stores like SCG that have the stock in cards to rent out.
I wouldn't rent any of my cards, because of the collateral thing. Say I rent a set of 4 wastelands, for $5. If I don't know the guy very well, how can I ensure he will return my wastelands?
'm not "good friends" with anyone that plays MTG. These are long known acquaintances.
You can't do that. And if you had deep pockets you are going to have the cards you need anyway.
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Think ill get anyone interested in "renting"? Maybe I should lower it to 300 bucks? A promise to return them? I can see that ending in tears..
Edit: and the idea of letting the borrower hold onto your cc info seems a bit far fetched. I'd be surprised if half the players you come into contact with even have a cc. Half of those probably have a 500 dollar limit as well assuming they actually have a card and half of those probably have it maxed. Tears I say!
I would be willing to pay something between $5 and $10 for a Black Lotus and maybe $1 for Underground Sea. A lot of vintage tournament allows proxy for $1 each. I would be willing to rent cards for those tournament if I could get them for less than a dollar.
So maybe you do Standard cards only? At least then you have a few more tournaments a month to collect rent, but here's the thing: a large portion of your business is already based on selling standard cards that people need prior to FNM/TNM/PTQs/GPTs, whatever. And if you're renting them out, you aren't selling them. Worse, you're probably renting to the same people that were previously buying, so guess what, you just cannabilized your own sale. Whoops.
Plus all the above issues of wear and tear, enforcing return, holding collateral, taking deposits, etc. There's a lot of overhead and it's hard to see a real benefit.
I borrow cards from my play group
This is called being in a community.
If you haven't built a community playing paper, then you're probably doing it wrong.