In MaRo's latest uploads on his 'Drive to Work' podcast series, he does four of them on Scourge, the last 'Dragon' set way back in Onslaught block. Besides the obvious parallels between Scourge & Dragons of Tarkir, there's also the fact we first saw Morph during Onslaught block.
Anyway, as he's going through the cards one-by-one, he gets to one that involves Jeska. After explaining storyline events during Onsluahgt he's like "We never did find out what happened to Jeska. I wonder if she's return some day... Maybe.."
Timing seems awfully fishy to me. She's also red and that's obviously resonating with all the Dragons flying around. And then I got to thinking about all the gender changing that's happened with the Khans in FRF.
Could Jeska, Planeswalker takes the place of Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker in third set, events-wise, once the timeline gets altered? Would that be the craziest thing they've ever done? That said, it's time travel for crying out loud, they can write in anything they want and just pull the standard J.J. Abrams defense. "ALternat timeline: Anything (and I do mean ANYTHING) is possible.."
I don't seriously expect exactly this ^^ to happen because it just seems totally unworkable but I do 100% expect her back now, and probably sooner rather than later.
I've been thinking about all this timey-wimey nonsense they are reintroducing into the mythos. I'm pretty positive they will be using this as a catalyst to bring back a lot of the "oldwalkers." We see this in the Commander Walkers. WotC set the precedent by saying singular time travel instances will almost always have rippling effects across the Multiverse. Magic is growing at an alarming rate and this would be an interesting ploy to connect with older players as well as bringing new ones into the fold and lore of MtG. I don't think this is a matter of if, but when. MtG had a very consistent, storied history in its flavor and has moved away from that since straying from the Dominaria cycles. It would just be good business to try to reap that nostalgia.
Seems like too much of a stretch for Jeska to be the new Sarkhan. Jeska was not a dragon person, but a pit fighter who became Phage then Korona. I would like to see a lot of the old planeswalkers become cards, but Jeska does not fit at all.
It would be cool to see her and Kamahl (assuming he isn't dead or something. I don't know the story that well) back but I think its a bit much to assume we will be until we get something a bit more concrete.
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They have said that Sarkhan saving Ugin won't have any effect on the multiverse as a whole, just Tarkir itself.
Since she's dead in the story (and dead is dead in MtG) I doubt we would see her in an expansion set, but she might appear a la Teferi in a supplemental product.
I know it's probably a given now that we're probably going to return to zendikar in the next few sets, everyone is talking about that, but I'm also getting the impression that a return to Dominaria is also in works. It's been a while since we've been there and it's practically a new plane to most people playing now, so that might have something to do with it.
Jeska is dead, she sacrificed herself to essentially MAKE the Mending.
He must have forgotten it.
There is always the question of if they are going to try applying some sort of timetravel ripples to change the past (hopefully they do not).
"Ripples" to overwrite/modify the most fundamental part of modern Magic history, that was made possible ONLY by the specific nature of the person in the middle of it all, e.g. Jeska? Only the fact that she has been so-called "Thrice Touched by Infinity", and existed a part of her life as a goddess of magic allowed her to heal all the rifts and make a change that affected the whole Multiverse.
We are talking about an event more important than the death of Yawgmoth. Do you think they would use Sarkhan's "ripples" to overwrite that?
And no matter what, the statement "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." is still blatantly wrong.
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She is very much dead. If she is ever revived then I expect Yawgmoth getting resurrected and we be seeing him on New Phyrexia.
I have the novel with me right now, Future Sight. She is so dead you could say she is cadaver-rific. She is so dead that:
Quote from Future Sight: Chapter 23, Pg 297 »
Then Jeska forced the last vestiges of herself outward, straining until she reached the very edge of existence. The void bled away, replaced by a haze of gossamer white, and Jeska Smiled.
To further enforce that the "haze of gossamer white she reached is the afterlife, she met with her dead brother, Kamahl. They had a happy reunion. The End.
As for Dominiria, I actually wonder what state is in at the moment. Last time we went to Dominiria it was Mad Max apocalypse meets Magic the Gathering.
Maybe it has Riggers and Contraptions now.
"Ripples" to overwrite/modify the most fundamental part of modern Magic history, that was made possible ONLY by the specific nature of the person in the middle of it all, e.g. Jeska? Only the fact that she has been so-called "Thrice Touched by Infinity", and existed a part of her life as a goddess of magic allowed her to heal all the rifts and make a change that affected the whole Multiverse.
We are talking about an event more important than the death of Yawgmoth. Do you think they would use Sarkhan's "ripples" to overwrite that?
And no matter what, the statement "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." is still blatantly wrong.
There is a large question which is if Ugin is alive what did he do for the span of history? The best answer would be sitting in a cave waiting for modern day which would not create any sort of ripples. He is a powerful dragon though and could easily have a large impact if he is running about.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
"Ripples" to overwrite/modify the most fundamental part of modern Magic history, that was made possible ONLY by the specific nature of the person in the middle of it all, e.g. Jeska? Only the fact that she has been so-called "Thrice Touched by Infinity", and existed a part of her life as a goddess of magic allowed her to heal all the rifts and make a change that affected the whole Multiverse.
We are talking about an event more important than the death of Yawgmoth. Do you think they would use Sarkhan's "ripples" to overwrite that?
And no matter what, the statement "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." is still blatantly wrong.
There is a large question which is if Ugin is alive what did he do for the span of history? The best answer would be sitting in a cave waiting for modern day which would not create any sort of ripples. He is a powerful dragon though and could easily have a large impact if he is running about.
Judging by the recent story of Sarkhan entombing him in a giant hedron creating the terrible land "Crucible of the Spirit Dragon," my guess is Ugin is still entombed within the crucible in present day when and if Sarkhan actually makes it back. Dragons of Tarkir will take off where Sarkhan left it or at least where the story of Khans of Tarkir started, and instead of finding a canyon of bones like in "Tomb of the Spirit Dragon" we will see some land giving birth to Ugin or something.
My guess is Nicol Bolas comes back to Tarkir in the present day to investigate why things aren't quite as he envisioned, and BOOM Ugin springs from his crucible and kicks some Bolas butt with the help of dragons and the clans. They all sing kumbaya together and Bolas runs away alive saying, "Better to lose and run away to fight another day than to die cause I did that once and it sucked."
"Ripples" to overwrite/modify the most fundamental part of modern Magic history, that was made possible ONLY by the specific nature of the person in the middle of it all, e.g. Jeska? Only the fact that she has been so-called "Thrice Touched by Infinity", and existed a part of her life as a goddess of magic allowed her to heal all the rifts and make a change that affected the whole Multiverse.
We are talking about an event more important than the death of Yawgmoth. Do you think they would use Sarkhan's "ripples" to overwrite that?
And no matter what, the statement "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." is still blatantly wrong.
There is a large question which is if Ugin is alive what did he do for the span of history? The best answer would be sitting in a cave waiting for modern day which would not create any sort of ripples. He is a powerful dragon though and could easily have a large impact if he is running about.
Okay, I will try it once more.
Jeska and her sacrifice, a deliberate release of all her immense power and subsequent accepting her death (to be with her brother Kamahl again in some sort of afterlife) during the final rift closure was the thrice-damned REASON for the MENDING.
They are NOT going to RETCON that.
And I still point out that the crucial statement that the OP is building his speculation on - i.e. "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." IS. WRONG.
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I am not trying to say that you are incorrect in any way. My own knowledge of the magic storyline is bad. I am just saying that until we see how wizards handles Ugin being potentially alive again it is hard to say how if at all the past will be altered. Ideally speaking I agree with you that its a bad idea to try to change the past because its goofy and it sort of opens a rabit hole that nobody really wants to go down.
I am only stating that if Ugin was running about frolicking that he would have impact on events. It is possible that he would change events if he is loose and running about so there is the question of if he will be contained until present day and released again or if he has been running about doing things since he was healed. I am not going to point at any particular events because we have no proof of any events he would be part of if he was running about.
I was just making a statement that the past "Could" change based on Ugin outside of the events directly involved at this time. I don't think that it is at all in Wizard's interest to change the past but if they were looking for a way to write themselves out of a dead end having a mysterious elder dragon wander into past events could do just that.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Jeska and her sacrifice, a deliberate release of all her immense power and subsequent accepting her death (to be with her brother Kamahl again in some sort of afterlife) during the final rift closure was the thrice-damned REASON for the MENDING.
They are NOT going to RETCON that.
Sadly, though, they could retcon whatever they want :-(
Jeska and her sacrifice, a deliberate release of all her immense power and subsequent accepting her death (to be with her brother Kamahl again in some sort of afterlife) during the final rift closure was the thrice-damned REASON for the MENDING.
They are NOT going to RETCON that.
Sadly, though, they could retcon whatever they want :-(
Yes. You are surely right they *could*. But they are still holding at least to some rules. That is why I said they are not going to.
Because if yes...that would be, at least for me, the death of Magic story.
I am not trying to say that you are incorrect in any way. My own knowledge of the magic storyline is bad. I am just saying that until we see how wizards handles Ugin being potentially alive again it is hard to say how if at all the past will be altered. Ideally speaking I agree with you that its a bad idea to try to change the past because its goofy and it sort of opens a rabit hole that nobody really wants to go down.
Okay, I get it. They said themselves that it would be some minor variations in what happened elsewhere, and that it would be interesting in seeing how it plays out. But there is not going to be any butterfly effect leading to entirely different realities spanning the Multiverse(aka Planar Chaos). The changes would be for most part contained to Tarkir, and maybe some related characters.
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They are using time travel here. At the moment they can go and retcon anything they want.
I suspect that we are sort of wandering from the original point of this discussion though. We don't have any evidence linking the current events of Ugin's revival to any other events. It is likely wasted effort to go through the what ifs on possible changes to the story when we don't know how wizards plans to handle him getting to the current time.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
They are using time travel here. At the moment they can go and retcon anything they want.
I see I am probably wasting my time here, but one more try.
1) Wizards essentially said that there will be ripples, but not major changes. They friggin' KNOW they using time travel is dangerous and that people are afraid they will abuse it. Heck, there are 5 or more threads on just this topic in Storyline.
Quote from from=Doug Beyer »
I usually like to let the story play out issues like these, rather than answer explicitly outside the text, but I think there’s been more anxiety about how we’re handling this story than we wanted. So here’s the rule of time travel we were assuming for this block: Altering the history of Tarkir only alters Tarkir.
In other words, we are not using the events of Tarkir to massively retcon the last 1280 years of Magic continuity across the entire Multiverse.
It was also our assumption, though, that planeswalkers who visited Tarkir sometime between 1280 years ago and now could experience time-travel-altered events and act differently on other planes due to those changed events — essentially, that planeswalkers were a way to transmit time-travel changes outside of Tarkir. That created some interesting story challenges, and I think you’ll see how we handled them as the story develops. For now, please continue to enjoy visiting Tarkir’s past. We’re getting to see a crucial, life-or-death tipping point in Tarkir’s history, when clans battle with dragons for survival, and a certain spirit dragon still lives — for now.
2) We are talking about virtually the biggest possible change with Jeska being alive.
3) Hence, is it reasonable to even speculate about it?
I know this is "baseless speculation" forum, but some people still do not understand that "baseless" should mean "without enough info to start with", not "contradicting available info" resulting in unreasonable "what if" scenarios..
And for the record, I absolutely hate this alibistic "everything can happen, they can retcon anything if they want" attitude
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Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I see I am probably wasting my time here, but one more try.
1) Wizards essentially said that there will be ripples, but not major changes. They friggin' KNOW they using time travel is dangerous and that people are afraid they will abuse it. Heck, there are 5 or more threads on just this topic in Storyline.
2) We are talking about virtually the biggest possible change with Jeska being alive.
3) Hence, is it reasonable to even speculate about it?
I know this is "baseless speculation" forum, but some people still do not understand that "baseless" should mean "without enough info to start with", not "contradicting available info" resulting in unreasonable "what if" scenarios..
And for the record, I absolutely hate this alibistic "everything can happen, they can retcon anything if they want" attitude
Thanks for the link, I had not seen that. I agree with the dislike of retconing things.
Anyway, as he's going through the cards one-by-one, he gets to one that involves Jeska. After explaining storyline events during Onsluahgt he's like "We never did find out what happened to Jeska. I wonder if she's return some day... Maybe.."
Timing seems awfully fishy to me. She's also red and that's obviously resonating with all the Dragons flying around. And then I got to thinking about all the gender changing that's happened with the Khans in FRF.
Could Jeska, Planeswalker takes the place of Sarkhan, Dragonspeaker in third set, events-wise, once the timeline gets altered? Would that be the craziest thing they've ever done? That said, it's time travel for crying out loud, they can write in anything they want and just pull the standard J.J. Abrams defense. "ALternat timeline: Anything (and I do mean ANYTHING) is possible.."
I don't seriously expect exactly this ^^ to happen because it just seems totally unworkable but I do 100% expect her back now, and probably sooner rather than later.
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Since she's dead in the story (and dead is dead in MtG) I doubt we would see her in an expansion set, but she might appear a la Teferi in a supplemental product.
This is completely and utterly incorrect.
Jeska is dead, she sacrificed herself to essentially MAKE the Mending.
He must have forgotten it.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
There is always the question of if they are going to try applying some sort of timetravel ripples to change the past (hopefully they do not).
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"Ripples" to overwrite/modify the most fundamental part of modern Magic history, that was made possible ONLY by the specific nature of the person in the middle of it all, e.g. Jeska? Only the fact that she has been so-called "Thrice Touched by Infinity", and existed a part of her life as a goddess of magic allowed her to heal all the rifts and make a change that affected the whole Multiverse.
We are talking about an event more important than the death of Yawgmoth. Do you think they would use Sarkhan's "ripples" to overwrite that?
And no matter what, the statement "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." is still blatantly wrong.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I have the novel with me right now, Future Sight. She is so dead you could say she is cadaver-rific. She is so dead that:
To further enforce that the "haze of gossamer white she reached is the afterlife, she met with her dead brother, Kamahl. They had a happy reunion. The End.
As for Dominiria, I actually wonder what state is in at the moment. Last time we went to Dominiria it was Mad Max apocalypse meets Magic the Gathering.
Maybe it has Riggers and Contraptions now.
There is a large question which is if Ugin is alive what did he do for the span of history? The best answer would be sitting in a cave waiting for modern day which would not create any sort of ripples. He is a powerful dragon though and could easily have a large impact if he is running about.
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Judging by the recent story of Sarkhan entombing him in a giant hedron creating the terrible land "Crucible of the Spirit Dragon," my guess is Ugin is still entombed within the crucible in present day when and if Sarkhan actually makes it back. Dragons of Tarkir will take off where Sarkhan left it or at least where the story of Khans of Tarkir started, and instead of finding a canyon of bones like in "Tomb of the Spirit Dragon" we will see some land giving birth to Ugin or something.
My guess is Nicol Bolas comes back to Tarkir in the present day to investigate why things aren't quite as he envisioned, and BOOM Ugin springs from his crucible and kicks some Bolas butt with the help of dragons and the clans. They all sing kumbaya together and Bolas runs away alive saying, "Better to lose and run away to fight another day than to die cause I did that once and it sucked."
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Okay, I will try it once more.
Jeska and her sacrifice, a deliberate release of all her immense power and subsequent accepting her death (to be with her brother Kamahl again in some sort of afterlife) during the final rift closure was the thrice-damned REASON for the MENDING.
They are NOT going to RETCON that.
And I still point out that the crucial statement that the OP is building his speculation on - i.e. "We never did find out what happened to Jeska." IS. WRONG.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I am only stating that if Ugin was running about frolicking that he would have impact on events. It is possible that he would change events if he is loose and running about so there is the question of if he will be contained until present day and released again or if he has been running about doing things since he was healed. I am not going to point at any particular events because we have no proof of any events he would be part of if he was running about.
I was just making a statement that the past "Could" change based on Ugin outside of the events directly involved at this time. I don't think that it is at all in Wizard's interest to change the past but if they were looking for a way to write themselves out of a dead end having a mysterious elder dragon wander into past events could do just that.
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Sadly, though, they could retcon whatever they want :-(
Yes. You are surely right they *could*. But they are still holding at least to some rules. That is why I said they are not going to.
Because if yes...that would be, at least for me, the death of Magic story.
Okay, I get it. They said themselves that it would be some minor variations in what happened elsewhere, and that it would be interesting in seeing how it plays out. But there is not going to be any butterfly effect leading to entirely different realities spanning the Multiverse(aka Planar Chaos). The changes would be for most part contained to Tarkir, and maybe some related characters.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I suspect that we are sort of wandering from the original point of this discussion though. We don't have any evidence linking the current events of Ugin's revival to any other events. It is likely wasted effort to go through the what ifs on possible changes to the story when we don't know how wizards plans to handle him getting to the current time.
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I see I am probably wasting my time here, but one more try.
1) Wizards essentially said that there will be ripples, but not major changes. They friggin' KNOW they using time travel is dangerous and that people are afraid they will abuse it. Heck, there are 5 or more threads on just this topic in Storyline.
2) We are talking about virtually the biggest possible change with Jeska being alive.
3) Hence, is it reasonable to even speculate about it?
I know this is "baseless speculation" forum, but some people still do not understand that "baseless" should mean "without enough info to start with", not "contradicting available info" resulting in unreasonable "what if" scenarios..
And for the record, I absolutely hate this alibistic "everything can happen, they can retcon anything if they want" attitude
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
Thanks for the link, I had not seen that. I agree with the dislike of retconing things.
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