I know I’m not the only one thinking that Madness will be back in Crimson Vow… after all, it’s kinda a “vampire mechanic”.
Well, I really love Madness and was digging for signs that would indicate the return of the beloved Madness mechanic. Here’s what I found:
1) Everything started in 2018 with some reprints in Ultimate Masters: Just the wind, Circular logic, etc.
2) in 2019, the commander precons with Madness theme (Anje's and Chainer's). This was probably a test to verify if the mechanic would be well received by the player base again after the success of Shadows over Innistrad. More reprints (Asylum Visitor, Squee, Fiery Temper, etc.) and new cards (Anje, Chainer, Ravager, etc).
3) Time Spiral is well known for madness draft archetype… and Time Spiral Remastered, in 2021, was no different. Many madness staples and enablers were reprinted here: lightning axe, big game hunter, nightshade assassin, etc.
4) The next step was the preparation of the future standard with Madness. The lesson mechanic allows the player to discard a card to draw a card. So, every one lesson card (there are 22) is also a discard outlet for madness. Plarg, a creature, is also clearly a discard outlet with legs. It’s also cool to notice that there’s even a card that grants “madness” to every discarded card: Conspiracy Theorist.
5) Then, MH2 was released… and WOTC explicitly said they wanted to push madness, helping its decks to reach tier level in Modern. Many new madness staples for modern: Blazing Rootwalla, Kitchen Imp, Necrogoyf, etc.
6) Some days ago, jumpstart historic horizons was announced for MTG Arena and madness has its own theme pack. BR madness is the new kid in Historic, loved by many players, being known for some pretty good results. So, many of the cards are already ready for digital scene.
7) At last, the first spoilers of Midnight Hunt show some new discard outlets with rummaging effects.
So, I may be wrong, but I think all these hints indicate that we will have madness in Crimson Vow. The support for madness decks in modern, historic and standard is there, just waiting for the right time.
It's quite possible that the Crimson Vow vampires will continue the Midnight Hunt vampires' theme of "if an opponent lost life this turn" (see Famished Foragers and Arrogant Outlaw) instead. Unless some of the vampires are literally driven insane by the Crimson Vow wedding, I don't think Madness will come back there - flavour-wise, Madness was an absolute hit for Shadows Over Innistrad block, and I think I read a Maro article giving a "the stars need to align" rating for reusing Madness, especially in Standard, due to the complexity involved and its current sheer unintuitive interpretation.
It's quite possible that the Crimson Vow vampires will continue the Midnight Hunt vampires' theme of "if an opponent lost life this turn" (see Famished Foragers) instead. Unless some of the vampires are literally driven insane by the Crimson Vow wedding, I don't think Madness will come back there - flavour-wise, Madness was an absolute hit for Shadows Over Innistrad block, and I think I read a Maro article giving a "the stars need to align" rating for reusing Madness, especially in Standard, due to the complexity involved and its current sheer unintuitive interpretation.
Famished Foragers itself is a common discard outlet with rummaging. Maybe what this card shows us is that they even tried to mix the two flavors: the “lost life” and the madness thing. Even the flavor text of Foragers tells us about starving and furious vampires getting into a frenzy state. Don’t think the two things are mutually exclusive… and innistrad's flavor was exactly what made the stars align.
Idk... I feel like Madness was more of a SoI block thing to fit alongside Emrakul's influence. You're reading too much into it. Red and Black have had discard outlets for things before.. it's not an uncommon piece of their identity. I think they will have abilities based on if an opponent lost life/was dealt damage this turn. This fits the theme of vampires getting riled up from smelling blood.
Might also be they have discard vampires to help support the madness/vampire deck even if they don't have madness in the set proper. They have said a goal for retune sets is that if you mess all the cards together they should somewhat play and feel like they belong together.
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I think we're going to a new vampire related mechanic in CV that's not either Madness or the unnamed mechanic in MH, just as they did a new flashy set selling mechanic for werewolves in MH with the new night/day mechanic, I think it's unlikely they have a similar vampire themed set that isn't going to sell itself partly off the back of a new flashy vampire mechanic. Reusing madness which has been seen multiple times before or making a named keyword of the rather familiar, unexeciting and also already seen mechanic from MH just wouldn't accomplish that well.
My guess is that like with day/night, the mechanic will be a top down attempt to capture the flavour of vampires in a grander more potent way. My best guess is something about using blood as a resource as this feels like a very resonant, very vampire thing to represent and matches with the story emphasis on some of the cards in MH about vampires finding ways to get enough blood (e.g. Vampire Interloper, Stromkirk Bloodthief). But I could also imagine a mechanic that provides some way to recruit new vampires, intended to evoke turning people into vampires, or perhaps something connected to vampire's ability to transform into different things.
Spinning of my previous comment about some kind of blood mechanic, that could also tie well with the damage theme from MH.
Say,
Bloodtithe (Whenever an opponent loses life, you get a blood counter)
and then blood counters could be exchanged for effects.
like Vampire Guy
Creature- Vampire
Bloodtithe
, (blood counter): ~ gets +2/+1 until end of turn.
2/1
My guess is that like with day/night, the mechanic will be a top down attempt to capture the flavour of vampires in a grander more potent way. My best guess is something about using blood as a resource as this feels like a very resonant, very vampire thing to represent and matches with the story emphasis on some of the cards in MH about vampires finding ways to get enough blood
My guess is that like with day/night, the mechanic will be a top down attempt to capture the flavour of vampires in a grander more potent way. My best guess is something about using blood as a resource as this feels like a very resonant, very vampire thing to represent and matches with the story emphasis on some of the cards in MH about vampires finding ways to get enough blood
Well, I really love Madness and was digging for signs that would indicate the return of the beloved Madness mechanic. Here’s what I found:
1) Everything started in 2018 with some reprints in Ultimate Masters: Just the wind, Circular logic, etc.
2) in 2019, the commander precons with Madness theme (Anje's and Chainer's). This was probably a test to verify if the mechanic would be well received by the player base again after the success of Shadows over Innistrad. More reprints (Asylum Visitor, Squee, Fiery Temper, etc.) and new cards (Anje, Chainer, Ravager, etc).
3) Time Spiral is well known for madness draft archetype… and Time Spiral Remastered, in 2021, was no different. Many madness staples and enablers were reprinted here: lightning axe, big game hunter, nightshade assassin, etc.
4) The next step was the preparation of the future standard with Madness. The lesson mechanic allows the player to discard a card to draw a card. So, every one lesson card (there are 22) is also a discard outlet for madness. Plarg, a creature, is also clearly a discard outlet with legs. It’s also cool to notice that there’s even a card that grants “madness” to every discarded card: Conspiracy Theorist.
5) Then, MH2 was released… and WOTC explicitly said they wanted to push madness, helping its decks to reach tier level in Modern. Many new madness staples for modern: Blazing Rootwalla, Kitchen Imp, Necrogoyf, etc.
6) Some days ago, jumpstart historic horizons was announced for MTG Arena and madness has its own theme pack. BR madness is the new kid in Historic, loved by many players, being known for some pretty good results. So, many of the cards are already ready for digital scene.
7) At last, the first spoilers of Midnight Hunt show some new discard outlets with rummaging effects.
So, I may be wrong, but I think all these hints indicate that we will have madness in Crimson Vow. The support for madness decks in modern, historic and standard is there, just waiting for the right time.
What you guys think?
| UBRG D. Shadow | WUBRG Humans | BRG Dredge | UG Infect |
Famished Foragers itself is a common discard outlet with rummaging. Maybe what this card shows us is that they even tried to mix the two flavors: the “lost life” and the madness thing. Even the flavor text of Foragers tells us about starving and furious vampires getting into a frenzy state. Don’t think the two things are mutually exclusive… and innistrad's flavor was exactly what made the stars align.
| UBRG D. Shadow | WUBRG Humans | BRG Dredge | UG Infect |
| UBRG D. Shadow | WUBRG Humans | BRG Dredge | UG Infect |
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
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My guess is that like with day/night, the mechanic will be a top down attempt to capture the flavour of vampires in a grander more potent way. My best guess is something about using blood as a resource as this feels like a very resonant, very vampire thing to represent and matches with the story emphasis on some of the cards in MH about vampires finding ways to get enough blood (e.g. Vampire Interloper, Stromkirk Bloodthief). But I could also imagine a mechanic that provides some way to recruit new vampires, intended to evoke turning people into vampires, or perhaps something connected to vampire's ability to transform into different things.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Say,
Bloodtithe (Whenever an opponent loses life, you get a blood counter)
and then blood counters could be exchanged for effects.
like
Vampire Guy
Creature- Vampire
Bloodtithe
, (blood counter): ~ gets +2/+1 until end of turn.
2/1
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
I am a genius.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
Just downhill from here though.
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