For complexity's sake, there wouldn't be -1/-1 counters in THS. It has been said before so that's definitely out. Negative counters never existed with positive counters together in the same set in the modern era. However, judging on what's been in discussion, Pharika could grant the abilty to bring back creatures.
"Whenever a creature an opponent control dies, you may pay GB. If you do, you may put a creature from your graveyard on top of your library."
also, just because the two ride boats in no way implies the mechanics behind them. Would it be interesting? sure.
but the mechanic has no real connection I can see to the implied flavor-ties, so its a big reach.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The true mind can weather all the lies and illusions without being lost. The true heart can tough the poison of hatred without being harmed. Since beginning-less time, darkness thrives in the void but always yields to purifying light.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
how about a static ability like whenever a creature dies target opponent loses a life and u gain however much life they lost that way. Or creatures u control have life link
Then give it an activated ability:Pay 1 and WBIf u gained life this turn draw a card
I would be expecting the enemy colored gods, much like the allied colored gods, to not have an activated ability.
some people are guessing that the enemy colored gods might be the opposite of the allied and have only activated abilities.
So, the big five would have both, allied five would have static and enemy would have activated. Just food for thought, either way would make sense. One reason in favor of being different is that I can imagine them wanting to make them different from the other minor gods.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The true mind can weather all the lies and illusions without being lost. The true heart can tough the poison of hatred without being harmed. Since beginning-less time, darkness thrives in the void but always yields to purifying light.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
I'd like Atheros to have a Debtors' Knell effect, but life drain seems more likely. Pharika...I'm hoping for something that works well with stax, but Mogis already got a sac effect. All the gods except for Erebos interact with creatures in some way.....so who knows what a GB can cover that the others don't, while maintaining something in line with what shes a god of.
Atheros, God of Lifegain 3WB
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indistructible
As long as your devotion to white and black is less then seven, Atheros isn't a creature.
At the beginning of your upkeep, target player sacrifices a creature and you gain life equal to twice that creatures toughness.
5/6
Pharika, God of Medicine 2GB
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indistructible
As long as your devotion to green and black is less then seven, Pharika isn't a creature.
Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your control, target creature gets -X/-X where X is that creatures converted mana cost.
6/5
Flavor-wise, Athreos probably has a 'if/when an opponent's creature dies/enters the graveyard, get some advantage' Because his focus is on the traveling of souls to the underworld (and not about them coming <i>back</i> in any way). Pharika, on the other hand, is about the boundary between health and harm. Regeneration is definitely on the table, possibly the adding or removing of +1/+1 counters (to make a connection to Golgari mechanics).
some people are guessing that the enemy colored gods might be the opposite of the allied and have only activated abilities.
So, the big five would have both, allied five would have static and enemy would have activated. Just food for thought, either way would make sense. One reason in favor of being different is that I can imagine them wanting to make them different from the other minor gods.
That's actually a very good idea and seems likely to me. The question is, though, if the gods will have one multicolour ability or two abilities, one for each colour.
If the latter I could easily see Athreos have something like:
3W, Exile a creature card from your graveyard: Put a 2/2 white Spirit enchantment creature token with lifelink onto the battlefield.
3B, Exile a creature card from your graveyard: Put a 2/2 black Zombie enchantment creature token onto the battlefield. Each opponent loses 2 life.
This way Athreos could both fit into a regular lifebleed deck and also have abilities that tie in flavourfully with his role as the ferryman.
Creatures Opponents control can't have +1/+1 and lose all counters. Whenever a creature dies, put x 1/1 counters on target creature you control where x was the dead creatures power.
So I just had a brilliant idea about Atheros.
Who remembers gild?
What if Atheros did something with that
Atheros, God of Voyages 3WB
Indestructable
Creatures in graveyards cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
Whenever an opponents creature dies, put a colorless artifact token named Gold onto the battlefield. It has "Sacrifice this artifact: add 1 to your mana pool.
While not very "good" persay, it would be hella flavorful and could prove to be a very interesting commander build.
For those not getting the reference, in Ancient Greece, the dead had a gold coin put into their mouth in order to pay the ferry man. If this is what they give us, i would be satified.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Your mind was a curious mix of madness and genius. I just took away the genius."
-Jace Beleren
I'm thinkin for Atheros: 3BW
Indestructible
(Devotion Clause)
Whenever a creature you control enters the graveyard from the battlefield, you may pay WBand 1 life. If you do, target (each?) opponent sacrifices a creature.
5/5
For Pharika, something like: 2BG
Indestructible
(Devotion Clause)
Other creatures you control have "1BG: regenerate this creature. Destroy each creature that dealt damage to this creature this turn."
4/6
I had a really strange dream in which I thought this was the text for Athreos: Old transactions are new transactions. Transactions cost 1 less.
No, I have no idea what it's supposed to mean either. Sounds kind of awesome, though. Realistically I expect Pharika to have a Consume Strength effect and Athreos to have a taxing/lifedrain death trigger of some sort. Seems to fit the flavor for each.
Athreos is a Fairy rower so i assume he wil have similarity to tidehallow sculler
Am i missing something? Why does everyone keep repeating this? ........ What is a Fairy Rower? its a zombie Tidehollow Sculler
That is a bit of a weak power thou. Exile is white's domain but black is mainly discard and kill spells.
how about a static ability like whenever a creature dies target opponent loses a life and u gain however much life they lost that way. Or creatures u control have life link
Then give it an activated ability:Pay 1 and WBIf u gained life this turn draw a card
I think he's saying that he's the boatman of the dead, ferrying the dead across the river. So "ferry", not "fairy" here.
That said, I think it's important to keep in mind the god's flavor here. W/B has a few different suites of abilities, but given that Ahtreos deals with creatures dying and bring them across the river to the underworld, I doubt it's going to be like Tidehollow. I also assume that it's going to deal with death triggers, as that just makes more sense than I care to iterate. Ahtreos' service is a one-way street, and he only brings the dead across and not does not deal with the living. So affecting creatures that are on the battlefield is probably a no-go.
I'm also not entirely certain he'll have the Blood Artist effect either. That sort of effect is largely used to signifify barter and payment, such as with Grey Merchant of Asphodel and Underworld Coinsmith. Although Charon took payment in the myths, it seems the same is not true for Athreos. Looking over what we know, nothing mentions payment to Athreos for crossing the river. Coinsmith *might* indicate otherwise, but given that color identity is only loosely associated with the gods themselves (Unlike in theros where a U/W creature was defacto a member of the Orzhov guild; here allegiance due to color is only assumed at best).
What does this mean?
*Well* I think we can rightly assume Athreos will have an on-death trigger. It's possible for the drain life sort, but I don't think it's entirely probable. He's not known to require payment to cross the river, and he doesn't indicate in the art that this is something he cares about (if there was a coinpouch on his person, it would be an almost certainty).
Given that it's a 1-way street, I think it would be odd for him to create something like Zombie tokens, as well (Which would be Phenax's work anyway).
I doubt he'll affect creatures on the battlefield in the same way as most of the other gods. Aside from a sac-outlet ability, I don't think he'll provide much beyond.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
looking at the that fact that we can have upkeep triggers, how about
Athreos, god of bringing back 3WB
indestructible
at the beginning of your upkeep, you may sacrifice 2 creatures. If you do return target creature or enchantment from your graveyard to the battle field.
"At the beginning of your draw step, if a creature died last turn, you may shuffle your library into your graveyard."
The thinking was that spells you use are gifts from Pharika, and you get them back when creatures die. But it can't be to your hand, that'd make a loop. Plus the random nature of shuffling/draw feels more divining to me.
For Atheros, I had:
"At the beginning of the end step, you may pay (2). If you do, exile a creature card in a graveyard, then put a token copy of it onto the battlefield tapped and with defender."
My thought was that Atheros is like Charon, who collected coins from the dead (coins on the eyes), hence (2). And in greek mythology, dead souls are listless, hence defender. The token copy prevents loops, but the copy adds devotion. The more 'souls' the stronger Atheros is.
Pharika, God of Potions 3BG
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indestructible, [devotion clause]
If you would draw a card, you may instead choose land or nonland and reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a card of the chosen kind.
If that card is a creature, you lose life equal to its power and gain life equal to its toughness.
Put that card into your hand and all other cards revealed this way on the bottom of your library in a random order.
4/7
Abundance meets an inverted, super Sapling of Colfenor. I take it that poison would hurt before it heals.
I would love something like this.
Athreos, God of Passage 3WB
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indestructible, [devotion clause]
At the beginning of your upkeep, you may sacrifice another creature.
If you do, you may put a creature from your graveyard onto the battlefield tapped with converted mana cost equal to or less than the sacrificed creature.
6/5
Grave Blink of some sort. Possibly even a Living Death sort of effect.
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
They wouldn't make Pharika too cheap And good. Especially since it is in dredge colors, they don't want to fuel that monster too much.
I hope they at least make it at least viable, unlike what they did with the GW karametra, basically a useless high cost ramp enabler.
I'm very much looking forward to Pharika. I need my Golgari love...
Maybe something like "Whenever a creature an opponent controls deals damage to you, destroy it at the end of turn"? That might be too powerful. Maybe could let you Scry whenever you're attacked (not when you're dealt damage). Draw a card for each attacking creature your opponents control? Maybe I'm setting my sights too high.
"Whenever a creature an opponent control dies, you may pay GB. If you do, you may put a creature from your graveyard on top of your library."
Which is sort of a Volrath's Stronghold ability I mentioned earlier.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
also, just because the two ride boats in no way implies the mechanics behind them. Would it be interesting? sure.
but the mechanic has no real connection I can see to the implied flavor-ties, so its a big reach.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
I would be expecting the enemy colored gods, much like the allied colored gods, to not have an activated ability.
So, the big five would have both, allied five would have static and enemy would have activated. Just food for thought, either way would make sense. One reason in favor of being different is that I can imagine them wanting to make them different from the other minor gods.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indistructible
As long as your devotion to white and black is less then seven, Atheros isn't a creature.
At the beginning of your upkeep, target player sacrifices a creature and you gain life equal to twice that creatures toughness.
5/6
Pharika, God of Medicine 2GB
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indistructible
As long as your devotion to green and black is less then seven, Pharika isn't a creature.
Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your control, target creature gets -X/-X where X is that creatures converted mana cost.
6/5
The Ur-Dragon's Tyranny
Karador, Ghost of the Golgari
Niv-Mizzet, Izzet Mastermind
Thromok's Barbecue, Come Get Some!
Sedris's Hand of the Dead
Wort, the Queen of Boggarts
Rafiq, King of Jerkish Nature
Standard Decks
Jund Midrange
Narset 5 Color
Mono-Green Devotion
Naya Beasts
WR Burn
Modern Decks
Izzet Fiend
Affinity for Green
That's actually a very good idea and seems likely to me. The question is, though, if the gods will have one multicolour ability or two abilities, one for each colour.
If the latter I could easily see Athreos have something like:
3W, Exile a creature card from your graveyard: Put a 2/2 white Spirit enchantment creature token with lifelink onto the battlefield.
3B, Exile a creature card from your graveyard: Put a 2/2 black Zombie enchantment creature token onto the battlefield. Each opponent loses 2 life.
This way Athreos could both fit into a regular lifebleed deck and also have abilities that tie in flavourfully with his role as the ferryman.
Pharika, God of Elixers
ATBOYU target creature gains X/X until the end of the turn, where X is your devotion to Green.
ATBOYU target creature loses X/X until the end of the turn, where X is your devotion to Black.
Creatures Opponents control can't have +1/+1 and lose all counters. Whenever a creature dies, put x 1/1 counters on target creature you control where x was the dead creatures power.
My Decks:
All my Decks are budget
EDH:GRWHazezon TamarGRW, RKazuul, Tyrant of the CliffsR, BMikaeus, the UnhallowedB, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GRXenagos, God of RevelsGR, BGPharika, God of AfflictionBG
Standard:BMono Black Control(devotion)B- retired
Casual:UWHeroicUW, UGWall tribalUG, BPhylactery LichB
Modern:UBAbyssal PersecutorUB, WKnight TribalW
Who remembers gild?
What if Atheros did something with that
Atheros, God of Voyages 3WB
Indestructable
Creatures in graveyards cannot be the target of spells or abilities.
Whenever an opponents creature dies, put a colorless artifact token named Gold onto the battlefield. It has "Sacrifice this artifact: add 1 to your mana pool.
While not very "good" persay, it would be hella flavorful and could prove to be a very interesting commander build.
For those not getting the reference, in Ancient Greece, the dead had a gold coin put into their mouth in order to pay the ferry man. If this is what they give us, i would be satified.
-Jace Beleren
3BW
Indestructible
(Devotion Clause)
Whenever a creature you control enters the graveyard from the battlefield, you may pay WBand 1 life. If you do, target (each?) opponent sacrifices a creature.
5/5
For Pharika, something like:
2BG
Indestructible
(Devotion Clause)
Other creatures you control have "1BG: regenerate this creature. Destroy each creature that dealt damage to this creature this turn."
4/6
No, I have no idea what it's supposed to mean either. Sounds kind of awesome, though. Realistically I expect Pharika to have a Consume Strength effect and Athreos to have a taxing/lifedrain death trigger of some sort. Seems to fit the flavor for each.
Cubetutor Link
I think he's saying that he's the boatman of the dead, ferrying the dead across the river. So "ferry", not "fairy" here.
That said, I think it's important to keep in mind the god's flavor here. W/B has a few different suites of abilities, but given that Ahtreos deals with creatures dying and bring them across the river to the underworld, I doubt it's going to be like Tidehollow. I also assume that it's going to deal with death triggers, as that just makes more sense than I care to iterate. Ahtreos' service is a one-way street, and he only brings the dead across and not does not deal with the living. So affecting creatures that are on the battlefield is probably a no-go.
I'm also not entirely certain he'll have the Blood Artist effect either. That sort of effect is largely used to signifify barter and payment, such as with Grey Merchant of Asphodel and Underworld Coinsmith. Although Charon took payment in the myths, it seems the same is not true for Athreos. Looking over what we know, nothing mentions payment to Athreos for crossing the river. Coinsmith *might* indicate otherwise, but given that color identity is only loosely associated with the gods themselves (Unlike in theros where a U/W creature was defacto a member of the Orzhov guild; here allegiance due to color is only assumed at best).
What does this mean?
*Well* I think we can rightly assume Athreos will have an on-death trigger. It's possible for the drain life sort, but I don't think it's entirely probable. He's not known to require payment to cross the river, and he doesn't indicate in the art that this is something he cares about (if there was a coinpouch on his person, it would be an almost certainty).
Given that it's a 1-way street, I think it would be odd for him to create something like Zombie tokens, as well (Which would be Phenax's work anyway).
I doubt he'll affect creatures on the battlefield in the same way as most of the other gods. Aside from a sac-outlet ability, I don't think he'll provide much beyond.
Whenever a creature you control dies, you gain 2 life.
Whenever a creature an opponent controls dies, its controller loses 2 life.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Athreos, god of bringing back 3WB
indestructible
at the beginning of your upkeep, you may sacrifice 2 creatures. If you do return target creature or enchantment from your graveyard to the battle field.
3/6
The thinking was that spells you use are gifts from Pharika, and you get them back when creatures die. But it can't be to your hand, that'd make a loop. Plus the random nature of shuffling/draw feels more divining to me.
For Atheros, I had:
My thought was that Atheros is like Charon, who collected coins from the dead (coins on the eyes), hence (2). And in greek mythology, dead souls are listless, hence defender. The token copy prevents loops, but the copy adds devotion. The more 'souls' the stronger Atheros is.
Pharika, God of ??? 1BG
If you have less then 7 devotion to B/G Pharika isn't a creature
At the beginning of your upkeep target creature gets +x/+x equal to the number of creatures you control.
At the beginning of your upkeep target creature gets -x/-x equal to the number of creatures in your graveyard.
6/4
This might be to powerful, it would be very good in and dredge deck.
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indestructible, [devotion clause]
If you would draw a card, you may instead choose land or nonland and reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a card of the chosen kind.
If that card is a creature, you lose life equal to its power and gain life equal to its toughness.
Put that card into your hand and all other cards revealed this way on the bottom of your library in a random order.
4/7
Abundance meets an inverted, super Sapling of Colfenor. I take it that poison would hurt before it heals.
I would love something like this.
Athreos, God of Passage 3WB
Legendary Enchantment Creature - God
Indestructible, [devotion clause]
At the beginning of your upkeep, you may sacrifice another creature.
If you do, you may put a creature from your graveyard onto the battlefield tapped with converted mana cost equal to or less than the sacrificed creature.
6/5
Grave Blink of some sort. Possibly even a Living Death sort of effect.
"OH GOD MY BRAIN IS EXPLOADING AT HOW BAD THE ART IS ON MY OWN CARD"
-A friend's first impression of Ancestral Recall
10/10, I tapped.
I hope they at least make it at least viable, unlike what they did with the GW karametra, basically a useless high cost ramp enabler.
My Decks:
All my Decks are budget
EDH:GRWHazezon TamarGRW, RKazuul, Tyrant of the CliffsR, BMikaeus, the UnhallowedB, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GRXenagos, God of RevelsGR, BGPharika, God of AfflictionBG
Standard:BMono Black Control(devotion)B- retired
Casual:UWHeroicUW, UGWall tribalUG, BPhylactery LichB
Modern:UBAbyssal PersecutorUB, WKnight TribalW
No Mercy on a stick?, sounds cool to me
Pharika won't have activated abilities, so what do you think that the trigger would be?
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.