Omg who cares if they reprint a card? If they reprint the fetches then yes people will buy the packs like crazy and of course the online value will drop, but who cares?
If your worried about the online price changing, then you should invest your money in land (actual land) and not magic cards. It feels like I am in the middle of a stock broker argument. Magic is a card game, a c-a-r-d g-a-m-e.
If you don't like the idea of playing 'keep up with magic' then either go casual or vintage. I wouldn't care what wizards print, just as long as they don't ever reprint Scornful Egotist in mythic. Love power creep hate power fail, nothing worse then seeing a card get reprinted at a higher rarity (looking at you Domestication!).
LOL "invest in land, actual land." That's like the best comment I've seen on this forum yet! You just made my day.
I am an MTG investor but I've never understood the mentality that Wizards shouldn't reprint expensive cards. That would please 5% of its player base who probably didn't even pull those cards from packs. Why would WOTC want to please a minority of its customer base, especially when pleasing that minority doesn't result in any amount of increased sales for them. They should look to please the 95% who actually purchase product from them.
I can't believe we almost managed to go the last few weeks of the year without having this sort of thread *claps hands*
Now in all seriousness, I'll paraphrase everything that is said in every thread every time this pops up; they will obviously be reprinted eventually, but Zendikar is only 5 years old. They need time to make other land cycles before returning to a land-heavy based block again in which to justify printing them. We don't know when they'll be reprinted, but it's more-or-less inevitable
I can't believe we almost managed to go the last few weeks of the year without having this sort of thread *claps hands*
Now in all seriousness, I'll paraphrase everything that is said in every thread every time this pops up; they will obviously be reprinted eventually, but Zendikar is only 5 years old. They need time to make other land cycles before returning to a land-heavy based block again in which to justify printing them. We don't know when they'll be reprinted, but it's more-or-less inevitable
Innistrad block had 15 rare lands, 5 being duals. Not a land block.
Return to Ravnica had 10 rare lands, and 10 common duals as well. Not a land block.
Theros is slated to have 11 rare lands, 10 of which will be duals. Again, not a land block.
The fetchlands can be reprinted in any Standard block, no sweat. Is it highly likely that they will be reprinted in a "return to ZEN" block? Yes. Does that mean they can't or won't be reprinted anywhere else? Absolutely not.
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fetchlands are really bad mana fixers, UNLESS you have duals.
Also fetchlands eat a lot of time, which is highly annoying.
In aggressive matches not "that" big of a deal, but you will spend a long time just fetch, land, 1 drop, shuffle and if you have so many fetchlands, you will spend a pretty big amount of time just searching and shuffling.
That sucks.
Not that big of a deal in Legacy, as you really dont need that many lands to operate anyway.
In the end, you have to abuse fetchlands in some way, be it landfall, be it dual lands, be it graveyard mechanics like threshold, life from the loam or what not.
Fetchlands are highly annoying kind of land, i dont see them reprinting them.
Fetchlands only really work if the set has a theme that supports them really well, and even then, i would highly think they wont put them together with duals.
If you wish for fetchlands, than its really all about the value of them.
In that case, put them in some Promo Decks, that would be totally fine, like 1 fetchland per Promo deck.
TheOnlyOne652089
fetchlands are really bad mana fixers, UNLESS you have duals.
If you wish for fetchlands, than its really all about the value of them.
In that case, put them in some Promo Decks, that would be totally fine, like 1 fetchland per Promo deck.
Yeah because the allied ones where so useless in standard during ONS/Mirrodin in two color deck that no one ever needed them to get the right fixing. Oh wait....and that was two years before shockslands where even a thing.
Well I don't know maybe its a stupid idea to have a game where people can get the cards they want to play the game with a deck they like. That is done by keeping prices down and having demand be resupplied when necessary.
So you want them to do True-Name Nemesis again but on purpose? Seriously? While they knew they where going to reprint shocklands in RtR part of they reason they didn't print shocklands in duel decks where they could have fit was because they knew they'd just end up getting scalped and resold higher since those lands would have paid for the deck itself plus more since those land are in high demand. The fetchlands would have the exact same problem. So no putting them in side products wouldn't help.
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fetchlands are really bad mana fixers, UNLESS you have duals.
Also fetchlands eat a lot of time, which is highly annoying.
In aggressive matches not "that" big of a deal, but you will spend a long time just fetch, land, 1 drop, shuffle and if you have so many fetchlands, you will spend a pretty big amount of time just searching and shuffling.
That sucks.
Not that big of a deal in Legacy, as you really dont need that many lands to operate anyway.
In the end, you have to abuse fetchlands in some way, be it landfall, be it dual lands, be it graveyard mechanics like threshold, life from the loam or what not.
Fetchlands are highly annoying kind of land, i dont see them reprinting them.
Fetchlands only really work if the set has a theme that supports them really well, and even then, i would highly think they wont put them together with duals.
If you wish for fetchlands, than its really all about the value of them.
In that case, put them in some Promo Decks, that would be totally fine, like 1 fetchland per Promo deck.
Fetchlands are great manafixers because the new land comes in untapped. You have to pick between A or B, but if your hand is full of A, you get the B you needed anyway.
They are better fixers with Shocks, but comparatively speaking the only modern legal fixland that's close to the reliability of the fetches are Shocks and Lorwyn Filters. Checklands only hit the reliability needed with Shocks, and Fastlands are only useful start of game.
They have said this before, and they DO NOT LIKE fetchlands mechanically, and I doubt they'll print them in standard.
You will likely see the Zen fetches in MM2. They need something to sell that set, with not a whole lot of impressively pricey cards from the relevant sets to bolster sales. If they print them at rare and not mythic, this is will have a very real effect on the supply of them for Modern.
Modern Masters was insanely popular. I think you're nuts if you don't believe WOTC will capitalize on this with a Legacy Masters. This is where you'll see onslaught block fetches reprinted.
Fetchlands are great manafixers because the new land comes in untapped. You have to pick between A or B, but if your hand is full of A, you get the B you needed anyway.
They are better fixers with Shocks, but comparatively speaking the only modern legal fixland that's close to the reliability of the fetches are Shocks and Lorwyn Filters. Checklands only hit the reliability needed with Shocks, and Fastlands are only useful start of game.
Sorry, but fetchlands are bad pure mana fixers without shocks. They are significantly worse than the Checklands, the shocklands, the scars lands, the filter lands, and the painlands.
Obviously wizards can design cards that interact with the fetches to make them a lot better (namely land fall cards and brainstorm effects), but they aren't exciting without shocklands.
Sorry, but fetchlands are bad pure mana fixers without shocks. They are significantly worse than the Checklands, the shocklands, the scars lands, the filter lands, and the painlands.
Obviously wizards can design cards that interact with the fetches to make them a lot better (namely land fall cards and brainstorm effects), but they aren't exciting without shocklands.
Fetchlands were played a fair amount in standard when they were legal the first time around (Onslaught). Goblin decks, for example, loved that they could run effectively 5x Swamp at no drawback but also have 4 of those Swamps be Mountains most of the time.
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If you can take advantage of it, yes. Same would go for landfall, or graveyard shenanigans.
However, simply as manafixers, fetchlands are one of the worst rare dual lands. It is only with the addition of shocklands that they become obscenely overpowered.
That being said, they are still technically "good." If they were in standard they would surely be played.
The problem I have with fetchlands in modern is twofold. Firstly, they slow the game down immensely. Secondly, and more importantly, they make every other dual land horribly obsolete. Poor balance is not good.
Without commenting on whether fetchlands should be reprinted or not as a whole, I would like to comment on whether "fetchlands are bad for two-color decks." If you look at competitive Modern Gruul Zoo decklists, most of them run some variation of Misty Rainforest/Verdant Catacombs/Arid Mesa/Scalding Tarn. Why? Let's look at some of things these lands can do:
1. fetch Stomping Ground (probably the most important reason)
2. thin out your deck to increase the chances of you drawing a non-land card
3. beef up Tarmogoyf
4. shuffle your deck (if you need do)
Now, imagine adding a 5th reason: you are now able to fetch a basic Forest OR Mountain. So with that being said, wouldn't having 4 Wooded Foothills be a lot better than having a combination of Misty Rainforest/Verdant Catacombs/Arid Mesa/Scalding Tarn?
The most interesting question to discuss I think is *which* fetches will be reprinted.
Personally, I think they will reprint the ONS ones and not the Zendikar ones (those will be reprinted in the far future).
The 5 extra fetches will not cause decks to run 20 fetches (since that is really not feasible). So the number of fetches in Modern decks would maybe only slightly increase (if at all).
If the ONS ones are reprinted, the prices of all fetches might come together (ZEN ones are now more expensive because they are played in more formats), and would create less strain on the availability of the fetches of the most played colors (ie blue fetches are more expensive now, because they are the most played and there are only 2 different ones in Modern. So if you play blue heavy, you need both Tarns and Misties).
Of course this is all theory (and there are different theories too that say the opposite), but I personally think reprinting ONS ones is better than the ZEN ones.
But not at the same time. I believe what he said is that they would support all 10 color combinations. I interpret that as; since enemy fetches are in, but allied are not currently, we need to do something about the allied ones. I don't think he ever mentioned that dual cycles are completed in just 1 block.
Besides, there is much more to gain in terms of booster sales if the ONS ones are reprinted (Legacy demand + decks in Modern that want ONS ones instead of Zend ones).
I highly doubt they will print all 10 in the same block, as ZEN proved that even a block where Land matters doesn't need 10 of them at the same time and it allows them to do the other 5 in a few years as well (making that block sell better as well).
Exodite
That seems unlikely given MaRo's response, which points to either just the Zendikar ones or all 10.
Actually it points to all 10 or nothing. MaRo stated that they aren't going ignore enemy colored duals anymore. If a dual land can be made for allied colors it can be made for enemy colors as well. This would apply to previously completed duals if reprinted or even unfinished cycles. Like if they decided to reprint the manlands they would make the other five to go along with them. Though the fastlands would require printing in a core set them make the enemys in the following fall set.
So basically if they ever decide the to reprint the Zen fetches the ONS one would be reprinted as well.
Edit-
Soulflame
I highly doubt they will print all 10 in the same block, as ZEN proved that even a block where Land matters doesn't need 10 of them at the same time and it allows them to do the other 5 in a few years as well (making that block sell better as well).
The reason they did it that way was because it was before they decided to give all two color pairs even mana fixing.
Before they just would think of a dual land and just put them in at allied colors because they thought enemy colors shouldn't get the same fixing. They've now decided that enemy's should get the same since enemy colors get less cards than the allied but that shouldn't stop said cards from having a good mana base to actually be able to be played.
Actually it points to all 10 or nothing. MaRo stated that they aren't going ignore enemy colored duals anymore. If a dual land can be made for allied colors it can be made for enemy colors as well. This would apply to previously completed duals if reprinted or even unfinished cycles. Like if they decided to reprint the manlands they would make the other five to go along with them. Though the fastlands would require printing in a core set them make the enemys in the following fall set.
So basically if they ever decide the to reprint the Zen fetches the ONS one would be reprinted as well.
Edit-
The reason they did it that way was because it was before they decided to give all two color pairs even mana fixing.
Before they just would think of a dual land and just put them in at allied colors because they thought enemy colors shouldn't get the same fixing. They've now decided that enemy's should get the same since enemy colors get less cards than the allied but that shouldn't stop said cards from having a good mana base to actually be able to be played.
Soooooo, does that mean we will also see enemy-paired fastlands in the not so distant future?
At this point, I'd say just put them all ten of them in Modern Masters 2. There is no guarantee that they're printing Goyf and Bob again, so the set might need some value at the top. As a matter of fact, I can imagine the Modern Masters series getting very boring after the second time and superfluous for the kinds of cards people expect to see in the set.
Heck, it could be done in standard, but I'd rather it be somewhere far away from Zendikar, hopefully good old naturally-proportioned Dominaria where they belong.
I have all the fetches I want except for Scalding Tarns, so it would be a disappointment if they just crash the ONS fetchlands without the 'Modern investors' putting any skin in the game.
I also wonder how many times one must destroy the value of Bloodstained Mire to bring Polluted Delta to an acceptable level.
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Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
I have all the fetches I want except for Scalding Tarns, so it would be a disappointment if they just crash the ONS fetchlands without the 'Modern investors' putting any skin in the game.
I also wonder how many times one must destroy the value of Bloodstained Mire to bring Polluted Delta to an acceptable level.
Unless I took your words for the wrong meaning I personally think its very selfish to care only about the $$$ value of what a card is going to be after a reprint. Its shouldn't be a worry or concern what the dollar value drops to but more so building the life and enjoyment of playing the game.
I own all Zendikar fetches, Goyfs, and Bobs. To be honest, I think they all still need reprints to make them more affordable and available for all players. The only people who should be concern about the price is the card sellers. If my cards loose value in expense to make them available and cheaper for my friendly players I'm cool with it.
I have only been following parts of this thread just to see and hear what people have to say. For me, I would not be surprised if they bring the Landfall effect back into one of the core sets and introducing the reprint of fetches. I see it happening in M15 the earliest, but I'm just your average Joe going off a assumption.
If they really want to push modern it would be a smart move. IMO. But then again players may just complain of another expensive card they should reprint to make Modern playable so there may never be a win.
Unless I took your words for the wrong meaning I personally think its very selfish to care only about the $$$ value of what a card is going to be after a reprint. Its shouldn't be a worry or concern what the dollar value drops to but more so building the life and enjoyment of playing the game.
I own all Zendikar fetches, Goyfs, and Bobs. To be honest, I think they all still need reprints to make them more affordable and available for all players. The only people who should be concern about the price is the card sellers. If my cards loose value in expense to make them available and cheaper for my friendly players I'm cool with it.
I have only been following parts of this thread just to see and hear what people have to say. For me, I would not be surprised if they bring the Landfall effect back into one of the core sets and introducing the reprint of fetches. I see it happening in M15 the earliest, but I'm just your average Joe going off a assumption.
You're heart is certainly in the right place, but I do not think there is any injustice in someone not having certain Magic cards.
It's selfish to want Magic cards, it's selfish for me to have enjoyed watching fetchlands double/triple in value. I've seen many ages of the game of Magic come and go and things like this just happen. Certain cards eventually generate great enough cache and demand that they become collector's items as well as play things. The game moves on and prints new cards for the next generation, eventually turning them into collectables too. The way people want things to go now though is to recycle every old idea to death because they weren't around for that era of Magic. The Innistrad crowd wishes to gut Magic for everything that it's worth.
I like that the games of Legacy/old-card-casual played between me and friends were using obscenely rare and valuable Magic cards that were attached to our own selfish identities, something unique to our generation, something that can have even greater value and mystique at a later time. Compounded with memories formed over the game in the past and you have the perfect storm for nostalgia. There is great, existential value in playing with rare and valuable cards which contributes to Magics awesomeness.
There are plenty of ways to play Magic, I happen to love limited. Denying someone easy access to fetches doesn't tell them that they can't play Magic.
Modern will NEVER be a cheap format. I think Wizards is OK with Modern being under-supplied. They only need to supply Modern with enough cards to be more played than Legacy. The hierarchy of Limited played more than Standard played more than Modern played more than Legacy played more than Vintage must be maintained.
I was all for banning fetchlands in Modern so more people could play, Goyf and DRS would suck, and other lands would have a chance to be format pillars, but no. Modern just need enough cards to see just a teentsy-bit more play than it does now.
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Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
I would love to see a reprint of fetchlands, even some of the older cards aswell,
Yes its all well and good that collectors took time to draft/find/buy them and invested alot but at the end of the day what's the point in having card's that a lot of people can't play due to lack of availability/affordability.
If they did get reprinted i think it would be a good thing for magic in general by making these cards more available for the general magic player and well, all you collectors could just be like "Oh i see you have a Marsh flats there, that's cute, it's the new printing, mines the first edition of it"
You're heart is certainly in the right place, but I do not think there is any injustice in someone not having certain Magic cards.
It's selfish to want Magic cards, it's selfish for me to have enjoyed watching fetchlands double/triple in value. I've seen many ages of the game of Magic come and go and things like this just happen. Certain cards eventually generate great enough cache and demand that they become collector's items as well as play things. The game moves on and prints new cards for the next generation, eventually turning them into collectables too. The way people want things to go now though is to recycle every old idea to death because they weren't around for that era of Magic. The Innistrad crowd wishes to gut Magic for everything that it's worth.
I like that the games of Legacy/old-card-casual played between me and friends were using obscenely rare and valuable Magic cards that were attached to our own selfish identities, something unique to our generation, something that can have even greater value and mystique at a later time. Compounded with memories formed over the game in the past and you have the perfect storm for nostalgia. There is great, existential value in playing with rare and valuable cards which contributes to Magics awesomeness.
There are plenty of ways to play Magic, I happen to love limited. Denying someone easy access to fetches doesn't tell them that they can't play Magic.
Modern will NEVER be a cheap format. I think Wizards is OK with Modern being under-supplied. They only need to supply Modern with enough cards to be more played than Legacy. The hierarchy of Limited played more than Standard played more than Modern played more than Legacy played more than Vintage must be maintained.
I was all for banning fetchlands in Modern so more people could play, Goyf and DRS would suck, and other lands would have a chance to be format pillars, but no. Modern just need enough cards to see just a teentsy-bit more play than it does now.
You are indeed a very selfish person.
What you care is to keep the card price where you own it when it is cheap. You reject other players own the card using a similar amount of expense and ask them to use less powerful to play.
Please keep that argument. Once nobody joins the "limited" format due to the high price issue, you will see how it affects the price of your "valuable" cards, and how difficult to find a player play the game with you.
You're heart is certainly in the right place, but I do not think there is any injustice in someone not having certain Magic cards.
It's selfish to want Magic cards, it's selfish for me to have enjoyed watching fetchlands double/triple in value. I've seen many ages of the game of Magic come and go and things like this just happen. Certain cards eventually generate great enough cache and demand that they become collector's items as well as play things. The game moves on and prints new cards for the next generation, eventually turning them into collectables too. The way people want things to go now though is to recycle every old idea to death because they weren't around for that era of Magic. The Innistrad crowd wishes to gut Magic for everything that it's worth.
I like that the games of Legacy/old-card-casual played between me and friends were using obscenely rare and valuable Magic cards that were attached to our own selfish identities, something unique to our generation, something that can have even greater value and mystique at a later time. Compounded with memories formed over the game in the past and you have the perfect storm for nostalgia. There is great, existential value in playing with rare and valuable cards which contributes to Magics awesomeness.
You know I'm glad you said that, and I do understand and can relate to some degree. I get it.
For myself, I suppose there may be some reasons why I still hold onto my decks from the early days of Urza's saga and Onslaught. Probably memory's, or maybe I find them collectible or valuable. Although maybe for me, its not necessarily the money that makes the card valuable.
I grew up playing these stupid cards but I found that they need to evolve as well. I enjoy playing just as much as collecting, and what's playing if your friends or group don't have the drive or range of cards you do.
You also have to consider the possibility of the old Onslaught fetches holding their value even after a reprint. People like myself, and maybe even you go nuts for cards in the old border. For every commander deck I build I went out of my way to get something in the old border even if I already own the Modern version just because. I also like having cards from their original sets. Its small things like that that might even make them hold their price keep everyone happy.
You know I'm glad you said that, and I do understand and can relate to some degree. I get it.
For myself, I suppose there may be some reasons why I still hold onto my decks from the early days of Urza's saga and Onslaught. Probably memory's, or maybe I find them collectible or valuable. Although maybe for me, its not necessarily the money that makes the card valuable.
I grew up playing these stupid cards but I found that they need to evolve as well. I enjoy playing just as much as collecting, and what's playing if your friends or group don't have the drive or range of cards you do.
You also have to consider the possibility of the old Onslaught fetches holding their value even after a reprint. People like myself, and maybe even you go nuts for cards in the old border. For every commander deck I build I went out of my way to get something in the old border even if I already own the Modern version just because. I also like having cards from their original sets. Its small things like that that might even make them hold their price keep everyone happy.
I'm glad we have some common ground.
Personally, I spent over $1,000 on cards to complete my Legacy decks...90% of it was on LANDS, because I was just a child playing the game when the cool cards were out.
I used to draft when I was twelve and during that time I collected x4 Goblin Piledriver (forever the heart and soul of my collection). I liked that he was hard enough to get that my friends didn't have him too. Expensive Magic cards forces players to accept the role that they identify with most, the trick is getting them to identify with them enough to open their wallets.
Unfortunately, I only came out of Onslaught block with x3 Bloodstained Mire (I once picked a Grinning Demon over one of these in the redraft). Nonetheless, I had enough awesome Magic cards which resonated with me in such a way that made me value the game. I didn't quit when Wasteland went from $12 > $30 > $50. I loved the game enough that I valued it enough to make a serious commitment. My friends did it too, which was the best part. I seriously hated paying that much for those stupid lands, but for the amount of play-value we got out of it, we determined that it was worth it.
Now that commitment is PRACTICALLY OVER! Barring the arrival of True-Ca$h Goblin, I'm FREE and out of the system just hoping Goblins don't go extinct so that the few chances I have to play Legacy these days, I can infiltrate random tournaments and have moderate success, but that is beside the point.
The moral of this story are that it sucks that Magic cards are expensive, but the graduating levels of formats are progressively more expensive for good reason. It's not a cruel extension of the Reserved List, but the way the game always has and must be.
*I am a strictly working-class individual to, so that might suggest that since I have had so little value in my life, the value from Magic cards is more important to me than it should be. Oh well, it makes me happy. I'm not in the game strictly to compete in tournaments. There is a certain aesthetic that appeals to me which I hope to see maintained and grown exponentially.
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Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
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LOL "invest in land, actual land." That's like the best comment I've seen on this forum yet! You just made my day.
Now in all seriousness, I'll paraphrase everything that is said in every thread every time this pops up; they will obviously be reprinted eventually, but Zendikar is only 5 years old. They need time to make other land cycles before returning to a land-heavy based block again in which to justify printing them. We don't know when they'll be reprinted, but it's more-or-less inevitable
Innistrad block had 15 rare lands, 5 being duals. Not a land block.
Return to Ravnica had 10 rare lands, and 10 common duals as well. Not a land block.
Theros is slated to have 11 rare lands, 10 of which will be duals. Again, not a land block.
The fetchlands can be reprinted in any Standard block, no sweat. Is it highly likely that they will be reprinted in a "return to ZEN" block? Yes. Does that mean they can't or won't be reprinted anywhere else? Absolutely not.
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That would get me playing legacy, till then I am not even bothering.
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Also fetchlands eat a lot of time, which is highly annoying.
In aggressive matches not "that" big of a deal, but you will spend a long time just fetch, land, 1 drop, shuffle and if you have so many fetchlands, you will spend a pretty big amount of time just searching and shuffling.
That sucks.
Not that big of a deal in Legacy, as you really dont need that many lands to operate anyway.
In the end, you have to abuse fetchlands in some way, be it landfall, be it dual lands, be it graveyard mechanics like threshold, life from the loam or what not.
Fetchlands are highly annoying kind of land, i dont see them reprinting them.
Fetchlands only really work if the set has a theme that supports them really well, and even then, i would highly think they wont put them together with duals.
If you wish for fetchlands, than its really all about the value of them.
In that case, put them in some Promo Decks, that would be totally fine, like 1 fetchland per Promo deck.
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Yeah because the allied ones where so useless in standard during ONS/Mirrodin in two color deck that no one ever needed them to get the right fixing. Oh wait....and that was two years before shockslands where even a thing.
Well I don't know maybe its a stupid idea to have a game where people can get the cards they want to play the game with a deck they like. That is done by keeping prices down and having demand be resupplied when necessary.
So you want them to do True-Name Nemesis again but on purpose? Seriously? While they knew they where going to reprint shocklands in RtR part of they reason they didn't print shocklands in duel decks where they could have fit was because they knew they'd just end up getting scalped and resold higher since those lands would have paid for the deck itself plus more since those land are in high demand. The fetchlands would have the exact same problem. So no putting them in side products wouldn't help.
BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
Fetchlands are great manafixers because the new land comes in untapped. You have to pick between A or B, but if your hand is full of A, you get the B you needed anyway.
They are better fixers with Shocks, but comparatively speaking the only modern legal fixland that's close to the reliability of the fetches are Shocks and Lorwyn Filters. Checklands only hit the reliability needed with Shocks, and Fastlands are only useful start of game.
You will likely see the Zen fetches in MM2. They need something to sell that set, with not a whole lot of impressively pricey cards from the relevant sets to bolster sales. If they print them at rare and not mythic, this is will have a very real effect on the supply of them for Modern.
Modern Masters was insanely popular. I think you're nuts if you don't believe WOTC will capitalize on this with a Legacy Masters. This is where you'll see onslaught block fetches reprinted.
Sorry, but fetchlands are bad pure mana fixers without shocks. They are significantly worse than the Checklands, the shocklands, the scars lands, the filter lands, and the painlands.
Obviously wizards can design cards that interact with the fetches to make them a lot better (namely land fall cards and brainstorm effects), but they aren't exciting without shocklands.
Fetchlands were played a fair amount in standard when they were legal the first time around (Onslaught). Goblin decks, for example, loved that they could run effectively 5x Swamp at no drawback but also have 4 of those Swamps be Mountains most of the time.
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If you can take advantage of it, yes. Same would go for landfall, or graveyard shenanigans.
However, simply as manafixers, fetchlands are one of the worst rare dual lands. It is only with the addition of shocklands that they become obscenely overpowered.
That being said, they are still technically "good." If they were in standard they would surely be played.
The problem I have with fetchlands in modern is twofold. Firstly, they slow the game down immensely. Secondly, and more importantly, they make every other dual land horribly obsolete. Poor balance is not good.
1. fetch Stomping Ground (probably the most important reason)
2. thin out your deck to increase the chances of you drawing a non-land card
3. beef up Tarmogoyf
4. shuffle your deck (if you need do)
Now, imagine adding a 5th reason: you are now able to fetch a basic Forest OR Mountain. So with that being said, wouldn't having 4 Wooded Foothills be a lot better than having a combination of Misty Rainforest/Verdant Catacombs/Arid Mesa/Scalding Tarn?
Personally, I think they will reprint the ONS ones and not the Zendikar ones (those will be reprinted in the far future).
The 5 extra fetches will not cause decks to run 20 fetches (since that is really not feasible). So the number of fetches in Modern decks would maybe only slightly increase (if at all).
If the ONS ones are reprinted, the prices of all fetches might come together (ZEN ones are now more expensive because they are played in more formats), and would create less strain on the availability of the fetches of the most played colors (ie blue fetches are more expensive now, because they are the most played and there are only 2 different ones in Modern. So if you play blue heavy, you need both Tarns and Misties).
Of course this is all theory (and there are different theories too that say the opposite), but I personally think reprinting ONS ones is better than the ZEN ones.
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Besides, there is much more to gain in terms of booster sales if the ONS ones are reprinted (Legacy demand + decks in Modern that want ONS ones instead of Zend ones).
I highly doubt they will print all 10 in the same block, as ZEN proved that even a block where Land matters doesn't need 10 of them at the same time and it allows them to do the other 5 in a few years as well (making that block sell better as well).
This great banner was made by Topher
So basically if they ever decide the to reprint the Zen fetches the ONS one would be reprinted as well.
Edit-
The reason they did it that way was because it was before they decided to give all two color pairs even mana fixing.
Before they just would think of a dual land and just put them in at allied colors because they thought enemy colors shouldn't get the same fixing. They've now decided that enemy's should get the same since enemy colors get less cards than the allied but that shouldn't stop said cards from having a good mana base to actually be able to be played.
BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
Soooooo, does that mean we will also see enemy-paired fastlands in the not so distant future?
Heck, it could be done in standard, but I'd rather it be somewhere far away from Zendikar, hopefully good old naturally-proportioned Dominaria where they belong.
I have all the fetches I want except for Scalding Tarns, so it would be a disappointment if they just crash the ONS fetchlands without the 'Modern investors' putting any skin in the game.
I also wonder how many times one must destroy the value of Bloodstained Mire to bring Polluted Delta to an acceptable level.
Legacy:
RWBG Goblins
RRR Burn
WBU Affinity
UBR Sac-Land Tendrils!
BBBPox
Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
Pauper:
RGoblins
URCloudpost
other decks
Goblins.
Unless I took your words for the wrong meaning I personally think its very selfish to care only about the $$$ value of what a card is going to be after a reprint. Its shouldn't be a worry or concern what the dollar value drops to but more so building the life and enjoyment of playing the game.
I own all Zendikar fetches, Goyfs, and Bobs. To be honest, I think they all still need reprints to make them more affordable and available for all players. The only people who should be concern about the price is the card sellers. If my cards loose value in expense to make them available and cheaper for my friendly players I'm cool with it.
I have only been following parts of this thread just to see and hear what people have to say. For me, I would not be surprised if they bring the Landfall effect back into one of the core sets and introducing the reprint of fetches. I see it happening in M15 the earliest, but I'm just your average Joe going off a assumption.
If they really want to push modern it would be a smart move. IMO. But then again players may just complain of another expensive card they should reprint to make Modern playable so there may never be a win.
You're heart is certainly in the right place, but I do not think there is any injustice in someone not having certain Magic cards.
It's selfish to want Magic cards, it's selfish for me to have enjoyed watching fetchlands double/triple in value. I've seen many ages of the game of Magic come and go and things like this just happen. Certain cards eventually generate great enough cache and demand that they become collector's items as well as play things. The game moves on and prints new cards for the next generation, eventually turning them into collectables too. The way people want things to go now though is to recycle every old idea to death because they weren't around for that era of Magic. The Innistrad crowd wishes to gut Magic for everything that it's worth.
I like that the games of Legacy/old-card-casual played between me and friends were using obscenely rare and valuable Magic cards that were attached to our own selfish identities, something unique to our generation, something that can have even greater value and mystique at a later time. Compounded with memories formed over the game in the past and you have the perfect storm for nostalgia. There is great, existential value in playing with rare and valuable cards which contributes to Magics awesomeness.
There are plenty of ways to play Magic, I happen to love limited. Denying someone easy access to fetches doesn't tell them that they can't play Magic.
Modern will NEVER be a cheap format. I think Wizards is OK with Modern being under-supplied. They only need to supply Modern with enough cards to be more played than Legacy. The hierarchy of Limited played more than Standard played more than Modern played more than Legacy played more than Vintage must be maintained.
I was all for banning fetchlands in Modern so more people could play, Goyf and DRS would suck, and other lands would have a chance to be format pillars, but no. Modern just need enough cards to see just a teentsy-bit more play than it does now.
Legacy:
RWBG Goblins
RRR Burn
WBU Affinity
UBR Sac-Land Tendrils!
BBBPox
Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
Pauper:
RGoblins
URCloudpost
other decks
Goblins.
Yes its all well and good that collectors took time to draft/find/buy them and invested alot but at the end of the day what's the point in having card's that a lot of people can't play due to lack of availability/affordability.
If they did get reprinted i think it would be a good thing for magic in general by making these cards more available for the general magic player and well, all you collectors could just be like "Oh i see you have a Marsh flats there, that's cute, it's the new printing, mines the first edition of it"
You are indeed a very selfish person.
What you care is to keep the card price where you own it when it is cheap. You reject other players own the card using a similar amount of expense and ask them to use less powerful to play.
Please keep that argument. Once nobody joins the "limited" format due to the high price issue, you will see how it affects the price of your "valuable" cards, and how difficult to find a player play the game with you.
Anything, but nothing at the moment...
Modern:
WUBRGAmulet Titan, WUBRGHuman
WUBRAd Nauseam, WBRGDeath Shadow, UBRGScapeshift, UBRGDredge
WURJeskai Nahiri, WURCheeri0s, WBGCounter Company, WRGBurn, UBRMadcap Moon, BRGJund Midrange
UBTurn,BRGriselbrand Reanimator, WGKnight Company, RGRG Tron, RGRG Ponza, XAffinity, XEldrazi Tron
You know I'm glad you said that, and I do understand and can relate to some degree. I get it.
For myself, I suppose there may be some reasons why I still hold onto my decks from the early days of Urza's saga and Onslaught. Probably memory's, or maybe I find them collectible or valuable. Although maybe for me, its not necessarily the money that makes the card valuable.
I grew up playing these stupid cards but I found that they need to evolve as well. I enjoy playing just as much as collecting, and what's playing if your friends or group don't have the drive or range of cards you do.
You also have to consider the possibility of the old Onslaught fetches holding their value even after a reprint. People like myself, and maybe even you go nuts for cards in the old border. For every commander deck I build I went out of my way to get something in the old border even if I already own the Modern version just because. I also like having cards from their original sets. Its small things like that that might even make them hold their price keep everyone happy.
I'm glad we have some common ground.
Personally, I spent over $1,000 on cards to complete my Legacy decks...90% of it was on LANDS, because I was just a child playing the game when the cool cards were out.
I used to draft when I was twelve and during that time I collected x4 Goblin Piledriver (forever the heart and soul of my collection). I liked that he was hard enough to get that my friends didn't have him too. Expensive Magic cards forces players to accept the role that they identify with most, the trick is getting them to identify with them enough to open their wallets.
Unfortunately, I only came out of Onslaught block with x3 Bloodstained Mire (I once picked a Grinning Demon over one of these in the redraft). Nonetheless, I had enough awesome Magic cards which resonated with me in such a way that made me value the game. I didn't quit when Wasteland went from $12 > $30 > $50. I loved the game enough that I valued it enough to make a serious commitment. My friends did it too, which was the best part. I seriously hated paying that much for those stupid lands, but for the amount of play-value we got out of it, we determined that it was worth it.
Now that commitment is PRACTICALLY OVER! Barring the arrival of True-Ca$h Goblin, I'm FREE and out of the system just hoping Goblins don't go extinct so that the few chances I have to play Legacy these days, I can infiltrate random tournaments and have moderate success, but that is beside the point.
The moral of this story are that it sucks that Magic cards are expensive, but the graduating levels of formats are progressively more expensive for good reason. It's not a cruel extension of the Reserved List, but the way the game always has and must be.
*I am a strictly working-class individual to, so that might suggest that since I have had so little value in my life, the value from Magic cards is more important to me than it should be. Oh well, it makes me happy. I'm not in the game strictly to compete in tournaments. There is a certain aesthetic that appeals to me which I hope to see maintained and grown exponentially.
Legacy:
RWBG Goblins
RRR Burn
WBU Affinity
UBR Sac-Land Tendrils!
BBBPox
Next possible deck: D&T, but that just wouldn't be right.
Modern: R Goblins (work in progress)
Standard: I only care about standard when Goblins is a deck.
Limited: I only care about limited when Goblins are in the set.
Pauper:
RGoblins
URCloudpost
other decks
Goblins.