Better to see a reprint at mythic then no reprint at all though. Doubt it will be mythic though.
There is no reasoning, business-wise, logically, or otherwise to print Thoughtseize at mythic.
Anyone that thinks Thoughtseize would ever be reprinted at mythic should probably stop speculating about cards and just go back to lurking the rumor mill.
Not sure if I buy the rumors from this thread though, its mostly confirmation of stuff that was already being speculated, from a source we don't know if we can trust or not.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
News and spoiler contributor for GatheringMagic.com
There is no reasoning, business-wise, logically, or otherwise to print Thoughtseize at mythic.
Anyone that thinks Thoughtseize would ever be reprinted at mythic should probably stop speculating about cards and just go back to lurking the rumor mill.
Quite an arrogant statement when one can logically back up Thoughtseize as a mythic using sufficient evidence, including price levels of staple reprints (e.g. Dark Confidant).
Myself? I am sure it will be re-printed at rare in M14, if at all, and I use the number crunch as the sole tipping point. But it is pure hubris to suggest that anyone who ever believed this card to be mythic-worthy as "unworthy of speculation".
Quite an arrogant statement when one can logically back up Thoughtseize as a mythic using sufficient evidence, including price levels of staple reprints (e.g. Dark Confidant).
Myself? I am sure it will be re-printed at rare in M14, if at all, and I use the number crunch as the sole tipping point. But it is pure hubris to suggest that anyone who ever believed this card to be mythic-worthy as "unworthy of speculation".
It has been done in the past with cards that have seen far less play, along the lines of Mindbreak Trap and even creatures like Lotus Cobra. This is the king of all 1-mana discard effects being able to do something no other card has or will be able to do--target any card in an opponent's hand to be discarded.
In terms of gaming lore, it certainly makes its case to be a mythic. It feels more rare from a personal standpoint, but I will certainly empathize with those in the mythic crowd.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I've never understood why Magic doesn't act like almost every other collectible in the world.
Comic books get reprinted all the time. Baseball/basketball cards get reprinted. Books get reprinted. Even guitars, or cars or almost anything people collect get reissued.
Actually that isn't completely true. While I know nothing about comic books and basketball cards, baseball cards do have rules about reprints and sets having a certain concentration of reprinted cards in them. Topps has to deal with it every year.
I've never understood why Magic doesn't act like almost every other collectible in the world.
Comic books get reprinted all the time. Baseball/basketball cards get reprinted. Books get reprinted. Even guitars, or cars or almost anything people collect get reissued.
When any collectible comes around, the price of the original run - the first printing of a comic book, the first edition of a book - is the one that maintains value.
Action Comics #1 (First printing) just auctioned for $175,000. You can find a reprint of the exact same issue for 20 bucks or less on ebay.
What I'm saying is, for some reason, companies like SCG which basically set the prices of cards is doing it all wrong and are partially to blame for things like the Reserved List. And I'll tell you why: If original printing of cards maintained their value but the reprints were seen as "less valuable," everyone would be happy.
You've got an RTR Shockland? Big deal. Everyone has one of those now. Try finding an original, mint condition Ravnica one.
Collectors will be happy because their original printing would still be worth $35-40. The reprints could be valued at a much more affordable $10.
And while this is the case to an extent - Guildpact Stomping Ground goes for $18 while Gatecrash Stomping Ground goes for $11 - if they simply maintained the values of the original print runs while decreasing the value of the reprints, everyone would be happier.
Why is the Reserved List still around? Because WotC made a promise to the collectors that they wouldn't decrease the value of their collectable. But a reprint in a later edition should have zero baring on whether you have the version from the original print run.
"Here's my M15 Tundra."
"Cool beans. Mine's from Beta."
As a player, I'm happy to play with the card. But as a collector, reprinting it in M15 should have NO BARRING on the price of my original Beta version. My Beta Tundra should maintain it's $1000 price tag 'cause it's still just as bloody hard to find a Beta version of the card regardless of reprint.
That's what the whole idea of "collecting" should be: To collect something because (A) you like collecting that particular thing and (B) because you're hoping it is one day worth something.
The problem is that stores like SCG just want to make money. When a reprint comes out, they just lower the price of the original versions to sell off more copies. That shouldn't be happening. If this were truly a "collectible," the prices wouldn't decrease. It's not the original printing. It's basically the stores that are warping the idea of this being a "collectable" game by determining what the value of cards should be on a day by day basis.
I'm not impressed when people break out RTR shocks. I am impressed when people break out Ravnica Shocks. Those are harder to get. They SHOULD be worth more. If Magic actually acted like every other collectable out there, the idea of reprints really wouldn't be a problem.
Like baseball cards and comic books, only the really old stuff retains that kind of value, even with reprints. An Alpha Shivan Dragon goes for $300-$500. A Revised one (printed only 8 months later) can be had for less than a buck. This is a card that's been reprinted a whole bunch of times and has little play value in Constructed, but the Alpha one holds value only because it would be cool to own one.
There's no prestige to owning an original Ravnica shockland not because Star City lowers the price when it gets reprinted, but because they aren't that hard to come by. They printed a ton of the original Ravnica and for a while there was no Constructed format to play them in. People only held onto them (and they only held some value at all) out of speculation that they would either be reprinted or a format would come along where they'd be useful (both of which eventually happened).
The only thing that would make one printing worth more than the other is if the art is better on one. It's not like Alpha where even junk rares like Lifelace are worth money simply because there weren't that many to begin with and even fewer are still in good condition.
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
Assuming true, I'm so happy Thoughtsieze is in M14.
I like M14 better than Modern Masters... with Mutavault, Thoughtsieze and Scavenging Ooze some of the rares that I am looking for.
Even better is that M14 will likely drive prices lower than Modern Masters would.
I sort of don't want Thoughtseize in M14. I dislike what it does to standard when it's legal, and if it stays relatively expensive (it will) then everyone who plays a lot of standard will have to spend a bunch of money on it if they don't already have it. I strongly, strongly dislike this.
How is that? I mean, Ooze was a $40 card and it's coming back as a promo and a rare in M14. I don't really think bets are off in this regard. Thoughtseize, whether now or later, needs to come down for Modern. I'm guessing one of the reasons Ooze was reprinted was to have a logical alternative to Goyf. I wouldn't be surprised to see Confidant return in the future in a Standard environment where it isn't too good.
Why i don't see thoughtseize as being in m14, is that wizards doesnt like core sets, they wouldnt pack value like that into essentially a bad set. we've seen it time and time again, they have had how many chances to place tarmogoyf into current blocks. i mean, we just saw a full graveyard block go by and it ends up in MM.
Although, Wizards might be tired of shooting themselves in the foot because core sets are so absolutely awful to justify drafting/buying in general. Here's hoping im wrong and they want to make money.
How is not giving creatures beneficial stats, along with a unique effect which can help combo during combat phases and double-serve as wrath protection not considered utility? Do you not understand the definition within the given context?
Assuming Thoughtseize is in.....if not, then some of this doesn't matter
I still can't believe mutavault made it into a CORE SET. Thoughtseize seems better primed for MM2 or some block, NOT in core? MM2 could easily have incorporated mutavault/Scav ooze/ thoughtseize plus good cards from newer blocks if they really wanted.
Wizards means to make the game more accessible to new players, ask all the kids playing standard how cheap that VoR is....240 retail for a playset
Is this the end of Magic and the beginning of Yugioh type printing of cards.... I hope not
I still can't believe mutavault made it into a CORE SET. Thoughtseize seems better primed for MM2 or some block, NOT in core? MM2 could easily have incorporated mutavault/Scav ooze/ thoughtseize plus good cards from newer blocks if they really wanted.
Changeling seems like a good way to not clog the set with slivers and still make it an archetype. Maybe they'll throw in a few more cards with it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Randomness:
Quote from Singer of White Line »
Hey, lolis with katanas are awesome, and I don't care about their home country.
I still can't believe mutavault made it into a CORE SET. Thoughtseize seems better primed for MM2 or some block, NOT in core? MM2 could easily have incorporated mutavault/Scav ooze/ thoughtseize plus good cards from newer blocks if they really wanted.
Ooze can't be in MM because it is not legal in modern, that is a good reason for print it in a core set.
Ooze can't be in MM because it is not legal in modern, that is a good reason for print it in a core set.
true, I keep forgetting it was CMDR printing only. I could care less about ooze being in to be honest. Mutavault was the big surprise and if Thoughtseize is in core, that will be just as surprising.
I remember all the speculators thinking ooze was going to hit 80+ and how it was supposed to be a goyf replacement. Neither happened in reality and extra oozes are a good thing.
Better to see a reprint at mythic then no reprint at all though. Doubt it will be mythic though.
There is no reasoning, business-wise, logically, or otherwise to print Thoughtseize at mythic.
Anyone that thinks Thoughtseize would ever be reprinted at mythic should probably stop speculating about cards and just go back to lurking the rumor mill.
Not sure if I buy the rumors from this thread though, its mostly confirmation of stuff that was already being speculated, from a source we don't know if we can trust or not.
Twitter
Quite an arrogant statement when one can logically back up Thoughtseize as a mythic using sufficient evidence, including price levels of staple reprints (e.g. Dark Confidant).
Myself? I am sure it will be re-printed at rare in M14, if at all, and I use the number crunch as the sole tipping point. But it is pure hubris to suggest that anyone who ever believed this card to be mythic-worthy as "unworthy of speculation".
Should a utility spell really be mythic?
No....but that didn't stop them with Lotus Cobra....that card is utility if there ever was utility.
It has been done in the past with cards that have seen far less play, along the lines of Mindbreak Trap and even creatures like Lotus Cobra. This is the king of all 1-mana discard effects being able to do something no other card has or will be able to do--target any card in an opponent's hand to be discarded.
In terms of gaming lore, it certainly makes its case to be a mythic. It feels more rare from a personal standpoint, but I will certainly empathize with those in the mythic crowd.
No, but it still happens.
See Legion's Initiative.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Actually that isn't completely true. While I know nothing about comic books and basketball cards, baseball cards do have rules about reprints and sets having a certain concentration of reprinted cards in them. Topps has to deal with it every year.
100 bucks on fake.
Like baseball cards and comic books, only the really old stuff retains that kind of value, even with reprints. An Alpha Shivan Dragon goes for $300-$500. A Revised one (printed only 8 months later) can be had for less than a buck. This is a card that's been reprinted a whole bunch of times and has little play value in Constructed, but the Alpha one holds value only because it would be cool to own one.
There's no prestige to owning an original Ravnica shockland not because Star City lowers the price when it gets reprinted, but because they aren't that hard to come by. They printed a ton of the original Ravnica and for a while there was no Constructed format to play them in. People only held onto them (and they only held some value at all) out of speculation that they would either be reprinted or a format would come along where they'd be useful (both of which eventually happened).
The only thing that would make one printing worth more than the other is if the art is better on one. It's not like Alpha where even junk rares like Lifelace are worth money simply because there weren't that many to begin with and even fewer are still in good condition.
"OH GOD MY BRAIN IS EXPLOADING AT HOW BAD THE ART IS ON MY OWN CARD"
-A friend's first impression of Ancestral Recall
10/10, I tapped.
I like M14 better than Modern Masters... with Mutavault, Thoughtsieze and Scavenging Ooze some of the rares that I am looking for.
Even better is that M14 will likely drive prices lower than Modern Masters would.
That's really not a utility card.
Standard: W/R Aggro
How is that? I mean, Ooze was a $40 card and it's coming back as a promo and a rare in M14. I don't really think bets are off in this regard. Thoughtseize, whether now or later, needs to come down for Modern. I'm guessing one of the reasons Ooze was reprinted was to have a logical alternative to Goyf. I wouldn't be surprised to see Confidant return in the future in a Standard environment where it isn't too good.
Trade List
MTGSalvation trade list
---------------------------------------------------------
"If you kill me now, it is I who will live, not your damned apples."
"Just mention a firing pole with balls and he's
already thinking about 'that'..."
Decks Played:
Dark DepthslBWG (Legacy)
Coralhelm KnightsGWU (Modern)
Vengevine the Rerevengeancening BRG (Modern)
Although, Wizards might be tired of shooting themselves in the foot because core sets are so absolutely awful to justify drafting/buying in general. Here's hoping im wrong and they want to make money.
GBW Control
UWB Esper Thing Control
How is not giving creatures beneficial stats, along with a unique effect which can help combo during combat phases and double-serve as wrath protection not considered utility? Do you not understand the definition within the given context?
They'll be neutered shortly by the time rotation hits anyway.. plus Ooze doesn't bode well for Reanimator regardless.
So Mutavault, Ooze and Thoughtsieze in M14? Sounds fantastic.
I still can't believe mutavault made it into a CORE SET. Thoughtseize seems better primed for MM2 or some block, NOT in core? MM2 could easily have incorporated mutavault/Scav ooze/ thoughtseize plus good cards from newer blocks if they really wanted.
Wizards means to make the game more accessible to new players, ask all the kids playing standard how cheap that VoR is....240 retail for a playset
Is this the end of Magic and the beginning of Yugioh type printing of cards.... I hope not
Ooze can't be in MM because it is not legal in modern, that is a good reason for print it in a core set.
true, I keep forgetting it was CMDR printing only. I could care less about ooze being in to be honest. Mutavault was the big surprise and if Thoughtseize is in core, that will be just as surprising.
I remember all the speculators thinking ooze was going to hit 80+ and how it was supposed to be a goyf replacement. Neither happened in reality and extra oozes are a good thing.