Wild Guess as the zero ability would be too good. JTMS-esque good. Like Liliana of the Veil, the plus loyalty ability should be card advantage, while the minus 'utility' ability should remove a creature. Perhaps even Lightning Bolt over Shock, to offset the downside of having to choose between casting her or your prime removal/sligh creature spell.
So rather:
+1: Draw a card, then discard a card.
-2: Shock/Bolt
-X: Ultimate
this is heading into tibalt's territory.
remember, they are trying to move towards giving each planeswalker an identity, not a bunch of generic abilities from that color (eg tezz is an artificer whereas jace is a mind mage; garruk is a beast summoner while nissa is some kind of elf champion; elspeth is a knight whilst ajani is more of a shaman)
for chandra to maintain her identity she needs to be a pyromancer
Chandra the Playable 1RR
Planeswalker - Chandra
+1: Chandra deals 2 damage to target player and 1 damage to you
-2: Chandra deals X damage to each creature, where X is Chandra's loyalty
-7: Search your library for 3 red instant or sorcery cards. You may cast those cards without paying their mana cost
starting loyalty: 3
At this point I think the only viable Chandra is at 3CMC or less.
Honestly, I loved the direction with planeswalkers that WOTC went with Sarkhan the Mad, but it was a little under-designed.
However, I think you can constitute some of those mechanics into a viable Chandra.
I'm thinking:
Chandra 4.0 - 1RR
0: Draw a card, then discard a card. Chandra deals damage to herself equal to the converted mana cost of the card discarded this way.
-2: Chandra deals 3 damage to target creature or player.
+3: You get an emblem with "Whenever a red instant or sorcery spell you control deals damage to a player, double it." Activate this ability only if Chandra has exactly 1 loyalty counter.
<4>
It's a start.
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Old enough to know better, much too young to care.
Maro has stated that the new Chandra has an ability that has never been in reds part of the color pie before.
Anyone care to guess what said ability is?
"Return target instant or sorcery from a graveyard to its owner's hand" as the minus ability?
@ Flop - I don't think "+2: deals 2 damage to each player" is out of the question. If you're going with a targeted Shock on a three mana planeswalker it should be more along the lines of an Orcish Artillery activation. (+1: deals 2 damage to a target and 3 to you)
"Return target instant or sorcery from a graveyard to its owner's hand" as the minus ability?
I wouldn't say that's never been part of red's color identity before. Anarchist does something similar, and that's just off the top of my head. Although I can't think of anything that allows you to return somebody else's sorcery to his/her hand.
... or a reason you'd want to do that.
He said it's something red's never done before and it came from his tumblr. I spent a bunch of time looking for it yesterday and gave up. It was really frustrating because I vaguely remember the post (I remember thinking the idea was really interesting and there were a lot of positive comments about it) but I don't remember when it was. It was during one of those stretches when the tumblr audience was obsessed with finding red more mechanics. Hopefully somebody will find it.
"Return target instant or sorcery from a graveyard to its owner's hand" as the minus ability?
@ Flop - I don't think "+2: deals 2 damage to each player" is out of the question. If you're going with a targeted Shock on a three mana planeswalker it should be more along the lines of an Orcish Artillery activation. (+1: deals 2 damage to a target and 3 to you)
mine didn't hit creatures though, so it wasn't necessarily as good (or bad) as the artillery.
also, it was more to illustrate a point about walkers being more thematic than a bunch of abilities from the color being thrown together
Maro has stated that the new Chandra has an ability that has never been in reds part of the color pie before.
Anyone care to guess what said ability is?
He said the idea came from his Tumblr account. To me the most interesting abilities that I saw discussed there were temporary turns and temporary card draw.
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There are 10 types of people in this world, those that understand binary and those that don't.
1RRChandra, _____________
Starting Loyalty 3
[+1] Deal 2 damage to each player. (Could be more realistic at 1dmg?)
[-2] Deal 4 damage to target creature (Pseudo Mizzium Mortars?)
[-6] or -7? Deal 5 damage to target player and 5 damage to each creature that player controls. Wabam Hellfire to all the tokens and hexproof.
Also just saw her one of her abilities is outside Red. Well For design sake I hope it's full of flavor, that is the most important thing in magic after all is said and done. Really Interested now.
It's somewhat realistic if they aren't hoping to make a name for Red Walkers off the kitchen table. Eitherway, Liliana was ridiculously popular, proving 3 mana walkers can BE something close to broken. She's an expensive lass. Chandra needs some love now. I love Red, I love Blue. So lets have Jace, Chandra, and Ral all on the same side. That's a deck I can get behind.
He said the idea came from his Tumblr account. To me the most interesting abilities that I saw discussed there were temporary turns and temporary card draw.
I was thinking along the lines of Ideas Unbound but that seems too powerful. It's just a 'draw a bunch of cards' activation if you can cast those spells. Wait.. That'd be awesome. btw it was probably from a Tumblr discussion long ago
I think to make it work it would have to be linked to the casting of instants and souceries.
I think it being a green ability is out, 1. Domri just came out 2. i'd be pretty pissed of if they are taking away chandra's spell based play and making it creature based.
What about black?.... "If an instant or sorcery delt damage to a player this turn return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand".. basically pheonix for anything... good conditional card advantage. that is both creature and spell related.
Blue seems most obvious since it is where a lot of new red mechanics come from... but I kind of don't think so.
White well they have land destruction in common but what white ability also works with red that isn't creature based.... I can't think of any... again it better be spell based.
inconclusion I think it is more likely to be from black or blue than the other colours
I think to make it work it would have to be linked to the casting of instants and souceries.
I think it being a green ability is out, 1. Domri just came out 2. i'd be pretty pissed of if they are taking away chandra's spell based play and making it creature based.
What about black?.... "If an instant or sorcery delt damage to a player this turn return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand".. basically pheonix for anything... good conditional card advantage. that is both creature and spell related.
Blue seems most obvious since it is where a lot of new red mechanics come from... but I kind of don't think so.
White well they have land destruction in common but what white ability also works with red that isn't creature based.... I can't think of any... again it better be spell based.
inconclusion I think it is more likely to be from black or blue than the other colours
Chandra will still be mono red.
Thus, it will be an ability that makes sense in red, but has never appeared on a red card before.
Recursion is right out, because red has had that since the first Phoenix way back in legends.
Non-damaging creature removal is also out due to Fissure.
Enchantment removal is out, due to it not being something red can deal with.
Card draw is out as red has had it since, well Flare and the other cantrips.
Extra turns is out because of Final Fortune.
Not that this narrows it down much. But it helps a bit.
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Oh so the actual quote was "never on a red card before"? rather than something that is outside reds colour pie.
That kind of makes me think it is almost to the level on never on a card before an actual new or almost new idea.... Kind of like how Doran, the siege tower was a completely new idea.
If it is that splashy it has to be her ultimate and consequentially it doesn't matter a whole lot.
Sure is taking awhile for our planeswalkers to be spoiled. I myself would love Jace, Memory Adept with different art. Really the hooded Jace is what made him so mysterious. Jace from RtR was good, I am still unsure about his flavor though, he is more versatile though. I really cannot wait to see new Chandra. I hope she is not a let down. This thread is a bit inactive now though seeing as how we are all just waiting for her any day now x)
Chandra, the legacy walker RRR
loyalty 3
+1 add RRto mana pool, if this mana isnt used for an instant or sorcery you take 2 damage at the beginning of the end phase
-2 chandra. deals 4 damage to target creature or 2 damage to target player.
-7 you get an emblem that says: whenever an instant or sorcery that you control would deal damage, that instant or sorcery would deal double 1 more damage to its target.
pushed, but not broken,
+1 allows you to still play the cards you want to be playing on your turn in a RDW shell,
-2 is protection that can also fit what chandra does which is burn players
ultimate is good, but not nearly as broken as people have been posting.
chandra is a pyromancer,
she isnt going to loot
she isnt going to take creatures
she isnt going to pump up your own creatures
she cares about burning people and their creatures.
she is s streamlined walker
Chandra, CARDNAME1RR
Planeswalker - Chandra
+1: ~ deals 2 damage to each player that doesn't control a basic Mountain.
-3: Target instant or sorcery with converted mana cost 3 or less in a graveyard gains Flashback 0 until end of turn.
-8: Search your library for any number of instants or sorceries and put them into your graveyard, then shuffle your library. You get an emblem with "Instants and sorceries in your graveyard have Flashback. Their flashback cost is equal to their mana cost."
3
Chandra, CARDNAME1RR
Planeswalker - Chandra
+1: ~ deals 2 damage to each player that doesn't control a basic Mountain.
-3: Target instant or sorcery with converted mana cost 3 or less in a graveyard gains Flashback 0 until end of turn.
-8: Search your library for any number of instants or sorceries and put them into your graveyard, then shuffle your library. You get an emblem with "Instants and sorceries in your graveyard have Flashback. Their flashback cost is equal to their mana cost."
3
Won't be flashback either, not only does it already exist in red, it is not in M14 from what we've seen.
It would be a nice Chandra however.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
I always thought that green ramps and white has some small ramping with other effects that make you not miss land drops like land tax. saying that I also thought since w/g are allies and share that and there are lots of gold/hybrid cards in r/g that ramp why should red get something like "search lib for mountain/land and put it in your hand".
mayby new chandra will have that ability with deal damage to creature equal to lands under your control stuck on it.
I always thought that green ramps and white has some small ramping with other effects that make you not miss land drops like land tax. saying that I also thought since w/g are allies and share that and there are lots of gold/hybrid cards in r/g that ramp why should red get something like "search lib for mountain/land and put it in your hand".
mayby new chandra will have that ability with deal damage to creature equal to lands under your control stuck on it.
But that's not really in red's flavor of shortsightedness either. Besides, it's more fitting of a Geomancer like Koth, than a Pyromancer like Chandra.
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The ability to target hexproof creatures might also make sense given the whole fire, heat, and bright light thing.
A damage ability that can hit any creature. I like this a LOT. If she had this, she would be played in modern if her cost was good. If it got past shroud which is unlikley, WOW, ultimate pyromancer chandra would be.
1RR
+1: return target instant or sorcery from gy to your hand
-2: pyroclasm
-6: you gain an emblem: "instants and sorceries you cast has storm"
Loyalty: 3
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LEGACY:
G Combo Elves G GW Maverick WG GWR Punishing Maverick RWG GWB Dark Maverick BWG RUG RUG Delver GUR UWR Miracles RWU
MODERN: G Coco Elves G
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No kidding. Most of the 3 cmc suggested walker designs would realistically cost 5+ cmc, or would be unprintable.
this is heading into tibalt's territory.
remember, they are trying to move towards giving each planeswalker an identity, not a bunch of generic abilities from that color (eg tezz is an artificer whereas jace is a mind mage; garruk is a beast summoner while nissa is some kind of elf champion; elspeth is a knight whilst ajani is more of a shaman)
for chandra to maintain her identity she needs to be a pyromancer
Chandra the Playable 1RR
Planeswalker - Chandra
+1: Chandra deals 2 damage to target player and 1 damage to you
-2: Chandra deals X damage to each creature, where X is Chandra's loyalty
-7: Search your library for 3 red instant or sorcery cards. You may cast those cards without paying their mana cost
starting loyalty: 3
Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
Honestly, I loved the direction with planeswalkers that WOTC went with Sarkhan the Mad, but it was a little under-designed.
However, I think you can constitute some of those mechanics into a viable Chandra.
I'm thinking:
Chandra 4.0 - 1RR
0: Draw a card, then discard a card. Chandra deals damage to herself equal to the converted mana cost of the card discarded this way.
-2: Chandra deals 3 damage to target creature or player.
+3: You get an emblem with "Whenever a red instant or sorcery spell you control deals damage to a player, double it." Activate this ability only if Chandra has exactly 1 loyalty counter.
<4>
It's a start.
Anyone care to guess what said ability is?
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
"Return target instant or sorcery from a graveyard to its owner's hand" as the minus ability?
@ Flop - I don't think "+2: deals 2 damage to each player" is out of the question. If you're going with a targeted Shock on a three mana planeswalker it should be more along the lines of an Orcish Artillery activation. (+1: deals 2 damage to a target and 3 to you)
I wouldn't say that's never been part of red's color identity before. Anarchist does something similar, and that's just off the top of my head. Although I can't think of anything that allows you to return somebody else's sorcery to his/her hand.
... or a reason you'd want to do that.
He said it's something red's never done before and it came from his tumblr. I spent a bunch of time looking for it yesterday and gave up. It was really frustrating because I vaguely remember the post (I remember thinking the idea was really interesting and there were a lot of positive comments about it) but I don't remember when it was. It was during one of those stretches when the tumblr audience was obsessed with finding red more mechanics. Hopefully somebody will find it.
mine didn't hit creatures though, so it wasn't necessarily as good (or bad) as the artillery.
also, it was more to illustrate a point about walkers being more thematic than a bunch of abilities from the color being thrown together
Niv-Mizzet Ramp 'n' Wheel
Godo: Strap him up and turn him sideways!
He said the idea came from his Tumblr account. To me the most interesting abilities that I saw discussed there were temporary turns and temporary card draw.
Tiamat, Chromatic Dragon RWUBG
Planeswalker - Tiamat
[+1] Sit on Nicol Bolas
[+0] Wait for him to beg for mercy, rule the multiverse.
[-7] Not necessary, she is the ultimate.
Starting Loyalty 3
[+1] Deal 2 damage to each player. (Could be more realistic at 1dmg?)
[-2] Deal 4 damage to target creature (Pseudo Mizzium Mortars?)
[-6] or -7? Deal 5 damage to target player and 5 damage to each creature that player controls. Wabam Hellfire to all the tokens and hexproof.
Also just saw her one of her abilities is outside Red. Well For design sake I hope it's full of flavor, that is the most important thing in magic after all is said and done. Really Interested now.
It's somewhat realistic if they aren't hoping to make a name for Red Walkers off the kitchen table. Eitherway, Liliana was ridiculously popular, proving 3 mana walkers can BE something close to broken. She's an expensive lass. Chandra needs some love now. I love Red, I love Blue. So lets have Jace, Chandra, and Ral all on the same side. That's a deck I can get behind.
I was thinking along the lines of Ideas Unbound but that seems too powerful. It's just a 'draw a bunch of cards' activation if you can cast those spells. Wait.. That'd be awesome. btw it was probably from a Tumblr discussion long ago
I think to make it work it would have to be linked to the casting of instants and souceries.
I think it being a green ability is out, 1. Domri just came out 2. i'd be pretty pissed of if they are taking away chandra's spell based play and making it creature based.
What about black?.... "If an instant or sorcery delt damage to a player this turn return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand".. basically pheonix for anything... good conditional card advantage. that is both creature and spell related.
Blue seems most obvious since it is where a lot of new red mechanics come from... but I kind of don't think so.
White well they have land destruction in common but what white ability also works with red that isn't creature based.... I can't think of any... again it better be spell based.
inconclusion I think it is more likely to be from black or blue than the other colours
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
Chandra will still be mono red.
Thus, it will be an ability that makes sense in red, but has never appeared on a red card before.
Recursion is right out, because red has had that since the first Phoenix way back in legends.
Non-damaging creature removal is also out due to Fissure.
Enchantment removal is out, due to it not being something red can deal with.
Card draw is out as red has had it since, well Flare and the other cantrips.
Extra turns is out because of Final Fortune.
Not that this narrows it down much. But it helps a bit.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
That kind of makes me think it is almost to the level on never on a card before an actual new or almost new idea.... Kind of like how Doran, the siege tower was a completely new idea.
If it is that splashy it has to be her ultimate and consequentially it doesn't matter a whole lot.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
RRR
loyalty 3
+1 add RRto mana pool, if this mana isnt used for an instant or sorcery you take 2 damage at the beginning of the end phase
-2 chandra. deals 4 damage to target creature or 2 damage to target player.
-7 you get an emblem that says: whenever an instant or sorcery that you control would deal damage, that instant or sorcery would deal double 1 more damage to its target.
pushed, but not broken,
+1 allows you to still play the cards you want to be playing on your turn in a RDW shell,
-2 is protection that can also fit what chandra does which is burn players
ultimate is good, but not nearly as broken as people have been posting.
chandra is a pyromancer,
she isnt going to loot
she isnt going to take creatures
she isnt going to pump up your own creatures
she cares about burning people and their creatures.
she is s streamlined walker
this could be as simple as "destroy target creature"
doesnt red normally have damage based removal and no destroy effects unless with black?
It's an ability that red has not haved before, thus "destroy target creature" is out due to Fissure and Aftershock.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Planeswalker - Chandra
+1: ~ deals 2 damage to each player that doesn't control a basic Mountain.
-3: Target instant or sorcery with converted mana cost 3 or less in a graveyard gains Flashback 0 until end of turn.
-8: Search your library for any number of instants or sorceries and put them into your graveyard, then shuffle your library. You get an emblem with "Instants and sorceries in your graveyard have Flashback. Their flashback cost is equal to their mana cost."
3
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Won't be flashback either, not only does it already exist in red, it is not in M14 from what we've seen.
It would be a nice Chandra however.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
mayby new chandra will have that ability with deal damage to creature equal to lands under your control stuck on it.
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But that's not really in red's flavor of shortsightedness either. Besides, it's more fitting of a Geomancer like Koth, than a Pyromancer like Chandra.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Tiamat, Chromatic Dragon RWUBG
Planeswalker - Tiamat
[+1] Sit on Nicol Bolas
[+0] Wait for him to beg for mercy, rule the multiverse.
[-7] Not necessary, she is the ultimate.
A damage ability that can hit any creature. I like this a LOT. If she had this, she would be played in modern if her cost was good. If it got past shroud which is unlikley, WOW, ultimate pyromancer chandra would be.
+1: return target instant or sorcery from gy to your hand
-2: pyroclasm
-6: you gain an emblem: "instants and sorceries you cast has storm"
Loyalty: 3
G Combo Elves G
GW Maverick WG
GWR Punishing Maverick RWG
GWB Dark Maverick BWG
RUG RUG Delver GUR
UWR Miracles RWU
MODERN:
G Coco Elves G