There looks like there's a lot of buzz about the Phyrexian text on Elesh Norn and in the video's WoTC is putting out. Appareantly WoTC hired a linguist to create a language, I'm assuming Phyrexian is what he came up with.
Do you think they'll print cards in Phyrexian? I really hope so and from the looks of the arcana spoiling Elesh Norn, I wouldn't doubt they're going to.
EDIT: After watching the video, I think it may be harder than it seems. I doubt it will be possible to get a direct to english translation at the moment. There is some more text in the video which may help.
The numbers and the horizontal lines stick out and are pretty easy to understand. If you look at the name of the card, the horizontal line starting the sentence has a little line beside the main line to it's left. I wonder if that indicates nouns.
It's nothing personal, but the punctuation bit is not even marginally complex and does nothing to help the overall cracking of it. There is also absolutely no need for any hivemind to try to crack it since we will have a decent cipher in less than a month's time. I'm really interested to see just how much information they give us about this language. Supposedly, they have gone to great lengths to create this language so I'm interested in seeing to what lengths they go in teaching it.
I really wish the Phyrexian speech in the videos wasn't so heavily distorted; it's impossible to make out any sort of recognizable phonemes, it all ends up as gargled noise. But apparently there are actual words being spoken underneath that; I wish so bad we could hear some clean, clear examples of Phyrexian speech.
Nah. The symbol itself is a letter you can see a few times on Norn's card. Though I suppose it would be believable if the letter/symbol had a cultural meaning of "all will be one" in addition to being a letter by itself.
Well, it is easy to create a language. The hard part is creating a useful language. Creating a simple conlang is the sort of thing students do in Linguistics 101 courses as in-class exercises (then again, my Linguistics 101 prof may have been abnormal...). Given half an hour it wouldn't be difficult to hammer out a rudimentary lexicon and some basic grammar.
The impressive thing here is that it's clearly not just the basics. It would have been so incredibly easy for WotC to just come up with a typeface and treat Phyrexian as a cypher of English text, but they didn't. They put in the work needed to pull a conlang up from the simple "in-class exercise" variety to something fairly sophisticated, and that takes dedication. A Phyrexian Elesh Norn will be just as readable to a Japanese-speaking player as it will be to a German or English-speaking player, and that tweaks my language-geek sensibilities so hard it's not even funny.
As for the language itself, here's something interesting. Someone pointed out that the Phyrexian symbol (the O with the line through it) is created simply by drawing a circle along the line of Phyrexian script. I noticed, however, that this symbol isn't just used to refer to Phyrexians. It's not used in Elesh Norn's card name, nor is it used in the line that, I assume, corresponds to her Vigilance. Instead, it is used in two abilities referring to creatures (although in different ways), as well as two sentences of flavor text referring to the Gitaxians and their thoughts of other worlds. Given what we know of the Phyrexian culture, it is likely that this symbol is used to indicate groups of people or things, and that the sentence construction and other symbols then describe the nature of those groups in more detail - "Those people over there who have not yet been compleated", "these zombie servants of Phyrexia of whom I am currently in command", etc.
Higher resolution of the typeface would be really nice too; there are some marks that are hard to tell if they are the same as one another or slightly different. I wait with baited breath for a future article detailing all the specifics.
Higher resolution of the typeface would be really nice too; there are some marks that are hard to tell if they are the same as one another or slightly different. I wait with baited breath for a future article detailing all the specifics.
That's probably just our unfamiliarity with the language more than anything. Imagine trying to tell apart I, i, and l without ever having seen a Latin-based alphabet before. Or google image search "Chinese newspaper" and check out some of the results for a similar experience - it can be hard as hell spotting the differences between two characters in an unfamiliar script, but for a hypothetical "Phyrexian-as-first-language" speaker, this typeface might not be problematic at all.
Of course, a Kindergarten version of the typeface would be a nice learning tool
Perhaps. At this size, though, I can't really tell if the first "apostrophe" in Norn's name is the same symbol as the second one or not. It looks to me like they are at slightly different angles, but otherwise shaped the same; I have no idea what that means. If I learned the language, I'm sure I could tell them apart just fine (or not if they're the same). But for now, it's driving me nuts staring at all these lines and not knowing what they mean. :<
Wouldn't it be rather wierd to print cards in a non-excisting language? It's not going to make the game any clearer to anyone. It will just cause confusion among players.
It would be a cool little gimmick but personally I think it would be stretching it to much.
It's only a problem if they don't also print those cards in existing languages. They would also have to label sources of Phyrexian-language cards clearly.
On the other hand, it's also not an issue if they just print all of the Mythics in Phyrexian by default as far as I'm concerned. It's not that hard to remember what mythics do.
I am VERY excited to see who among us will actually learn the language (assuming the tools we are given are sophisticated enough for to achieve fluency). A lot of people claim they will, but it will be interesting to see exactly who is a bad enough Vorthos to save the president. I'm concerned that this is going to consume my entire being even more so than MtG already has for the last 15 years. I'm glad I'm not one of the many who judges people who learn Klingon because I'm about to be an honorary member of that most elite of nerd cliches.
Well this is what i want out of it: I want to be able to actually use the language, so i can put my name in Phyrexian anywhere
Wake up and find not only a thread like this, but to see I was quoted in it. :]
Fun fact, whenever I Learn this language I'm getting something in the language tattooed some where on me.
It may be worth pointing out that if you hit "Translate", a list of languages appear shortly afterwords, one of which is a Phyrexian version of, what's safe to say, "Phyrexia". Good starting point? Also, kudos to anyone willing to put in the time and energy to learn Phyrexian. I'll be trying to keep up ;D
It will be great when someone figures out how to construct a legit Phyrexian sentence which, when recorded and played backwards sounds like someone saying "I heart Satan."
And then the congressional hearings begin.
It'll be like Unholy Strength all over again!
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Haha, only now did I realize that the Phyrexian symbol most likely originated from the Greek letter Phi (Φ uppercase, ϕ lower case). Φ for Φyrexia
So I thought it was cute that the whole language they used involves a vertical line through it, just like the Phyrexian symbol. This means that without the required vertical line, the Phyrexian symbol is only left with a circle. And usually, a circle means the "whole." Thus, I can totally see this symbol used in their language in short hand as an expression of either the Phyrexian world, or all of Phyrexia (kind of like the Japanese using the Kanji Chinese characters for short hand).
And heck, although this symbol was used in old Phyrexia before this whole Mirrodin thing, it wouldn't be inconceivable that this symbol of wholeness can now be used as "All Will be One."
Nah. The symbol itself is a letter you can see a few times on Norn's card. Though I suppose it would be believable if the letter/symbol had a cultural meaning of "all will be one" in addition to being a letter by itself.
Probable. Just consider Alpha and Omega and their cultural meaning as representations of a beginning or end or X as something myterious or anormal.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
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Wouldn't it be rather wierd to print cards in a non-excisting language? It's not going to make the game any clearer to anyone. It will just cause confusion among players.
It would be a cool little gimmick but personally I think it would be stretching it to much.
No more confusing than printing cards in other foreign languages. You are allowed to run foreign cards even if no one present speaks the language.
I just don't think there would be enough demand to print them like this.
http://wizards.com/Magic/Magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/stf/118
Do you think they'll print cards in Phyrexian? I really hope so and from the looks of the arcana spoiling Elesh Norn, I wouldn't doubt they're going to.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showpost.php?p=6531772&postcount=185
EDIT: After watching the video, I think it may be harder than it seems. I doubt it will be possible to get a direct to english translation at the moment. There is some more text in the video which may help.
Bravo wizards. Creating a language isn't easy.
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Well, it is easy to create a language. The hard part is creating a useful language. Creating a simple conlang is the sort of thing students do in Linguistics 101 courses as in-class exercises (then again, my Linguistics 101 prof may have been abnormal...). Given half an hour it wouldn't be difficult to hammer out a rudimentary lexicon and some basic grammar.
The impressive thing here is that it's clearly not just the basics. It would have been so incredibly easy for WotC to just come up with a typeface and treat Phyrexian as a cypher of English text, but they didn't. They put in the work needed to pull a conlang up from the simple "in-class exercise" variety to something fairly sophisticated, and that takes dedication. A Phyrexian Elesh Norn will be just as readable to a Japanese-speaking player as it will be to a German or English-speaking player, and that tweaks my language-geek sensibilities so hard it's not even funny.
As for the language itself, here's something interesting. Someone pointed out that the Phyrexian symbol (the O with the line through it) is created simply by drawing a circle along the line of Phyrexian script. I noticed, however, that this symbol isn't just used to refer to Phyrexians. It's not used in Elesh Norn's card name, nor is it used in the line that, I assume, corresponds to her Vigilance. Instead, it is used in two abilities referring to creatures (although in different ways), as well as two sentences of flavor text referring to the Gitaxians and their thoughts of other worlds. Given what we know of the Phyrexian culture, it is likely that this symbol is used to indicate groups of people or things, and that the sentence construction and other symbols then describe the nature of those groups in more detail - "Those people over there who have not yet been compleated", "these zombie servants of Phyrexia of whom I am currently in command", etc.
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
That's probably just our unfamiliarity with the language more than anything. Imagine trying to tell apart I, i, and l without ever having seen a Latin-based alphabet before. Or google image search "Chinese newspaper" and check out some of the results for a similar experience - it can be hard as hell spotting the differences between two characters in an unfamiliar script, but for a hypothetical "Phyrexian-as-first-language" speaker, this typeface might not be problematic at all.
Of course, a Kindergarten version of the typeface would be a nice learning tool
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
It's only a problem if they don't also print those cards in existing languages. They would also have to label sources of Phyrexian-language cards clearly.
On the other hand, it's also not an issue if they just print all of the Mythics in Phyrexian by default as far as I'm concerned. It's not that hard to remember what mythics do.
My Blog About It
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
Wake up and find not only a thread like this, but to see I was quoted in it. :]
Fun fact, whenever I Learn this language I'm getting something in the language tattooed some where on me.
And then the congressional hearings begin.
It'll be like Unholy Strength all over again!
For FNM reports, Legacy reports and commentary: http://justindz.tumblr.com
So I thought it was cute that the whole language they used involves a vertical line through it, just like the Phyrexian symbol. This means that without the required vertical line, the Phyrexian symbol is only left with a circle. And usually, a circle means the "whole." Thus, I can totally see this symbol used in their language in short hand as an expression of either the Phyrexian world, or all of Phyrexia (kind of like the Japanese using the Kanji Chinese characters for short hand).
And heck, although this symbol was used in old Phyrexia before this whole Mirrodin thing, it wouldn't be inconceivable that this symbol of wholeness can now be used as "All Will be One."
Have is say "All will be One" across your back along with the Phyrexian Symbol ( ϕ ) underneath it.
Probable. Just consider Alpha and Omega and their cultural meaning as representations of a beginning or end or X as something myterious or anormal.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
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I just don't think there would be enough demand to print them like this.