I'd like to know why there are'nt any mythic lands in ZEN. Grated there are no other mythic lands but this set was supposedly land theamed so you would think that if they're gonna print a Artifact, Planeswalker, Instant, Creature, and a OCTOPUS that they would make a mythic land. WWK and RotE are'nt out granted but unless its a mythic manland (would be awesome) I dont think they are going to print one. Would anybody like to shed a little more light on this conundrum?
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In an eight player game, is anything good? Don't you just sit there countering combos until someone genesis waves for 42 after all the blue players tap out fighting over a bribery?
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The problem with printing a mythic land is that based on the history of lands, they either end up unplayable or staples in most cases. Now, something like Dark Depths would be a mythic land. It packs a rediculous amount of potential, but is no where near staple. I'd say it's a good model for the theoretical mythic land that will come around some day.
The problem with printing a mythic land is that based on the history of lands, they either end up unplayable or staples in most cases. Now, something like Dark Depths would be a mythic land. It packs a rediculous amount of potential, but is no where near staple. I'd say it's a good model for the theoretical mythic land that will come around some day.
yes, thats a good example, without hexmage hax that is. lands don't have to be either staples or unplayable, though.
Because lands have such a narrow primary purpose -- to produce mana -- the design space for mythic lands is extremely small. (As opposed to mythic creatures, for which there's an exceedingly huge amount of design space.)
In order to print a land at mythic, it needs to have a mythic-feeling effect, and not be a utility card (more difficult since any deck can run any land), and have a proper flavor justification, and not be the sort of card R&D wants to bump down to rare given how it'll be played.
I wouldn't say it's impossible to meet all those standards, but it's pretty unlikely. The only land I can think of offhand that might qualify out of existing cards is Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth.
Because lands have such a narrow primary purpose -- to produce mana -- the design space for mythic lands is extremely small. (As opposed to mythic creatures, for which there's an exceedingly huge amount of design space.)
In order to print a land at mythic, it needs to have a mythic-feeling effect, and not be a utility card (more difficult since any deck can run any land), and have a proper flavor justification, and not be the sort of card R&D wants to bump down to rare given how it'll be played.
I wouldn't say it's impossible to meet all those standards, but it's pretty unlikely. The only land I can think of offhand that might qualify out of existing cards is Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth.
This is just an example of what they could do that would indeed not suck and would be quite flavorful for WWK. I don't want to hear about if its overpowered or not just saying that they could do it and I would most certinly approve.
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This is just an example of what they could do that would indeed not suck and would be quite flavorful for WWK. I don't want to hear about if its overpowered or not just saying that they could do it and I would most certinly approve.
Woah TYVM for 5 mana on turn 2 in any deck and a 6/6 beater on turn 3. Plus for S&G its a Locus. Doesn't seem broken at all, not one bit.
Woah TYVM for 5 mana on turn 2 in any deck and a 6/6 beater on turn 3. Plus for S&G its a Locus. Doesn't seem broken at all, not one bit.
UM 3 mana turn 2 and 6/6 beater turn 6 weather you have two of them or not.
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Really? I think those are definitely utility cards. There's nothing big or splashy about those, especially the Library which makes colorless mana and can go in any deck, which is kind of the definition of utility...
I was thinking more of the flavor aspect, and if for some god awful reason they where reprinted their reputation would move them to auto include mythic.
I don't see how Dark Depths isn't utility... Isn't utility "can fit in any deck" and "can perform a winning purpose"? It doesn't take any specific kind of mana or anything special to do it's thing. (Though it's a lot more useful/beneficial if you're playing the combo deck.)
I understand that without Hexmage it isn't good (outside of EDH, that is... I really enjoyed DD in my Azusa deck) but doesn't it still perform well regardless? I would almost put Dark Depths in any Tron deck as a one of. Is my definition of utility wrong, or am I missing something?
Do you consider Strip Mine utility? Or can it be mythic?
Typically, I agree with Killax. But I think that the Epic spells from Saviors could have been Mythic if they were tweaked a little bit, and I would agree that (regardless of their uselessness) they could be Mythic (perhaps if they were all significantly cheaper?)
In an eight player game, is anything good? Don't you just sit there countering combos until someone genesis waves for 42 after all the blue players tap out fighting over a bribery?
Megabug:
Tap two lands, play your land, tap it = 5 mana on turn 3. See Lotus Vale on how to make it more fair.
I can see other potential mythic lands.
Easy ones are token generating lands, just like this one which is just a shift of Dragon Roost to a land.
Dragon Brood Cave
Land
Dragon Brood Cave enters the battlefield tapped. T: Add R to your mana pool. 5RR,T: Put a 5/5 Dragon Token with Flying into play.
Token Generating lands can qualify if they make an impressive enough token, which is sorta a cop-out to make a land mythic because of the creature token. The lands are by nature "utility cards" Maro already said we are using the word utility card too loosely, he means that he would never make a mythic Disenchant that only costs W. The one thing about mythics is that they tend to be limited mostly by cost, and since lands generally have no cost and its slightly counter intuitive for a land to have a large cost, it's unlikely to see a mythic land with an awesome ability that is free. The more likely scenario as shown above is that the ability is restricted by a large cost; a real example would be Dark Depths.
mythic lands are boring for one. another reason is inorder for a land to be mythic it has to be really powerful. Not likely to see those again.
So like Valakut and Oran Rief? Emeria? And Crypt is fair, in it's own deck. Let's be honest. Magosi has a very narrow use (in that one jank extended deck with Rings of Brighthearth)
To be honest, I think Lands have the design space for being Mythic, but it's a lot more complicated to do. You have to let it's playability be narrowed (because otherwise it could go in any deck, and therefore be utility). "When ~ enters the battlefield, you must control 2 Red permanents." Or something of the sort. The design space is there, it's just significantly harder to tap into because of your limitations of text.
In an eight player game, is anything good? Don't you just sit there countering combos until someone genesis waves for 42 after all the blue players tap out fighting over a bribery?
Megabug:
Tap two lands, play your land, tap it = 5 mana on turn 3. See Lotus Vale on how to make it more fair.
I can see other potential mythic lands.
Easy ones are token generating lands, just like this one which is just a shift of Dragon Roost to a land.
Dragon Brood Cave
Land
Dragon Cave enters the battlefield tapped. T: Add R to your mana pool. 5RR,T: Put a 5/5 Dragon Token with Flying into play.
Token Generating lands can qualify if they make an impressive enough token, which is sorta a cop-out to make a land mythic because of the creature token. The lands are by nature "utility cards" Maro already said we are using the word utility card too loosely, he means that he would never make a mythic Disenchant that only costs W. The one thing about mythics is that they tend to be limited mostly by cost, and since lands generally have no cost and its slightly counter intuitive for a land to have a large cost, it's unlikely to see a mythic land with an awesome ability that is free. The more likely scenario as shown above is that the ability is restricted by a large cost; a real example would be Dark Depths.
I really like your idea for the Mythic Land, however, the problem is that this card pretty much all ready exists (although with some tweaks, like you don't have to tap it) as an Enchantment (which I'm sure you knew, and I feel like an idiot for saying this since the card name is in your card's name) but the thing about Mythic is that you can make it better than that. I would simply take the 'tap' requirement out of it, and it would be unplayed and great.
In an eight player game, is anything good? Don't you just sit there countering combos until someone genesis waves for 42 after all the blue players tap out fighting over a bribery?
Simply making a good land legendary usually reduces the demand for it even if it's playable (see pendlehaven, Academy Ruins). So even at mythic, those wouldn't have ridiculous prices since they are one or two ofs at most. Also see, Tomb of Whathisname from Kamigawa. Arena definitely could have been a good mythic.
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yes, thats a good example, without hexmage hax that is. lands don't have to be either staples or unplayable, though.
In order to print a land at mythic, it needs to have a mythic-feeling effect, and not be a utility card (more difficult since any deck can run any land), and have a proper flavor justification, and not be the sort of card R&D wants to bump down to rare given how it'll be played.
I wouldn't say it's impossible to meet all those standards, but it's pretty unlikely. The only land I can think of offhand that might qualify out of existing cards is Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth.
EDIT: Oh, Dark Depths would probably work too.
Others Include Library of Alexandria and Bazaar of Baghdad
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Woah TYVM for 5 mana on turn 2 in any deck and a 6/6 beater on turn 3. Plus for S&G its a Locus. Doesn't seem broken at all, not one bit.
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UM 3 mana turn 2 and 6/6 beater turn 6 weather you have two of them or not.
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Really? I think those are definitely utility cards. There's nothing big or splashy about those, especially the Library which makes colorless mana and can go in any deck, which is kind of the definition of utility...
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=532795
I understand that without Hexmage it isn't good (outside of EDH, that is... I really enjoyed DD in my Azusa deck) but doesn't it still perform well regardless? I would almost put Dark Depths in any Tron deck as a one of. Is my definition of utility wrong, or am I missing something?
Do you consider Strip Mine utility? Or can it be mythic?
Typically, I agree with Killax. But I think that the Epic spells from Saviors could have been Mythic if they were tweaked a little bit, and I would agree that (regardless of their uselessness) they could be Mythic (perhaps if they were all significantly cheaper?)
Thanks to DarkNightCavalier
Tap two lands, play your land, tap it = 5 mana on turn 3. See Lotus Vale on how to make it more fair.
I can see other potential mythic lands.
Easy ones are token generating lands, just like this one which is just a shift of Dragon Roost to a land.
Dragon Brood Cave
Land
Dragon Brood Cave enters the battlefield tapped.
T: Add R to your mana pool.
5RR,T: Put a 5/5 Dragon Token with Flying into play.
Token Generating lands can qualify if they make an impressive enough token, which is sorta a cop-out to make a land mythic because of the creature token. The lands are by nature "utility cards" Maro already said we are using the word utility card too loosely, he means that he would never make a mythic Disenchant that only costs W. The one thing about mythics is that they tend to be limited mostly by cost, and since lands generally have no cost and its slightly counter intuitive for a land to have a large cost, it's unlikely to see a mythic land with an awesome ability that is free. The more likely scenario as shown above is that the ability is restricted by a large cost; a real example would be Dark Depths.
So like Valakut and Oran Rief? Emeria? And Crypt is fair, in it's own deck. Let's be honest. Magosi has a very narrow use (in that one jank extended deck with Rings of Brighthearth)
To be honest, I think Lands have the design space for being Mythic, but it's a lot more complicated to do. You have to let it's playability be narrowed (because otherwise it could go in any deck, and therefore be utility). "When ~ enters the battlefield, you must control 2 Red permanents." Or something of the sort. The design space is there, it's just significantly harder to tap into because of your limitations of text.
Thanks to DarkNightCavalier
I really like your idea for the Mythic Land, however, the problem is that this card pretty much all ready exists (although with some tweaks, like you don't have to tap it) as an Enchantment (which I'm sure you knew, and I feel like an idiot for saying this since the card name is in your card's name) but the thing about Mythic is that you can make it better than that. I would simply take the 'tap' requirement out of it, and it would be unplayed and great.
Thanks to DarkNightCavalier
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