There is no argument, comparing a TV to a Magic card in terms of how people consider money/time/effort spent on acquiring them is idiotic.
You're still stuck on the tv bit, which was just an example being used for conversations sake. He could have said a bike, an xbox, a playstation, a cake, it doesn't matter what the object/item is. His point is that if a cake or a bike or an Xbox had a 25% price drop, you might be bummed or have buyers remorse, but in the end you come to terms with a price drop, and don't feel entitled to have the manufacturer of the item to refund you on your loss.
But you're right. Comparing TVs and magic cards is something that shouldn't be compared, which is why 4 pieces of cardboard shouldn't cost more than your average tv. Wizards can sat what they want about not caring about the secondary market, but in the end it's a load of hooey. If wizards truly didn't care about the value of cards, then goyf would have been reprinted as a rare instead of a chase mythic, and the enemy fetches would have been in the new commander product. If they had put the fetches in the commander products and the flooded the market with copies of the product, it would probably be the best selling magic product they've ever had. Yes there's probably more reasons not to do that than there are to do it, but there's no reason to make goyf a chase mythic other than using it as a cash cow to sell product.
Of course it matters what the item is. How you keep missing this is highly amusing.
If the upcoming draft set isn't modern focused then what are the chances they use it to get EDH general foils out in the wild? The mana-fixing and synergy required to make a limited set that can respectably hand you rares/mythics like Zedruu the Greathearted or Sydri, Galvanic Genius and expect you to actually be able to use them would have to be pretty ludicrous but I think WOTC acknowledges the need to get these guys out in regular sized foils hence them showing up as Judge Promos - but Judges haaaaate getting foil generals as promos. Maybe the easier-to-play ones like Titania, Protector of Argoth could make an appearance and they could keep trying to sneak out Judge/GP promos of the others.
That said I kind of perceive this going more like Conspiracy and not having a very high reprint stock - if they're not focusing on Modern then maybe they'll just be trying to feed out some new EDH playables or walkers like Dack Fayden that have pretty overall competitive play use.
My info is that there will be an "eternal-masters" set and that it will have a higher msrp than mm2. What do you think about that?
It had best have Force of Will, Tarmo, Wasteland, Stoneforge and a bunch of MagicChristmasland stuff in it if I'm going to spend more than $10 a pack. I did some MMII drafts because it had the sweet Spirit draft archetype and that was a riot, but I'm not spending much on this if they reprint a bunch of crap like the Kamigawa dragons or Comet Storm etc.
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The "Crazy One", playing casual magic and occasionally dipping his toes into regular play since 1994.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
What if...
... what if...
.... this is WotC's solution to the Reserved List? Let's abolish it, but only make the cards previously on the list available in super-duper-ultimate-premium-rare-limited-release product that's priced accordingly? Perhaps after two Modern Masters sets, they've finally figured out how to properly reprint things without affecting the secondary price market too much (and that's by pricing a limited release set at a ridiculous price point).
Something tells me that if Eternal/Exceptional Masters isn't real and when we all find out it isn't the prices on a lot of Legacy/Vintage cards are going to shoot up, just like how Inquisition of Kozilek and fetches have done recently as soon as we found out they weren't getting reprinted.
That you don't understand why comparing TVs to collectible trading cards made by one company is pointless speaks volume about your grasp of the topic at hand.
You may want to consider that for yourself as well.
There is no argument, comparing a TV to a Magic card in terms of how people consider money/time/effort spent on acquiring them is idiotic.
Yeah, because neither of them have you putting in a bit of research to find what is best for you at the time, go to the store or going on the internet to buy them, and that both have prices that can drop wildly and randomly, but sure, yeah outside of those things they have no similarities at all. Yep, totally.
Of course it matters what the item is. How you keep missing this is highly amusing.
Yours is more amusing, unfortunately. I am not comparing the items directly, because yes that would be stupid, I am comparing how similar they can be in price and how they are known for their frequent and radical price changes, which has a rather nice parallel, but for some reason you are stuck on the objects more than the price similarities.
Everyone wants to play eternal formats, these special sets won't completely get you there. You will have to either trade up or spend money. It takes time and patience if you don't have the disposable income.... I don't understand why everyone complains about the supplemental sets not being enough to bridge the gap, it will never be enough.... Build one std deck and trade the rest away for Eternal Staples..... That's what I did and over years of playing magic I got what i needed.
I have not sympathy of whiners, sorry... Your not trying hard enough.
Everyone wants to play eternal formats, these special sets won't completely get you there. You will have to either trade up or spend money. It takes time and patience if you don't have the disposable income.... I don't understand why everyone complains about the supplemental sets not being enough to bridge the gap, it will never be enough.... Build one std deck and trade the rest away for Eternal Staples..... That's what I did and over years of playing magic I got what i needed.
I have not sympathy of whiners, sorry... Your not trying hard enough.
You don't find it a bit odd it takes years to get into a part of the game? That probably shouldn't be a thing. The cards will still have value, but for some reason those that play the format treat it like it is a country club, which is just strange. Also Standard decks right now are like cheap Legacy decks, so skip the middle man and just go straight to Legacy.
You are right though, any set won't perfectly get you into any format, but right now they are offering zero sets for Legacy/Vintage and those two formats have been dying slowly for a long time because of it, at the very least this will allow those sets to thrive a bit with new life being injected into it.
Everyone wants to play eternal formats, these special sets won't completely get you there. You will have to either trade up or spend money. It takes time and patience if you don't have the disposable income.... I don't understand why everyone complains about the supplemental sets not being enough to bridge the gap, it will never be enough.... Build one std deck and trade the rest away for Eternal Staples..... That's what I did and over years of playing magic I got what i needed.
I have not sympathy of whiners, sorry... Your not trying hard enough.
You don't find it a bit odd it takes years to get into a part of the game? That probably shouldn't be a thing. The cards will still have value, but for some reason those that play the format treat it like it is a country club, which is just strange. Also Standard decks right now are like cheap Legacy decks, so skip the middle man and just go straight to Legacy.
You are right though, any set won't perfectly get you into any format, but right now they are offering zero sets for Legacy/Vintage and those two formats have been dying slowly for a long time because of it, at the very least this will allow those sets to thrive a bit with new life being injected into it.
I don't find it weird at all, "usually" magic players don't jump into eternal formats right away.
I don't mind the the supplemental sets, I enjoy them. But to expect them to be the catch all to get into an eternal format is backwards thinking. These are cards that have been in print for years, it helps make them more available but that's it. You will still need to find a way to get the rest of the cards and most of them will be the most expensive (reserved list or didn't see a reprint). Complaining doesn't do anything but waste time, take action and go get the cards.....
Alright everyone, how about we go back on track before warnings start being handed out? Lay off on the TV analogy.
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
.... this is WotC's solution to the Reserved List? Let's abolish it, but only make the cards previously on the list available in super-duper-ultimate-premium-rare-limited-release product that's priced accordingly? Perhaps after two Modern Masters sets, they've finally figured out how to properly reprint things without affecting the secondary price market too much.
They have, in fact, cracked it.
It's called "not reprinting cards".
The Reserved List is sticking around for no other reason than it giving WotC an excuse to not reprint these cards.
Notice how Modern doesn't have a Reserved List, that being the reason the format was created in the first place and all, but still don't get cards reprinted?
The Reserved List was never the true obstacle to reprinting staples, WotC not wanting to reprint staples is.
That is unfortunately true. Even the cards not on the Reserved list that are played in Legacy/Vintage way back in the day they have the hardest troubles with reprinting, they just have some problem with reprinting cards.
When printing cards, there needs to be a reason it is included in a product. They could easily toss something like FOW in anything blue, but would it make sense? Should FOW been in Jace V. Chandra? It could have, but it makes no sense there. It would take away from the rest of the set. It would be FOW V. Who freaking cares? The problem with reprints is finding a good place to print them that doesn't overshadow the rest of the product and unless it is a reprint themed product not actually making it too heavily reprint oriented.
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All your base are belong to us!
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
The problem with reprints is finding a good place to print them that doesn't overshadow the rest of the product and unless it is a reprint themed product not actually making it too heavily reprint oriented.
They design the Duel Decks/Standard environment/Commander products, which means the only reason there's no relevant density of high-profile reprints in said products is because they don't want there to be.
It would have been a trivial affair to maintain a list of needed high-profile/high-cost reprints (and I'm sure they already do) and sculpt the products in question so that a reasonable subset of said reprints would make it in.
Instead they're all like "oh no, we're sooo sorry... we know it's the millionth block in a row that we didn't reprint any cards (let alone the one's that were really expected *cough*enemyfetches*cough*) but we just couldn't make it work. it's not like we design the products or anything, it's completely out of our hands... the set just didn't want any reprints! next time though, probably maybe. please buy more Standard chase mythics that'll be worthless in 15-18 months. ktxh!"
They just reprinted enemy fetches last set. And the block before it had ally fetches in two of the sets. Chill.
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MTGSalvation; Where the whining is a time honored tradition, and enjoying the game is trolling.
It would have been a trivial affair to maintain a list of needed high-profile/high-cost reprints (and I'm sure they already do) and sculpt the products in question so that a reasonable subset of said reprints would make it in.
Instead they're all like "oh no, we're sooo sorry... we know it's the millionth block in a row that we didn't reprint any cards (let alone the one's that were really expected *cough*enemyfetches*cough*) but we just couldn't make it work. it's not like we design the products or anything, it's completely out of our hands... the set just didn't want any reprints! next time though, probably maybe. please buy more Standard chase mythics that'll be worthless in 15-18 months. ktxh!"
So you think standard sets/environments should be sculpted around high-profile reprints?
Or they should put expensive high profile reprints in casual boxed product so that they are scooped up, dissected, and sold for parts?
The problem with reprints is that these are absolutely not good ways to do them and WoTC hasn't figured out a valid way to get the right amount of cards out there yet.
We don't need another standard environment that is all about a reprinted card like thoughtseize. We almost had that with a LotV reprint. Development does decide when and if a high profile reprint can happen, but they absolutely won't put one in if it requires bending the entire format, and altering other cards to allow the card to be reprinted and hopefully not dominate all of standard.
Besides, if LotV got reprinted, Siege Rhino would have a discard clause instead and not be the unholy terror it is today.
Also, enemy fetches were not really expected. At least by people following closely enough to things.
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News and spoiler contributor for GatheringMagic.com
They did not reprint the fetches in the last set. Reprint, as commonly used by players, is used to mean a card printed in a set that is part of the set and occurs up to a rarity of mythic. Expeditions were not part of the set, they are not legal for Standard, they are less common than mythic. They are no more a reprint than a judge foil or GP promo- a reprint in name only, not what people mean when they use the word reprint.....
A proper reprint of enemy fetches would go a long way towards quelling the irate player-base who wish to play older formats but cannot get in. It would not last very long, however, because as soon as fetches become cheaper the demand increases and the non-reprinted cards go up. Give me a market where fetches are 10-15 dollars, and I will show you a $350-500 Goyf.
One of the reasons people want to play the older formats is insulation from rotation, but it is a bit of a myth, a utopia that has not ever really existed. Only Legacy and Vintage have anything approaching stability (and an ever increasing set of staples), whilst bans and reprints keep the Modern market volatile (in the economic rather than scientific sense of the word). In my case its not rotation at all- I hate all the things that new players like (creatures, especially big ones, story and Planeswalkers), and like all the things that new players loathe (prison cards). I would consider playing Standard- when and if I can lock someone out of the game. Since that won't happen I will sit and make as much money as I can out of the Modern market by speculation and slowly convert spare cash into more Legacy decks, to keep my Legacy scene going. I bought my last MM2 box, sat on it sold it for 20 quid quick profit, sunk that into a good deal on Legacy staples. If it was really worth ripping I would have done so, but it was a poor, poor set for value. It did not draft that well either, and had mish mash cards like Daybreak Coronet that seemed to have no use.
The problem with reprints is finding a good place to print them that doesn't overshadow the rest of the product and unless it is a reprint themed product not actually making it too heavily reprint oriented.
They design the Duel Decks/Standard environment/Commander products, which means the only reason there's no relevant density of high-profile reprints in said products is because they don't want there to be.
It would have been a trivial affair to maintain a list of needed high-profile/high-cost reprints (and I'm sure they already do) and sculpt the products in question so that a reasonable subset of said reprints would make it in.
Instead they're all like "oh no, we're sooo sorry... we know it's the millionth block in a row that we didn't reprint any cards (let alone the one's that were really expected *cough*enemyfetches*cough*) but we just couldn't make it work. it's not like we design the products or anything, it's completely out of our hands... the set just didn't want any reprints! next time though, probably maybe. please buy more Standard chase mythics that'll be worthless in 15-18 months. ktxh!"
You are welcome to your opinion. But they do have to factor in many things when reprinting cards. It would be bad business to just reprint FOW or other mana drain in a big box store product. Things like that can't just go anywhere no matter how much you wish they could. How do you think printing FOW or Mana Drain in a VS. Deck would affect people who shelled out hundreds for FOW, or 200 for a single drain for their EDH deck? They would alienate many long time customers. I wouldn't personally care much about FOW because I ripped them out of packs and I want people to play legacy with, but many people would be utterly pissed and put off by the decision. Cards like those need to be in limited products. It is bad business to put them anywhere else. Fetches are the same. They need to be in either a standard set, or a limited product. They do not belong in a Wal-Mart product.
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All your base are belong to us!
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
How do you think printing FOW or Mana Drain in a VS. Deck would affect people who shelled out hundreds for FOW, or 200 for a single drain for their EDH deck?
Appeal to emotion is a logical fallacy.
In general most of my arguments are based around living and, ostensibly, supported formats. Meaning Modern rather than Legacy and so on.
That said I'd argue that the same reasoning applies to staples for other formats as well.
Reasonable amounts of reprints would allow these formats to grow and players invested in them to actually have others to play with.
Forgoing substantial reprints of relevant staples will lead to decline and eventual death of every non-rotating format. Thus, for a format to stay alive you need to reprint staples. Lowered prices is the natural result, though that is also the inevitable result of a dead format - Magic cards are generally valued on their playability over anything else. Since prices inevitably go up (bar special circumstances, metagame shifts etc.) as long as a format is healthy and supported it's better to reprint sooner rather than later, as when prices have to be reduced it's better to do so before they get too expensive.
If it's an issue, and I'm not so sure it is, it's most definitely an issue of WotC's own making.
As an example you often hear people claim WotC "can't" print cards like Snapcaster Mage or Liliana of the Veil in the likes of Duel Decks because they're $80-$100 cards. I don't necessarily agree, though if that were the case they had plenty of opportunity to reprint the cards while they were $20 and that line of argument entirely moot.
Cue Tasigur, the Golden Fang or Thragtusk. Banana man could have easily ended up a $20 card but the inclusion in a precon meant that it's hovering around ~4 euro on MCM at least. Thragtusk, Standard all-star, was included in no less than 3 precons and were still a ~$15 card during much of its Standard life cycle. Imagine what it would have cost if it weren't?
We tend to forget the cards that got timely reprints, and how good that was for the game, but moan endlessly about how bad it would be with dropping prices.
Remember when Thoughtseize was a $70-$90 card? No one does, yet somehow there were no riots when the card dropped to $10 (and then rose again) with the Theros reprint.
So reprint away, I eagerly anticipate my ~$10-15k collection to drop in price as long as it means healthy and accessible formats.
Im not the one appealing to emotion. They have to in order to keep their customers happy. They must find a balance between all interested parties. That said, you are going to stick to your opinions, and I will stick with my opinions. There is no more point to discussing it. We don't even know if this product is real yet. I believe something legacy related is coming out, but I don't know what exactly it will be. I hope we get an announcement today from WOTC so we can discuss other things related to it instead of the pointless arguments about goods and prices the past few pages have been about.
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All your base are belong to us!
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
When printing cards, there needs to be a reason it is included in a product. They could easily toss something like FOW in anything blue, but would it make sense? Should FOW been in Jace V. Chandra? It could have, but it makes no sense there. It would take away from the rest of the set. It would be FOW V. Who freaking cares? The problem with reprints is finding a good place to print them that doesn't overshadow the rest of the product and unless it is a reprint themed product not actually making it too heavily reprint oriented.
You do have a point, and it is a point to remember, but they did miss some rather prime reprint possibilities over the last year or so that made sense. Like Damnation in FTV: Annihilation, MM2, and Commander 2014 (they even mentioned that if something obvious isn't in something expect it soon, and it never showed up a year later), missing Serum Visions in MM2 and Elspeth vs. Kiora, Gitaxian Probe in MM2, Inquisition of Kozilek in Oath, Cabal Coffers in Commander 2014 and mostly just a bunch of stuff that would have served better in MM2 in both limited and as a reprint than most of what we got.
We have gotten quite a few great places for some good stuff and yet they miss them, which is rather befuddling.
When printing cards, there needs to be a reason it is included in a product. They could easily toss something like FOW in anything blue, but would it make sense? Should FOW been in Jace V. Chandra? It could have, but it makes no sense there. It would take away from the rest of the set. It would be FOW V. Who freaking cares? The problem with reprints is finding a good place to print them that doesn't overshadow the rest of the product and unless it is a reprint themed product not actually making it too heavily reprint oriented.
You do have a point, and it is a point to remember, but they did miss some rather prime reprint possibilities over the last year or so that made sense. Like Damnation in FTV: Annihilation, MM2, and Commander 2014 (they even mentioned that if something obvious isn't in something expect it soon, and it never showed up a year later), missing Serum Visions in MM2 and Elspeth vs. Kiora, Gitaxian Probe in MM2, Inquisition of Kozilek in Oath, Cabal Coffers in Commander 2014 and mostly just a bunch of stuff that would have served better in MM2 in both limited and as a reprint than most of what we got.
We have gotten quite a few great places for some good stuff and yet they miss them, which is rather befuddling.
No arguments with that. My only thing is they had to pick and choose which to include cause if in any given product they included all the best possibilities, then the target audience would have issues getting it. Could you imagine if FTV 20 had Jace, Liliana, FOW, mana drain, Show amd Tell, Goyf and another several high demand cards? They could certainly print it, but only a very few would get sold as a whole set, or at least sold at a reasonable cost. So, while some cards I would agree should have been in X Y or Z set, not everything I would like to see in any given one is possible without causing an issue. Sorry for arguing with while also agreeing with your point. Their pick and choose was incorrect, leading to missed opportunities.
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RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Im not the one appealing to emotion.
...
That said, you are going to stick to your opinions, and I will stick with my opinions. There is no more point to discussing it.
...
We don't even know if this product is real yet.
When your argument hinges upon how people would feel about "losing" value on their collections due to reprints then yes, you're appealing to emotion. Whether you're claiming to merely represent WotC reasoning on the matter or your own is irrelevant.
As for opinions you're absolutely correct but it's a pointless statement to make. No one argues to convince the opposing party, especially not online. That's ever been a fruitless effort, people don't change their minds. Even those few times when someone can be proven factually, irrefutably wrong they tend to move the goalposts or quietly disappear rather than face reality.
I'm not arguing to convince you, I'm pointing out where your argument fails to the benefit of others - and myself, so as to spare me the effort of doing it all over again quite as often.
And the point is thus: The few high-profile staple reprints we've gotten have either been timely, which means the cards in question never had an opportunity to rise in price until accessibility became an issue in the first place, or completely undramatic. Thoughtseize and the allied fetchlands are prime examples, and to a lesser extent the shocklands as well. The initial prices plummeted from their previous heights but there was no outrage, no hordes of speculators bemoaning how their precious collection plummeted in - entirely fictional - value.
Just a lot of Magic players happy about finally being able to afford those pieces for their decks, and others equally happy to have someone to play against.
Thus I posit that the, oft repeated, argument against reprints on grounds of player base outrage is based on fiction. It seems more based on hearsay, repetition and urban legends about the 20 year old Chronicles set than actual, factual effects of current reprints - few as they may be.
As for the idea of Exceptional Masters overall I could believe it as another Magic Online set. In paper it goes against pretty much everything WotC has done so far, unless it's filled to the brim with jank and retails for $20 a pack. I, for one, am going to need a lot more evidence before I believe it's a real set.
Personally I'd probably prefer it not to be true, given how the Modern Masters set have been terrible for Modern as a format overall. Though if the set is more focused on older, Legacy and Vintage, staples it might be a good thing. Those formats being significantly smaller than Modern might mean such a set could provide enough cards to actually offset the increased interest. Then again the real limitation of those formats is actually the cards that won't get reprinted anyway.
Who are you even still talking to? I told you I was done talking to you. They have to consider several factors including what players want. Wants are emotions. Have a nice day talking to yourself from this point on. Like I said, you are welcome to your opinion. I wont agree with it and you won't agree with my statements. Conversation is over.
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All your base are belong to us!
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Of course it matters what the item is. How you keep missing this is highly amusing.
That said I kind of perceive this going more like Conspiracy and not having a very high reprint stock - if they're not focusing on Modern then maybe they'll just be trying to feed out some new EDH playables or walkers like Dack Fayden that have pretty overall competitive play use.
It had best have Force of Will, Tarmo, Wasteland, Stoneforge and a bunch of MagicChristmasland stuff in it if I'm going to spend more than $10 a pack. I did some MMII drafts because it had the sweet Spirit draft archetype and that was a riot, but I'm not spending much on this if they reprint a bunch of crap like the Kamigawa dragons or Comet Storm etc.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
... what if...
.... this is WotC's solution to the Reserved List? Let's abolish it, but only make the cards previously on the list available in super-duper-ultimate-premium-rare-limited-release product that's priced accordingly? Perhaps after two Modern Masters sets, they've finally figured out how to properly reprint things without affecting the secondary price market too much (and that's by pricing a limited release set at a ridiculous price point).
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You may want to consider that for yourself as well.
Yeah, because neither of them have you putting in a bit of research to find what is best for you at the time, go to the store or going on the internet to buy them, and that both have prices that can drop wildly and randomly, but sure, yeah outside of those things they have no similarities at all. Yep, totally.
Yours is more amusing, unfortunately. I am not comparing the items directly, because yes that would be stupid, I am comparing how similar they can be in price and how they are known for their frequent and radical price changes, which has a rather nice parallel, but for some reason you are stuck on the objects more than the price similarities.
I have not sympathy of whiners, sorry... Your not trying hard enough.
You don't find it a bit odd it takes years to get into a part of the game? That probably shouldn't be a thing. The cards will still have value, but for some reason those that play the format treat it like it is a country club, which is just strange. Also Standard decks right now are like cheap Legacy decks, so skip the middle man and just go straight to Legacy.
You are right though, any set won't perfectly get you into any format, but right now they are offering zero sets for Legacy/Vintage and those two formats have been dying slowly for a long time because of it, at the very least this will allow those sets to thrive a bit with new life being injected into it.
I don't find it weird at all, "usually" magic players don't jump into eternal formats right away.
I don't mind the the supplemental sets, I enjoy them. But to expect them to be the catch all to get into an eternal format is backwards thinking. These are cards that have been in print for years, it helps make them more available but that's it. You will still need to find a way to get the rest of the cards and most of them will be the most expensive (reserved list or didn't see a reprint). Complaining doesn't do anything but waste time, take action and go get the cards.....
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
That is unfortunately true. Even the cards not on the Reserved list that are played in Legacy/Vintage way back in the day they have the hardest troubles with reprinting, they just have some problem with reprinting cards.
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
They just reprinted enemy fetches last set. And the block before it had ally fetches in two of the sets. Chill.
So you think standard sets/environments should be sculpted around high-profile reprints?
Or they should put expensive high profile reprints in casual boxed product so that they are scooped up, dissected, and sold for parts?
The problem with reprints is that these are absolutely not good ways to do them and WoTC hasn't figured out a valid way to get the right amount of cards out there yet.
We don't need another standard environment that is all about a reprinted card like thoughtseize. We almost had that with a LotV reprint. Development does decide when and if a high profile reprint can happen, but they absolutely won't put one in if it requires bending the entire format, and altering other cards to allow the card to be reprinted and hopefully not dominate all of standard.
Besides, if LotV got reprinted, Siege Rhino would have a discard clause instead and not be the unholy terror it is today.
Also, enemy fetches were not really expected. At least by people following closely enough to things.
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A proper reprint of enemy fetches would go a long way towards quelling the irate player-base who wish to play older formats but cannot get in. It would not last very long, however, because as soon as fetches become cheaper the demand increases and the non-reprinted cards go up. Give me a market where fetches are 10-15 dollars, and I will show you a $350-500 Goyf.
One of the reasons people want to play the older formats is insulation from rotation, but it is a bit of a myth, a utopia that has not ever really existed. Only Legacy and Vintage have anything approaching stability (and an ever increasing set of staples), whilst bans and reprints keep the Modern market volatile (in the economic rather than scientific sense of the word). In my case its not rotation at all- I hate all the things that new players like (creatures, especially big ones, story and Planeswalkers), and like all the things that new players loathe (prison cards). I would consider playing Standard- when and if I can lock someone out of the game. Since that won't happen I will sit and make as much money as I can out of the Modern market by speculation and slowly convert spare cash into more Legacy decks, to keep my Legacy scene going. I bought my last MM2 box, sat on it sold it for 20 quid quick profit, sunk that into a good deal on Legacy staples. If it was really worth ripping I would have done so, but it was a poor, poor set for value. It did not draft that well either, and had mish mash cards like Daybreak Coronet that seemed to have no use.
You are welcome to your opinion. But they do have to factor in many things when reprinting cards. It would be bad business to just reprint FOW or other mana drain in a big box store product. Things like that can't just go anywhere no matter how much you wish they could. How do you think printing FOW or Mana Drain in a VS. Deck would affect people who shelled out hundreds for FOW, or 200 for a single drain for their EDH deck? They would alienate many long time customers. I wouldn't personally care much about FOW because I ripped them out of packs and I want people to play legacy with, but many people would be utterly pissed and put off by the decision. Cards like those need to be in limited products. It is bad business to put them anywhere else. Fetches are the same. They need to be in either a standard set, or a limited product. They do not belong in a Wal-Mart product.
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Im not the one appealing to emotion. They have to in order to keep their customers happy. They must find a balance between all interested parties. That said, you are going to stick to your opinions, and I will stick with my opinions. There is no more point to discussing it. We don't even know if this product is real yet. I believe something legacy related is coming out, but I don't know what exactly it will be. I hope we get an announcement today from WOTC so we can discuss other things related to it instead of the pointless arguments about goods and prices the past few pages have been about.
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
You do have a point, and it is a point to remember, but they did miss some rather prime reprint possibilities over the last year or so that made sense. Like Damnation in FTV: Annihilation, MM2, and Commander 2014 (they even mentioned that if something obvious isn't in something expect it soon, and it never showed up a year later), missing Serum Visions in MM2 and Elspeth vs. Kiora, Gitaxian Probe in MM2, Inquisition of Kozilek in Oath, Cabal Coffers in Commander 2014 and mostly just a bunch of stuff that would have served better in MM2 in both limited and as a reprint than most of what we got.
We have gotten quite a few great places for some good stuff and yet they miss them, which is rather befuddling.
No arguments with that. My only thing is they had to pick and choose which to include cause if in any given product they included all the best possibilities, then the target audience would have issues getting it. Could you imagine if FTV 20 had Jace, Liliana, FOW, mana drain, Show amd Tell, Goyf and another several high demand cards? They could certainly print it, but only a very few would get sold as a whole set, or at least sold at a reasonable cost. So, while some cards I would agree should have been in X Y or Z set, not everything I would like to see in any given one is possible without causing an issue. Sorry for arguing with while also agreeing with your point. Their pick and choose was incorrect, leading to missed opportunities.
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Who are you even still talking to? I told you I was done talking to you. They have to consider several factors including what players want. Wants are emotions. Have a nice day talking to yourself from this point on. Like I said, you are welcome to your opinion. I wont agree with it and you won't agree with my statements. Conversation is over.
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.
Where?
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/news/announcing-eternal-masters-2016-02-15
Edit. Well holy heck
BUG Reanimator
BWG Nic-Fit
BGR Punishing Nic-Fit
Commander: WUBRG Superfriends, GW Rhys Tokens, WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Kitchen Table (now that's real Magic): WUBRG Domain, GU Biovisionary, UB Korlash Grandeur, UW Merfolk Mill
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/671716-eternal-masters-confirmed