Mark Rosewater's comment about the inclusion of Lightning Bolt in Ethan Fleischer's intro pack design for the GDS2 implies that M12 will not include Lightning Bolt.
It seems that the "power creep" for cheap burn has started its period of backing off, to make room for some other part of the game to be awesome for a while.
I came here to post the same thing, he talked a couple times about how it or Baneslayer were to be cut from M11 and how bolt wasn't a permanent return, this is pretty much the nail in the coffin. As a primarily red player I hate it, but I also understand it. Having it around hurts the new burn spells, it means you play 4x Bolt and then take your pick between the 3-5 other options for the rest. And of course it means anything with 3 toughness or less is instantly less good.
If they get rid of lightning bolt then they better get rid of some control cards like mana leak or I will be pissed. Control is already overpowered and has access to more sweepers than I can remember. Now magic is going to take away reds best card thx!:mad:
Perhaps we might get incinerate back or a variation. There are some interesting things they could have the 3 damage burn spell do after they tack on a generic mana. Exile the creature instead of having it go to the graveyard this turn or having the burn spell either be uncounterable or harder to counter would be nice bonuses.
Anyone else think that these Infect decks will be incredibly susceptible to Planeswalkers?
I will relish the first few weeks when my opponent swings this or the other Infect baddies into my Jace 2.0 and I say "ok no blocks" and they look at me dumbfounded as I lose no loyalty and gain no poison counters.
I'm sure noobs will catch on quickly but I know the above situation will happen.
Having it around hurts the new burn spells, it means you play 4x Bolt and then take your pick between the 3-5 other options for the rest.
That makes no sense. All it means is some other card will become the de facto four of comparator spell. Lightning bolt is an iconic staple and should be in every core set.
I don't read Rosewater's comment that way. I think what he means is that printing Bolt in a large set in the fall would not give players a sense of ancient power, because Bolt is already in the core set and has been for a couple years. In other words, Rosewater is saying he would not print Bolt in a Fall expansion unless the card has been out of rotation for some time and thus is meaningful as a reprint.
That makes no sense. All it means is some other card will become the de facto four of comparator spell. Lightning bolt is an iconic staple and should be in every core set.
Actually it presents design problems which have been discussed at length over the years. The only other thing they can do at 1 mana is a "deal 2 damage, sometimes four" which they have done in the last two years with Bolt around. And two-mana 3-damage spell design is impacted as well.
This is not a surprise because that very point was brought up last summer when they announced that Bolt would be back for "one more year."
Having Lightning Bolt around severely impacts the playability of creatures with 3 toughness. When it rotates out, 4 will no longer be the "magic number" to keep creatures safe from "baseline" burn; they will be out of range of Arc Trail and Galvanic Bolt without metalcraft. It depends on what replaces Bolt in the core set and what shows up in Action and Shake block, but Bolt leaving Standard can open doors for creatures that wouldn't be up to snuff otherwise.
That makes no sense. All it means is some other card will become the de facto four of comparator spell. Lightning bolt is an iconic staple and should be in every core set.
No it doesn't. Take standard right now if there is no Lightning Bolt. Right now just about every deck playing red plays Lightning Bolt. If it weren't there what would they play? Would they just not play a burn spell? Would they play Burst Lightning? Galvanic Blast? Forked Bolt? Arc Trail? Burn the Impure? Searing Blaze? Staggershock? Can you really say one of those jumps out as the clear best? No. It all depends on the deck. In some Searing Blaze is strongest, in other Galvanic Blast. Against some decks Arc Trail is best and against others Burn the Impure is. Burst Lightning is pretty decent across the board but is it really good enough to just be the new instant 4-of over these cards? It's not nearly as simple as you make it out to be.
Actually it presents design problems which have been discussed at length over the years. The only other thing they can do at 1 mana is a "deal 2 damage, sometimes four" which they have done in the last two years with Bolt around. And two-mana 3-damage spell design is impacted as well.
This is not a surprise because that very point was brought up last summer when they announced that Bolt would be back for "one more year."
That's fine, but there will always be a penultimate card at some task, to eschew a card simply because it fulfills that role is ridiculous. Yes, maybe lightning bolt is a bit too good at what it does, and maybe I'm not thinking deeply enough about the ramifications that spells like that have on the game (ie counterspell) but I think those cards aren't necessarily bad.
If they get rid of lightning bolt then they better get rid of some control cards like mana leak or I will be pissed. Control is already overpowered and has access to more sweepers than I can remember. Now magic is going to take away reds best card thx!:mad:
Good, it was nice to have it back for awhile but it's time to see it go again, so that later it can come back again. It's not necessarily good for cards that are that efficient to always be around. Just like counters, discard, and many other things, their power level needs to fluctutate from year to year. They need to take a break sometimes so we can explore what the meta is like without them.
That makes no sense. All it means is some other card will become the de facto four of comparator spell. Lightning bolt is an iconic staple and should be in every core set.
Same thing could be said about dark ritual for black decks and counterspell for blue, but those have been removed from the core sets.
In all honesty, within the standard environment, Lightning Bolt is a staple, and a good reason to play red. It also helps keep up against the aggro decks, and helps aggro decks as well. I personally believe that Lightning Bolt should (and most likely will) stay over Baneslayer Angel. Creatures with ridiculously amazing abilities at the 5+ mana stage right now are a bit of an annoyance. I also am under the influence that Lightning Bolt does not just hinder design, but in the other spectrum also improves it. We would have never seen great spells like Staggershock, Arc Trail, Galvanic Blast, or Burst Lightning had there been a spell such as Incinerate.
In a 60 card deck, red has to be pretty broken across the board for it to be playable without Lightning Bolt in the format. I couldn't imagine the next years rotation without Lightning Bolt and amazing cards like Skinrender and Go for the Throat roaming around.
It seems that the "power creep" for cheap burn has started its period of backing off, to make room for some other part of the game to be awesome for a while.
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
If they get rid of lightning bolt then they better get rid of some control cards like mana leak or I will be pissed. Control is already overpowered and has access to more sweepers than I can remember. Now magic is going to take away reds best card thx!:mad:
EDH:
Niv-Mizzet
Legacy:
The Rack
Modern
Venser, the Sojourner Control
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
Reading the Rules FTW
Isuckatmagic on MTGO
Legacy: Burn, U/R Delver
Modern: U/R Storm, Soul Sisters
Vintage: #ImBrokeLOL
EDH: Nin, the Pain Artist (Chaos), Roon of the Hidden Realm (Blink)
That makes no sense. All it means is some other card will become the de facto four of comparator spell. Lightning bolt is an iconic staple and should be in every core set.
Rules Advisor: 9/5/11
Old, sparsely updated because of above: Trade with me!
Weirdly, standard has been BAD since JTMS was banned, it hasn't been fun, nor healthy since.
Actually it presents design problems which have been discussed at length over the years. The only other thing they can do at 1 mana is a "deal 2 damage, sometimes four" which they have done in the last two years with Bolt around. And two-mana 3-damage spell design is impacted as well.
This is not a surprise because that very point was brought up last summer when they announced that Bolt would be back for "one more year."
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
Back in the day we called those creatures "bolt bait".
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
No it doesn't. Take standard right now if there is no Lightning Bolt. Right now just about every deck playing red plays Lightning Bolt. If it weren't there what would they play? Would they just not play a burn spell? Would they play Burst Lightning? Galvanic Blast? Forked Bolt? Arc Trail? Burn the Impure? Searing Blaze? Staggershock? Can you really say one of those jumps out as the clear best? No. It all depends on the deck. In some Searing Blaze is strongest, in other Galvanic Blast. Against some decks Arc Trail is best and against others Burn the Impure is. Burst Lightning is pretty decent across the board but is it really good enough to just be the new instant 4-of over these cards? It's not nearly as simple as you make it out to be.
That's fine, but there will always be a penultimate card at some task, to eschew a card simply because it fulfills that role is ridiculous. Yes, maybe lightning bolt is a bit too good at what it does, and maybe I'm not thinking deeply enough about the ramifications that spells like that have on the game (ie counterspell) but I think those cards aren't necessarily bad.
Rules Advisor: 9/5/11
Old, sparsely updated because of above: Trade with me!
Weirdly, standard has been BAD since JTMS was banned, it hasn't been fun, nor healthy since.
"Control" is rotating out with bolt.
Same thing could be said about dark ritual for black decks and counterspell for blue, but those have been removed from the core sets.
In a 60 card deck, red has to be pretty broken across the board for it to be playable without Lightning Bolt in the format. I couldn't imagine the next years rotation without Lightning Bolt and amazing cards like Skinrender and Go for the Throat roaming around.
Sorcery
Deal 4
I'd be super happy with this and as a sorcery it is probably not too good