Hi,thanks in advance.So if I drop card[Enter the infinite] and then cast card[Deflection] on my opponent targeting them,they take there turn,passes to me,i make them draw a card,they lose correct?since they have no cards left.i don't have to pass turn and wait until there draw step do I?Because if I'm running a blue spell deck with ONLY instants and sorceries then they can only draw a land from me.So in a multiplayer I can kill them off before my other opponent(2) can benefit from playing a card in opponent(1) hand during there turn before it comes back to my turn.make sense?sorry if it doesnt.very new and not very tech savy.
A) Please use [card]Enter the Infnite[/card] tags to get autocarded cards: Enter the InfiniteDeflection
B) Enter the Infinite does not target, so it can't be Deflected
C) You need to draw from an empty library to lose the game. Drawing your last card does not lose you the game.
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Well that doesn't work then.lol.thanks for that quick response.Any way I can use something to basically donate that card to my opponent?whole deck idea was based around that idea and being able to reuse it on several opponents out of my graveyard.didnt realize the "target" part worked that way.thought it was target card I targeted and opponent I am targeting.
Cause I can make it work as long as I can dump my opponents library as well as my own because I can put mine back in before the end of my turn.well that WAS my theory.lol
What if I copy it?i get to choose new target for the copy correct???
If you copy a spell, you can choose new targets for that copy only if the original spell has targets. Since Enter the Infinite doesn't target, the copy won't target, either.
Enter the Inifinite only affects yourself (assuming no external effects). It will never be able to affect any other player, given the situation you've described here.
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How to use card tags (please use them for everybody's sanity)
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format Minimum deck size: 60 Maximum number of identical cards: 4 Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
But in that case for that card ruling it states that the sorcery I copy does not have to have a target and it also says I can choose a new target.So now I'm even more confused why I can't looking at [card]Twincast[card].
But in that case for that card ruling it states that the sorcery I copy does not have to have a target and it also says I can choose a new target.So now I'm even more confused why I can't looking at [card]Twincast[card].
Enter the Infinite never targets anyone, ever. When you cast it you aren't targeting yourself with the spell, you're playing a spell that says you (the person casting the spell) do something. When you copy it you're creating an exact duplicate. You have 2 copies of the spell saying you do something.
A since I can in [card]Twincast[\card] ruling target a spell that does NOT target and then I get to choose a new target,being opponent instead of myself being the one targeted by [card]Twincast[\card] itself.
TARGET is the keyword. If it does not say "Target" then you can't change the "target" as there is no "target".
Enter the Infinite - Draw cards equal to the number of cards in your library, then put a card from your hand on top of your library. You have no maximum hand size until your next turn.
There aren't any words that say "target".
Lightning Bolt -
Lightning Bolt deals 3 damage to target creature or player.
It says "target" creature or player.
So, when a card says "target"; that's the keyword you are looking for.
Yes I see that with ETI but with Twincast it's ruling say that the sorcery spell I copy doesn't have to target anything.then I get to choose a target for TC, myself or someone else.it doesn't automatically make me the target from TC does it.my understanding is that it's [card]Twincaster[\card] that is allowing me to basically create a target,the choice no just being myself due to TC second sentence.because if I copy ETI if an opponent cast it using TC I can choose myself as the new target,right??? Say my opponent cast some thing that said draw two cards,then I cast TC,that doesn't mean they get to draw 2 again does it,because I'm choosing myself as the new target even though the card didn't say target player gets to draw two cards.This is where the confusion comes in.lol.so very sorry and again I REALLY appreciate the help with this and your patience in helping me understand.
Like couldn't I use Divination ,then use Twincast to make another player draw two cards as well?Or do I HAVE to draw two more f a total of four???
Divination doesn't target, so creating a copy of it would just make you draw four cards instead of just two (two copies, two for each copy).
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How to use card tags (please use them for everybody's sanity)
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format Minimum deck size: 60 Maximum number of identical cards: 4 Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
Twincast can copy any instant or sorcery, but it lets you change the targets if and only if the spell already has targets to change. It can't create card text where none existed.
If you bring your jet ski in to a mechanic's for a tune-up and tire rotation, you'll only get the tune-up, because jet skis have no tires.
Lol.ok.i got it now.so then there is no way to cast a sorcery that doesn't "target" and have it affect my opponent.The card doesn't exist that allows someone to do that.every depletion or redirect card refers to target spells only, otherwise by default it would revert back to myself as there was no said target and I would always be the one affected. Correct?
If my opponent plays a spell that says to put out say a 3/3 centaur,there is no card that let's me put one out too to copy the spell for myself?because nothing is being targeted does my opponent get another token???cause if so I've been playing so wrong!lol.
Pretty much. The only way I can think of adding targets to an otherwise untargeted spell is Arcane/Splice, but that only works on a very limited subset of cards of which Enter the Infinite is not one.
That said, Hive Mind gets pretty close. It is one of the only cards I know of that creates the copies under the control of the opponent, thus having the copy have the opponent as the 'you' that draws cards. Twincast and such copy them under your control, thus making the 'you' that's drawing lots of cards simply be you.
'Target' is weird in Magic for not meaning what everyone else thinks it does. Something only targets if it literally says the word 'target' -- which, interestingly, allows you to get around hexproof with certain cards that say 'choose a creature' instead of 'target creature' for formatting reasons.
Out of curiosity, how are you planning on casting Enter the Infinite? I mean, it's just a wee bit expensive...
Sounds like a neat deck idea, good luck getting something similar working!
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[card]Energy tap[card] on the only creature I was gonna put in,a [card]Scornful Egotist[card]. Then it's useless to anyone but me,then twiddle as much as I need to to ramp up until I had enough.twice is 16 mana for three blue,so with the aid of that I technically only need 7 mana,8 if I wanna keep it all going if I got ETI out on me.Its lands, (silo) for counters,blue can search deck for that specific land,store for few turns,turn four u should have stacked a few special lands and added a few mana counters on a few others,counterspells are cheap so u never have to dip into them.then flip egotist and set off the chain of spells using taps and twiddlin.that was the original way.Built a deck around that from going up against a deck that always took my stuff,he was brutal, but he couldn't take instants and sorceries so I used ETI when I could ramp up via the egotist and then go nuts until I could triple up on [card]traumatize[card] and finish them off with [card]Mindsculpt[card] and [card]Tomescour[card].
The idea was they know that one was coming so I wanted to try and change it up and redirect it to him as a "suprise" move but I wanted to check legality first.and I'm glad I did as I hate being wrong mid game.so embarrassing.lol.
Could I [card]spellbind[card] then [card]Donate[card] to creature I took using control to my opponent and force them to tap???ill have to research more I guess.maybe a way to make [card]panoptic mirror[card] viable.but then I'm getting away from instants and sorceries....
Thanks again for the help everyone.
If my opponent plays a spell that says to put out say a 3/3 centaur,there is no card that let's me put one out too to copy the spell for myself?because nothing is being targeted does my opponent get another token???cause if so I've been playing so wrong!lol.
You've been playing right in that case, if you copy the spell as with twincast. Any spell that does not have targets affects the controller of that spell. If you twincast a spell that your opponent controllers, then you copy it, and you control the copy, since you control the twincast. So the spells effects work for you. (you don't choose which player the spell works for, it is only the controller of the spell).
Could I [card]spellbind[card] then [card]Donate[card] to creature I took using control to my opponent and force them to tap???ill have to research more I guess.maybe a way to make [card]panoptic mirror[card] viable.but then I'm getting away from instants and sorceries....
Thanks again for the help everyone.
Both spellbinder and panoptic mirror have clauses that say you may cast the spell so if the opponent controls those permanents they won't be forced to cast your spells (because they may cast those spells) so those cards wouldn't help your goal of getting your opponent to cast enter the infinite.
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B) Enter the Infinite does not target, so it can't be Deflected
C) You need to draw from an empty library to lose the game. Drawing your last card does not lose you the game.
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If you copy a spell, you can choose new targets for that copy only if the original spell has targets. Since Enter the Infinite doesn't target, the copy won't target, either.
Enter the Inifinite only affects yourself (assuming no external effects). It will never be able to affect any other player, given the situation you've described here.
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format
Minimum deck size: 60
Maximum number of identical cards: 4
Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
Enter the Infinite never targets anyone, ever. When you cast it you aren't targeting yourself with the spell, you're playing a spell that says you (the person casting the spell) do something. When you copy it you're creating an exact duplicate. You have 2 copies of the spell saying you do something.
Enter the Infinite - Draw cards equal to the number of cards in your library, then put a card from your hand on top of your library. You have no maximum hand size until your next turn.
There aren't any words that say "target".
Lightning Bolt -
Lightning Bolt deals 3 damage to target creature or player.
It says "target" creature or player.
So, when a card says "target"; that's the keyword you are looking for.
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Divination doesn't target, so creating a copy of it would just make you draw four cards instead of just two (two copies, two for each copy).
[c]Lightning Bolt[/c] -> Lightning Bolt
[c=Lightning Bolt]Apple Pie[/c] -> Apple Pie
Vowels-Only Format
Minimum deck size: 60
Maximum number of identical cards: 4
Ban list: Cards whose English names begin with a consonant, Unglued and Unhinged cards, cards involving ante, Ancestral Recall
Because you can't choose a target with Enter The Infinite, you can't change the 'target' to something else.
You can change the target of Lightning Bolt because it says "target" in the spell.
It's not a matter of choosing. It's a matter of the card actually saying "TARGET".
Tooth and Nail
8 Rack
Mono Red Storm
Elves
R/G Tron
If you bring your jet ski in to a mechanic's for a tune-up and tire rotation, you'll only get the tune-up, because jet skis have no tires.
That said, Hive Mind gets pretty close. It is one of the only cards I know of that creates the copies under the control of the opponent, thus having the copy have the opponent as the 'you' that draws cards. Twincast and such copy them under your control, thus making the 'you' that's drawing lots of cards simply be you.
'Target' is weird in Magic for not meaning what everyone else thinks it does. Something only targets if it literally says the word 'target' -- which, interestingly, allows you to get around hexproof with certain cards that say 'choose a creature' instead of 'target creature' for formatting reasons.
Out of curiosity, how are you planning on casting Enter the Infinite? I mean, it's just a wee bit expensive...
Sounds like a neat deck idea, good luck getting something similar working!
--Buck v Bell, 1927. This case, regarding the compulsory sterilization of inmates at mental institutions, has -- somehow -- never been overturned. Just a wee PSA for ya.
Thanks again for the help everyone.
You've been playing right in that case, if you copy the spell as with twincast. Any spell that does not have targets affects the controller of that spell. If you twincast a spell that your opponent controllers, then you copy it, and you control the copy, since you control the twincast. So the spells effects work for you. (you don't choose which player the spell works for, it is only the controller of the spell).
Both spellbinder and panoptic mirror have clauses that say you may cast the spell so if the opponent controls those permanents they won't be forced to cast your spells (because they may cast those spells) so those cards wouldn't help your goal of getting your opponent to cast enter the infinite.
Graham from Loading Ready Run