I have a question regarding Awakening and Hardened Scales. My gut says that they don't interact at all (at least pre-animation), however I'm not sure specifically why.
Where I'm getting stuck is that Hardened Scales couldn't trigger until after the ability Awakening resolves (because nothing can happen in the middle of a spell resolution if I understand the rules correctly - not even state based effects). Since by the time Hardened Scales would trigger, the land would be a creature and would have counters - I can see the argument that +1/+1 counters were put on a creature, which would cause it to trigger. But that's really related to timing, which I might not have the best grasp on. I do know that [card]Hardened Scales]/card] works on creatures that come into play with +1/+1 counters. So I guess my question(s) is/are:
Can a triggered ability trigger in the middle of the resolution of another ability?
For example - if you had an enchantment card in play that said "Whenever you draw a card, if you control a creature, draw an additional card." Then you cast a spell that said "Draw a card. Put a 0/1 creature onto the battlefield." Assuming you controlled no other creatures, would you draw one card, or two cards? And why specifically?
What if the spell you cast said "Draw a card. Sacrifice all creatures you control." or "Sacrifice all creatures you control. Draw a card. Put a 0/1 creature onto the battlefield." If you controlled at least one creature. How would these similarly resolve?
The thing you are missing here is that Hardened Scales is NOT a trigger. It's a replacement effect. This means that it does happen in the middle of the resolution of another ability.
So here's what happens:
(Unawakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on, but not to a creature, so does nothing. Then the land becomes a creature.
(Awakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on a creature, so changes that to X+1 +1/+1 counters.
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The thing you are missing here is that Hardened Scales is NOT a trigger. It's a replacement effect. This means that it does happen in the middle of the resolution of another ability.
So here's what happens:
(Unawakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on, but not to a creature, so does nothing. Then the land becomes a creature.
(Awakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on a creature, so changes that to X+1 +1/+1 counters.
Duh, Ok that makes sense. For some reason I coded that in my brain as "whenever +1/+1 counters would be.." Thanks for the explanation.
It is important to look for key words. All triggered abilities start with "when", "whenever", or "at" (as in, "at the beginning of your upkeep,"). Replacement effects generally start with "if". Creatures can have replacement effects that start with things like "[Cardname] enters the battlefield with...", "You may have [Cardname] enter the battlefield as...", or "As [Cardname] enters the battlefield" (Kalonian Hydra, Clone, Meddling Mage) that modify how those card enter the battlefield.
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Fully understanding that interaction now. I still wonder about how triggered abilities work within the resolution of a spell.
If a card said "Whenever a +1/+1 counter would be put on a creature you control, put a +1/+1 counter on that creature" would a newly awakened land get a +1/+1 counter?
Another thing worth noting is that triggers DO trigger during the reolution of a spell. They will, however, not be put on the stack until th ecurrent ability is done resolving.
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Fully understanding that interaction now. I still wonder about how triggered abilities work within the resolution of a spell.
If a card said "Whenever a +1/+1 counter would be put on a creature you control, put a +1/+1 counter on that creature" would a newly awakened land get a +1/+1 counter?
A) Things happen during the resolution of an ability in the order they are listed, so no, this would not trigger. (For a real-life example of this, with Titania, Protector of Argoth on the board and someone casts Rite of Ruin, if they choose "creature" before land, Titania would not produce tokens if she was sacrificed, but if they choose Land before creature, she would, but not until after the spell resolved)
B) Your imaginary card would trigger itself indefinitely, and thus this is why they use replacement effects for these kind of abilities.
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Where I'm getting stuck is that Hardened Scales couldn't trigger until after the ability Awakening resolves (because nothing can happen in the middle of a spell resolution if I understand the rules correctly - not even state based effects). Since by the time Hardened Scales would trigger, the land would be a creature and would have counters - I can see the argument that +1/+1 counters were put on a creature, which would cause it to trigger. But that's really related to timing, which I might not have the best grasp on. I do know that [card]Hardened Scales]/card] works on creatures that come into play with +1/+1 counters. So I guess my question(s) is/are:
Can a triggered ability trigger in the middle of the resolution of another ability?
For example - if you had an enchantment card in play that said "Whenever you draw a card, if you control a creature, draw an additional card." Then you cast a spell that said "Draw a card. Put a 0/1 creature onto the battlefield." Assuming you controlled no other creatures, would you draw one card, or two cards? And why specifically?
What if the spell you cast said "Draw a card. Sacrifice all creatures you control." or "Sacrifice all creatures you control. Draw a card. Put a 0/1 creature onto the battlefield." If you controlled at least one creature. How would these similarly resolve?
Thanks!
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So here's what happens:
(Unawakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on, but not to a creature, so does nothing. Then the land becomes a creature.
(Awakened Land)
Put X +1/+1 counters on the land. Hardened Scales sees counters going on a creature, so changes that to X+1 +1/+1 counters.
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Duh, Ok that makes sense. For some reason I coded that in my brain as "whenever +1/+1 counters would be.." Thanks for the explanation.
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
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If a card said "Whenever a +1/+1 counter would be put on a creature you control, put a +1/+1 counter on that creature" would a newly awakened land get a +1/+1 counter?
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
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A) Things happen during the resolution of an ability in the order they are listed, so no, this would not trigger. (For a real-life example of this, with Titania, Protector of Argoth on the board and someone casts Rite of Ruin, if they choose "creature" before land, Titania would not produce tokens if she was sacrificed, but if they choose Land before creature, she would, but not until after the spell resolved)
B) Your imaginary card would trigger itself indefinitely, and thus this is why they use replacement effects for these kind of abilities.
Currently Playing:
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