(I have not posted in quite some time here, so forgive me if I commit any faux pas)
Looking at the recently spoiled Sultai Emissary (2/2 for 1B, when it dies manifest), I began to wonder about: Sultai Emissary + Infinite Reflection + another creature + Sac outlet.
If I understand correctly, after putting Reflection onto an Emissary, you can just run through your entire deck (and get a whole lot of sacrifices) using any other creature and an outlet. What confuses me about this, though, is that it would feature face-down cards treated as Sultai Emissary. Does that mean they're not viewed as face-down (for the purposes of any other card) at all? Could they morph?
(I have not posted in quite some time here, so forgive me if I commit any faux pas)
Looking at the recently spoiled Sultai Emissary (2/2 for 1B, when it dies manifest), I began to wonder about: Sultai Emissary + Infinite Reflection + another creature + Sac outlet.
If I understand correctly, after putting Reflection onto an Emissary, you can just run through your entire deck (and get a whole lot of sacrifices) using any other creature and an outlet. What confuses me about this, though, is that it would feature face-down cards treated as Sultai Emissary. Does that mean they're not viewed as face-down (for the purposes of any other card) at all? Could they morph?
A face-down creature would have its true characteristics rewritten by face-down characteristics (2/2, no name, color or creature type). I *think* (not 100% sure) that you could turn the card face up for 1B and it would be Sultai Emissary then, but if the card is actually instant or sorcery, it would stay face down. A bit confusing.
707.10. If a face-down permanent becomes a copy of another permanent, its copiable values become the copiable values of that permanent, as modified by its face-down status. Its characteristics therefore remain the same: the characteristics listed by the ability or rules that allowed it to be turned face down. However, if it is turned face up, its copiable values become the values it copied from the other permanent.
If a permanent is turned face down by a spell or ability, it becomes a 2/2 face-down creature with no text, no name, no subtypes, no expansion symbol, and no mana cost. A card that enters the battlefield face down also has these characteristics.
If you manifest a creature, it has all traits of the copied permanent, as modified by face-down characteristics applied by the card that gave them those characteristics. If you are able to turn it face-up (if its a creature in this case), then it gains the copied characteristics applied by Infinite Reflection. In the case of Zoetic Cavern, if morphed it will become a complete copy of the creature enchanted by Infinite Reflection.
Though from what Matt Tabak said, it seems that prohibition on instants and sorceries being on the battlefield face up is absolute, despite any copy effects.
Though from what Matt Tabak said, it seems that prohibition on instants and sorceries being on the battlefield face up is absolute, despite any copy effects.
That's why I said "(if it's a creature in this case [Manifest])".
Looking at the recently spoiled Sultai Emissary (2/2 for 1B, when it dies manifest), I began to wonder about: Sultai Emissary + Infinite Reflection + another creature + Sac outlet.
If I understand correctly, after putting Reflection onto an Emissary, you can just run through your entire deck (and get a whole lot of sacrifices) using any other creature and an outlet. What confuses me about this, though, is that it would feature face-down cards treated as Sultai Emissary. Does that mean they're not viewed as face-down (for the purposes of any other card) at all? Could they morph?
A face-down creature would have its true characteristics rewritten by face-down characteristics (2/2, no name, color or creature type). I *think* (not 100% sure) that you could turn the card face up for 1B and it would be Sultai Emissary then, but if the card is actually instant or sorcery, it would stay face down. A bit confusing.
If you manifest a creature, it has all traits of the copied permanent, as modified by face-down characteristics applied by the card that gave them those characteristics. If you are able to turn it face-up (if its a creature in this case), then it gains the copied characteristics applied by Infinite Reflection. In the case of Zoetic Cavern, if morphed it will become a complete copy of the creature enchanted by Infinite Reflection.
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
That's why I said "(if it's a creature in this case [Manifest])".
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW