Is it true that I can announce a spell, try to pay with her mana ability and if not enough mana is generated the play gets rewinded and Selvala gets untapped but we all keep the extra Cards? Selvala, Explorer Returned
A player may activate an activated mana ability whenever he or she has priority, whenever he or she is casting a spell or activating an ability that requires a mana payment, or whenever a rule or effect asks for a mana payment, even if it's in the middle of casting or resolving a spell or activating or resolving an ability.
You aren't required to cast a spell to activate her ability. So you could just tap her. Get to see everyone top deck card. Get mana and life and keep the mana until the "Phase" end. Say you use her in your first main phase. The mana will stay in the mana pool until you declare your combat phase. So you may or may not spend it as you wish.
That would let you keep failing to cast the expensive spell until you've gained as much life as you want or forced the table to draw as many cards as you want, potentially milling out every player with fewer cards in their library than you.
Seems like a bit much to all be contained in one card. Although at the moment, I can't point to anything that says you can't.
First you announce your are playing a card. You never show the card or tell the name.
Second you activate any mana ability you want. The mana goes to the mana pool
Third you play the said card and pay with the mana from the mana pool. If you don't have the mana then you can't play the announced card.
Fourth you announce any mana left in the mana pool (if there is any left). They will vanish at the end of the phase.
Where I think you misplay (and a lot of player do) is at first step. You probably say "Guys I am going to play 10CMC named card. I will play it using Selvala, Explorer Returned. Ah sorry I don't have enough mana, I untap it as I would with my land. Everyone keep his card since I taped it." But that would be exactly why you misplay. First you can't rewind play in MTG (casual game/friend party doesn't count). Next if you would have followed the step play like upside, you wouldn't have to "rewind" the game. I also don't understand why everyone would have to keep there drawn card. If you ask the play to get rewinded, everyone should have to put the drawn card on top of the library. And how can you be sure they put the right card on top of it. You also get to know everyone next drawing card.
Seriously. NO, it isn't true. Once you tap Selvala, Explorer Returned and proceed to have everyone revealing there top card, she stay tapped.
The rule that deals with this is 717 "Handling Illegal Actions". If you tap Sevala to pay for a spell that it turns out you can't pay for, then you rewind everything to before you announced the spell... Except "Players may not reverse actions that... moved cards from a library to [hand]...". So you'd untap any lands you tapped, and put the spell back in your hand, but once you've revealed and drawn with Selvala (and remember that those are one action, so you can't pause in between when you realize you won't be able to pay), you can't reverse that action, so she will not be untapped. You'll still add whatever green mana she produced to your mana pool, and move forward from there.
717. Handling Illegal Actions
717.1. If a player realizes that he or she can't legally take an action after starting to do so, the entire action is reversed and any payments already made are canceled. No abilities trigger and no effects apply as a result of an undone action. If the action was casting a spell, the spell returns to the zone it came from. The player may also reverse any legal mana abilities activated while making the illegal play, unless mana from them or from any triggered mana abilities they triggered was spent on another mana ability that wasn't reversed. Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
717.2. When reversing illegal spells and abilities, the player who had priority retains it and may take another action or pass. The player may redo the reversed action in a legal way or take any other action allowed by the rules.
717. Handling Illegal Actions
717.1. If a player realizes that he or she can't legally take an action after starting to do so, the entire action is reversed and any payments already made are canceled. No abilities trigger and no effects apply as a result of an undone action. If the action was casting a spell, the spell returns to the zone it came from. The player may also reverse any legal mana abilities activated while making the illegal play, unless mana from them or from any triggered mana abilities they triggered was spent on another mana ability that wasn't reversed. Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
717.2. When reversing illegal spells and abilities, the player who had priority retains it and may take another action or pass. The player may redo the reversed action in a legal way or take any other action allowed by the rules.
...which implies you could do what the op said I guess?
Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
Since the mana ability and the effect of Drawing a card are bound in 1 ability, I assume he can't reverse the mana ability of Selvala.
Players may not reverse actions that moved cards to a library, moved cards from a library to any zone other than the stack, or caused a library to be shuffled.
Since the mana ability and the effect of Drawing a card are bound in 1 ability, I assume he can't reverse the mana ability of Selvala.
I didn't read wallycaine's post right the first time. Thanks!
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Selvala, Explorer Returned
You aren't required to cast a spell to activate her ability. So you could just tap her. Get to see everyone top deck card. Get mana and life and keep the mana until the "Phase" end. Say you use her in your first main phase. The mana will stay in the mana pool until you declare your combat phase. So you may or may not spend it as you wish.
That would let you keep failing to cast the expensive spell until you've gained as much life as you want or forced the table to draw as many cards as you want, potentially milling out every player with fewer cards in their library than you.
Seems like a bit much to all be contained in one card. Although at the moment, I can't point to anything that says you can't.
First you announce your are playing a card. You never show the card or tell the name.
Second you activate any mana ability you want. The mana goes to the mana pool
Third you play the said card and pay with the mana from the mana pool. If you don't have the mana then you can't play the announced card.
Fourth you announce any mana left in the mana pool (if there is any left). They will vanish at the end of the phase.
Where I think you misplay (and a lot of player do) is at first step. You probably say "Guys I am going to play 10CMC named card. I will play it using Selvala, Explorer Returned. Ah sorry I don't have enough mana, I untap it as I would with my land. Everyone keep his card since I taped it." But that would be exactly why you misplay. First you can't rewind play in MTG (casual game/friend party doesn't count). Next if you would have followed the step play like upside, you wouldn't have to "rewind" the game. I also don't understand why everyone would have to keep there drawn card. If you ask the play to get rewinded, everyone should have to put the drawn card on top of the library. And how can you be sure they put the right card on top of it. You also get to know everyone next drawing card.
Seriously. NO, it isn't true. Once you tap Selvala, Explorer Returned and proceed to have everyone revealing there top card, she stay tapped.
Copying the complete rules from source.
...which implies you could do what the op said I guess?
Since the mana ability and the effect of Drawing a card are bound in 1 ability, I assume he can't reverse the mana ability of Selvala.
I didn't read wallycaine's post right the first time. Thanks!