You get an Act of Treason that you don't pay mana for plus as many as you can pay for. You can choose as many targets for Harness by Force as you want, but it'll cost you 2R more for each target beyond the first.
For example, if you target three creatures, it'll cost 4RR to cast.
You get an Act of Treason that you don't pay mana for plus as many as you can pay for. You can choose as many targets for Harness by Force as you want, but it'll cost you 2R more for each target beyond the first.
For example, if you target three creatures, it'll cost 4RR to cast.
Normally I'd agree under the "additional cost" clause, but that doesn't apply here. From the comprehensive rules:
117.8d Some effects increase the cost to cast a spell or activate an ability without using the word "additional." Those are not additional costs, and are not considered until determining the total cost of a spell or ability as described in rule 601.2e.
117.8e Some effects increase the cost to cast a spell or activate an ability without using the word "additional." Those are not additional costs, and are not considered until determining the total cost of a spell or ability as described in rule 601.2e.
601.2e The player determines the total cost of the spell. Usually this is just the mana cost. Some spells have additional or alternative costs. Some effects may increase or reduce the cost to pay, or may provide other alternative costs. Costs may include paying mana, tapping permanents, sacrificing permanents, discarding cards, and so on. The total cost is the mana cost or alternative cost, plus all additional costs and cost increases, and minus all cost reductions.
As described in 601.2e, the cost increase that strive gives is determined separately from the mana cost that one may or may not need to pay.
It makes sense at first, but what trips me up is 117.9a.
117.9a Only one alternative cost can be applied to any one spell as it’s being cast. The controller of the spell announces his or her intentions to pay that cost as described in rule 601.2b.
Wouldn't applying both the strive cost and CMC cost reduction qualify as paying two alternative costs?
An alternative cost is something you pay instead of the mana cost, and "mana cost" specifically means the symbols printed in the upper-right corner of the card. When an effect tells you to cast something "without paying its mana cost" it's an alternative cost, and the mana cost is the only part you get for free. Any other cost increasers/decreasers or additional costs are still applied to figure out the total cost for casting the spell.
Strive is a cost-increasing effect, so the total cost to cast Harness by Force in the example is 0 + (2R)*N, where N is the number of additional targets.
601.2e The player determines the total cost of the spell. Usually this is just the mana cost. Some spells have additional or alternative costs. Some effects may increase or reduce the cost to pay, or may provide other alternative costs. Costs may include paying mana, tapping permanents, sacrificing permanents, discarding cards, and so on. The total cost is the mana cost or alternative cost, plus all additional costs and cost increases, and minus all cost reductions.
So yeah, the "mana cost" becomes zero due to cascade, then you add the cost increases for each additional target.
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For example, if you target three creatures, it'll cost 4RR to cast.
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Normally I'd agree under the "additional cost" clause, but that doesn't apply here. From the comprehensive rules:
117.8d Some effects increase the cost to cast a spell or activate an ability without using the word "additional." Those are not additional costs, and are not considered until determining the total cost of a spell or ability as described in rule 601.2e.
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It makes sense at first, but what trips me up is 117.9a.
Wouldn't applying both the strive cost and CMC cost reduction qualify as paying two alternative costs?
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Strive is a cost-increasing effect, so the total cost to cast Harness by Force in the example is 0 + (2R)*N, where N is the number of additional targets.
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601.2e The player determines the total cost of the spell. Usually this is just the mana cost. Some spells have additional or alternative costs. Some effects may increase or reduce the cost to pay, or may provide other alternative costs. Costs may include paying mana, tapping permanents, sacrificing permanents, discarding cards, and so on. The total cost is the mana cost or alternative cost, plus all additional costs and cost increases, and minus all cost reductions.
So yeah, the "mana cost" becomes zero due to cascade, then you add the cost increases for each additional target.