not that impressed now that the full thing is spoiled.
sure, core sets get pushed as beginner or introductory sets, but this one feels very lazy mechanically.
the walkers are kind of trash
scapeshift and crucible feel thrown in to sell the set, to bring their secondary prices down, or both. i'm not a fan of pack lotto or reprinting cards just to reprint cards.
the past few sets i've picked up multiple boxes of, this one has a handful of mediocre singles i might pick up just to try out in various casual decks and nothing more.
The whole point of a core set is to reprint cards for the sake of reprinting cards. This is the ONE set where they don't have to stick to a set theme or whatever. This is the place to print safety valves for potentially problematic cards in future sets. This is the purpose of a core set. Did you see what happened to standard in the last 2 years with core sets being dissolved? Ya, the worst set of bannings since mirrodin block.
This is a "necessary evil" for wotc to protect the game from itself.
Personally, i'm glad these are back. It was a bad idea to get rid of them in the first place.
no, the whole point of a core set is to make an approachable product for new players WHILE reprinting cards.
like, wtf in the set do crucible and scapeshift interact with? they're great reprints, they just do nothing within the set itself. on top of that, at mythic not only do they do nothing when you draft them, you can't even force them to do anything. they would've been much better off being jammed into something where they could at least see some use outside of reprinting for the sake of reprinting. it's like if they had just thrown a random karn into the set. like, thats cool but this doesn't actually belong here.
once you start getting into forced reprints for the sake of reprints territory you might as well not even have sets. when the reprints don't really push cohesion with the rest of the set, just turn it into deck builder's toolkit: value and call it a day.
no, the whole point of a core set is to make an approachable product for new players WHILE reprinting cards.
like, wtf in the set do crucible and scapeshift interact with? they're great reprints, they just do nothing within the set itself. on top of that, at mythic not only do they do nothing when you draft them, you can't even force them to do anything. they would've been much better off being jammed into something where they could at least see some use outside of reprinting for the sake of reprinting. it's like if they had just thrown a random karn into the set. like, thats cool but this doesn't actually belong here.
once you start getting into forced reprints for the sake of reprints territory you might as well not even have sets. when the reprints don't really push cohesion with the rest of the set, just turn it into deck builder's toolkit: value and call it a day.
Scapeshift is just mana fixing in limited. Its pretty bad in general, but given you play 3+ color and splash all the elder dragons and multicolor cards you might find it useful to hit your 5-color manabase.
And in the very late game it "extracts" all the lands from your deck to give you non-land draws.
So its not "unplayable" bad , but it doesnt really support a theme in a direct way.
Crucible is somewhere along that line too, its just even more generic and specialized. You need some form of discard and/or self mill to get it going, so its almost impossible to get it going for any kind of value (which means at least playing 2+ lands of it).
If you have a deck that can self-mill (which is almost guaranteed black) , Desecrated Tomb does a hell better job given you value from all forms of creature recursion in the set.
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These cards really only exist for money value and being able to play them in limited for any reasonable effect is just "accidentally" (but Scapeshift seems very plausibly if you have a reason to splash up to 5 colors).
The reasonable rarity for the effect would have been uncommon. All it does is fixing your mana and as uncommon you could somewhat reliable get one in draft to make a green deck splash much better.
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Coresets are great to reprint some generic land cycles, which they didnt do.
It also amplifies the core mechanics of the colors, to ensure colors have an identity, so especially new players get a feeling for what a color is going to do ; expansion sets mess with that a lot, especially if special mechanics are introduced across the colors that bind some color combinations much more to that mechanic, rather than the colors actual identity.
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A bunch of reprints are "extremely" terrible choices.
I mean looking at Pelakka Wurm upshifted to rare makes me downright angry, and if a card does that, the designer made a tremendous mistake.
All the rarity upshift is terrible and every time they do it, it pisses people off MASSIVELY.
Its a 100% guaranteed feels bad moment, something they normally want to avoid, while here they DIRECTLY push it and nobody in design and R&D felt thats just plain wrong ? What are they drinking ? Everyone at vacation at that time ? This cannot be an accident, the person that did this needs to get kicked out immediately, thats how terrible that move is (and every person that thinks just 5 seconds will come to the conclusion that upshifting rarities is something you have to avoid 100% , every single time you "want" to upshift a card to rare, you have to question your motive and simply throw the card away and design a new card to fill that slot).
Theres simply no excuse for this crap, its like they STEAL a rare slot, and i will shred every single Pelakka Wurm and hate them deeply for it (and they could avoid this so easily ... ).
I am buying a bundle cause I like the boxes, booklet, and if I preorder from my store it is a pretty good deal. I am also buying a couple of PW decks cause I like some of the cards(Liliana, Serra's Guardian, Ajani, Sarkhan, Dragonsoul etc.). Also getting a discount for preordering it is not too bad of a deal. I will also do a prerelease event and some FNM draft to get some of the promos. I like the opportunity to get Scapeshift and Crucible of Worlds which have been two cards I have recently been looking at buying as singles and will buy them as singles if I don't get them.
It feels great cracking packs but the number of cards I already have and/or don't want is just too high as opposed to Dominaria.
I open packs only if I want commons and uncommons.. rares are too random and unlikely to get (mythics even worse)
Looking at this set I am probably saying Nay. There is a bunch of really powerful new blue 3 drops but a lot of the other powerful uncommons are reprints from recent sets. As for the rares there are some really useful pieces of hate but there is no rare lands and they are where the real money is... considering the probability of shock lands in RTRTR I'd save my money for that, Dominaria is also still really good even at the common/uncommon level.
I would like to preorder some singles I need though....
Riku of Two Reflections - Copy, then copy again | Shattergang Brothers - Token Sac&Recur | Gahiji, Honored One - Multiple attack steps | Karametra, God of Harvests - Landfall, Creaturefall, Shroud | Ruhan of the Fomori - Stop hitting yourself | Zurgo Helmsmasher - Equipment&Wraths | Crosis, the Purger - Dragon Tribal Reanimator | Derevi, Empyrial Tactician - No stax, just tap and untap fun | Anafenza, the Foremost - Enduring Ideal Enchantress | Sharuum, the Hegemon - Sphinx Tribal Control | Noyan Dar - Spellslinger | The Mimeoplasm - Counterpalooza
Lists can be found here.
Still convinced the guy on Beseech the Queen is wearing a Mitra-type hat. Wake up sheeple!
On paper (grin) it looks cool. I'll wait to see how it plays out during the prerelease. That's where I usually get a good feel for whether it's worth it or not.
It's more or less what a typical core set looks like. I know I'll be buying some singles due to their reprinting causing price reductions, but outside of that, I'm not so sure.
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'buster
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not that impressed now that the full thing is spoiled.
sure, core sets get pushed as beginner or introductory sets, but this one feels very lazy mechanically.
the walkers are kind of trash
scapeshift and crucible feel thrown in to sell the set, to bring their secondary prices down, or both. i'm not a fan of pack lotto or reprinting cards just to reprint cards.
the past few sets i've picked up multiple boxes of, this one has a handful of mediocre singles i might pick up just to try out in various casual decks and nothing more.
The whole point of a core set is to reprint cards for the sake of reprinting cards. This is the ONE set where they don't have to stick to a set theme or whatever. This is the place to print safety valves for potentially problematic cards in future sets. This is the purpose of a core set. Did you see what happened to standard in the last 2 years with core sets being dissolved? Ya, the worst set of bannings since mirrodin block.
This is a "necessary evil" for wotc to protect the game from itself.
Personally, i'm glad these are back. It was a bad idea to get rid of them in the first place.
no, the whole point of a core set is to make an approachable product for new players WHILE reprinting cards.
like, wtf in the set do crucible and scapeshift interact with? they're great reprints, they just do nothing within the set itself. on top of that, at mythic not only do they do nothing when you draft them, you can't even force them to do anything. they would've been much better off being jammed into something where they could at least see some use outside of reprinting for the sake of reprinting. it's like if they had just thrown a random karn into the set. like, thats cool but this doesn't actually belong here.
once you start getting into forced reprints for the sake of reprints territory you might as well not even have sets. when the reprints don't really push cohesion with the rest of the set, just turn it into deck builder's toolkit: value and call it a day.
So explain to me then, what did Scapeshift do in its original printing? It didn't fit either the flavor or had any use in limited in Lorwyn. Same thing for crucible, which was in fifth dawn. There wasn't any land theme in that deck, it was all about sunburst.
I stand by the idea that core sets shouldn't be designed for limited and only a sort of "dumping grounds" for needed reprints. It's the set that gives you safety valves too. It's a necessary "evil" for wotc in order to keep the rest of the format balanced and without bannings (or at least as much as possible).
I'm not sure why nobody wants to entertain anything different in this thread? Like..."NO EVERY SET NEEDS TO BE COHESIVE AND DESIGNED FOR LIMITED OR THEN THEY SHOULD JUST IMPLODE!!!". Really? There is literally no other options but this?
C'mon now. Just look at the history of the core sets. Most were pretty awful for drafting (Titan or bust!) and Origins was a massive departure from what the core sets were before that.
Core sets are the hedge against a constructed environment gone wild. It's the buffer the game needs to ensure "regulation" by the supposed printing of environmental control cards that have no real storyline connectivity to the sets adjacent to it. Core sets act--or should act--as the government set to ensure everything plays out smoothly around it.
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I see a lot of great cards for my decks, like Sai, Master Thopterist, Angel of the Dawn, Remorseful Cleric, Salvager of Secrets, Frilled Sea Serpent and Supreme Phantom - for my Silas Renn, Avacyn, Thrasios and Geist decks, respectively.
Overall, pretty good set. I love that they made plane-specific cards for it, similar to Magic Origins, and focused on a core story for this set, instead of generic Shandalar trash that is pointless in relation to the story or flavor of the cards as core sets of the past did. I loved Magic Origins and while this isn't as solid as that one was, it's certainly a lot of fun identifying cards by their planes.
I think the mythics are fairly decent power level and I like a lot of the Mythics. When it comes to the rares though they don't even have a rare land cycle reprint. There is no money to be had in the rares and due to this, I would say I wouldn't buy any packs of the set other than to do draft / pre release and even then I would be hesitant to do that more than a few times.
I will do the pre release event and maybe I would draft it once or twice but I feel like overall I would rather draft about anything else. I will buy singles for the things I want because opening packs seems to be a bad prospect.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
[quote from="Xcric »" url="/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/new-card-discussion/793735-core-19-yay-or-nay?comment=27"]
I mean looking at Pelakka Wurm upshifted to rare makes me downright angry, and if a card does that, the designer made a tremendous mistake.
All the rarity upshift is terrible and every time they do it, it pisses people off MASSIVELY.
Its a 100% guaranteed feels bad moment, something they normally want to avoid, while here they DIRECTLY push it and nobody in design and R&D felt thats just plain wrong ? What are they drinking ? Everyone at vacation at that time ? This cannot be an accident, the person that did this needs to get kicked out immediately, thats how terrible that move is (and every person that thinks just 5 seconds will come to the conclusion that upshifting rarities is something you have to avoid 100% , every single time you "want" to upshift a card to rare, you have to question your motive and simply throw the card away and design a new card to fill that slot).
Theres simply no excuse for this crap, its like they STEAL a rare slot, and i will shred every single Pelakka Wurm and hate them deeply for it (and they could avoid this so easily ... ).
God ...
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While I ageee with the general premise here, I don't necessarily agree with the implications drawn from it.
If a card "needs" to have its rarity increased later, a mistake has certainly been made somewhere down the line.
Anther vial, sensei's divining too, and mana drain are probably a bit too powerful to have been printed at uncommon.
With that said, I do not think that the proper response is to abandon those cards forever and simply make new cards that are printed in the right rarity... because of eternal formats.
If we get a weakened uncommon version of mana drain or a similarly powerful mythic version of mana drain from a new set, the original mana drain doesn't go away. Instead, we end up with eternal formats where players are effectively playing 8 mana drains/aether vials and the price of the originals continues to soar.
This is especially true for singleton formats, where having three versions of a broken card can warp the format far more than simply reprinting it at an appropriate rarity.
With that said, the pelaka wurm business is a fiasco. I do not support that decision at all.
If they change rarity for "master" sets that are 100% reprints, and they shift stuff like Force of Will or Mana Drain you can "hardly" blame them at all.
But that is something you can totally get behind.
Its an ENTIRELY different story for some stuff like Pelakka Wurm , god damn Pelakka Wurm, seriously ...
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The cards unquestionable GOOD in limited and its a great card, but shifting it up is a guaranteed 100% feels bad moment and its simply DOOMED to be worthless , as you have the card as uncommon.
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In limited Sensei's Divining Top and Aether Vial arent even crazy , they are just playable and abusing them isnt a given at all, nothing gets hurt making them uncommon ; and the ONLY reason they are upshifted is how much money they packed.
But aside all that, if a card is a reprint of an expensive card, the rarity should not be shifted just because the card is expensive.
If the card is in everyone right mind a rare/mythic level card (like Force of will unquestionable is), the upshift is totally justified , but in the end, the card is only reprinted to please the reprint market of players that want the card reprinted, so theres no real concern for limited at all by reprinting these "very special" cards (but WotC really badly tries in a horrible way to make even Master sets somehow about "limited" , which is a cruel joke anyway).
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For consistency sake it would be a good rule to simply argue that every upshift in rarity is bad.
If you need to do that in a "standard legal set" , you better question if you not make a new card that fits the rarity you want, instead of reprinting a card in a higher rarity.
The feel bad moment of opening a former uncommon thats worth 1 cent as a RARE is just borderline bad and avoiding it is FREE, theres simply no reason to do that crap, it only pisses people off and that cannot ever be a good business decision at all.
And like for every rule Master sets and stuff like Promo cards for Judge Rewards etc. are a entirely different deal, they can go wild reprinting whatever at whatever, people are only concerned that the set has enough value to justify the tremendously overblown money they charge for the packs, so do whatever to please the customers.
I think the set is worth buying, but the prices are artificial on the singles market. Wizards appears to be severely throttling the release of each set now and is avoiding releasing the flood-gates until a few months past release. This is why Karn, Scion of Urza costed 60 dollars at one point when Gideon, Ally of Zendikar at his peak was only 34-35 dollars. Yes he goes in any color, but that was only part of the reason his price was high. We're probably going to see artificially high prices on cards like Tezzeret, Artifice Master for a while after release.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I think the set is worth buying, but the prices are artificial on the singles market. Wizards appears to be severely throttling the release of each set now and is avoiding releasing the flood-gates until a few months past release. This is why Karn, Scion of Urza costed 60 dollars at one point when Gideon, Ally of Zendikar at his peak was only 34-35 dollars. Yes he goes in any color, but that was only part of the reason his price was high. We're probably going to see artificially high prices on cards like Tezzeret, Artifice Master for a while after release.
There are a lot of reasons for the price to be different, but to claim intentional limiting of supply as the reason makes little sense. Maybe it is because Gideon did nothing in Modern whereas Karn has been tried in other formats. Maybe it is because Battle For Zendikar had Masterpieces to eat up a bit of each boxes value. Maybe it is because the Masterpieces created a scenario where people opened a lot more product than they would have without them.
I could see it be un-intentional (ie, Wizards underestimated the demand) but to say this is a deliberate attempt on their part to increase secondary market prices for <reasons> is just tin-foil hat thinking. A lot of cards are overcosted when they are first released and Planeswalkers are not exempted from that. The fact that Karn goes into any deck and can be good in multiple formats contribute to his higher than average price-tag. But pointing to one card as being expensive does not indicate a conscious decision on Wizards part to throttle supply since I don't recall seeing anything else in the set that seemed to be exorbitantly high.
I think the set is worth buying, but the prices are artificial on the singles market. Wizards appears to be severely throttling the release of each set now and is avoiding releasing the flood-gates until a few months past release. This is why Karn, Scion of Urza costed 60 dollars at one point when Gideon, Ally of Zendikar at his peak was only 34-35 dollars. Yes he goes in any color, but that was only part of the reason his price was high. We're probably going to see artificially high prices on cards like Tezzeret, Artifice Master for a while after release.
There are a lot of reasons for the price to be different, but to claim intentional limiting of supply as the reason makes little sense. Maybe it is because Gideon did nothing in Modern whereas Karn has been tried in other formats. Maybe it is because Battle For Zendikar had Masterpieces to eat up a bit of each boxes value. Maybe it is because the Masterpieces created a scenario where people opened a lot more product than they would have without them.
I could see it be un-intentional (ie, Wizards underestimated the demand) but to say this is a deliberate attempt on their part to increase secondary market prices for <reasons> is just tin-foil hat thinking. A lot of cards are overcosted when they are first released and Planeswalkers are not exempted from that. The fact that Karn goes into any deck and can be good in multiple formats contribute to his higher than average price-tag. But pointing to one card as being expensive does not indicate a conscious decision on Wizards part to throttle supply since I don't recall seeing anything else in the set that seemed to be exorbitantly high.
The part about this I find the most interesting is that you think that I believe wizards is intentionally selling less product, therefore losing money from sales, for the sake of a healthier market.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
The part about this I find the most interesting is that you think that I believe wizards is intentionally selling less product, therefore losing money from sales, for the sake of a healthier market.
I don't think you think it is in the name of a healthier market. But you did say:
Wizards appears to be severely throttling the release of each set now and is avoiding releasing the flood-gates until a few months past release
This seemed to imply that you think this throttling was intentional. If not, what is that statement meant to say? What is the reason you think this is happening? I disagree that it is happening at all, but I am curious as to what prompted you to make the statement to begin with or what you think the possible reasons for this throttling could be.
The part about this I find the most interesting is that you think that I believe wizards is intentionally selling less product, therefore losing money from sales, for the sake of a healthier market.
I don't think you think it is in the name of a healthier market. But you did say:
Wizards appears to be severely throttling the release of each set now and is avoiding releasing the flood-gates until a few months past release
This seemed to imply that you think this throttling was intentional. If not, what is that statement meant to say? What is the reason you think this is happening? I disagree that it is happening at all, but I am curious as to what prompted you to make the statement to begin with or what you think the possible reasons for this throttling could be.
It is intentional. The sales were down in the trading cards market and all the trading card companies throttled down in anticipation of a weaker market. It's basically the same situation that happened with the recession around Lorwyn block. The difference is that we are in the print to demand age, so if sales are strong for a set they can rev up the run.
The thing is they likely just had not one, not two, but three successful sets in a row, so I'm imagining we will see the typical market flood we are used to come Ravnica Alliances.
The singles prices are floaty because of the circumstances more than anything else, so its unusually profitable for mass box openers right now. That's also why boxes for players were a little scarcer than usual while fat packs were still fine in availability.
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1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Power level is dismal, value rightnow terrible. I do not loke coresets ever since they decided to chnage the name and started creating new cards for them on the excuse of plummeting sales, bad card choices was more like it.
Yay here. It is a solid core set, the commons are simple but flavorful, the uncommons are more complex and teaches the noobs, the rares are moderately complex and obviously made for modern and standard competitive play, and the mythics are all awesome. It is a blast to draft, and contains a lot of tools for Commander. All in all a solid 8 on a 10 point scale.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
After playing League heavily, I really like this set almost as much as Dominaria. Yes there are some garbage rares and mythics, but when aren't there.
However, there are some many different styles of decks you can build out of Core19 limited, lots of variety. I've got a legit UB Mill deck going (Turn 6 mill) and at the same time a GW agro deck. Met many BW and RW decks as well. That isn't even counting all the people going three color for an Elder dragon. When you can sit down in a night for 30 games of league, and have 6-7 different styles of decks to verse, its a good night.
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no, the whole point of a core set is to make an approachable product for new players WHILE reprinting cards.
like, wtf in the set do crucible and scapeshift interact with? they're great reprints, they just do nothing within the set itself. on top of that, at mythic not only do they do nothing when you draft them, you can't even force them to do anything. they would've been much better off being jammed into something where they could at least see some use outside of reprinting for the sake of reprinting. it's like if they had just thrown a random karn into the set. like, thats cool but this doesn't actually belong here.
once you start getting into forced reprints for the sake of reprints territory you might as well not even have sets. when the reprints don't really push cohesion with the rest of the set, just turn it into deck builder's toolkit: value and call it a day.
Scapeshift is just mana fixing in limited. Its pretty bad in general, but given you play 3+ color and splash all the elder dragons and multicolor cards you might find it useful to hit your 5-color manabase.
And in the very late game it "extracts" all the lands from your deck to give you non-land draws.
So its not "unplayable" bad , but it doesnt really support a theme in a direct way.
Crucible is somewhere along that line too, its just even more generic and specialized. You need some form of discard and/or self mill to get it going, so its almost impossible to get it going for any kind of value (which means at least playing 2+ lands of it).
If you have a deck that can self-mill (which is almost guaranteed black) , Desecrated Tomb does a hell better job given you value from all forms of creature recursion in the set.
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These cards really only exist for money value and being able to play them in limited for any reasonable effect is just "accidentally" (but Scapeshift seems very plausibly if you have a reason to splash up to 5 colors).
The reasonable rarity for the effect would have been uncommon. All it does is fixing your mana and as uncommon you could somewhat reliable get one in draft to make a green deck splash much better.
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Coresets are great to reprint some generic land cycles, which they didnt do.
It also amplifies the core mechanics of the colors, to ensure colors have an identity, so especially new players get a feeling for what a color is going to do ; expansion sets mess with that a lot, especially if special mechanics are introduced across the colors that bind some color combinations much more to that mechanic, rather than the colors actual identity.
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A bunch of reprints are "extremely" terrible choices.
I mean looking at Pelakka Wurm upshifted to rare makes me downright angry, and if a card does that, the designer made a tremendous mistake.
All the rarity upshift is terrible and every time they do it, it pisses people off MASSIVELY.
Its a 100% guaranteed feels bad moment, something they normally want to avoid, while here they DIRECTLY push it and nobody in design and R&D felt thats just plain wrong ? What are they drinking ? Everyone at vacation at that time ? This cannot be an accident, the person that did this needs to get kicked out immediately, thats how terrible that move is (and every person that thinks just 5 seconds will come to the conclusion that upshifting rarities is something you have to avoid 100% , every single time you "want" to upshift a card to rare, you have to question your motive and simply throw the card away and design a new card to fill that slot).
Theres simply no excuse for this crap, its like they STEAL a rare slot, and i will shred every single Pelakka Wurm and hate them deeply for it (and they could avoid this so easily ... ).
God ...
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WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
It feels great cracking packs but the number of cards I already have and/or don't want is just too high as opposed to Dominaria.
Looking at this set I am probably saying Nay. There is a bunch of really powerful new blue 3 drops but a lot of the other powerful uncommons are reprints from recent sets. As for the rares there are some really useful pieces of hate but there is no rare lands and they are where the real money is... considering the probability of shock lands in RTRTR I'd save my money for that, Dominaria is also still really good even at the common/uncommon level.
I would like to preorder some singles I need though....
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
Tamanoa - Welcome to the Jungle
Lists can be found here.
It's more or less what a typical core set looks like. I know I'll be buying some singles due to their reprinting causing price reductions, but outside of that, I'm not so sure.
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
So explain to me then, what did Scapeshift do in its original printing? It didn't fit either the flavor or had any use in limited in Lorwyn. Same thing for crucible, which was in fifth dawn. There wasn't any land theme in that deck, it was all about sunburst.
I stand by the idea that core sets shouldn't be designed for limited and only a sort of "dumping grounds" for needed reprints. It's the set that gives you safety valves too. It's a necessary "evil" for wotc in order to keep the rest of the format balanced and without bannings (or at least as much as possible).
I'm not sure why nobody wants to entertain anything different in this thread? Like..."NO EVERY SET NEEDS TO BE COHESIVE AND DESIGNED FOR LIMITED OR THEN THEY SHOULD JUST IMPLODE!!!". Really? There is literally no other options but this?
C'mon now. Just look at the history of the core sets. Most were pretty awful for drafting (Titan or bust!) and Origins was a massive departure from what the core sets were before that.
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
I see a lot of great cards for my decks, like Sai, Master Thopterist, Angel of the Dawn, Remorseful Cleric, Salvager of Secrets, Frilled Sea Serpent and Supreme Phantom - for my Silas Renn, Avacyn, Thrasios and Geist decks, respectively.
Overall, pretty good set. I love that they made plane-specific cards for it, similar to Magic Origins, and focused on a core story for this set, instead of generic Shandalar trash that is pointless in relation to the story or flavor of the cards as core sets of the past did. I loved Magic Origins and while this isn't as solid as that one was, it's certainly a lot of fun identifying cards by their planes.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
I will do the pre release event and maybe I would draft it once or twice but I feel like overall I would rather draft about anything else. I will buy singles for the things I want because opening packs seems to be a bad prospect.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
While I ageee with the general premise here, I don't necessarily agree with the implications drawn from it.
If a card "needs" to have its rarity increased later, a mistake has certainly been made somewhere down the line.
Anther vial, sensei's divining too, and mana drain are probably a bit too powerful to have been printed at uncommon.
With that said, I do not think that the proper response is to abandon those cards forever and simply make new cards that are printed in the right rarity... because of eternal formats.
If we get a weakened uncommon version of mana drain or a similarly powerful mythic version of mana drain from a new set, the original mana drain doesn't go away. Instead, we end up with eternal formats where players are effectively playing 8 mana drains/aether vials and the price of the originals continues to soar.
This is especially true for singleton formats, where having three versions of a broken card can warp the format far more than simply reprinting it at an appropriate rarity.
With that said, the pelaka wurm business is a fiasco. I do not support that decision at all.
If they change rarity for "master" sets that are 100% reprints, and they shift stuff like Force of Will or Mana Drain you can "hardly" blame them at all.
But that is something you can totally get behind.
Its an ENTIRELY different story for some stuff like Pelakka Wurm , god damn Pelakka Wurm, seriously ...
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The cards unquestionable GOOD in limited and its a great card, but shifting it up is a guaranteed 100% feels bad moment and its simply DOOMED to be worthless , as you have the card as uncommon.
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In limited Sensei's Divining Top and Aether Vial arent even crazy , they are just playable and abusing them isnt a given at all, nothing gets hurt making them uncommon ; and the ONLY reason they are upshifted is how much money they packed.
But aside all that, if a card is a reprint of an expensive card, the rarity should not be shifted just because the card is expensive.
If the card is in everyone right mind a rare/mythic level card (like Force of will unquestionable is), the upshift is totally justified , but in the end, the card is only reprinted to please the reprint market of players that want the card reprinted, so theres no real concern for limited at all by reprinting these "very special" cards (but WotC really badly tries in a horrible way to make even Master sets somehow about "limited" , which is a cruel joke anyway).
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For consistency sake it would be a good rule to simply argue that every upshift in rarity is bad.
If you need to do that in a "standard legal set" , you better question if you not make a new card that fits the rarity you want, instead of reprinting a card in a higher rarity.
The feel bad moment of opening a former uncommon thats worth 1 cent as a RARE is just borderline bad and avoiding it is FREE, theres simply no reason to do that crap, it only pisses people off and that cannot ever be a good business decision at all.
And like for every rule Master sets and stuff like Promo cards for Judge Rewards etc. are a entirely different deal, they can go wild reprinting whatever at whatever, people are only concerned that the set has enough value to justify the tremendously overblown money they charge for the packs, so do whatever to please the customers.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
However, I do like the new Green stuff they're making in this set. I might rejoin Standard. Still wish Detention Center didn't exist.
Vintage >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Legacy
I could see it be un-intentional (ie, Wizards underestimated the demand) but to say this is a deliberate attempt on their part to increase secondary market prices for <reasons> is just tin-foil hat thinking. A lot of cards are overcosted when they are first released and Planeswalkers are not exempted from that. The fact that Karn goes into any deck and can be good in multiple formats contribute to his higher than average price-tag. But pointing to one card as being expensive does not indicate a conscious decision on Wizards part to throttle supply since I don't recall seeing anything else in the set that seemed to be exorbitantly high.
The part about this I find the most interesting is that you think that I believe wizards is intentionally selling less product, therefore losing money from sales, for the sake of a healthier market.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
This seemed to imply that you think this throttling was intentional. If not, what is that statement meant to say? What is the reason you think this is happening? I disagree that it is happening at all, but I am curious as to what prompted you to make the statement to begin with or what you think the possible reasons for this throttling could be.
It is intentional. The sales were down in the trading cards market and all the trading card companies throttled down in anticipation of a weaker market. It's basically the same situation that happened with the recession around Lorwyn block. The difference is that we are in the print to demand age, so if sales are strong for a set they can rev up the run.
The thing is they likely just had not one, not two, but three successful sets in a row, so I'm imagining we will see the typical market flood we are used to come Ravnica Alliances.
The singles prices are floaty because of the circumstances more than anything else, so its unusually profitable for mass box openers right now. That's also why boxes for players were a little scarcer than usual while fat packs were still fine in availability.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
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Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
yea
adverb archaic formal
1. yes.
"she has the right to say yea or nay"
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Want to play a UW control deck in modern, but don't have jace or snaps?
Please come visit us at the Emeria Titan control thread
However, there are some many different styles of decks you can build out of Core19 limited, lots of variety. I've got a legit UB Mill deck going (Turn 6 mill) and at the same time a GW agro deck. Met many BW and RW decks as well. That isn't even counting all the people going three color for an Elder dragon. When you can sit down in a night for 30 games of league, and have 6-7 different styles of decks to verse, its a good night.