New mechanics, one of which is entirely parasitic and requires playing bad cards to use, and the other (vehicles) is just plain stupid. I thought they couldn't get worse than BfZ or Eldrazistrad, but they seem to want to stop themselves in crappy cards department. Nothing from this set would see play in any actual set (like Mirrodin 1, the best block ever created that coincidentally is the first set I ever played). Only because we have such a powered down noob friendly standard will any of these actually see a constructed table.
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Okay, now that we have the usual "Newest set is the worst set EVER!!!!!!!" post out of the way, what from the set has your attention?
Rashmi seems like she will be a great control engine if we get any decent counter magic. Saheeli seems like a decent Izzet walker for what she does.
Your thoughts?
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Level 1 Judge
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
Homelands is a hard animal to beat for worst set. If I recall correctly WotC required a certain number of cards from each set their decks so everyone just playedSerrated Arrows . I also remember searching every card list trying to make Baron Sengir worthwhile.
I haven't seen enough of the set to fabricate any negative opinions on it.
The vehicle mechanic feels like another attempt to fix banding. I don't feel it's a terrible mechanic (yet) and I'm sure it'll find use in token heavy decks. It does feel... restrictive. At worst, Skysovereign, Consul Flagship feels like a bad Lightning Bolt variant. At best, it's got a big target on its underbelly.
The energy counters just irked me. I didn't like the "one off" nature of the Clue Tokens (I liked the clues, wish there were more) and I wonder if this is just another gimmicky counter I'll have to track for a mere handful of cards. I would be interested to see what new cards, if any, destroy energy counters like Clock Spinning or convert energy counters to usable mana. I'm sure it's a one-off but I hope there's ore than just a handful 9f cards. I'll wait and see.
Vehicles are weird. It's like they took the terrible proto-equipment like Power Armor and turned it on its head. That said, I'm pretty excited for it. Even just the few we've seen look interesting if not exactly constructed playable. Depala might change my mind on that, depending on how good dwarves turn out to be.
Everything in this set is very elegantly designed. Fabricate, helps create creature etbing triggers, helps with sac or token strategies, creates blockers, artifact matters stuff or simply pumps your guy. Vehicles are also designed very well and create interesting dynamics. Energy is unique in that it gives us as a player this entirely new resource to find ways to abuse. Everything I was hoping for and more mechanically and flavor wise. Drafting and sealed is going to be insanely fun. I'm mainly a legacy/cube player so the threshold for cards to be played in my world are pretty high, but this set is a home run. So much refreshing aesthetics and new interesting things being explored.
Honestly, it's hitting a lot of Ravnica for me: Specifically the first set in the original Ravnica block, before Guildpact or Dissention. I don't think it'll be a bad set, but I think that it will run into the issue Rav did of wonderful flavor and good cards, but mostly useless mechanics that are either useful on one card (ie: Convoke) or totally worthless (ie: Radiance), with one that'll probably be format warping (ie: Dredge).
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Cyme we inne frið, fram the grip of deaþ to lif inne ðis smylte land.
Vehicles look amazing! A great way to minimize a downside of equipment. Energy counters are meh, however theres only like 20 cards spoiled from this set so far, so maybe they will make it better. Im glad that each energy card so far has been both an engine and a payoff, or else it would be a terrible mechanic. The new simic legend is fantastic for edh, im already brewing, and the izzet walker will for sure see play in almost every format imo
Overall, very excited for this set. If the rest of the set is pure poo, then at least they hit it home with the first few, and i would only be mildly disappointed. I was entirely uninterested during spoiler season for both SOI and EDM, its a good feeling to be excited during spoiler season again
I hate Vehicles, both their concept and their design. Come on, cars in Magic: The Gathering? Their playability doesn't look very appealing to me either.
Fabricate doesn't seem very original to me. I bet Mark Rosewater created that one because it just mixes the things he enjoys most (tokens and counters).
On the other hand Energy looks interesting to me, I think it has a lot of design space if they keep using it in future blocks.
The vehicle card template pisses me off. I understand they aren't Creatures. But only Creatures should get a Power/Toughness box. This is going to bite the butt for Wizards so hard Maro will shame himself on the next State of Design article.
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Wanted -Zombie Foils and older expensive Zombie stuff. High Priority- Beta Z Master/ Int. Collector's Edition.
Even though the thread is satire, it's kind of comical in a tragic way that people flocked in to agree without reading the first post. Satire aside, do people make these threads out of some sort of unspoken obligation for every set that ever comes out, or is it just because it's edgy and cool to be cynical on the internet? Honestly not sure which, but most of the complaints in the replies are entirely nonsensical.
Honestly laughing at the vehicle hate some are giving, considering the same reaction for every new type/design ever. DFCs anyone? Yeah, wait and see.
I hate Vehicles, both their concept and their design. Come on, cars in Magic: The Gathering?
But no male Angels because that's too much for a fantasy game.
BTW I don't like India lore/mythology or Artifacts, so you can just imagine how I feel about Kaladesh. I don't even like Chandra. Or Red for that matter lol.
Looking through the spoilers I couldn't help but think of anakin skywalker running around on his pod racer on tatooine lol. Hope the set turns out better than episode one and I also hope vehicles don't suck as much as I think they do.
Vehicles are weird. It's like they took the terrible proto-equipment like Power Armor and turned it on its head. That said, I'm pretty excited for it. Even just the few we've seen look interesting if not exactly constructed playable. Depala might change my mind on that, depending on how good dwarves turn out to be.
I'm just happy that they brought back dwarves, period. I don't care if they're playable.
The vehicle card template pisses me off. I understand they aren't Creatures. But only Creatures should get a Power/Toughness box. This is going to bite the butt for Wizards so hard Maro will shame himself on the next State of Design article.
They turn into Creatures, which is why they get power and toughness. It's like the Gods from Theros in a way.
Personally I am loving the flavor. Mechanics seem plenty solid overall, even if I doubt I'll use them, not an artifact person. But it looks fun overall, better than Innistrad was for me.
WOTC has said they want to move away from on-board tricks because they lead to stupid plays that make people feel bad.
Vehicle crewing at instant speed during combat is going to cause this.
Looking through the spoilers I couldn't help but think of anakin skywalker running around on his pod racer on tatooine lol. Hope the set turns out better than episode one and I also hope vehicles don't suck as much as I think they do.
So you have to cast a sizable creature and a cheesy artifact to attack next turn after they killed your creature and ship. This won't work for standard and especially any other sets. All I have been seeing in mtg these last couple of years is cards that need other cards to work. Like waste lands which is so nobody worth playing basically only a colorless deck. These cards don't even look good paying a dollar for. I don't want to open a pack with these silly cards in them.
So you have to cast a sizable creature and a cheesy artifact to attack next turn after they killed your creature and ship. This won't work for standard and especially any other sets. All I have been seeing in mtg these last couple of years is cards that need other cards to work. Like waste lands which is so nobody worth playing basically only a colorless deck. These cards don't even look good paying a dollar for. I don't want to open a pack with these silly cards in them.
People who play Commander would beg to differ on the Wastes bit. Although they aren't for everyone, there is definitely an audience for them. And Vehicles feel like Equipment but in a different way, I wouldn't say they're bad just yet. You don't need to have only one creature either, the ability to use multiple creatures to pay for Crew makes it flexible.
This first batch of cards is a pile of crap play wise, but they're silly and make me giggle, so I'm probably in for a box. These cards are dumb and I love it.
When I first saw Vehicles yesterday, I thought they were a huge flavor fail and wouldn't fit into Mtg at all. However, sleeping over it and seeing more cards of the set, it now seems very fitting to this particular world and its feel to me. I also like the execution a lot, especially the creatures profiting from crewing a vehicle. There is that dwarf legend which would certainly die when attacking and can be protected by riding a vehicle and the guy girl that grants haste when crewing.
On the other hand, I am still very sceptical about energy counters. Me (and my whole EDH playgroup) didn't like experience counters at all, because you can't interact with them after they were gained, and this seems pretty similar. Also it adds another resource to the game, making it even harder for new player to get started.
I'd say Fabricate is a really good, albeit very basic mechanic. Sadly, it will probably be limited-only and not be seen on constructed playable cards (see Cohort, Rally, Ingest, Support, etc).
Edit: Oh and I really like the Vehicle border. It looks gorgeous and (together with the P/T) clearly communicates "This may look like an artifact, but it's actually a creature (kinda).".
Fallen Empires and Prophecy both give Homelands a run for it's money as worst set ever, but yes Kaladesh is definitely looking like it will be worse than just printing blank cards... Energy!?!?! What are we now playing Pokémon??? (and before 90% of you answer "We'll, yes I am playing Pokémon... right now in fact.", I'm talking about the Pokémon CCG, NOT Pokémon Go) Vehicles?!? Seriously?!? I mean, are we going to have to endure hearing things like "My Winnebago blocks your VW Bus and taps to put you Bugatti in the shop for two turns."??? And Fabricate??? We already have a crappy thing called Fabricate, did we really need another??? I mean c'mon Wizards, all you care about is money and you never care about the players and you are killing the game and dumbing the game down for n00bs and Maro should be fired and where are our Contraptions and and and.......
But on a serious note, other than a few campy card names (I admit I laughed a bit when I saw Start Your Engines and Speedway Fanatic) the set mechanics look pretty cool.
Mechanics are so far very Meh. Fabricate is a solid but pretty boring mechanic that looks like it will be fun to play with and well balanced. Crew/Vehicles is interesting new design space that I'm excited to play with. Energy counters are just dumb. They are parasitic and don't do anything by themselves, unlike similar counters and pseudo counters of the past: +1/+1 counters, clue tokens, Spawn/scion tokens, Gold tokens. I'm sure wizards will push it enough for standard though making it be another thing I need to track as a player.
Individual card design is hit and miss. At the moment, the biggest myth for me is Verdurous Gearhulk. There is no good reason for Hulk to be a mythic. It doesn't do anything mechanically complex or interesting and is effectively just a big dumb beater. Just because a card is efficient, doesn't mean it should be a mythic. At the moment, my favorite card is Inventor's Fair, but that is only because I enjoy Lantern Control.
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Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
- Manite
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Okay, now that we have the usual "Newest set is the worst set EVER!!!!!!!" post out of the way, what from the set has your attention?
Rashmi seems like she will be a great control engine if we get any decent counter magic. Saheeli seems like a decent Izzet walker for what she does.
Your thoughts?
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
I haven't seen enough of the set to fabricate any negative opinions on it.
The vehicle mechanic feels like another attempt to fix banding. I don't feel it's a terrible mechanic (yet) and I'm sure it'll find use in token heavy decks. It does feel... restrictive. At worst, Skysovereign, Consul Flagship feels like a bad Lightning Bolt variant. At best, it's got a big target on its underbelly.
The energy counters just irked me. I didn't like the "one off" nature of the Clue Tokens (I liked the clues, wish there were more) and I wonder if this is just another gimmicky counter I'll have to track for a mere handful of cards. I would be interested to see what new cards, if any, destroy energy counters like Clock Spinning or convert energy counters to usable mana. I'm sure it's a one-off but I hope there's ore than just a handful 9f cards. I'll wait and see.
Overall, very excited for this set. If the rest of the set is pure poo, then at least they hit it home with the first few, and i would only be mildly disappointed. I was entirely uninterested during spoiler season for both SOI and EDM, its a good feeling to be excited during spoiler season again
UWRjeskai nahiri UWR
UBRgrixis titi UBR
UBRgrixis delverUBR
UR ur kikimite UR
EDH
RUG Riku of Two Reflections RUG
UBR Marchesa, the Black Rose UBR
UBRGYidris, Maelstrom Wielder UBRG
UBRJeleva, Nephalia's ScourgeUBR
Fabricate doesn't seem very original to me. I bet Mark Rosewater created that one because it just mixes the things he enjoys most (tokens and counters).
On the other hand Energy looks interesting to me, I think it has a lot of design space if they keep using it in future blocks.
Selling some cards I don't want.
Generally less than tcg mid.
Honestly laughing at the vehicle hate some are giving, considering the same reaction for every new type/design ever. DFCs anyone? Yeah, wait and see.
(Also known as Xenphire)
BTW I don't like India lore/mythology or Artifacts, so you can just imagine how I feel about Kaladesh. I don't even like Chandra. Or Red for that matter lol.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
I'm just happy that they brought back dwarves, period. I don't care if they're playable.
They turn into Creatures, which is why they get power and toughness. It's like the Gods from Theros in a way.
Personally I am loving the flavor. Mechanics seem plenty solid overall, even if I doubt I'll use them, not an artifact person. But it looks fun overall, better than Innistrad was for me.
Vehicle crewing at instant speed during combat is going to cause this.
Pioneer:UR Pheonix
Modern:U Mono U Tron
EDH
GB Glissa, the traitor: Army of Cans
UW Dragonlord Ojutai: Dragonlord NOjutai
UWGDerevi, Empyrial Tactician "you cannot fight the storm"
R Zirilan of the claw. The solution to every problem is dragons
UB Etrata, the Silencer Cloning assassination
Peasant cube: Cards I own
InB4 Jar Jar Plainswalker.
People who play Commander would beg to differ on the Wastes bit. Although they aren't for everyone, there is definitely an audience for them. And Vehicles feel like Equipment but in a different way, I wouldn't say they're bad just yet. You don't need to have only one creature either, the ability to use multiple creatures to pay for Crew makes it flexible.
guygirl that grants haste when crewing.On the other hand, I am still very sceptical about energy counters. Me (and my whole EDH playgroup) didn't like experience counters at all, because you can't interact with them after they were gained, and this seems pretty similar. Also it adds another resource to the game, making it even harder for new player to get started.
I'd say Fabricate is a really good, albeit very basic mechanic. Sadly, it will probably be limited-only and not be seen on constructed playable cards (see Cohort, Rally, Ingest, Support, etc).
Edit: Oh and I really like the Vehicle border. It looks gorgeous and (together with the P/T) clearly communicates "This may look like an artifact, but it's actually a creature (kinda).".
But on a serious note, other than a few campy card names (I admit I laughed a bit when I saw Start Your Engines and Speedway Fanatic) the set mechanics look pretty cool.
Jalira, Master Polymorphist | Endrek Sahr, Master Breeder | Bosh, Iron Golem | Ezuri, Renegade Leader
Brago, King Eternal | Oona, Queen of the Fae | Wort, Boggart Auntie | Wort, the Raidmother
Captain Sisay | Rhys, the Redeemed | Trostani, Selesnya's Voice | Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight | Obzedat, Ghost Council | Niv-Mizzet, the Firemind | Vorel of the Hull Clade
Uril, the Miststalker | Prossh, Skyraider of Kher | Nicol Bolas | Progenitus
Ghave, Guru of Spores | Zedruu the Greathearted | Damia, Sage of Stone | Riku of Two Reflections
Mechanics are so far very Meh. Fabricate is a solid but pretty boring mechanic that looks like it will be fun to play with and well balanced. Crew/Vehicles is interesting new design space that I'm excited to play with. Energy counters are just dumb. They are parasitic and don't do anything by themselves, unlike similar counters and pseudo counters of the past: +1/+1 counters, clue tokens, Spawn/scion tokens, Gold tokens. I'm sure wizards will push it enough for standard though making it be another thing I need to track as a player.
Individual card design is hit and miss. At the moment, the biggest myth for me is Verdurous Gearhulk. There is no good reason for Hulk to be a mythic. It doesn't do anything mechanically complex or interesting and is effectively just a big dumb beater. Just because a card is efficient, doesn't mean it should be a mythic. At the moment, my favorite card is Inventor's Fair, but that is only because I enjoy Lantern Control.
- Manite