Reality Shift 1U
Instant
Exile target creature. Its controller manifests the top card of his or her library.
I dunno if it's just me, but I cringed when they made Curse of the Swine. Now they make this? When was it suddenly okay for Blue to get hard (wrong/loose use of term) removal of the best kind? I understand the Polymorphkind of deal (if they'd actually just change the damn creature instead of totally removing the representative card it originated from).
Static polymorph: Turn this creature/permanent into something pre-determined (a 0/4 nothing Treefolk or a specific creature for instance).
Should utilize this zone for the target: the board - so you can flicker or otherwise remove the polymorphing effect.
I don't see how this is any different than Curse of the Swine. It exiles the creature and replaces it with a 2/2. In fact, it's a little weaker, because sometimes that 2/2 would be able to turn into a real threat.
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I agree that this card is effective hard removal. I really dont get why blue gets exile creature effects. The polymorphic argument is so lame. Especially when you consider all the flavor reasons why other colors cant do things. Eventually blue will get some spell that just exiles a creature with no draw back.
Which is a polymorph-effect. It doesn't remove the previous creature it alters it (or so it should). They said they didn't want to make the weird interactions between Destroy-polymorphing and indestructible, so they straight up upgraded those effects to exile, which from a mechanical point of view is not fixing the issue with polymorphing.
I don't see how this is any different than Curse of the Swine. It exiles the creature and replaces it with a 2/2. In fact, it's a little weaker, because sometimes that 2/2 would be able to turn into a real threat.
So you're saying that this card is broken because it sometimes "takes away" a card?
Manifest Density 1U
Instant
Exile target creature and the top card of its controller's library. That player puts a 2/2 colorless token onto the battlefield.
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So you're saying that this card is broken because it sometimes "takes away" a card?
Manifest Density 1U
Instant
Exile target creature and the top card of its controller's library. That player puts a 2/2 colorless token onto the battlefield.
Basically.
Exile a Goyf or a Siege Rhino, and what else other than the (Very slim chance of getting) other goyfs/rhinos is there? Pretty much any other card is blanked.
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Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
(EDIT: Just wanted to make sure people know I'm talking about standard here)
This is the same thing as pongify and rapid hybridization. How else do you want blue to deal with creatures that make it through counters? The only other things in it's color pie are bounce, tap effects, and griptide-esque effects.
This is a card that blue needs to be competitive, because aside from dig through time, counterspells, and treasure cruise, blue sucks, it needs serious help from other colors. Now it doesn't need it as badly.
If this didn't exist then only blue decks with red or black as either the dominant or secondary colors would exist because blue needs the removal those colors provide. Now we can see blue decks with a strong green or white element, because previously, u/w decks couldn't kill a seeker of the way, rabblemaster, heir of the wilds, etc... without playing last breath or devouring light, and u/g decks would have to play something awful like savage punch, this is the answer now.
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I don't see how this is any different than Curse of the Swine. It exiles the creature and replaces it with a 2/2. In fact, it's a little weaker, because sometimes that 2/2 would be able to turn into a real threat.
Like there is a lot of morph creatures in Modern huh?
If manifest doesn't produce a lot of competitive decks or, when it will be played in other formats, it will always be better than Curse.
Which was honestly annoying enough already.
At least there is Ugin on the art, and not that Circé chick wannabe.
Actually curse and this shouldn't be compared, they are different spells that do different things, Curse is a mass wipe, this is single target. Oh and by the way, with manifest you don't need morph to turn face up. So sometimes you will morph a polukranos and hand them a facedown stormbreath
If every time a card gets printed in a blue and you say 'OH OH OH THIS IS TOO FAR' because you're comparing 20 years of blue magic to every other colors standard card pool, you're plain stupid.
I guess this is probably better than rapid hybridization or pongify most of the time, a 2/2 is smaller than a 3/3. Though you risk giving your opponent something worse, uncountrably, and you may or may not have a response to their reveal. Their likelihood of hitting something good depends upon how many creatures that play is playing, and why they're running those creatures.
I guess it's good we're not printing efficient top deck manipulation, huh? /sarcasm
Exile a Goyf or a Siege Rhino, and what else other than the (Very slim chance of getting) other goyfs/rhinos is there? Pretty much any other card is blanked.
For the same reason that mill isn't broken because it could stop them from drawing a key card, this isn't a valid argument. Simple statistics. If the card on top is a Goyf or Rhino, they can just flip it back up anyway.
Ok, let me explain it to you simply, then.
Mill: Goes to Graveyard, can be recurred.
Destroy: Goes to Graveyard, can be recurred.
Exile: Goes to Exile, can NOT be recurred.
Manifest: Becomes a creature, IS essentially exiled until the creature dies.
It's not about exiling a Goyf and manifesting a Goyf. It's about Exiling a Goyf and blanking Abrupt Decay.
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Oath of the Gatewatch; the set that caused the competitive community to freak out over Basic Lands.
1) The card is fine from a color pie perspective (no, a person no liking it doesn't make it any less true).
2) There is a real drawback to the card (what-if scenarios are poor for card evaluation).
3. There seems to be a non-negligible portion of the player base that wants to simultaneously neuter countermagic AND dislikes blue getting removal (this is not an applicable stance to take).
The card seems fine, playable, and possibly even good. I don't know for sure, I tend not to like playing with Pongify's.
Blue has been doing this for almost a decade. Can we stop making this thread every time Blue gets one of these removal spells? Polymorphing a creature into another creature is certainly Blue.
(EDIT: Just wanted to make sure people know I'm talking about standard here)
This is the same thing as pongify and rapid hybridization. How else do you want blue to deal with creatures that make it through counters? The only other things in it's color pie are bounce, tap effects, and griptide-esque effects.
This is a card that blue needs to be competitive, because aside from dig through time, counterspells, and treasure cruise, blue sucks, it needs serious help from other colors. Now it doesn't need it as badly.
If this didn't exist then only blue decks with red or black as either the dominant or secondary colors would exist because blue needs the removal those colors provide. Now we can see blue decks with a strong green or white element, because previously, u/w decks couldn't kill a seeker of the way, rabblemaster, heir of the wilds, etc... without playing last breath or devouring light, and u/g decks would have to play something awful like savage punch, this is the answer now.
Bounce, tap effects and top-of-library cards are exactly how blue should be dealing with creatures that resolve. It isn't supposed to get hard removal any more than black is supposed to get enchantment removal.
Bounce, tap effects and top-of-library cards are exactly how blue should be dealing with creatures that resolve. It isn't supposed to get hard removal any more than black is supposed to get enchantment removal.
I believe you're mentally equating blue 'hard' removal with black hard removal. Which is simply incorrect.
(EDIT: Just wanted to make sure people know I'm talking about standard here)
This is the same thing as pongify and rapid hybridization. How else do you want blue to deal with creatures that make it through counters? The only other things in it's color pie are bounce, tap effects, and griptide-esque effects.
This is a card that blue needs to be competitive, because aside from dig through time, counterspells, and treasure cruise, blue sucks, it needs serious help from other colors. Now it doesn't need it as badly.
If this didn't exist then only blue decks with red or black as either the dominant or secondary colors would exist because blue needs the removal those colors provide. Now we can see blue decks with a strong green or white element, because previously, u/w decks couldn't kill a seeker of the way, rabblemaster, heir of the wilds, etc... without playing last breath or devouring light, and u/g decks would have to play something awful like savage punch, this is the answer now.
You're saying Blue sucks because it's only a support-color to another color... then how the **** does a support-card like Reality Shift change that?
How do you want black to deal with enchantments or artifacts once they hit the board? They have no effective answers for those. And red is largely in on the enchantments-problem too.
Each color have their strengths and weaknesses, why must Blue get effective answers to basically anything?
Artifacts grant answers to a lot of these color-specific problems and blue is no exception with their challenges against resolved creatures.
Actually they do still have answers and you mention them yourself: Their primary "old-school" answer to resolved threats is bounce.
The problem you propose is that their permanents/creatures are secondary to that of other colors and in an environment that can sustain greedy mana pools like 3 color decks, you're unlikely to choose from blue's pool of creatures.
However, look no further back than Lorwyn-standard to witness total blue creature domination. Faeries and their ilk while other colors' creatures were small or costly and Blue had a lot of control-effects (Mind control-esque, hand-control, resource control).
The problem Wizards seem to have with Blue is that they cannot create easy creatures for a color that primarily deals in spells, which means they sometimes throw a bone to the color and sometimes its a bit much... Delver of Secrets, True-name Nemesis.
If blue had straight off the bat good creatures, it would make no sense to play other colors.
If this was me behind the board, I'd let it be a Commander's nightmare and have it tuck the creature, shuffle up, then spew out a Manifest-creature. Now THAT is polymorphing / reality shifting. Merely exiling the creature effectively removes it from the game from a mechanical point of view.
For EDH-reasons it could be banned or even a lil clause about not being able to target legendary creatures, tough luck being a Morphed Akroma though.
This card definitely has potential. Remember that the other player does have to pay the mana cost of the manifested creature and most of the time blue isn't about clearing the board, but about slowing the other player down. If they have to waste a turn flipping their Rhino then that is one more turn you gained to dropping your I WIN combo/spell/lockout.
So I do think that this card has more potential then Pognify with Exile totally removing one threat and Manifest either removing a non-creature threat or making them waste mana to make their bear into something decent.
Bounce, tap effects and top-of-library cards are exactly how blue should be dealing with creatures that resolve. It isn't supposed to get hard removal any more than black is supposed to get enchantment removal.
I believe you're mentally equating blue 'hard' removal with black hard removal. Which is simply incorrect.
No, I'm equating permanently exiling a creature with hard removal. Your reading of my post is way off-base.
It is arguable, however, that this not is hard removal. Yes, it removes the intended threat, but it does not result in full on threat negation. If you are at 2 life and you Reality Shift during your opponent's turn, they will still have a threat to end the game with on their next turn, and you will have to find a way to deal with it. Red and Black, by contrast, don't have this problem.
In many ways this manner of removal is similar to some White removal, like Path to Exile or Swords to Plowshares. You get a removal spell, but your opponent gets something in return. Green has even dipped its toes into this area a bit with cards like Beast Within and Lignify.
Instant
Exile target creature. Its controller manifests the top card of his or her library.
I dunno if it's just me, but I cringed when they made Curse of the Swine. Now they make this? When was it suddenly okay for Blue to get
hard(wrong/loose use of term) removal of the best kind? I understand the Polymorph kind of deal (if they'd actually just change the damn creature instead of totally removing the representative card it originated from).Static polymorph: Turn this creature/permanent into something pre-determined (a 0/4 nothing Treefolk or a specific creature for instance).
Should utilize this zone for the target: the board - so you can flicker or otherwise remove the polymorphing effect.
Variable polymorph: Turn this creature/permanent into something random (Manifest top library, into random creature or into random permanent).
Should utilize: Library exclusively.
Variable polymorphing is a big issue in EDH I realize but at least Magic would be consistent in what the hell their effects are doing.
Also /rant about Blue getting hard removal.
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And others times you just completely blanked their Raging Ravine, Creeping Tar-Pit, Celestial Colonnade, Lightning Bolt, Sphinx's Revelation, Thoughtseize, Sideboard non-creature, or similar. Yet other times you just took away the only reasons for playing Snapcaster Mage, Vendellion Clique, any other ETB creature, and a main reason to play Siege Rhino.
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So you're saying that this card is broken because it sometimes "takes away" a card?
Manifest Density 1U
Instant
Exile target creature and the top card of its controller's library. That player puts a 2/2 colorless token onto the battlefield.
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Basically.
Exile a Goyf or a Siege Rhino, and what else other than the (Very slim chance of getting) other goyfs/rhinos is there? Pretty much any other card is blanked.
This is the same thing as pongify and rapid hybridization. How else do you want blue to deal with creatures that make it through counters? The only other things in it's color pie are bounce, tap effects, and griptide-esque effects.
This is a card that blue needs to be competitive, because aside from dig through time, counterspells, and treasure cruise, blue sucks, it needs serious help from other colors. Now it doesn't need it as badly.
If this didn't exist then only blue decks with red or black as either the dominant or secondary colors would exist because blue needs the removal those colors provide. Now we can see blue decks with a strong green or white element, because previously, u/w decks couldn't kill a seeker of the way, rabblemaster, heir of the wilds, etc... without playing last breath or devouring light, and u/g decks would have to play something awful like savage punch, this is the answer now.
Standard/Block = The on-again, off-again holiday fling
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Pauper/Peasant = Sweet, kind, practical, but shy and boring
Actually curse and this shouldn't be compared, they are different spells that do different things, Curse is a mass wipe, this is single target. Oh and by the way, with manifest you don't need morph to turn face up. So sometimes you will morph a polukranos and hand them a facedown stormbreath
Only color with real counter spells (Looking at you Dash Hopes).
Best color for card draw.
Only real color for library manipulation.
Best color for creature evasion.
Only color for bounce-effects.
Houses one of the best tempo creatures.
Only color for time altering effects without drawback.
Second-best tutor color.
Houses one of the most ridiculous effects in magic.
It's quite possible you can find one or two cards that contradicts these statements but overall they are true.
Basically between Counterspell and Reality Shift, blue is pretty well covered. If all hell breaks loose; Time Stop or Evacuation of the board, one way or another.
Also now modern players can run around with
4x Pongify
4x Rapid Hybridization
4x Reality Shift
I guess it's good we're not printing efficient top deck manipulation, huh? /sarcasm
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Ok, let me explain it to you simply, then.
Mill: Goes to Graveyard, can be recurred.
Destroy: Goes to Graveyard, can be recurred.
Exile: Goes to Exile, can NOT be recurred.
Manifest: Becomes a creature, IS essentially exiled until the creature dies.
It's not about exiling a Goyf and manifesting a Goyf. It's about Exiling a Goyf and blanking Abrupt Decay.
2) There is a real drawback to the card (what-if scenarios are poor for card evaluation).
3. There seems to be a non-negligible portion of the player base that wants to simultaneously neuter countermagic AND dislikes blue getting removal (this is not an applicable stance to take).
The card seems fine, playable, and possibly even good. I don't know for sure, I tend not to like playing with Pongify's.
Bounce, tap effects and top-of-library cards are exactly how blue should be dealing with creatures that resolve. It isn't supposed to get hard removal any more than black is supposed to get enchantment removal.
I believe you're mentally equating blue 'hard' removal with black hard removal. Which is simply incorrect.
How do you want black to deal with enchantments or artifacts once they hit the board? They have no effective answers for those. And red is largely in on the enchantments-problem too.
Each color have their strengths and weaknesses, why must Blue get effective answers to basically anything?
Artifacts grant answers to a lot of these color-specific problems and blue is no exception with their challenges against resolved creatures.
Actually they do still have answers and you mention them yourself: Their primary "old-school" answer to resolved threats is bounce.
The problem you propose is that their permanents/creatures are secondary to that of other colors and in an environment that can sustain greedy mana pools like 3 color decks, you're unlikely to choose from blue's pool of creatures.
However, look no further back than Lorwyn-standard to witness total blue creature domination. Faeries and their ilk while other colors' creatures were small or costly and Blue had a lot of control-effects (Mind control-esque, hand-control, resource control).
The problem Wizards seem to have with Blue is that they cannot create easy creatures for a color that primarily deals in spells, which means they sometimes throw a bone to the color and sometimes its a bit much... Delver of Secrets, True-name Nemesis.
If blue had straight off the bat good creatures, it would make no sense to play other colors.
If this was me behind the board, I'd let it be a Commander's nightmare and have it tuck the creature, shuffle up, then spew out a Manifest-creature. Now THAT is polymorphing / reality shifting. Merely exiling the creature effectively removes it from the game from a mechanical point of view.
For EDH-reasons it could be banned or even a lil clause about not being able to target legendary creatures, tough luck being a Morphed Akroma though.
So I do think that this card has more potential then Pognify with Exile totally removing one threat and Manifest either removing a non-creature threat or making them waste mana to make their bear into something decent.
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No, I'm equating permanently exiling a creature with hard removal. Your reading of my post is way off-base.
In many ways this manner of removal is similar to some White removal, like Path to Exile or Swords to Plowshares. You get a removal spell, but your opponent gets something in return. Green has even dipped its toes into this area a bit with cards like Beast Within and Lignify.