Prior to her appearance in Commander 2014,Nahiri, the Lithomancer was one of the most mysterious characters in the game, since virtually nothing was known about her other than the fact that she played a role in imprisoning the Eldrazi on Zendikar. She was massively hyped and anticipated, just as both Ral Zarek and Kiora Atua were before their appearances, but, unlike them, I actually find her to be somewhat underwhelming, since all of her abilities are focused on equipment, meaning that she has a narrow focus and requires a specific type of deck to function at her fullest potential.
I do concede that her first ability, being able to repeatedly generate creatures for no mana, and attaching equipment to them, also free of mana, is very nice, and her final ability is very awesome, but her middle ability should have applied to any artifact, her starting loyalty is too low for her initial casting cost, and I also dislike how none of her abilities related to imprisonment, a practice in which the color white specializes. If she played a role in imprisoning the Eldrazi on Zendikar, I believe that she should have an ability that reflects that role.
What does everyone else say about this? Do you find Nahiri to be somewhat underwhelming after all the mystery and suspense regarding her? And does anyone find her title to be rather plain and unexciting?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
So are you gonna make a thread for each of the C14 planeswalkers?
I'm currently running Nahiri as my commander, and I love her. However, it is odd that they made her an equipment planeswalker when what we knew of her prior had nothing to do with equipments, but was instead focused on binding magic, which doesn't show at all on her card. They did say they picked the equipment theme of the white deck before choosing a walker (which is why Serra wasn't the white planeswalker,) so that likely explains why they switched Nahiri's powers from binding to equipment.
Still a bummer since I really wanted to see a planeswalker focusing on white's style of control (would love a Banishing Light/Journey to Nowhere ability) and Nahiri felt like the perfect one for that.
I would like to point out that she only made the Hedrons, the tools/equipment, to bind the eldrazi. the actual sealing magic was carved into them by ugin.
Sure, there is a chance of spending $4 on a booster and getting the Mythic Rare $30 super card. There is also a chance of surviving putting your tongue in a light socket.
So are you gonna make a thread for each of the C14 planeswalkers?
I'm currently running Nahiri as my commander, and I love her. However, it is odd that they made her an equipment planeswalker when what we knew of her prior had nothing to do with equipments, but was instead focused on binding magic, which doesn't show at all on her card. They did say they picked the equipment theme of the white deck before choosing a walker (which is why Serra wasn't the white planeswalker,) so that likely explains why they switched Nahiri's powers from binding to equipment.
Still a bummer since I really wanted to see a planeswalker focusing on white's style of control (would love a Banishing Light/Journey to Nowhere ability) and Nahiri felt like the perfect one for that.
The binding magic was actually Ugin, she is the crafter of the hedrons, and being a lithomancer/stoneforge mystic means she creates stuff out of stone. I currently run her as a commander. Just a small handful of equips out with her, slam an armageddon down and you pretty much win. You have to combat unfair decks by wrecking them from all angles, which includes mana denial.
Modern: UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy: UWBMiracles
Edh: UUUThassa Control WWWHokori Stax GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy BBBGriselbrand French List RBGShattergang(Super Villians) RWGHazezon Flicker UBRMarchesa Aggro URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
Nahiri's magic is white, though. I think it would take colorless magic like Ugin's to have any containment effect on the Eldrazi. Nahiri did the actual stonework in raising the hedrons. Ugin wove the containment.
So are you gonna make a thread for each of the C14 planeswalkers?
I'm currently running Nahiri as my commander, and I love her. However, it is odd that they made her an equipment planeswalker when what we knew of her prior had nothing to do with equipments, but was instead focused on binding magic, which doesn't show at all on her card. They did say they picked the equipment theme of the white deck before choosing a walker (which is why Serra wasn't the white planeswalker,) so that likely explains why they switched Nahiri's powers from binding to equipment.
Still a bummer since I really wanted to see a planeswalker focusing on white's style of control (would love a Banishing Light/Journey to Nowhere ability) and Nahiri felt like the perfect one for that.
The binding magic was actually Ugin, she is the crafter of the hedrons, and being a lithomancer/stoneforge mystic means she creates stuff out of stone.
What I'm saying is that she defeated Ob Nixilis by using "binding magic like he had never seen before," not by smacking him with rocks. The whole thing about her specializing in equipment came with Commander 2014 and was never even hinted at before.
Stoneforge Mystic came out long before the 2014 Commander series. Binding Magic is a pretty vague term. I could bind someone with sea weed, with vines, roots, molten lava, fungi...all magically augmented, of course.
It's because we weren't given much info about her prior to this release that they were able to give her this flavor. She is a Kor of Zendikar, she made the hedrons. Prior to C14 that's all we knew. It's perfectly fine to make her a stoneforge mystic. It gives her a connection to her people. As for the binding of Ob Nixilis all she did was take a hedron and implant it into him. It's still Ugins magic doing the work Ob just doesn't know that.
So she needs to be built around. Don't most commanders?
I would like to point out that she only made the Hedrons, the tools/equipment, to bind the eldrazi. the actual sealing magic was carved into them by ugin.
Yes, I am very displeased by that; before her backstory was revealed, it seemed to me that each planeswalker played an equally-important role in imprisoning the Eldrazi, but now it seems that Ugin did most of the work, with Sorin and Nahiri only providing supporting roles.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Yes, I am very displeased by that; before her backstory was revealed, it seemed to me that each planeswalker played an equally-important role in imprisoning the Eldrazi, but now it seems that Ugin did most of the work, with Sorin and Nahiri only providing supporting roles.
Yep, a forty year long supporting role that was necessary to bind cosmic beings onto a single plane.
Sure, there is a chance of spending $4 on a booster and getting the Mythic Rare $30 super card. There is also a chance of surviving putting your tongue in a light socket.
Yep, a forty year long supporting role that was necessary to bind cosmic beings onto a single plane.
Are you being serious or sarcastic with that post? I cannot tell.
Sarcastic or not is not important. What he says is correct regardless of tone. All of their roles were necessary in order to bind the Eldrazi. Ugin could not have done it by himself.
My playgroup and I have been playing a lot of games using slightly modified (10 cards or less) Commander 2014 decks.
We all have agreed pretty much Nahiri is the weakest of all 5.
I'll put it this way: If someone casts Ob Nixilis, Freyalise or Daretti, people start to pay attention and try to kill them.
When I cast Nahiri, no one really cares. She has yet to do anything productive to win me a game.
Whereas Ob Nix creates a demon army and has an ultimate that is disgustingly good, Freyalise can ramp like mad, draw like mad and shut down artifact and enchantment based decks (like equipment for example) and Daretti has three overpowered abilities that build on each other perfectly.
There has been a game or two I don't even cast her.
No one has the Blue deck, but I've seen the deck being played before and Teferi does a great job of building card advantage, and letting you either attack/defend, or cast multiple spells in a turn.
I had one session of three games where no one even tried to attack her the whole night. They just let me build to ultimate then bounced the Stoneforged Blade. If they attacked her instead of me at least she would tank damage. Suffice to say I won none of the games.
Yeah she is a cool character, and has pretty cool art. I bought the deck because the oversized foil looked sick and I liked the flavor of her storyline. But the same could be said for all of the 2014 commanders. They really should have used SERRA instead.
My playgroup and I have been playing a lot of games using slightly modified (10 cards or less) Commander 2014 decks.
We all have agreed pretty much Nahiri is the weakest of all 5.
I'll put it this way: If someone casts Ob Nixilis, Freyalise or Daretti, people start to pay attention and try to kill them.
When I cast Nahiri, no one really cares. She has yet to do anything productive to win me a game.
Whereas Ob Nix creates a demon army and has an ultimate that is disgustingly good, Freyalise can ramp like mad, draw like mad and shut down artifact and enchantment based decks (like equipment for example) and Daretti has three overpowered abilities that build on each other perfectly.
There has been a game or two I don't even cast her.
No one has the Blue deck, but I've seen the deck being played before and Teferi does a great job of building card advantage, and letting you either attack/defend, or cast multiple spells in a turn.
I had one session of three games where no one even tried to attack her the whole night. They just let me build to ultimate then bounced the Stoneforged Blade. If they attacked her instead of me at least she would tank damage. Suffice to say I won none of the games.
Yeah she is a cool character, and has pretty cool art. I bought the deck because the oversized foil looked sick and I liked the flavor of her storyline. But the same could be said for all of the 2014 commanders. They really should have used SERRA instead.
How do you play with 10 cards or less? Do you mean you only play with 10 cards?
How do you play with 10 cards or less? Do you mean you only play with 10 cards?
it obviously means they have changed 10 or less cards in the precon decks
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Huey, Dewey and Louie are always dressed in RUG. it is CLEARLY going to be the wedges block Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
If the second ability allowed any artifact it would push out the Red deck and give White a repeatable Tinker. Equipment based strategies are quite white, complete artifact control is not, especially when in tandem they're releasing a red artifact deck.
STATISTICS.
All of these "Let's eliminate bad cards" crusades are simply ignorant. And when they start to devolve into "WotC is conspiring to give us crappy cards," they just become embarrassing. MATH is conspiring to give you crappy cards.
i like both freyalise and nahiri
my only complain is nahiri ultimate is not an emblem, with now, it's too easy to counter the hard-earn ultimate of her
Wizards print good rares, players complain about cash grab. They print underwhelming rares, players complain that the cards suck. They spoil the best cards first, players complain about the insane prices of preorders. They spoil the meh cards first, players complain that this is the worst set ever.
So. I think I understand now.
As far as these forums are concerned, WotC can never do anything good because:
Card that is new and probably good = "pushed"
Card that is new and probably bad = "EDH/casual fodder"
Card that is a reprint = "lazy"
Card that is a better version of an older card = "power creep"
Card that is a weaker version of an older card = "worthless"
I think something to keep in mind is that they designed an equipment based walker and then fit Nahari to it which works with the established Kor/Stone Forge Mystic.
I'm pretty sure we will see her again in standard fairly soon and while I think the equipment part while be a big part of her design, we can see a lot more exploration of it as well.
Honestly power level aside she tickets a lot of boxes in terms of being new design space and cool flavour wise and story continuation, she doesn't need to be pushed to make her an interesting card to want to own.
I suspect Ob Nix was pushed a little bit because I'm not sure he generated as much excitement just to see him in PW form.
Even more inexplicable to me is the absence of Stoneforge Mystic in the "Forged in Stone" deck.
Nahiri seems to be a planeswalker derivation of SFM, just as Daretti is a derivation of Goblin Welder, yet Daretti's deck also gets his Welder.
I can't imagine there wasn't a time in the development of these decks that SFM was in the deck, and I wouldn't be surprised if SFM was the initial inspiration for the deck.
Why the equipment theme was adhered to after SFM was presumably removed, I have no idea. Other parts of the deck seem to point to a "go wide" tokens theme which probably would have been a stronger unifying theme.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
On MTGO as Protoman.
On 7/14/10, broke 1900 mark! <3 ROE.
She is supossed to be narrow,if you want a "good stuff" commander, you should look somewhere else, this year's white commander precon is equipment FOCUSED, deal with it.
So are you gonna make a thread for each of the C14 planeswalkers?
I'm currently running Nahiri as my commander, and I love her. However, it is odd that they made her an equipment planeswalker when what we knew of her prior had nothing to do with equipments, but was instead focused on binding magic, which doesn't show at all on her card. They did say they picked the equipment theme of the white deck before choosing a walker (which is why Serra wasn't the white planeswalker,) so that likely explains why they switched Nahiri's powers from binding to equipment.
Still a bummer since I really wanted to see a planeswalker focusing on white's style of control (would love a Banishing Light/Journey to Nowhere ability) and Nahiri felt like the perfect one for that.
The binding magic was actually Ugin, she is the crafter of the hedrons, and being a lithomancer/stoneforge mystic means she creates stuff out of stone.
What I'm saying is that she defeated Ob Nixilis by using "binding magic like he had never seen before," not by smacking him with rocks. The whole thing about her specializing in equipment came with Commander 2014 and was never even hinted at before.
Note that this card is also her in the distant past. She may well have matured her own binding magic since then.
So are you gonna make a thread for each of the C14 planeswalkers?
No, I am very impressed with the others, so there is no need to complain about them.
You're "very impressed" with Ob Nixilis while "underwhelmed" with Freyalise? Have you seen Ob Nix's +2?
Though while I disagree with you on Freyalise, I have to agree with you on Nahiri.
Nahiri's simultaneously the most overrated and the worst of the new walkers. By herself she only makes tokens and builds up to a bad ult. -2's an extremely pricy cost for cheating out an equipment you could hard cast anyway (would you play an instant/sorcery that did nothing but cheat an equipment out)? She may have the additional utility of cheating equips out of the GY, but a lot of times removal doesn't put things in the GY in EDH.
...And that's assuming you had good equipment. Even in an equipment-centric deck you likely won't be running more than 10-15 equipment, so it's still easy to run out of gas relatively quickly.
Once you have a selection of equipment, she goes from bad to marginally good. Even after you have equipment out you generally want them on specific creatures as opposed to 1/1s with no abilities (the only equipment I think I'd really be excited about +2ing with would be Argentum Armor). Her ultimate dies to cards like Cyclonic Rift and Boomerang as well, so it's not really that impressive either.
I do concede that her first ability, being able to repeatedly generate creatures for no mana, and attaching equipment to them, also free of mana, is very nice, and her final ability is very awesome, but her middle ability should have applied to any artifact, her starting loyalty is too low for her initial casting cost, and I also dislike how none of her abilities related to imprisonment, a practice in which the color white specializes. If she played a role in imprisoning the Eldrazi on Zendikar, I believe that she should have an ability that reflects that role.
What does everyone else say about this? Do you find Nahiri to be somewhat underwhelming after all the mystery and suspense regarding her? And does anyone find her title to be rather plain and unexciting?
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
I'm currently running Nahiri as my commander, and I love her. However, it is odd that they made her an equipment planeswalker when what we knew of her prior had nothing to do with equipments, but was instead focused on binding magic, which doesn't show at all on her card. They did say they picked the equipment theme of the white deck before choosing a walker (which is why Serra wasn't the white planeswalker,) so that likely explains why they switched Nahiri's powers from binding to equipment.
Still a bummer since I really wanted to see a planeswalker focusing on white's style of control (would love a Banishing Light/Journey to Nowhere ability) and Nahiri felt like the perfect one for that.
No, I am very impressed with the others, so there is no need to complain about them.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
The binding magic was actually Ugin, she is the crafter of the hedrons, and being a lithomancer/stoneforge mystic means she creates stuff out of stone. I currently run her as a commander. Just a small handful of equips out with her, slam an armageddon down and you pretty much win. You have to combat unfair decks by wrecking them from all angles, which includes mana denial.
Draft it Here!
UUUBlue Man Group
Legacy:
UWBMiracles
Edh:
UUUThassa Control
WWWHokori Stax
GGGJolrael, Empress of Land Stompy
BBBGriselbrand French List
RBGShattergang(Super Villians)
RWGHazezon Flicker
UBRMarchesa Aggro
URGMaelstom Wanderer (Maelstorm)
So she needs to be built around. Don't most commanders?
Yes, I am very displeased by that; before her backstory was revealed, it seemed to me that each planeswalker played an equally-important role in imprisoning the Eldrazi, but now it seems that Ugin did most of the work, with Sorin and Nahiri only providing supporting roles.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Yep, a forty year long supporting role that was necessary to bind cosmic beings onto a single plane.
Are you being serious or sarcastic with that post? I cannot tell.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Sarcastic or not is not important. What he says is correct regardless of tone. All of their roles were necessary in order to bind the Eldrazi. Ugin could not have done it by himself.
We all have agreed pretty much Nahiri is the weakest of all 5.
I'll put it this way: If someone casts Ob Nixilis, Freyalise or Daretti, people start to pay attention and try to kill them.
When I cast Nahiri, no one really cares. She has yet to do anything productive to win me a game.
Whereas Ob Nix creates a demon army and has an ultimate that is disgustingly good, Freyalise can ramp like mad, draw like mad and shut down artifact and enchantment based decks (like equipment for example) and Daretti has three overpowered abilities that build on each other perfectly.
There has been a game or two I don't even cast her.
No one has the Blue deck, but I've seen the deck being played before and Teferi does a great job of building card advantage, and letting you either attack/defend, or cast multiple spells in a turn.
I had one session of three games where no one even tried to attack her the whole night. They just let me build to ultimate then bounced the Stoneforged Blade. If they attacked her instead of me at least she would tank damage. Suffice to say I won none of the games.
Yeah she is a cool character, and has pretty cool art. I bought the deck because the oversized foil looked sick and I liked the flavor of her storyline. But the same could be said for all of the 2014 commanders. They really should have used SERRA instead.
BUDGET DECK BUILDER SINCE 93'
Modern ------------------------- WU Azorius Titan Midrange
Commander ------------------- WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician
***Are you looking for cards priced below TCG NM "LOW" and with FREE SHIPPING? - Click HERE! for my sales thread - 485 Feedback 100% positive!***
How do you play with 10 cards or less? Do you mean you only play with 10 cards?
it obviously means they have changed 10 or less cards in the precon decks
Pioneer: WURFaerie fires BRGDragons
ModernBGElves WRBurn UR Fires Turns URGift Storm UG Twiddle Storm
i think you do, since you also complaining about freyalise
i like both freyalise and nahiri
my only complain is nahiri ultimate is not an emblem, with now, it's too easy to counter the hard-earn ultimate of her
edit: adding link
I'm pretty sure we will see her again in standard fairly soon and while I think the equipment part while be a big part of her design, we can see a lot more exploration of it as well.
Honestly power level aside she tickets a lot of boxes in terms of being new design space and cool flavour wise and story continuation, she doesn't need to be pushed to make her an interesting card to want to own.
I suspect Ob Nix was pushed a little bit because I'm not sure he generated as much excitement just to see him in PW form.
Nahiri seems to be a planeswalker derivation of SFM, just as Daretti is a derivation of Goblin Welder, yet Daretti's deck also gets his Welder.
I can't imagine there wasn't a time in the development of these decks that SFM was in the deck, and I wouldn't be surprised if SFM was the initial inspiration for the deck.
Why the equipment theme was adhered to after SFM was presumably removed, I have no idea. Other parts of the deck seem to point to a "go wide" tokens theme which probably would have been a stronger unifying theme.
On 7/14/10, broke 1900 mark! <3 ROE.
On 7/14/10, broke 1900 mark! <3 ROE.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
You're "very impressed" with Ob Nixilis while "underwhelmed" with Freyalise? Have you seen Ob Nix's +2?
Though while I disagree with you on Freyalise, I have to agree with you on Nahiri.
Nahiri's simultaneously the most overrated and the worst of the new walkers. By herself she only makes tokens and builds up to a bad ult. -2's an extremely pricy cost for cheating out an equipment you could hard cast anyway (would you play an instant/sorcery that did nothing but cheat an equipment out)? She may have the additional utility of cheating equips out of the GY, but a lot of times removal doesn't put things in the GY in EDH.
...And that's assuming you had good equipment. Even in an equipment-centric deck you likely won't be running more than 10-15 equipment, so it's still easy to run out of gas relatively quickly.
Once you have a selection of equipment, she goes from bad to marginally good. Even after you have equipment out you generally want them on specific creatures as opposed to 1/1s with no abilities (the only equipment I think I'd really be excited about +2ing with would be Argentum Armor). Her ultimate dies to cards like Cyclonic Rift and Boomerang as well, so it's not really that impressive either.
GX Tron XG
UR Phoenix RU
GG Freyalise High Tide GG
UR Parun Counterspells RU
BB Yawgmoth Token Storm BB
WB Pestilence BW