I'm not convinced that will be the case, however. It's a land and a creature. It's not the same as, say, Elvish Mystic, which is a creature with a tap for mana ability. They aren't identical. I'd like too see the actual ruling that specifically deals with this.
Just take a look at Dryad Arbor. You can't tap it for mana either when you play it because it's also a creature and therefore effected by summoning sickness.
I'm not convinced that will be the case, however. It's a land and a creature. It's not the same as, say, Elvish Mystic, which is a creature with a tap for mana ability. They aren't identical. I'd like too see the actual ruling that specifically deals with this.
There isn't an actual section in the rules to specifically address this, because the rules are permissive, not restrictive. Creatures with summoning sickness cannot activate "tap" abilities. Lands have an activated "tap" ability to produce mana. There is no special exemption in the rules that says you may tap animated lands with summoning sickness for mana, so you cannot.
But if you like you can read the Gatherer rulings on Living Lands, or any other card that animates lands. They all note that permanents can only attack or activate "tap" abilities if you've controlled them since the beginning of your turn.
If your question is "What would a judge do is this situation?", only one person's answer is relevant, and that is the Head Judge at your event. I can quote the rules, but I don't know your HJ.
I'll have to take your words for it. When I read the rulings for Dryad Arbor, it didn't mention anything about not being able to use it for mana the turn it comes out. If anything, "Dryad Arbor is played as a land. It doesn't use the stack, it's not a spell, it can't be responded to, it has no mana cost, and it counts as your land play for the turn", makes it sound as though it can be tapped for mana the turn it comes out.
But, I digress, I'm the newbie here, so I'll take your word for it until it's proven otherwise (or not).
I'll have to take your words for it. When I read the rulings for Dryad Arbor, it didn't mention anything about not being able to use it for mana the turn it comes out. If anything, "Dryad Arbor is played as a land. It doesn't use the stack, it's not a spell, it can't be responded to, it has no mana cost, and it counts as your land play for the turn", makes it sound as though it can be tapped for mana the turn it comes out.
But, I digress, I'm the newbie here, so I'll take your word for it until it's proven otherwise (or not).
Look at the Oracle text:
(Dryad Arbor isn't a spell, it's affected by summoning sickness, and it has "T: Add G to your mana pool.")
And the official explanation of summoning sickness is this:
The term “summoning sickness” is an informal term which describes a creature’s inability to attack or to use activated abilities that include the tap symbol when it has come under a player’s control since the beginning of that player’s most recent turn.
I agree though that it is not an obvious interaction. It's understandable to think that it being still a land would make it possible to tap it for mana like it is normally the case.
Right, it has a marked "tap", which would make it like Elvish Mystic. There's no oracle text to Nissa's ability, or rulings, so far. I'll just be hopeful, but not expectant.
Right, it has a marked "tap", which would make it like Elvish Mystic. There's no oracle text to Nissa's ability, or rulings, so far. I'll just be hopeful, but not expectant.
Well, guess there is 1 fun way to use them that turn:
Use Nissa Ult, then cast Chord of Calling into Cyclops of eternal Fury.
Proceed to either tap for massive mana, or attack with everything for a kill.
It's like a punch to the gut.
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Anyone else testing Nissa? Card is freaking bonkers. Just the +1 making 4/4 tramplers for a 5drop PW is playable. The middle +1 is gravy and nuts in heavy/mono-Green. Most of the time when I have lost the 4/4 lands the impact is tiny being you don't need the extra lands.
Feels like it has to see some play now and probably a ton post Sphinx-Revelation. Back to testing...
It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
Will 90% of players misread the card and think that the lands become creatures only until end of turn? I suspect this will be the case, according to my experiences with Hunting Wilds. (While I don't have a very extensive sample size for this, the 90% figure is probably at least close to the truth.)
Yeah there is just something about that effect that makes people automatically think it's only until end of turn.
It's the same with Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas. Most people make big eyes when they finally realize that his -1 is permanently.
That is also why the comparison with Koth of the Hammer is lacking a bit. He doesn't animate them permanently and they don't have trample either. It's a completely different power-level.
Anyone else testing Nissa? Card is freaking bonkers. Just the +1 making 4/4 tramplers for a 5drop PW is playable. The middle +1 is gravy and nuts in heavy/mono-Green. Most of the time when I have lost the 4/4 lands the impact is tiny being you don't need the extra lands.
Feels like it has to see some play now and probably a ton post Sphinx-Revelation. Back to testing...
Head on over to Standard Deck Creation forum and take a look.
She is broken as ****. Untap 4 forests? She essentially only costs one green and ramps your mana pool next turn to 9, 10 if you hit your land drop. While threatening to win the game over time if you try to ignore her. There is zero risk to playing her if they dont have 5 damage on the board.
Oh yeah she can tap forest island hybrid type lands so you can have a counterspell ready and waiting to go. I think she is overpowered. She is the jace of mind sculptor of green and thats the fact.
Just take a look at Dryad Arbor. You can't tap it for mana either when you play it because it's also a creature and therefore effected by summoning sickness.
There isn't an actual section in the rules to specifically address this, because the rules are permissive, not restrictive. Creatures with summoning sickness cannot activate "tap" abilities. Lands have an activated "tap" ability to produce mana. There is no special exemption in the rules that says you may tap animated lands with summoning sickness for mana, so you cannot.
But if you like you can read the Gatherer rulings on Living Lands, or any other card that animates lands. They all note that permanents can only attack or activate "tap" abilities if you've controlled them since the beginning of your turn.
If your question is "What would a judge do is this situation?", only one person's answer is relevant, and that is the Head Judge at your event. I can quote the rules, but I don't know your HJ.
But, I digress, I'm the newbie here, so I'll take your word for it until it's proven otherwise (or not).
Look at the Oracle text:
(Dryad Arbor isn't a spell, it's affected by summoning sickness, and it has "T: Add G to your mana pool.")
And the official explanation of summoning sickness is this:
The term “summoning sickness” is an informal term which describes a creature’s inability to attack or to use activated abilities that include the tap symbol when it has come under a player’s control since the beginning of that player’s most recent turn.
I agree though that it is not an obvious interaction. It's understandable to think that it being still a land would make it possible to tap it for mana like it is normally the case.
Even basic lands use the T symbol. They just don't show it on recent printings of the basic lands. http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=2386
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
Regardless, I'm not expecting to ult her.
Use Nissa Ult, then cast Chord of Calling into Cyclops of eternal Fury.
Proceed to either tap for massive mana, or attack with everything for a kill.
It's like a punch to the gut.
Great place to get Anime, Figurines, Comics and Magic The Gathering cards in South Africa: www.heroesofgc.com
4 Elvish Mystic
4 Sylvan Caryatid
3 Courser of Kruphix
4 Polukranos, World Eater
4 Reaper of the Wilds
4 Master of the Feast
1 Scuttling Doom Engine
2 Genesis Hydra
Planeswalkers
3 Nissa, Worldwaker
4 Thoughtseize
2 Setessan Tactics
Lands
10 Forests
2 Darksteel Citadel
3 Overgrown Tomb
4 Temple of Malady
3 Urborg, Tomb of Yawgmoth
2 Llanowar Wastes
1 Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
4 Nylea's Disciple
4 Unravel the Aether
3 Duress
4 Mistcutter Hydra
Feels like it has to see some play now and probably a ton post Sphinx-Revelation. Back to testing...
Yeah there is just something about that effect that makes people automatically think it's only until end of turn.
It's the same with Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas. Most people make big eyes when they finally realize that his -1 is permanently.
That is also why the comparison with Koth of the Hammer is lacking a bit. He doesn't animate them permanently and they don't have trample either. It's a completely different power-level.
Head on over to Standard Deck Creation forum and take a look.
C Kozilek C
GB Gitrog GB
G Titania G
WU Brago WU
GB MerenGB
Duel Commander Decks
UR Keranos UR
BRG Jund BRG
GR Tron GR GW Tron GW
C Eldrazi Tron (SB) C
BG Lantern Control BG
UW Control (SB) UW
Oh yeah she can tap forest island hybrid type lands so you can have a counterspell ready and waiting to go. I think she is overpowered. She is the jace of mind sculptor of green and thats the fact.
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