At around $7 now, this seems like such a great card in so many places. Don't know that there's even been something that shuts down card draw like this at 2 mana, nevermind monocolor on a nice 3/1 beater. (Notion Thief was 2 colors, twice the mana, and not a piece for existing strategies.)
Spirit also has some interaction with Ephara...you can still get your extra card on their turn.
The Archetypes also seem like sleepers, uncommon-wise: especially White and Red. Mass trample and mass first strike are super rare, especially on aggressive dudes. The green one might even be a decent Garruk/Nykthos target. Demand on these should be pretty crazy for a long time to come.
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that's not what happened at all. kamahl stabbed phage, akroma, and some old lady and they became korona. then korona got stabbed by her "prophets" and kamahl got drunk with a mutant centaur
On Eidolon of Countless Battles:
After test playing him for a bit, I actually now think that he's not bad at all.
He's a pretty nice way for aggressive white decks to top off -
He adds immediate pressure to the board while caring for Verdict.
An ideal situation would be something like this:
Turn 4, you have 3creatures on board, you cast cast him as an aura to give +4/+4 pump.
Then, your opponent board wipes you, but then your next turn, you can cast another creature and activate mutavault to make him a 3/3, then swing for 5 total with mutavault.
As for Hero of Iroas, he does have good synergy with the Eidolon, but he doesn't have enough other good auras at the moment to be viable.
Also, for people paring up the Hero and Eidolon, note that Eidolon is viable without Hero but a Hero deck would always want 4 Eidolon's.
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Please check out my 360 unpowered, non-PW cube!
It's got more than 10 different strategies you can choose from.
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It is an indestructible 5 mana sometimes creature with a useless ability. It is worse than many other cards at its cost.
Its a 5/7 most-the-time creature that ramps incredibly well in the right deck. She ramps as much as you can overextend yourself
As for people poo-pooing Hero of Leina Tower, youre right, nobody wants a 1drop that can have a relevant body later on. You know what sucks? top decking a 1drop late in the game with a ton of free mana. She makes late game tricks super relevant. I said it once, one can almost compare her to a vanilla Figure of Destiny- cept you have to use extra cards, i know, i know. 2-1 3-1 blah blah
Its a 5/7 most-the-time creature that ramps incredibly well in the right deck. She ramps as much as you can overextend yourself
As for people poo-pooing Hero of Leina Tower, youre right, nobody wants a 1drop that can have a relevant body later on. You know what sucks? top decking a 1drop late in the game with a ton of free mana. She makes late game tricks super relevant. I said it once, one can almost compare her to a vanilla Figure of Destiny- cept you have to use extra cards, i know, i know. 2-1 3-1 blah blah
no, we don't want a late game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets her PLUS open mana.
we also don't want an early game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets when we don't have open mana to use it's heroic ability.
super narrow creature is super narrow.
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Standard:
Nothing Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
Underrated: Ephara, God of the Polis
This is increadibly powerful in an agressive W/u azorius build. Courser of Kruphix
Increases your chance of hitting land drops, survives a decent portion of standard removal, occasionally generates card advantage, gains life, and blocks well. The downside of giving your opponent information is offset by being able to plan around that next card yourself. Herald of Torment
An extremely efficient flying beater. Flame-Wreathed Phoenix
This is useless right now, but after rotation it could easily be the next desecration demon, as an undercosted big flyer with a punisher drawback. Hunter's Prowess
Initially I didn't think much of this card, but after testing it in a simic prophet deck it's been insane. As long as you play it at the right time, usually after your opponent taps out, you're practically guaranteed 3+ cards and a bunch of damage.
coursers limitation, however, is that it can only play lands from the top of your library without increasing the amount of lands you can play per turn.
while the green deck doesn't really care about information and isn't trying to be tricky, allowing the black or blue player across the table to know which cards you have in hand and which card is on top of your library makes it so they know exactly which course of action is the best. they don't have to do the math about what you have in your hand, and you're making their job easier. giving your opponent free information is never good, and the benefits have to outweigh the negatives.
oracle did that in that you could play a land from your library and from your hand, or two from your library. courser doesn't. and if you need to play the land in your hand more than the land on top of your deck, it doesn't do the job of filtering through clumps.
the mana cost is great, and is proper for what the card does, but it's not an amazing card. RG devotion will play it, and that's only because its double G.
I agree entirely with what you're saying. I just wouldnt put it in the category of "not a good card" personally (nor does it goes into the great card category), it seems like its cost, P/T and ability are enough to call it good.
It is not something I would necessarily want to drop on turn 2-3, but more like 5-7 where youre more likely to top-deck lands and want spells.
It has a nice interaction with chandra / domri as well at least. Also decently couples with Kiora as far as possibility of : play a land from top, tick down kiora, draw the non-land and reveal another land to play off the top.
no, we don't want a late game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets her PLUS open mana.
we also don't want an early game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets when we don't have open mana to use it's heroic ability.
super narrow creature is super narrow.
That is late game versatility, instead of looking for your lone aetherling. All I said was late game it CAN become something bigger, and is a mana dump. Early game, yeah, youre right, no one that plays green will have extra mana for anything. No one who plays Gx will EVER be in a position with extra mana and a combat trick in hand.
It's just an uncommon, but I think Odunos River Trawler will find a home. That's a lot of potential card advantage.
Fated Infatuation seems like almost a lock to go in every Mono-Blue Devotion list. An instant-speed duplicate Master of Waves for 3 mana is mighty good, and Scry 2 if you play it on the attack is gravy.
On Eidolon of Countless Battles:
After test playing him for a bit, I actually now think that he's not bad at all.
He's a pretty nice way for aggressive white decks to top off -
He adds immediate pressure to the board while caring for Verdict.
An ideal situation would be something like this:
Turn 4, you have 3creatures on board, you cast cast him as an aura to give +4/+4 pump.
Then, your opponent board wipes you, but then your next turn, you can cast another creature and activate mutavault to make him a 3/3, then swing for 5 total with mutavault.
As for Hero of Iroas, he does have good synergy with the Eidolon, but he doesn't have enough other good auras at the moment to be viable.
Also, for people paring up the Hero and Eidolon, note that Eidolon is viable without Hero but a Hero deck would always want 4 Eidolon's.
Hero of Iroas has Boon Satyr, Unflinching Courage, hopeful eidolon, and Ephara's blessing....
Think Vortex Elemental is quite underrated atm. Azurious Charm that can take out Blood Baron.
Phoenix dies to pretty much every removal but shock, Searing Blood and Mortar. Tribute is a trap, avoid.
Tribute isn't particularly terrible, as the better creatures are well costed on their own. Tribute isn't amazing because of the reason you stated.
The problem with Phoenix isn't really the removal bit. That's only a secondary problem with it. The main problem with it is that it is simply outclassed by almost everything in standard currently, regardless of what you get out of the deal. It can't get passed a Desecration Demon, it can't get passed an Arbor Collossus, U/W has no problem with it.
The only deck where it's actually *good* against is Mono-U, as they have no real way to interact with either option (No removal, and fliers that either side will eat alive).
Dies to removal is a terrible argument, as that can be applied to many cards. Much of the removal it *does* die to is removal that any creature dies to; the only means of killing it with the recursion trigger on the stack is either Lightning Strike or Bile Blight in hand. Which while not horribly unlikely, I have to question why they haven't burned those options out yet on our other creatures.
As I said, the real problem is that a 5/5 flyer for 4 simply isn't good enough right now when you can easily be facing down a Desecration Demon or Arbor Collosus the next turn. RDW wouldn't want it, as they really need their turn 4 play to have an immediate and major impact, less they lose one of their most important turns. The deck that *does* want it right now is a Midrange deck. A Midrange deck that, mind you, doesn't exist. The only deck it has a home in is G/R monsters which is probably where it will see play if it does.
That said, it's still a damn good creature, just not good enough for the meta as it stands. Personally, I'm going to buy the living crap out of them if they hit $1-2, and probably start getting them aggressively at $3. Rotation is always looming on the horizon, and post-rotation does crazy things to borderline cards.
Hero of Iroas has Boon Satyr, Unflinching Courage, hopeful eidolon, and Ephara's blessing....
Yep, there was already a good amount and with Born of Gods, there's a ton which is why I think Hero is being slept on some too. I've even seen quite a bit of R/W with Madcap Skills theorycrafting.
It's an instant speed 5/5 trampler for 4. Wtf do you people want seriously? It has applications in populate/ above the curve beats decks, or in Bant control/ flash. I seriously think anyone mad at this card for any reason other than losing an attacker to instant speed wurm, should go home and make their own awesome card game and leave the rest of us alone.
Whelming Wave does seem like a very good blue "board wipe" as I don't see many of the named creature types being played in standard and rarely in modern. At times it is much better to move stuff to hand than GY.
Ephara, God of the Polis I do think she is quite good especially with Deputy of Acquittals though a very "ideal" situation, using two of them defensively is very interesting and for UW give you card draw and "safe blocks" baring trample. You will attack with your 10/10 with no trample? Sweet i will block with my Deputy... then after blocks bounce it with my another and draw 2 cards on my turn. It is an ideal situation but honestly might be worth it to save a dude and get draw out of it.
Scourge of Skola Vale I do like this card, the one trait that I think might break it would be Viligance and tokens. Playing G/W wouldn't make this impossible if you use Heliod to pump out tokens. Those two actually go very well together. Heck a G/U combo has the Kiora's Followers in order to abuse the hydra for a "pusedo"-vigilance.
Nessian Wilds Ravager despite the hatred towards "tribute" I don't see this as a bad card with a healthy amount of ramp. A lot of people hated on Kalonian Hydra because "Oh no big deal, its a 'garabage mythic'" though not played a lot in standard right now it did show its strength. I would not underestimate hydras in standard. You either get a 12/12 that if you have Kalonian hydra too, gets really stupid big fast, and if not you get a 6/6 that acts like removal "if you want". Sure there will be situations where it isn't useful and your opponent has no creatures and refuses tribute in order to by a turn for removal, but that is the same argument for any removal? No creatures, no targets?
for Scourge of Skola Vale i think cards like : Tower Defense would be great at least in casual. but maybe we see a BG reanimator whip with it (cause you just get more and more value)
I think perplexing chimera will be far more popular in edh than people are giving it credit for with homeward path, or astral slide, or in modern (doubtfully, but i'd love to see it) with brooding saurian, or my favorite, flickerform.
Pain Seer will see more play than most people believe. I'd say buy your playset now before a single one of them reaches $10+. It's the perfect card in B/W Humans.
Besides that, Whelming Waves and Herald of Torment for only a dollar seems quite cheap... They're both look standard playable to me. Herald can be a 4-of in black related aggro decks, so I think it has a good chance of increasing in price.
Well, Herald of Torment was about $3 each less than a week ago. Now some places are selling it for just over a dollar. I just purchased 4 at $0.99 each from Channel Fireball with $0.99 shipping. The obvious parallel is to Boon Satyr, distinguished by its Flash, but Flying ain't no joke neither. Even if Herald doesn't make an immediate impact on Standard I reckon it will impact the format eventually. $1.25 each with shipping seems plenty fair. It doesn't generate the CA or devotion that a Nightveil Specter can but it does fight Specters well and is more resilient to removal. Plus, Rakdos might make a comeback with Mogis and the Temple.
Well, Herald of Torment was about $3 each less than a week ago. Now some places are selling it for just over a dollar. I just purchased 4 at $0.99 each from Channel Fireball with $0.99 shipping. The obvious parallel is to Boon Satyr, distinguished by its Flash, but Flying ain't no joke neither. Even if Herald doesn't make an immediate impact on Standard I reckon it will impact the format eventually. $1.25 each with shipping seems plenty fair. It doesn't generate the CA or devotion that a Nightveil Specter can but it does fight Specters well and is more resilient to removal. Plus, Rakdos might make a comeback with Mogis and the Temple.
Yeah, I couldn't resist getting Herald of Torment at .99 either. Even if it does nothing for me for the forseeable future, it seems good enough to eventually do something good. Worst case scenario, I broke even on it. I also bought a set of Gild at .49, and Fate Conflagration at .99 (And a few other things). Both seem like they were far too cheap for what they do.
Pain Seer will see more play than most people believe. I'd say buy your playset now before a single one of them reaches $10+. It's the perfect card in B/W Humans.
You might want to re-read the card. If you could draw with Pain Seer the turn after it came out, it would be pretty sweet. But you can't.
Yes, I'm kind of shocked that Pain Seer is still hovering around the $5 mark. I'm fully expecting that this card will end up at $0.50 once people actually put it in their deck. The power level of this card is about on the same level as Stealer of Secrets. It costs one less, but you have to pay life for the card and wait until next turn before you get it.
Except that Stealer of Secrets is not even the same universe of power level as the Seer is.
They're FAR closer than you think. In fact, I'd say that stealer is significantly more useful than seer.
They're both equally unplayable in constructed, but as a common at least stealer has a decent chance of having a meaningful and positive impact on a limited deck.
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At around $7 now, this seems like such a great card in so many places. Don't know that there's even been something that shuts down card draw like this at 2 mana, nevermind monocolor on a nice 3/1 beater. (Notion Thief was 2 colors, twice the mana, and not a piece for existing strategies.)
Spirit also has some interaction with Ephara...you can still get your extra card on their turn.
The Archetypes also seem like sleepers, uncommon-wise: especially White and Red. Mass trample and mass first strike are super rare, especially on aggressive dudes. The green one might even be a decent Garruk/Nykthos target. Demand on these should be pretty crazy for a long time to come.
After test playing him for a bit, I actually now think that he's not bad at all.
He's a pretty nice way for aggressive white decks to top off -
He adds immediate pressure to the board while caring for Verdict.
An ideal situation would be something like this:
Turn 4, you have 3creatures on board, you cast cast him as an aura to give +4/+4 pump.
Then, your opponent board wipes you, but then your next turn, you can cast another creature and activate mutavault to make him a 3/3, then swing for 5 total with mutavault.
As for Hero of Iroas, he does have good synergy with the Eidolon, but he doesn't have enough other good auras at the moment to be viable.
Also, for people paring up the Hero and Eidolon, note that Eidolon is viable without Hero but a Hero deck would always want 4 Eidolon's.
It's got more than 10 different strategies you can choose from.
Comment about it here.
Its a 5/7 most-the-time creature that ramps incredibly well in the right deck. She ramps as much as you can overextend yourself
As for people poo-pooing Hero of Leina Tower, youre right, nobody wants a 1drop that can have a relevant body later on. You know what sucks? top decking a 1drop late in the game with a ton of free mana. She makes late game tricks super relevant. I said it once, one can almost compare her to a vanilla Figure of Destiny- cept you have to use extra cards, i know, i know. 2-1 3-1 blah blah
no, we don't want a late game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets her PLUS open mana.
we also don't want an early game 1 mana 1/1 that requires a second spell that targets when we don't have open mana to use it's heroic ability.
super narrow creature is super narrow.
Nothing
Modern:
Cruel Control, UR Delver, RUG midrange, Akroma's Elfmorial
EDH:
Animar, Chainer, Derevi the Stonehewer Mystic, Nekusar
Ephara, God of the Polis
This is increadibly powerful in an agressive W/u azorius build.
Courser of Kruphix
Increases your chance of hitting land drops, survives a decent portion of standard removal, occasionally generates card advantage, gains life, and blocks well. The downside of giving your opponent information is offset by being able to plan around that next card yourself.
Herald of Torment
An extremely efficient flying beater.
Flame-Wreathed Phoenix
This is useless right now, but after rotation it could easily be the next desecration demon, as an undercosted big flyer with a punisher drawback.
Hunter's Prowess
Initially I didn't think much of this card, but after testing it in a simic prophet deck it's been insane. As long as you play it at the right time, usually after your opponent taps out, you're practically guaranteed 3+ cards and a bunch of damage.
I agree entirely with what you're saying. I just wouldnt put it in the category of "not a good card" personally (nor does it goes into the great card category), it seems like its cost, P/T and ability are enough to call it good.
It is not something I would necessarily want to drop on turn 2-3, but more like 5-7 where youre more likely to top-deck lands and want spells.
It has a nice interaction with chandra / domri as well at least. Also decently couples with Kiora as far as possibility of : play a land from top, tick down kiora, draw the non-land and reveal another land to play off the top.
Thirst for Knowledge % to hit artifact
That is late game versatility, instead of looking for your lone aetherling. All I said was late game it CAN become something bigger, and is a mana dump. Early game, yeah, youre right, no one that plays green will have extra mana for anything. No one who plays Gx will EVER be in a position with extra mana and a combat trick in hand.
Fated Infatuation seems like almost a lock to go in every Mono-Blue Devotion list. An instant-speed duplicate Master of Waves for 3 mana is mighty good, and Scry 2 if you play it on the attack is gravy.
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Hero of Iroas has Boon Satyr, Unflinching Courage, hopeful eidolon, and Ephara's blessing....
Tribute isn't particularly terrible, as the better creatures are well costed on their own. Tribute isn't amazing because of the reason you stated.
The problem with Phoenix isn't really the removal bit. That's only a secondary problem with it. The main problem with it is that it is simply outclassed by almost everything in standard currently, regardless of what you get out of the deal. It can't get passed a Desecration Demon, it can't get passed an Arbor Collossus, U/W has no problem with it.
The only deck where it's actually *good* against is Mono-U, as they have no real way to interact with either option (No removal, and fliers that either side will eat alive).
Dies to removal is a terrible argument, as that can be applied to many cards. Much of the removal it *does* die to is removal that any creature dies to; the only means of killing it with the recursion trigger on the stack is either Lightning Strike or Bile Blight in hand. Which while not horribly unlikely, I have to question why they haven't burned those options out yet on our other creatures.
As I said, the real problem is that a 5/5 flyer for 4 simply isn't good enough right now when you can easily be facing down a Desecration Demon or Arbor Collosus the next turn. RDW wouldn't want it, as they really need their turn 4 play to have an immediate and major impact, less they lose one of their most important turns. The deck that *does* want it right now is a Midrange deck. A Midrange deck that, mind you, doesn't exist. The only deck it has a home in is G/R monsters which is probably where it will see play if it does.
That said, it's still a damn good creature, just not good enough for the meta as it stands. Personally, I'm going to buy the living crap out of them if they hit $1-2, and probably start getting them aggressively at $3. Rotation is always looming on the horizon, and post-rotation does crazy things to borderline cards.
Yep, there was already a good amount and with Born of Gods, there's a ton which is why I think Hero is being slept on some too. I've even seen quite a bit of R/W with Madcap Skills theorycrafting.
Whelming Wave does seem like a very good blue "board wipe" as I don't see many of the named creature types being played in standard and rarely in modern. At times it is much better to move stuff to hand than GY.
Ephara, God of the Polis I do think she is quite good especially with Deputy of Acquittals though a very "ideal" situation, using two of them defensively is very interesting and for UW give you card draw and "safe blocks" baring trample. You will attack with your 10/10 with no trample? Sweet i will block with my Deputy... then after blocks bounce it with my another and draw 2 cards on my turn. It is an ideal situation but honestly might be worth it to save a dude and get draw out of it.
Scourge of Skola Vale I do like this card, the one trait that I think might break it would be Viligance and tokens. Playing G/W wouldn't make this impossible if you use Heliod to pump out tokens. Those two actually go very well together. Heck a G/U combo has the Kiora's Followers in order to abuse the hydra for a "pusedo"-vigilance.
Nessian Wilds Ravager despite the hatred towards "tribute" I don't see this as a bad card with a healthy amount of ramp. A lot of people hated on Kalonian Hydra because "Oh no big deal, its a 'garabage mythic'" though not played a lot in standard right now it did show its strength. I would not underestimate hydras in standard. You either get a 12/12 that if you have Kalonian hydra too, gets really stupid big fast, and if not you get a 6/6 that acts like removal "if you want". Sure there will be situations where it isn't useful and your opponent has no creatures and refuses tribute in order to by a turn for removal, but that is the same argument for any removal? No creatures, no targets?
Eight-and-a-Half-Tails, Faith & Wrath (Control)
Jarad, Life & Death (Reanimator)
Merieke, Seduction & Obedience (Control/Steals)
Intet, Dreamworld (Aggro/Control)
Rith, Predators (Aggro)
Also, I'd be interested in limited to play Scourge and then draft as many portent of betrayal's as possible.
The creature can't be blocked, a little off topic though
Eight-and-a-Half-Tails, Faith & Wrath (Control)
Jarad, Life & Death (Reanimator)
Merieke, Seduction & Obedience (Control/Steals)
Intet, Dreamworld (Aggro/Control)
Rith, Predators (Aggro)
Turn 1 Dryad Militant or any other 1 drop
Turn 2 Pain Seer
Turn 3 draw, then play a 3 drop, Xathrid Necromancer if you can.
At this point if they Supreme Verdict or Drown in Sorrow, you still have a lot of guys on the battlefield, and you drew with the Seer.
I mean there's a lot of removal sure, but the deck is already pretty good so drawing cards on a stick is insane for that strategy.
Well, Herald of Torment was about $3 each less than a week ago. Now some places are selling it for just over a dollar. I just purchased 4 at $0.99 each from Channel Fireball with $0.99 shipping. The obvious parallel is to Boon Satyr, distinguished by its Flash, but Flying ain't no joke neither. Even if Herald doesn't make an immediate impact on Standard I reckon it will impact the format eventually. $1.25 each with shipping seems plenty fair. It doesn't generate the CA or devotion that a Nightveil Specter can but it does fight Specters well and is more resilient to removal. Plus, Rakdos might make a comeback with Mogis and the Temple.
STANDARD
UB Midrange
Modern
U-Tron
Yeah, I couldn't resist getting Herald of Torment at .99 either. Even if it does nothing for me for the forseeable future, it seems good enough to eventually do something good. Worst case scenario, I broke even on it. I also bought a set of Gild at .49, and Fate Conflagration at .99 (And a few other things). Both seem like they were far too cheap for what they do.
You might want to re-read the card. If you could draw with Pain Seer the turn after it came out, it would be pretty sweet. But you can't.
Yes, I'm kind of shocked that Pain Seer is still hovering around the $5 mark. I'm fully expecting that this card will end up at $0.50 once people actually put it in their deck. The power level of this card is about on the same level as Stealer of Secrets. It costs one less, but you have to pay life for the card and wait until next turn before you get it.
They're FAR closer than you think. In fact, I'd say that stealer is significantly more useful than seer.
They're both equally unplayable in constructed, but as a common at least stealer has a decent chance of having a meaningful and positive impact on a limited deck.