After building a pretty slick w/r heroic deck at the prerelease, I'll say Hero of Iroas and Eidolon of Countless Battles are both on my watch list now. Unfortunately I didn't get to play my initial sleeper pick, Herald of Torment, but I'm standing by that pick. I would actively seek out a few Heralds, whereas I'm only picking up those white creature cards in trade if possible.
So, I'm not the only one that's mentioned Courser of Kruphix, but I've only seen people talking about his first ability. People did notice that he has Landfall, right?
Granted, his landfall ability isn't amazing, but couple it with never missing land drops, getting regular card advantage and a solid 4 toughness... and I can't see how you wouldn't love this guy.
That said, I'll also put in a speculative comment here... because the last time we got Landfall we got fetch lands. There's a decent possibility this guy is not only good, but also a preview for the next block.
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Yea I preordered 10 courser of kruphix last friday, even at 5 each. It's currently out of stock at both scg and channelfireball, though scg keeps restocking them at the same price, even if it went out of stock around 4 times. Like pain seer there's a lot of mixes opinions about the courser.
Personally I think it's a great card if rg devotion or rg midrange is successful again, but there's other cards I would rather play in rg agro for the 3 drop slot, like fanatic of xenagos or boon satyr, or maybe even fervent hunter if you play the whole suite of krosan tusker and the GG 3/2 from botg. 2/4 survives bile blight which I think will be a 4 of in mono black lists though, a lot of pros are saying it's the best 2cc removal for mono black.
Then again, boros reckoner was still around 6$ during gatecrash prerelease, most people have to play with the cards to see how good they are.
This card will be the worst rare in RTR and less remembered than skaab ruibator in three months. It struggles to be on the same power level as mass of ghouls, even in limited.
That its not simply "not good enough for competitive", or underpowered. But that this is offensively bad, the real stinker tier.
Still, my best evaluation is that its approximately on the same power level as a 4/4 for 4 vanilla beater.
Staple? Well perhaps in the post-RTR standard, definitely not before that. It's just a sad state of affairs how much WotC is weakening Standard that this courser could be considered playable.
I for one welcome our powered down standard environment
Staple? Well perhaps in the post-RTR standard, definitely not before that. It's just a sad state of affairs how much WotC is weakening Standard that this courser could be considered playable.
Standard has to weakened or power creep goes entirely out of control. I'm happy to see the power level go down so we don't see stuff like a 4/4 shroud when it attacks your opponent loses 4 life before combat for 1RG type stuff.
OT: Courser is gonna be decent in a couple decks. The people hating on Oracle are spouting the same nonsense they did when Desecration Demon came out. Punisher effects that both put your opponent in a bad situation are good, and your opponent isn't going to have 16 Hero's Downfalls in their hand and 7 Liliana Emblems on the field like people on here assume.
Pain Seer isn't as good as Underworld Connections without a good untap/tap mechanic. If it didn't burn you, it'd be different.
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"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
I think people underestimated Desecration Demon because no one predicted that Stormbreath Dragon would be a card. Note that a lone Stormbreath Dragon matches up poorly against Desecration Demon. Back when Desecration Demon was initially revealed, I think nearly no one mentioned its Flying as a good defensive feature--its Flying was mainly ridiculed as useless offensively.
(Yes, I bashed Desecration Demon back then, and I still find it awkward now, especially against Mono-Blue Devotion and GW Aggro and their high creature counts, but at least it blows less against decks with fewer creatures.)
I still can't be comfortable with Oracle of Bones, though. Your opponent will never pay Tribute if you're Hellbent. It dies to Lightning Strike and Bile Blight (and 3+/X's like Brimaz, Boros Reckoner, Herald of Torment, some Voice of Resurgence tokens,...). If your opponent catches you with nothing to cast too many times, s/he'll just stop paying Tribute.
I think people underestimated Desecration Demon because no one predicted that Stormbreath Dragon would be a card. Note that a lone Stormbreath Dragon matches up poorly against Desecration Demon. Back when Desecration Demon was initially revealed, I think nearly no one mentioned its Flying as a good defensive feature--its Flying was mainly ridiculed as useless offensively.
As someone who tried and tried to get DD into last year's decks, I can tell you that his inclusion this year is more about sac outlets than anything. It just happened to be in the same block as stuff like Lingering Souls, the Undying mechanic, two Garruks that produced tokens and Huntmaster of the Fells. I also saw enemies sacrifice a thragtusk on occasion to save themselves the damage. Oh and **** Gravecrawler, he made the demon worthless.
He just happened to be in a metagame that was much more capable of getting around him. I see Brimaz being a big weakness for him moving forward.
Pain Seer is the worst rare in the set. Such an overhyped card that litteraly takes forever to turn on.
Brimaz will see play, but with people packing Ultimate Price, Doom Blade, and soon Mizzium Mortars...he will eat it all day. Master of Waves is WAY more of a threat than he is a hurn later and can churn out more guys JUST by casting him. No where near as annoying and difficult to deal with like Geist was, nor as hard hitting like Hero of Bladehold or even Hero of Oxix Ridge was. Absolute Trap, but will resurge post rotation in September.
It always bugs me when people brag about how right they were about a card they thought would be good, or insulting others about how wrong they were about some other card. First off, people are going to be wrong about their card evaluations. Pros, amateurs, Timmy, Spike, Johnny - everyone is going to be wrong about a card at some point. And using a card like Desecration Demon as your standard for those evaluations is even worse. It was a horrid card for much of its initial appearance in Standard, and remains an awkward card even in the current Standard. Even when it's at its best, it's still not that great! The success of a card like Desecration Demon is more a product of its environment than any independent evaluation of its power level. So, calm down with your braggadocio.
Pain Seer is the worst rare in the set. Such an overhyped card that litteraly takes forever to turn on.
Brimaz will see play, but with people packing Ultimate Price, Doom Blade, and soon Mizzium Mortars...he will eat it all day. Master of Waves is WAY more of a threat than he is a hurn later and can churn out more guys JUST by casting him. No where near as annoying and difficult to deal with like Geist was, nor as hard hitting like Hero of Bladehold or even Hero of Oxix Ridge was. Absolute Trap, but will resurge post rotation in September.
Ironically, I think you're going to find that the number of people packing Ultimate Price and Doom Blade is going to decrease because they will replace them with Bile Blight.
You're right that it isn't Geist. But I don't think it is too far off from Hero of Bladehold. They have the same stats and similar effects after all. It is less aggressive, more defensive, but also 1 mana cheaper (not insignificant.)
It always bugs me when people brag about how right they were about a card they thought would be good, or insulting others about how wrong they were about some other card. First off, people are going to be wrong about their card evaluations. Pros, amateurs, Timmy, Spike, Johnny - everyone is going to be wrong about a card at some point. And using a card like Desecration Demon as your standard for those evaluations is even worse. It was a horrid card for much of its initial appearance in Standard, and remains an awkward card even in the current Standard. Even when it's at its best, it's still not that great! The success of a card like Desecration Demon is more a product of its environment than any independent evaluation of its power level. So, calm down with your braggadocio.
Who are you talking about here, exactly? I think I was the only one talking about extensive use of him, and my post basically said I tried to use him and failed miserably -- and then also pointed out a new card that will hurt him.
Pain Seer is the worst rare in the set. Such an overhyped card that litteraly takes forever to turn on.
Brimaz will see play, but with people packing Ultimate Price, Doom Blade, and soon Mizzium Mortars...he will eat it all day. Master of Waves is WAY more of a threat than he is a hurn later and can churn out more guys JUST by casting him. No where near as annoying and difficult to deal with like Geist was, nor as hard hitting like Hero of Bladehold or even Hero of Oxix Ridge was. Absolute Trap, but will resurge post rotation in September.
Ironically, I think you're going to find that the number of people packing Ultimate Price and Doom Blade is going to decrease because they will replace them with Bile Blight.
You're right that it isn't Geist. But I don't think it is too far off from Hero of Bladehold. They have the same stats and similar effects after all. It is less aggressive, more defensive, but also 1 mana cheaper (not insignificant.)
From what I've seen with just people playing with new cards, Mono Black has shifted to Devour Flesh and Bile Blight main board. If this trend continues to proliferate in the majority of builds, I can see Brimaz being a problem. But then again, they always have Hero's Downfall.
Mizzium Mortars is still being played in GR decks. I'm really gunning for Satyr Firedancer to shine here. He get's my pick for the sleeper of the set.
So, I'm not the only one that's mentioned Courser of Kruphix, but I've only seen people talking about his first ability. People did notice that he has Landfall, right?
Granted, his landfall ability isn't amazing, but couple it with never missing land drops, getting regular card advantage and a solid 4 toughness... and I can't see how you wouldn't love this guy.
That said, I'll also put in a speculative comment here... because the last time we got Landfall we got fetch lands. There's a decent possibility this guy is not only good, but also a preview for the next block.
If anything, it's main advantage is getting rid of lands from the top deck, letting you draw value cards.
I think that's some why people have yet to figure out why it's good:
They're locked into the 'doesn't ramp' idea, ignoring the fact that once he has dropped one single land, he has replaced himself with a new card by letting you draw a non-land.
I wish I played paper, because the prices will already be adjusted when this hits MTGO.
So, I'm not the only one that's mentioned Courser of Kruphix, but I've only seen people talking about his first ability. People did notice that he has Landfall, right?
Granted, his landfall ability isn't amazing, but couple it with never missing land drops, getting regular card advantage and a solid 4 toughness... and I can't see how you wouldn't love this guy.
That said, I'll also put in a speculative comment here... because the last time we got Landfall we got fetch lands. There's a decent possibility this guy is not only good, but also a preview for the next block.
If anything, it's main advantage is getting rid of lands from the top deck, letting you draw value cards.
I think that's some why people have yet to figure out why it's good:
They're locked into the 'doesn't ramp' idea, ignoring the fact that once he has dropped one single land, he has replaced himself with a new card by letting you draw a non-land.
I wish I played paper, because the prices will already be adjusted when this hits MTGO.
Oh dont worry. He wont be that expensive since Green decks are not as popular and good as the Blue and Black decks
It always bugs me when people brag about how right they were about a card they thought would be good, or insulting others about how wrong they were about some other card. First off, people are going to be wrong about their card evaluations. Pros, amateurs, Timmy, Spike, Johnny - everyone is going to be wrong about a card at some point. And using a card like Desecration Demon as your standard for those evaluations is even worse. It was a horrid card for much of its initial appearance in Standard, and remains an awkward card even in the current Standard. Even when it's at its best, it's still not that great! The success of a card like Desecration Demon is more a product of its environment than any independent evaluation of its power level. So, calm down with your braggadocio.
Nice use of braggadocio lol... But so true. If Abyssal Persecutor was in standard instead of DD, it'd cost a zillion dollars.
Checking in! It looks like Courser of Kruphix might be the only sleeper so far. In a set that's somewhat weak, it provides incremental advantages and a decent body and is naturally under-costed mana-wise.
Otherwise prices have been surprisingly stable. Brimaz, Kiora and the other top mythics have hardly moved. Perhaps this is because people see potential in these cards and don't want to trade or sell them off quite yet, despite these cards not seeing heavy constructed play. Of course, the meta may evolve and the jury is still out! Signing out.
The whole last page of suggestions were wrong. Courser of Kruphix will not be a staple in anything. Role-player...maybe? It does not scream staple at at all.
The courser became a green staple after all.
Nice to see who were wrong.
It always bugs me when people brag about how right they were about a card they thought would be good, or insulting others about how wrong they were about some other card. First off, people are going to be wrong about their card evaluations. Pros, amateurs, Timmy, Spike, Johnny - everyone is going to be wrong about a card at some point. And using a card like Desecration Demon as your standard for those evaluations is even worse. It was a horrid card for much of its initial appearance in Standard, and remains an awkward card even in the current Standard. Even when it's at its best, it's still not that great! The success of a card like Desecration Demon is more a product of its environment than any independent evaluation of its power level. So, calm down with your braggadocio.
There's no such thing as "independent evaluation of it's power level". Cards are not played in a vacuum. The usefulness of each card always entirely dependent on the environment.
What you say about DD is entirely wrong as DD have even seen small amount of play in Modern.
The only reason why DD was downplayed in ISD-RTR seasons was because of the many sac outlets provided. AND at the end of that season the top one deck was BG Rock which indeed packed 4x DD.
i agree. you have to build around him for him to be good. and if you do build around him, and he is your win condition, what if they detention sphere him? i dont like him.
Ppl seem to not to notice courser of kruphix seeing play in modern jund. It's a great card with a big butt and provides card advantage. I use it in standard jund and alongside underworld connections and chandra you can easily dig for lands and answers. It's a good card and definitely needs to be picked up for the price they're at now. Other than that almost every other card in BNG is awful. I think brimaz is overrated. Kiora is not that great. I say if it's not legacy or modern playable then it's just bad.
Brimaz was supposed to be the cat's meow but it doesn't see that much play at all.
That is not really surprising at all. I said that right from the beginning. If two of the best decks are packed to the brim with removal a pushed creature without protection wont make a difference at all.
I really dont know why people seriously thought that he would make stuff like White Weenie Tier 1.
The Mono Black Aggro decks, while fringe, have had awesome success with Spiteful Returned and Herald of Torment. FWIW, those cards are quite off the radar and are pretty nice when paired with the right mix of cards like Tormented Hero and company.
It's also the only deck where I've seen Pain Seer work too.
Still no one has caught on to Hero of Leina Tower. It's my #1 pick, considering you don't need a dedicated heroic deck to make it good, just one spell, and it fits very well in the sideboard of Hexproof against decks packing less removal.
For what it's worth, the opposite of evergreen is "deciduous" so I suggest we start using that from now on to refer to shroud, banding, islandhome, etc.
Another week, another 5 packs of awful BNG boosters. Last week I opened 6 packs from my FNM winnings, got absolute jank. This week, exactly the same.
Heroes' Podium
Oracle of Bones
Fated Infatuation
Champion of Stray Souls
Herald of Torment
This is dire. I won a box of BNG and there was nothing decent inside either. Winning FNM feels so hollow when the prize is just worthless paper I have no room for.
does your LGS offer store credit instead of packs? i usually just decline the packs and take the store credit at $2.50/pack
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Granted, his landfall ability isn't amazing, but couple it with never missing land drops, getting regular card advantage and a solid 4 toughness... and I can't see how you wouldn't love this guy.
That said, I'll also put in a speculative comment here... because the last time we got Landfall we got fetch lands. There's a decent possibility this guy is not only good, but also a preview for the next block.
If you hate the deck, I'm probably playing it!
Personally I think it's a great card if rg devotion or rg midrange is successful again, but there's other cards I would rather play in rg agro for the 3 drop slot, like fanatic of xenagos or boon satyr, or maybe even fervent hunter if you play the whole suite of krosan tusker and the GG 3/2 from botg. 2/4 survives bile blight which I think will be a 4 of in mono black lists though, a lot of pros are saying it's the best 2cc removal for mono black.
Then again, boros reckoner was still around 6$ during gatecrash prerelease, most people have to play with the cards to see how good they are.
I for one welcome our powered down standard environment
Standard has to weakened or power creep goes entirely out of control. I'm happy to see the power level go down so we don't see stuff like a 4/4 shroud when it attacks your opponent loses 4 life before combat for 1RG type stuff.
OT: Courser is gonna be decent in a couple decks. The people hating on Oracle are spouting the same nonsense they did when Desecration Demon came out. Punisher effects that both put your opponent in a bad situation are good, and your opponent isn't going to have 16 Hero's Downfalls in their hand and 7 Liliana Emblems on the field like people on here assume.
Pain Seer isn't as good as Underworld Connections without a good untap/tap mechanic. If it didn't burn you, it'd be different.
"I hope to have such a death... lying in triumph atop the broken bodies of those who slew me..."
(Yes, I bashed Desecration Demon back then, and I still find it awkward now, especially against Mono-Blue Devotion and GW Aggro and their high creature counts, but at least it blows less against decks with fewer creatures.)
I still can't be comfortable with Oracle of Bones, though. Your opponent will never pay Tribute if you're Hellbent. It dies to Lightning Strike and Bile Blight (and 3+/X's like Brimaz, Boros Reckoner, Herald of Torment, some Voice of Resurgence tokens,...). If your opponent catches you with nothing to cast too many times, s/he'll just stop paying Tribute.
As someone who tried and tried to get DD into last year's decks, I can tell you that his inclusion this year is more about sac outlets than anything. It just happened to be in the same block as stuff like Lingering Souls, the Undying mechanic, two Garruks that produced tokens and Huntmaster of the Fells. I also saw enemies sacrifice a thragtusk on occasion to save themselves the damage. Oh and **** Gravecrawler, he made the demon worthless.
He just happened to be in a metagame that was much more capable of getting around him. I see Brimaz being a big weakness for him moving forward.
Brimaz will see play, but with people packing Ultimate Price, Doom Blade, and soon Mizzium Mortars...he will eat it all day. Master of Waves is WAY more of a threat than he is a hurn later and can churn out more guys JUST by casting him. No where near as annoying and difficult to deal with like Geist was, nor as hard hitting like Hero of Bladehold or even Hero of Oxix Ridge was. Absolute Trap, but will resurge post rotation in September.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
Ironically, I think you're going to find that the number of people packing Ultimate Price and Doom Blade is going to decrease because they will replace them with Bile Blight.
You're right that it isn't Geist. But I don't think it is too far off from Hero of Bladehold. They have the same stats and similar effects after all. It is less aggressive, more defensive, but also 1 mana cheaper (not insignificant.)
Who are you talking about here, exactly? I think I was the only one talking about extensive use of him, and my post basically said I tried to use him and failed miserably -- and then also pointed out a new card that will hurt him.
From what I've seen with just people playing with new cards, Mono Black has shifted to Devour Flesh and Bile Blight main board. If this trend continues to proliferate in the majority of builds, I can see Brimaz being a problem. But then again, they always have Hero's Downfall.
Mizzium Mortars is still being played in GR decks. I'm really gunning for Satyr Firedancer to shine here. He get's my pick for the sleeper of the set.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
If anything, it's main advantage is getting rid of lands from the top deck, letting you draw value cards.
I think that's some why people have yet to figure out why it's good:
They're locked into the 'doesn't ramp' idea, ignoring the fact that once he has dropped one single land, he has replaced himself with a new card by letting you draw a non-land.
I wish I played paper, because the prices will already be adjusted when this hits MTGO.
Oh dont worry. He wont be that expensive since Green decks are not as popular and good as the Blue and Black decks
Nice use of braggadocio lol... But so true. If Abyssal Persecutor was in standard instead of DD, it'd cost a zillion dollars.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Otherwise prices have been surprisingly stable. Brimaz, Kiora and the other top mythics have hardly moved. Perhaps this is because people see potential in these cards and don't want to trade or sell them off quite yet, despite these cards not seeing heavy constructed play. Of course, the meta may evolve and the jury is still out! Signing out.
The courser became a green staple after all.
Nice to see who were wrong.
There's no such thing as "independent evaluation of it's power level". Cards are not played in a vacuum. The usefulness of each card always entirely dependent on the environment.
What you say about DD is entirely wrong as DD have even seen small amount of play in Modern.
The only reason why DD was downplayed in ISD-RTR seasons was because of the many sac outlets provided. AND at the end of that season the top one deck was BG Rock which indeed packed 4x DD.
BGU Control
R Aggro
Standard - For Fun
BG Auras
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
That is not really surprising at all. I said that right from the beginning. If two of the best decks are packed to the brim with removal a pushed creature without protection wont make a difference at all.
I really dont know why people seriously thought that he would make stuff like White Weenie Tier 1.
It's also the only deck where I've seen Pain Seer work too.
"There are no two words in the English language more harmful than 'good job'." -Terrance Fletcher, Whiplash (2014)
Quotes:
does your LGS offer store credit instead of packs? i usually just decline the packs and take the store credit at $2.50/pack