Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Legendary Land (Rare)
Tap: Add 1 to your mana pool
2, Tap: Choose a color. Add to your mana pool an amount of mana of that color equal to your devotion to that color. (Your devotion to a color is the number of mana symbols of that color in the mana costs of permanents you control.)
Everyone already knows what BTE does, and it's an insane card. but now, its even better.
So has anyone every thought of casting 4 BTE's then in turn activating Nykthos for 8 red or 9 green mana? well i did and i found a (unlikely)draw that can make it happen, ponder on this turn 1-2 scenario (yes, an 8 or 9 drop on turn two.)
-Turn one, you play, you have 7 cards in hand, it's Elvish Mystic, a forest(or stomping ground), Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and 4 BTE's. You play forest into Mystic. end turn
-Turn two, you draw some insane fatty like Craterhoof Behemoth (sadly its rotating, maybe a new craterhoof will appear) or Garruk, Caller of Beasts. some bomb diggity thing. play shrine for land drop. tap Mystic for G, tap your forest G, have GG, cast 4 BTE's, have RG left over from the BTE's, use it to activate Shrine for 9 green mana, or 8 red mana. cast big fatty.
A red creature could work because BTE's hybrid mana gives green AND red devotion, but your dork doesn't count for red, only green.
and thats the new way to ramp guys, cast crazy things on turn two with dork, forest, shrine and BTE. even two BTE's work, you still get a 4 or 5 drop turn two.
so i see this card being INSANE in any deck. Sphinx's for billions? sure.
Moral of the story is, play mono green ramp, race RDW and pulverize it.
I guess OP wants it to be 'keyworded' like "dies" was. What word would you replace ETB with though?
When Aegis Angel is born?
When Huntmaster of the Fells arrives?
When Kitchen Sphinx lands?
When Faerie Imposter busts in?
When Dread Cacodemon pops in?
When Malfegor shows up?
I have been hit by BTE chains pretty consistently so this is not that far off. Simply getting off two BTEs and one Elvish mystic would give 5 mana to spend... on turn 2. At least Thragtusk is rotating.
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To the people that say that a card needs to be a higher rarity because of Limited... I hate you guys so much. I present to you with this.
I have been hit by BTE chains pretty consistently so this is not that far off. Simply getting off two BTEs and one Elvish mystic would give 5 mana to spend... on turn 2. At least Thragtusk is rotating.
Shrine requires 2 to activate, it's not that explosive. Back from Christmas Land and into the reality of RL, this card will be played, but it won't be played for it's mythical t2 explosiveness.
The new mythic rules make it viable in multiple copies though. Tap one during main phase, play the second one, sac the first one, tap the second one . . . loads of mana potential.
Shrine requires 2 to activate, it's not that explosive. Back from Christmas Land and into the reality of RL, this card will be played, but it won't be played for it's mythical t2 explosiveness.
The new mythic rules make it viable in multiple copies though. Tap one during main phase, play the second one, sac the first one, tap the second one . . . loads of mana potential.
Turn 2: Tap forest, Tap Elvish Mystic into BTE into BTE then tap Nykthos for a 5 mana green or red threat on turn two. How is that not explosive? It isn't even asking for a lot either. Granted you over-extend like a boss but lately Wizards has been forgiving to that as removal keeps getting more and more crappy.
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To the people that say that a card needs to be a higher rarity because of Limited... I hate you guys so much. I present to you with this.
Still can't believe they thought BTE was an acceptable card to print, especially right before a devotion block with that land...so dumb.
Doesn't help that half the multicolored cards in Theros are in Gruul colors.
Free 2/2 aren't exactly new and never broke anything (frogmite etc). The 3 mana version of them also absolutely never saw play anywhere (priest of gyx and the red colorshifted version). The 1G 2/1 that gave one mana of any color as it ETB never saw any play either. I think, considering those precedents, that the card was pushed, but nothing would've made you think that it was too good (i don't honestly, BBE was another thing completely and even BBE see fringe play in formats with the good PWs still unbanned).
You're right, bte doesnt fit in a ramp deck normally, but with this new insane combo, I can see it happening easily, because with shrine, bte is basically a ramp card, even if its only one bte and mystic its still a free two drop and a 3 drop as well. It is a pretty insane card and since mono colors are a thing it provides an easy way to ramp as well as defend from aggro decks
Realistically you can possibly get that 5 mana turn 2, but 9 is definitely MCL. That's still a lot of mana. I don't think the Acolyte will be worth it, but the Caryatid definitely. Depending on what the 3 drop is, even turn 2ing a free 3 drop (Reverent Hunter? I'd be gunning for Bow of Nylea, myself) is nothing to laugh at. Turn 3 Garruk McDramatic Entrance. There's a lot of possibilities with this legendary land card.
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*I COLLECT EHAN106 ALTERS. GOT ANY?*
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Exactly, an early 5 drop is nothing to scoff at. Altho, they just untap drop a 2nd land and Doom Blade your Hydra. But in all seriousness, I think this land has a lot of potential in a dedicated deck. How about ramp into Garruk then use his -3 to put out a HUGE fatty (Worldspine Worm comes to mind. )
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*I COLLECT EHAN106 ALTERS. GOT ANY?*
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
Turn one, you play, you have 7 cards in hand, it's Elvish Mystic, a forest(or stomping ground), Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and 4 BTE's. You play forest into Mystic. end turn
What are the chances that you'll have all four BtE in your opening hand? What would the math on that be?
I do not think that is a realistic example. I can see 2, 3 being a stretch... but 4 copies?
I see much larger casual-fun uses for the land, such as a black weenie deck, w/ fast beats costing BB, w/ Consume Spirit and Drain Life as finishers. There more to Magic than standard...
What are the chances that you'll have all four BtE in your opening hand? What would the math on that be?
I do not think that is a realistic example. I can see 2, 3 being a stretch... but 4 copies?
I see much larger casual-fun uses for the land, such as a black weenie deck, w/ fast beats costing BB, w/ Consume Spirit and Drain Life as finishers. There more to Magic than standard...
Sorry, but you obviously did not bother reading my whole post.
well i did and i found a (unlikely)draw that can make it happen, ponder on this turn 1-2 scenario (yes, an 8 or 9 drop on turn two.)
Notice how i said unlikely? Also i think everyone here has enough sense to know that the perfect hand is not going to happen very often, maybe 1 out of 100 games will something like this happen. I often get two BTE's opening hand in my RG deck.
Also, of course there is more to magic than standard, it's just my favorite format so god forbid i should think of a way to make the card useful in standard. Just because all of my examples are standard does not mean this card is only for standard, it's just what I know best since I only started playing magic late Innistrad.
On another note, what you said implies that this use of BTE and Shrine are not fun, a lot of people have different ideas and concepts of fun. just like my favorite quote. "I don't understand why other people aren't having fun when I cast Armageddon, I'm having fun when I cast Armageddon."
Stoogeslap, the point of this post was to point out how broken this card could be, not how likely or "believable" the opening hand depicted would actually be.
Exactly, an early 5 drop is nothing to scoff at. Altho, they just untap drop a 2nd land and Doom Blade your Hydra. But in all seriousness, I think this land has a lot of potential in a dedicated deck. How about ramp into Garruk then use his -3 to put out a HUGE fatty (Worldspine Worm comes to mind. )
Usually, when your 5 drop gets doombladed on turn 2 you just kind of sit there and lose because you expended too many resources on it. In this scenario, you beat for 4, play another Hydra, and consider what to do with the 3-4 cards left in your hand.
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I primarily play limited, so most of my spoiler season comments view cards through that lens.
Free 2/2 aren't exactly new and never broke anything (frogmite etc). The 3 mana version of them also absolutely never saw play anywhere (priest of gyx and the red colorshifted version). The 1G 2/1 that gave one mana of any color as it ETB never saw any play either. I think, considering those precedents, that the card was pushed, but nothing would've made you think that it was too good (i don't honestly, BBE was another thing completely and even BBE see fringe play in formats with the good PWs still unbanned).
Context.
You will be hard-pressed to find anyone who would suggest that Frogmite, in combination with other things, did not break Mirrodin.
I don't doubt that Nykthos has potential and can power out big beaters. However, the card isn't supposed to, and does not, work in a vacuum, isn't most of the power from cards such as Burning-Tree Emissary?
In fact, in the absence of an adequate board presence, whether that's mana dorks, BTEs, or whatever, the card is a losing game and it is clear that the card isn't for every deck.
Usually, when your 5 drop gets doombladed on turn 2 you just kind of sit there and lose because you expended too many resources on it. In this scenario, you beat for 4, play another Hydra, and consider what to do with the 3-4 cards left in your hand.
This is exactly what makes this so dangerous. Normally, mana ramp cards slow down your first turn or two before they start benefiting you, don't have 2 power, aren't essentially free, and have to tap to do their job. Burning Tree Emissary used with Nykthos has none of these drawbacks, and doesn't deviate from a standard aggro build at all. It totally deviates from the weakness that ramp is supposed to have. Playing a 5 drop on turn two is dumb...at least Dark Ritual cost you a couple cards to pull that off.
It's stupid, it's terrible design, and it's going to make standard suck. I wouldn't be surprised to see one of these two cards banned in Standard. I really hope it's Burning Tree Emissary.
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Trolljutai, YOLOghan, Swagumgar, Bromoka, and Derptarka, the Elder Dragons.
Forest, Elvish Mystic
Nykthos, BTE --> 3 mana...
...which is the same you would have had anyway on turn 2 off a turn 1 mana dork? That's really explosive.
Forest, Elvish Mystic
Nykthos, BTE --> 3 mana...
...which is the same you would have had anyway on turn 2 off a turn 1 mana dork? That's really explosive.
Not sure where you're getting six. Elvish Mystic, two BTE, and Nykthos. That's four. Five if you want to count the thing you're ramping into. If you're including "forest" in your count, then I suppose hard casting an Obzedat or whatever is a six card combo too.
And yeah, it is too stronk when it's entirely realistic to get opening hands with those cards pretty often and it requires you to play no cards you wouldn't already be playing.
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Trolljutai, YOLOghan, Swagumgar, Bromoka, and Derptarka, the Elder Dragons.
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Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx
Legendary Land (Rare)
Tap: Add 1 to your mana pool
2, Tap: Choose a color. Add to your mana pool an amount of mana of that color equal to your devotion to that color. (Your devotion to a color is the number of mana symbols of that color in the mana costs of permanents you control.)
Everyone already knows what BTE does, and it's an insane card. but now, its even better.
So has anyone every thought of casting 4 BTE's then in turn activating Nykthos for 8 red or 9 green mana? well i did and i found a (unlikely)draw that can make it happen, ponder on this turn 1-2 scenario (yes, an 8 or 9 drop on turn two.)
-Turn one, you play, you have 7 cards in hand, it's Elvish Mystic, a forest(or stomping ground), Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, and 4 BTE's. You play forest into Mystic. end turn
-Turn two, you draw some insane fatty like Craterhoof Behemoth (sadly its rotating, maybe a new craterhoof will appear) or Garruk, Caller of Beasts. some bomb diggity thing. play shrine for land drop. tap Mystic for G, tap your forest G, have GG, cast 4 BTE's, have RG left over from the BTE's, use it to activate Shrine for 9 green mana, or 8 red mana. cast big fatty.
A red creature could work because BTE's hybrid mana gives green AND red devotion, but your dork doesn't count for red, only green.
and thats the new way to ramp guys, cast crazy things on turn two with dork, forest, shrine and BTE. even two BTE's work, you still get a 4 or 5 drop turn two.
so i see this card being INSANE in any deck. Sphinx's for billions? sure.
Moral of the story is, play mono green ramp, race RDW and pulverize it.
I have been hit by BTE chains pretty consistently so this is not that far off. Simply getting off two BTEs and one Elvish mystic would give 5 mana to spend... on turn 2. At least Thragtusk is rotating.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SY8h2vp5Xis
Doesn't help that half the multicolored cards in Theros are in Gruul colors.
Shrine requires 2 to activate, it's not that explosive. Back from Christmas Land and into the reality of RL, this card will be played, but it won't be played for it's mythical t2 explosiveness.
The new mythic rules make it viable in multiple copies though. Tap one during main phase, play the second one, sac the first one, tap the second one . . . loads of mana potential.
Turn 2: Tap forest, Tap Elvish Mystic into BTE into BTE then tap Nykthos for a 5 mana green or red threat on turn two. How is that not explosive? It isn't even asking for a lot either. Granted you over-extend like a boss but lately Wizards has been forgiving to that as removal keeps getting more and more crappy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SY8h2vp5Xis
Free 2/2 aren't exactly new and never broke anything (frogmite etc). The 3 mana version of them also absolutely never saw play anywhere (priest of gyx and the red colorshifted version). The 1G 2/1 that gave one mana of any color as it ETB never saw any play either. I think, considering those precedents, that the card was pushed, but nothing would've made you think that it was too good (i don't honestly, BBE was another thing completely and even BBE see fringe play in formats with the good PWs still unbanned).
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
You have a Kalonian Hydra.
It's not a bad start, eh?
EDH:
UBGThe MimeoplasmUBG
Turn two hydra is not bad at all.
Exactly, an early 5 drop is nothing to scoff at. Altho, they just untap drop a 2nd land and Doom Blade your Hydra. But in all seriousness, I think this land has a lot of potential in a dedicated deck. How about ramp into Garruk then use his -3 to put out a HUGE fatty (Worldspine Worm comes to mind. )
An actor without a director is but a mannequin.
While a director without a writer is unemployed.
But ultimately a writer without words is dead.
~R. D. Newman
"7,015 creatures in existence. They all die to removal."
Never before has a boy wanted more...zombie slaying.
GP Vegas: It was once in a lifetime!
On Vault of the Archangel
What are the chances that you'll have all four BtE in your opening hand? What would the math on that be?
I do not think that is a realistic example. I can see 2, 3 being a stretch... but 4 copies?
I see much larger casual-fun uses for the land, such as a black weenie deck, w/ fast beats costing BB, w/ Consume Spirit and Drain Life as finishers. There more to Magic than standard...
Turn 1: Forest, mana dork
Turn 2: Shrine, BTE, BTE, tap shrine Kalonian Hydra.
You aren't even playing "bad" cards. Everything here works just fine in an aggressive GR deck, but together they're kind of sickening.
EDH:
UBGThe MimeoplasmUBG
Sorry, but you obviously did not bother reading my whole post.
Notice how i said unlikely? Also i think everyone here has enough sense to know that the perfect hand is not going to happen very often, maybe 1 out of 100 games will something like this happen. I often get two BTE's opening hand in my RG deck.
Also, of course there is more to magic than standard, it's just my favorite format so god forbid i should think of a way to make the card useful in standard. Just because all of my examples are standard does not mean this card is only for standard, it's just what I know best since I only started playing magic late Innistrad.
On another note, what you said implies that this use of BTE and Shrine are not fun, a lot of people have different ideas and concepts of fun. just like my favorite quote. "I don't understand why other people aren't having fun when I cast Armageddon, I'm having fun when I cast Armageddon."
That is a more believable opening hand.
Usually, when your 5 drop gets doombladed on turn 2 you just kind of sit there and lose because you expended too many resources on it. In this scenario, you beat for 4, play another Hydra, and consider what to do with the 3-4 cards left in your hand.
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
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A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).
Context.
You will be hard-pressed to find anyone who would suggest that Frogmite, in combination with other things, did not break Mirrodin.
I don't doubt that Nykthos has potential and can power out big beaters. However, the card isn't supposed to, and does not, work in a vacuum, isn't most of the power from cards such as Burning-Tree Emissary?
In fact, in the absence of an adequate board presence, whether that's mana dorks, BTEs, or whatever, the card is a losing game and it is clear that the card isn't for every deck.
This is exactly what makes this so dangerous. Normally, mana ramp cards slow down your first turn or two before they start benefiting you, don't have 2 power, aren't essentially free, and have to tap to do their job. Burning Tree Emissary used with Nykthos has none of these drawbacks, and doesn't deviate from a standard aggro build at all. It totally deviates from the weakness that ramp is supposed to have. Playing a 5 drop on turn two is dumb...at least Dark Ritual cost you a couple cards to pull that off.
It's stupid, it's terrible design, and it's going to make standard suck. I wouldn't be surprised to see one of these two cards banned in Standard. I really hope it's Burning Tree Emissary.
Forest, Elvish Mystic
Nykthos, BTE --> 3 mana...
...which is the same you would have had anyway on turn 2 off a turn 1 mana dork? That's really explosive.
You really need 2-3 BTE for this to be stupid.
6 cards combo for 5 mana drop too stronk.
Not sure where you're getting six. Elvish Mystic, two BTE, and Nykthos. That's four. Five if you want to count the thing you're ramping into. If you're including "forest" in your count, then I suppose hard casting an Obzedat or whatever is a six card combo too.
And yeah, it is too stronk when it's entirely realistic to get opening hands with those cards pretty often and it requires you to play no cards you wouldn't already be playing.