I disagree with Point 2...2/1 for 2 is not passable; it is under the curve and a sacrifice for an aggro-based deck to make. If a deck of this nature includes this creature, it is because it has a really playable ability, which this is not. If an opponent removes it, it does set you behind significantly--as the aggressor, you do NOT want to be trading and time is NOT on your side. Your opponents can likely be much more threatening than you past Turn 4, and if you do have a good midrange game, you probably do not want to be playing this card, anyway.
I don't fully agree with this. As a RakDW player, I can tell you that Rakdos aggro is not fast by comparison to the rest of the format. Would you play this card in Gruul or Naya blitz (if the colors provided the possibility)? No, not at all because a 2/1 for 2 is bad for your curve and too slow for the deck. However, Rakdos plays a bit slower, a bit bigger but still faster than a midrange deck; it still has problems when it runs out of cards and this could potentially be a great way to solve it. Your little guys are far less valuable in Rakdos than other faster aggro decks. On turn seven, Cackler or Nobel are awful topdecks equivalent to pretty much drawing Blood Scrivener AND having your opponent remove him because they do virtually nothing for you at that point.
However, I can't say I think Rakdos is where he'll shine (though a more "control" focused aggro like Rakdos could potentially fit him). I think playing him in a dedicated control deck (likely Grixis, maybe BUG..I don't think Esper can empty it's hand enough) that uses the graveyard a lot and takes advantage of multiple empty handed draws from think twice/flashbacks, etc is where this guy could shine. If we had Bob, Scrivs wouldn't be played but we don't and card advantage has been crap outside of a turn 10 Sphinx's Rev.
This is, by far, the only post in this thread or the card introduction thread that has any shred of sanity whatsoever. I have been speculating on cards for over a decade to great success, both as a profiteer and a player, and I am 95% sure that the Scrivener is first-class junk.
Not trying to be rude but this statement is wholly unnecessary and doesn't do you any favors with respect to providing any legitimacy to your post. It's incredibly hyperbolic and inflammatory despite the fact that a lot of people who posted here simply said something along lines of "this looks fun in X/with X!" Fun != hyper competitive, ultra valuable. It's a cool card with a fairly unique effect and some people will have a good time playing it in their casual decks. Calling us insane for wanting to have fun playing Magic is a bit much don't you think? Really not sure why you felt as though you had to belittle everyone and swoop in to point out how foolish we all are for displaying mild interest in a newly spoiled card. This isn't the competitive Standard forums and we're not all trying to break the format wide open. Some of us just like playing with cool Black cards and we'd like to give it a go in our casual decks. What's so insane about that?
I'm not saying that your overall opinions of the card are wrong, far from it, I'm just not sure why you couldn't leave out the part where you openly mock everyone for no visible reason. Seems like a great way to have your otherwise strong post completely ignored. I 100% agree that the card seems relatively weak in competitive Constructed formats but I don't see why you felt the need to insult me for wanting to pair it with Uba Mask in my casual, multiplayer global discard deck.
Point 1 makes me scratch my head...that plan take 2 turns to get one card...maybe. If you overextend into a Verdict, you are justifying immediate, game-breaking card disadvantage with a board wipe with incremental card advantage. And if you get 2 cards, you are still probably drawing dead against Aurelia, Thragtusk, Angel of Serenity, and so on.
Aggro normal game plan is to play dudes until there is enough to kill opponent. Scrivener only affects the order in which you play them: either him on t2 if you need more power or last if you need more cards.
I disagree with Point 2...2/1 for 2 is not passable; it is under the curve and a sacrifice for an aggro-based deck to make. If a deck of this nature includes this creature, it is because it has a really playable ability, which this is not. If an opponent removes it, it does set you behind significantly--as the aggressor, you do NOT want to be trading and time is NOT on your side. Your opponents can likely be much more threatening than you past Turn 4, and if you do have a good midrange game, you probably do not want to be playing this card, anyway.
power = cmc+1 is a playable aggro creature
power = cmc is fine if you have abilities that justify a card (loltroll, knights, etc.)
So it all depends on how good his ability will turn out. 1 activation out of him is already enough to justify inclusion in aggro as proved by Silvergill Adept.
Outside of aggro midrange decks could use him as anti-rakdos return tech that is also a win condition with either wolf run or township.
This card is certainly not everyone's cup of tea. As has been pointed out ad nauseam, in a post undying world overextending into wrath is one of the worst things you can do. Still, I think this card is playable.
1 He's a zombie. Gravecrawler loves zombies.
2 In an ideal situation (work with me for a second) he functions as a dark confidant with less lifeloss.
3 This card has its fans. Those fans will work to make him work. Lili is obvious, but cards like the newly spoiled Sin Collector will also be utilized to clear your opponents hand of wraths. This card loves being played with too much discard, (maindeck duress anyone?) and players love playing with too much discardd. It's sad that discard demon costs 6, but there is the potential here for a sweet all in black deck, and that gets people excited.
4 A core of Gravecrawler and Geralf's messenger is resilient to wraths. Throw in lingering souls, faithless looting (perfect for both card selection and going down on cards) and you have a sweet deck with a real shot at being a competitive player in the meta.
Personally I always feel like a naked baby doused in bacon grease thrown into a tiger pit when i'm in topdeck mode. This is a polarizing card that isn't for anyone, but it has enough upside to see play.
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Whenever a player taps a nonbasic land, [Card] deals 2 damage to them.
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Whenever a player would gain life, flip a coin. If heads, that player loses that much life instead. If tails sacrifice [card] and that player gains that life as per usual.
BOB + BS = awesome deck. haha!I'm seeing a grixis movement, this plus duskmantle seer + sire. looks amazing to me.
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In modern there is dredge, in standard there is lotleth troll, i don't see the problem, does it need support to shine? Yup, you know who else was a bad card till people figured out what sort of deck to play it in? bob. Is he busted like bob? No, he is a good card with decent interactions, i'm willing to bet he will find a good home in golgari zombies. after rotation, who knows.
I think this is one of my favorite cards in the set. Having played around with BW Zombies a bit, the biggest issue was running out of cards late game without having to cut cards you need to keep aggressive. This guy helps this issue wonderfully.
These are going for ~$9 pre-order on eBay. If Reckoner can crash to $11, where do you think this card will be?
It's extremely conditional and strategy based. I think it's good, but I also think that you can scoop these up for nothing post pre-release. Have we learned nothing from Duskmantle Seer (still a good card, lacking support)
The main point getting a BS out then putting Sire on the table asap, to insure that you're using it to your advantage and reanimating stuff from your grave..
Maybe you can remove green for Wild Guess and Dangerous Wager, four colors seems a bit harsh and those two cards work nice with Blood Scrivener.
Varolz, the Scar-Striped & Lotleth Troll & Blood Scrivener seem like they could have some good synergy between them.
Pitch cards with Troll, draw extra cards with Scrivener, reuse the creatures in the yard with Varolz.
You don't call "dying to removal" if the removal is more expensive in resources than the creature. If you have to spend BG (Abrupt Decay), or W + basic land (PtE) to remove a 1G, that is not "dying to removal". Strictly speaking Goyf dies to removal, but actually your removal is dying to Goyf.
As a fan, owner, and user of Bob; this card is somwhat incomparable to Bob. Bob allows you to relaibly draw cards, but with higher, possible damage. Blood Scriviner does non of these things reliably, but the damage amount is known. One issue that a few have raised is the length of time required be "helbent" to draw the card. This is a problem for keeping him alive or game play tricks when you need something else in hand at turn 2-3 to play (removal or creature to attack/block with). One big bonus is the zombie creature type for grave crawler. I find that RB aggro wants to swing big and fast to win before I start dumping the life gain threats of Junk reanimator, Jund, Esper, and Naya aggro. Blood Scriviner is not an aggressive card for that build plan to win. As for Jund, I really don't see it fitting in anywhere to gain any advantage while keeping this creature alive. Now a deck that I could see using Blood Scriviner would be Aristocrats, cause it seem to run out of gas quickly and needs card draw to sack dudes. It's just a theory for that build. I speculate that this card is not worth a pre-order due to lack of consisten effect when needed. It has value, but has a market face Duskmantle Seer had in hype. Blood Scriviner has great potential for being easily splashed and under 3 CMC for modern builds, but another card, Infernal Tutor (hellbent needed for effectiveness) sees no play. Although not comparible, the "hellbent" factor is something no one wants in competative play cause its the early signs of circling the drain in a match. There is still much to be discussed on this card, but my findings are weak for staple play future.
I think it is somewhat possible to put this in reanimater, but it'd have to be a very weird version that used cards like loteth troll and whispering madness, janky but it could interesting.
One with nothingness is an awesome idea, i love you.
This card is certainly not everyone's cup of tea. As has been pointed out ad nauseam, in a post undying world overextending into wrath is one of the worst things you can do. Still, I think this card is playable.
1 He's a zombie. Gravecrawler loves zombies.
2 In an ideal situation (work with me for a second) he functions as a dark confidant with less lifeloss.
3 This card has its fans. Those fans will work to make him work. Lili is obvious, but cards like the newly spoiled Sin Collector will also be utilized to clear your opponents hand of wraths. This card loves being played with too much discard, (maindeck duress anyone?) and players love playing with too much discardd. It's sad that discard demon costs 6, but there is the potential here for a sweet all in black deck, and that gets people excited.
4 A core of Gravecrawler and Geralf's messenger is resilient to wraths. Throw in lingering souls, faithless looting (perfect for both card selection and going down on cards) and you have a sweet deck with a real shot at being a competitive player in the meta.
Personally I always feel like a naked baby doused in bacon grease thrown into a tiger pit when i'm in topdeck mode. This is a polarizing card that isn't for anyone, but it has enough upside to see play.
I think I remember reading somewhere that a few deck archetypes were pretty much eliminated because of many players complaining that they were "unfun" Three of those archetypes being land destruction, counter magic, and discard. While there are cards that exist with these functions on them, you cant build a deck revolved around them in standard and havent been able to for a long time. Some times counters get through, but discard decks and LD decks dont exist anymore.
As far as the card goes, I like the flavor...it feels very Rakdos with it's all or nothing..let's throw everything I got and the kitchen sink at the opponent. Besides Sign in Blood, there really hasnt been a good black draw engine...not saying this is one...I've been trying the Underworld Connections a little to see how it did...but it really doesnt help much.
We'll see how this guy does. Getting an empty hand could prove to be annoying, but if you do or run out of steam, it could possibly turn the tables quick.
As a fan, owner, and user of Bob; this card is somwhat incomparable to Bob. Bob allows you to relaibly draw cards, but with higher, possible damage. Blood Scriviner does non of these things reliably, but the damage amount is known. One issue that a few have raised is the length of time required be "helbent" to draw the card. This is a problem for keeping him alive or game play tricks when you need something else in hand at turn 2-3 to play (removal or creature to attack/block with). One big bonus is the zombie creature type for grave crawler. I find that RB aggro wants to swing big and fast to win before I start dumping the life gain threats of Junk reanimator, Jund, Esper, and Naya aggro. Blood Scriviner is not an aggressive card for that build plan to win. As for Jund, I really don't see it fitting in anywhere to gain any advantage while keeping this creature alive. Now a deck that I could see using Blood Scriviner would be Aristocrats, cause it seem to run out of gas quickly and needs card draw to sack dudes. It's just a theory for that build. I speculate that this card is not worth a pre-order due to lack of consisten effect when needed. It has value, but has a market face Duskmantle Seer had in hype. Blood Scriviner has great potential for being easily splashed and under 3 CMC for modern builds, but another card, Infernal Tutor (hellbent needed for effectiveness) sees no play. Although not comparible, the "hellbent" factor is something no one wants in competative play cause its the early signs of circling the drain in a match. There is still much to be discussed on this card, but my findings are weak for staple play future.
Fair points, and the two cards indeed are very different beasts, but here are a few things I think deserve mention about Bartleby (yes, I'm calling him that):
1) Most importantly, this can trigger multiple times in a turn. If you have looting or Wheel of Fortune effects, you can get multiple triggers in a turn. This is especially useful if you topdeck this late with something like Faithless Looting or Think Twice in the graveyard; you can get a powerful effect the turn of.
2) You can plan your game around the 1 life loss. As an average, it doesn't mean much, but as long as you know your opponent can't burn you out, you don't have to sacrifice your Scrivener before you're down to the last life you can afford.
3) Symmetrical discard is a powerful tool, and can often make you Hellbent by your turn 4 draw step. Here's an example in Standard:
By T3, you've already gotten a trigger out of the Scrivener. You won't get it on the T4 upkeep unless you draw a 1 drop off of Looting, but hey, you can just flash back Looting next turn for that same card advantage and graveyard filling. Meanwhile, you've got huge board control and have already hit him with a Mind Rot.
Your opponent has had to discard twice and sacrifice a creature + land. You're drawing two cards a turn, one of which will be a dredged Loam. Next turn, you dredge Loam, bringing back Bloodghast. If you dredge into a second Loam or even a Looting, your engine speeds up faster than Bob could ever hope for. Eventually you can reanimate Borborygmos or something to burn their face off. Or you can go for a mega-combo with Trade Routes!
So yea, I'm fully looking forward to breaking this card.
I seriously like this card. Ya he is no Bob, of course not. Bob is bob, and if they ever made another one they would be stupid lol
BUT he is awesome lets be honest, sure you HAVE to build around him in order to use his full effect, but i think that modern could use him a lot more than the standard as of right now after the good zombie/aristocrat stuff rotates out in the near future.
I really do want to abuse this guy though, no matter what format. One of my favorites in the last few sets released.
As far as trying to play this guy in Standard, I'm not sure. I am going to be testing him in my Legacy Affinity deck though. Vomit your hand by turn two with this guy on the field and you can draw two a turn, or cast Thoughtcast as your last card and draw three. It might not work in the deck, but it's worth testing.
I don't fully agree with this. As a RakDW player, I can tell you that Rakdos aggro is not fast by comparison to the rest of the format. Would you play this card in Gruul or Naya blitz (if the colors provided the possibility)? No, not at all because a 2/1 for 2 is bad for your curve and too slow for the deck. However, Rakdos plays a bit slower, a bit bigger but still faster than a midrange deck; it still has problems when it runs out of cards and this could potentially be a great way to solve it. Your little guys are far less valuable in Rakdos than other faster aggro decks. On turn seven, Cackler or Nobel are awful topdecks equivalent to pretty much drawing Blood Scrivener AND having your opponent remove him because they do virtually nothing for you at that point.
However, I can't say I think Rakdos is where he'll shine (though a more "control" focused aggro like Rakdos could potentially fit him). I think playing him in a dedicated control deck (likely Grixis, maybe BUG..I don't think Esper can empty it's hand enough) that uses the graveyard a lot and takes advantage of multiple empty handed draws from think twice/flashbacks, etc is where this guy could shine. If we had Bob, Scrivs wouldn't be played but we don't and card advantage has been crap outside of a turn 10 Sphinx's Rev.
Not trying to be rude but this statement is wholly unnecessary and doesn't do you any favors with respect to providing any legitimacy to your post. It's incredibly hyperbolic and inflammatory despite the fact that a lot of people who posted here simply said something along lines of "this looks fun in X/with X!" Fun != hyper competitive, ultra valuable. It's a cool card with a fairly unique effect and some people will have a good time playing it in their casual decks. Calling us insane for wanting to have fun playing Magic is a bit much don't you think? Really not sure why you felt as though you had to belittle everyone and swoop in to point out how foolish we all are for displaying mild interest in a newly spoiled card. This isn't the competitive Standard forums and we're not all trying to break the format wide open. Some of us just like playing with cool Black cards and we'd like to give it a go in our casual decks. What's so insane about that?
I'm not saying that your overall opinions of the card are wrong, far from it, I'm just not sure why you couldn't leave out the part where you openly mock everyone for no visible reason. Seems like a great way to have your otherwise strong post completely ignored. I 100% agree that the card seems relatively weak in competitive Constructed formats but I don't see why you felt the need to insult me for wanting to pair it with Uba Mask in my casual, multiplayer global discard deck.
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Aggro normal game plan is to play dudes until there is enough to kill opponent. Scrivener only affects the order in which you play them: either him on t2 if you need more power or last if you need more cards.
power = cmc+1 is a playable aggro creature
power = cmc is fine if you have abilities that justify a card (loltroll, knights, etc.)
So it all depends on how good his ability will turn out. 1 activation out of him is already enough to justify inclusion in aggro as proved by Silvergill Adept.
Outside of aggro midrange decks could use him as anti-rakdos return tech that is also a win condition with either wolf run or township.
1 He's a zombie. Gravecrawler loves zombies.
2 In an ideal situation (work with me for a second) he functions as a dark confidant with less lifeloss.
3 This card has its fans. Those fans will work to make him work. Lili is obvious, but cards like the newly spoiled Sin Collector will also be utilized to clear your opponents hand of wraths. This card loves being played with too much discard, (maindeck duress anyone?) and players love playing with too much discardd. It's sad that discard demon costs 6, but there is the potential here for a sweet all in black deck, and that gets people excited.
4 A core of Gravecrawler and Geralf's messenger is resilient to wraths. Throw in lingering souls, faithless looting (perfect for both card selection and going down on cards) and you have a sweet deck with a real shot at being a competitive player in the meta.
Personally I always feel like a naked baby doused in bacon grease thrown into a tiger pit when i'm in topdeck mode. This is a polarizing card that isn't for anyone, but it has enough upside to see play.
Whenever a player taps a nonbasic land, [Card] deals 2 damage to them.
-or-
R
Whenever a player would gain life, flip a coin. If heads, that player loses that much life instead. If tails sacrifice [card] and that player gains that life as per usual.
Fires Rf Salvation
NVM, I have to wait for the draw to finish tohave cards in hand to discard.
Still, 4 of these in play means 1 draw turns into 5 cards and -4 life.
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Teach my Son/Daughter Sports and magic cards!!!
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It's silly to think this card won't give aggro a card advantage edge. This card is perfect for aggro decks.
It has value written all over it.
Bob puts a card into your hand at the beginning of your upkeep.
BS would then do nothing, as you have a card in your hand during your draw step. (outside of instant shenanigans)
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It's extremely conditional and strategy based. I think it's good, but I also think that you can scoop these up for nothing post pre-release. Have we learned nothing from Duskmantle Seer (still a good card, lacking support)
Maybe you can remove green for Wild Guess and Dangerous Wager, four colors seems a bit harsh and those two cards work nice with Blood Scrivener.
Pitch cards with Troll, draw extra cards with Scrivener, reuse the creatures in the yard with Varolz.
You need to pack the deck with cheap, instant burn cards that you can vomit on demand.
So there is a deck out there for this, but it has to be built with Blood Scriviner in mind.
You can't throw it into just anything with a low curve.
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One with nothingness is an awesome idea, i love you.
I think I remember reading somewhere that a few deck archetypes were pretty much eliminated because of many players complaining that they were "unfun" Three of those archetypes being land destruction, counter magic, and discard. While there are cards that exist with these functions on them, you cant build a deck revolved around them in standard and havent been able to for a long time. Some times counters get through, but discard decks and LD decks dont exist anymore.
As far as the card goes, I like the flavor...it feels very Rakdos with it's all or nothing..let's throw everything I got and the kitchen sink at the opponent. Besides Sign in Blood, there really hasnt been a good black draw engine...not saying this is one...I've been trying the Underworld Connections a little to see how it did...but it really doesnt help much.
We'll see how this guy does. Getting an empty hand could prove to be annoying, but if you do or run out of steam, it could possibly turn the tables quick.
Fair points, and the two cards indeed are very different beasts, but here are a few things I think deserve mention about Bartleby (yes, I'm calling him that):
1) Most importantly, this can trigger multiple times in a turn. If you have looting or Wheel of Fortune effects, you can get multiple triggers in a turn. This is especially useful if you topdeck this late with something like Faithless Looting or Think Twice in the graveyard; you can get a powerful effect the turn of.
2) You can plan your game around the 1 life loss. As an average, it doesn't mean much, but as long as you know your opponent can't burn you out, you don't have to sacrifice your Scrivener before you're down to the last life you can afford.
3) Symmetrical discard is a powerful tool, and can often make you Hellbent by your turn 4 draw step. Here's an example in Standard:
T1 Land, Arbor Elf (5 cards in hand)
T2 Land, Liliana of the Veil, activate +1. (3 cards in hand)
T3 Land, activate +1, Blood Scrivener, Faithless Looting (draw 3, discard 2, lose 1 life)
By T3, you've already gotten a trigger out of the Scrivener. You won't get it on the T4 upkeep unless you draw a 1 drop off of Looting, but hey, you can just flash back Looting next turn for that same card advantage and graveyard filling. Meanwhile, you've got huge board control and have already hit him with a Mind Rot.
Here's an even better example in Modern:
T1 Crack fetchland, Arbor Elf (5 cards)
T2 Crack fetchland, Raven's Crime, Bloodghast (3 cards)
T3 Crack fetchland, Scrivener, Smallpox discarding Life from the Loam and sacrificing Bloodghast. (0 cards)
Your opponent has had to discard twice and sacrifice a creature + land. You're drawing two cards a turn, one of which will be a dredged Loam. Next turn, you dredge Loam, bringing back Bloodghast. If you dredge into a second Loam or even a Looting, your engine speeds up faster than Bob could ever hope for. Eventually you can reanimate Borborygmos or something to burn their face off. Or you can go for a mega-combo with Trade Routes!
So yea, I'm fully looking forward to breaking this card.
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BUT he is awesome lets be honest, sure you HAVE to build around him in order to use his full effect, but i think that modern could use him a lot more than the standard as of right now after the good zombie/aristocrat stuff rotates out in the near future.
I really do want to abuse this guy though, no matter what format. One of my favorites in the last few sets released.
Thanks you very much DarkNightCavalier for the Sig.