Wow there's a whole flock here now. LOL...Kidding...
But seriously why are you guys so incredibly opposed to me posting my opinion? Seriously I won't let you shout me down. Do you all have so much invest in the success of this that my mere descent to your obvious dogma is sooo incredibly threatening...lol.
And windstrider:
Point 1: I called him a sheep after allowing an opportunity to prove otherwise.
Point 2: yes everybody's the victim. I know your kind.
Point 3: am I getting to ya am I getting to ya am I gettng to ya....
Point 4: And tell me me how many creatures that shoot up to $25 hold even close to that value in the long term (which mind you is the point I've been making all along.) I can think of a couple like goyf and bob and well...yeah Reckoner is close to that/sarcasm...
Point 5: The cards strengths and weakness should stand on their own and they make my argument for me. When a card is fetching the amount this is and is on par with abilities to uncommon creatures seeing play in modern, people in standard should be taking note.
Point 6: Frankly I don't care why you don't play my formats, why do you care about my opinion of yours?
Point 7: Last point, I'm really trying not to just say..... You know what I'd get banned for saying that cause I can't even make a sheep joke on here with out getting warned. Lol.
Stating your opinion is fine. (See Point 5 for more clarification.) You could have easily written "Please don't buy cards when they spike like this. Reckoner is decent in Standard, but it has yet to prove itself in the more eternal formats." Ta-da. You had to ruin it by insulting people and using logical fallacies to support your points.
Point 1. You're too generous [with your shoddy statements]. You asserted that you had not called him a sheep. I provided proof that you had. You like moving the goalposts around.
Point 2. My kind? Pray, please tell me more about my kind. I wish I could tag you as Mr. Strawman.
Point 3. Nope. The word you're looking for is "dissent." Using the wrong word multiple times is tiresome, especially if you're using it in an infantile and inane attempt at being humorous. Please stop slaughtering the written language you are attempting to use.
Point 4. Why should its price spike matter to its use in Standard? Lightning Bolt is $.80. Must mean it's bad in Modern. Plus, false equivalence fallacy. Reckoner was just printed. Part of Bob's price is his availability.
Point 5. Reworded to "I can't provide proof of my statements, but I'll continue making them anyway." You made the original statement that the card was mediocre. The onus of proving that statement thus falls on you. This is otherwise known as a begging the question fallacy: asserting the truth of an unproven statement. When several others refuted your original statement, you moved the goalposts (arguing off the point fallacy) by then stating it was stupid for people to buy the card at inflated prices when it wouldn't hold value in the other formats. Then you proceeded to insult people by calling them sheep.
Point 6. Because you're here telling Standard players how bad a card is in the format that they play while admitting that you don't play Standard? Did you lose track of the conversation already? Do try to keep up, old boy.
Point 7. No idea. Bestiality is legal in 16 states, so have at it.
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The world is on fire
and you are here to stay and burn with me.
Let's look at him in total.
One of the few 3 drops that kills a full out Tarmo. The others tend to have deathtouch and are black or green.
For actual creatures, it is very close to being "unblockable" in the sense that anything played and put infront of it dies. Chump blockers still get deal damage to their owners. For Red, getting your creature through is crazy good. For White, it's the upside of the weenie horde.
For splash Green, it can get enchanted +2/+0 and trample. Forcing you to take 5 a turn. Last I checked that's a good clock.
It kills ground pounders such a titans.
Boros Charm loves the guy. Especially on turn 4 with a Madcap skills first. Drop your fourth land, cast Madcap Skills. leaving RW open. Take 6 or block with enough toughness to deal with the first strike. Don't block with two creatures and possibly take 12.
He was a game winner at pre-release. I'd play "better" creatures to get him to stick. Then he'd clear house.
All on his own, he stops the assualt while whittling down your opponent.
THANK YOU! Finally...
So where could he fit? I'd be curious to try him in pod but again he's not the right creature for that really. He sticks around but doesn't give you the application of Finks. In Modern RDW, again I want to be doing damage not dragging out the game. I imagine he's a bomb in limited.
I mean he seems ok by himself and probably has something that can make him better and up to really good, but generally I like my $20 cards to be good by themselves.
Stating your opinion is fine. (See Point 5 for more clarification.) You could have easily written "Please don't buy cards when they spike like this. Reckoner is decent in Standard, but it has yet to prove itself in the more eternal formats." Ta-da. You had to ruin it by insulting people and using logical fallacies to support your points.
Point 1. You're too generous [with your shoddy statements]. You asserted that you had not called him a sheep. I provided proof that you had. You like moving the goalposts around.
Point 2. My kind? Pray, please tell me more about my kind. I wish I could tag you as Mr. Strawman.
Point 3. Nope. The word you're looking for is "dissent." Using the wrong word multiple times is tiresome, especially if you're using it in an infantile and inane attempt at being humorous. Please stop slaughtering the written language you are attempting to use.
Point 4. Why should its price spike matter to its use in Standard? Lightning Bolt is $.80. Must mean it's bad in Modern. Plus, false equivalence fallacy. Reckoner was just printed. Part of Bob's price is his availability.
Point 5. Reworded to "I can't provide proof of my statements, but I'll continue making them anyway." You made the original statement that the card was mediocre. The onus of proving that statement thus falls on you. This is otherwise known as a begging the question fallacy: asserting the truth of an unproven statement. When several others refuted your original statement, you moved the goalposts (arguing off the point fallacy) by then stating it was stupid for people to buy the card at inflated prices when it wouldn't hold value in the other formats. Then you proceeded to insult people by calling them sheep.
Point 6. Because you're here telling Standard players how bad a card is in the format that they play while admitting that you don't play Standard? Did you lose track of the conversation already? Do try to keep up, old boy.
Point 7. No idea. Bestiality is legal in 16 states, so have at it.
Point 1: Your right and I apologized for that.
Point 2: What I meant is don't be a victim.
Point 3: Yep I'm wrong there too.
Point 4: It doesn't matter what format. Its a card game. It has nearly 20,000 moving parts and the price spiking of one new one to ridiculous levels is oh so very annoying.
Point 5: Hey, insults work.
Point 6: Ya know, I wish people would just put a sign over there sig saying I'm a standard player and thats all I care about because my esp has been a little twitchy lately and I CAN'T READ MINDS. I mean this is a general usage thread welcome to all players right? I didn't miss the sign for standard only or something?
Point 7: Errr, well I guess if your gonna do it you should know where its legal...
Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Yeah it got pretty crazy. Mostly my fault and apologies all around.
I think the best way for me to look at this card is first to ignore the price because I'm so aggravated by that aspect, I kind of have blinders on the rest of it. Everybody else though, please feel free to complain about the prices of it...lol.
I think, in modern anyway, it could find a home. I really wish it was a more relevant creature type though.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Back to my point of his main problem: hard mana :symrw::symrw::symrw:
In Standard, it's not a problem to cast as long as:
1. You're running a mono R or W deck, or
2. You're running a two color deck where the main color is R or W, or
3. You're running a three color deck that's RWx
In Modern, between Fetches and Shocks giving even greater flexibility to mana bases, I imagine it'd be even less of an issue - assuming it sees play in that format.
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"Of course you should fight fire with fire. You should fight everything with fire."
—Jaya Ballard, task mage
redthirst is redthirst, fifth Horseman of the Apocalypse. He was the leader of the Fires of Salvation, the only clan I'm aware of to get modded off the forums so hard they made their own forums.
Degenerate? Sure. Loudmouth? You bet. Law abiding? No ****ing way.
I was thinking of him in a mostly white control build. I think that's where he'll find his legs if he has them in modern and beyond. If I were playing red I'd want more damage faster. His ability seems most relevant in a defensive posture. Though the fact that he's stuck on the ground kinda hurts that usage as well.
As to the antigoyf comment, well he certainly kills goyf most turn threes. In fact he'll pretty much always kill goyf, but so will anything with deathtouch. He does have reach, which I like, (reach meaning the ability to get damage in, not the actual ability of course.)
As long as I don't look at the price I'm ok...lol.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
In Standard, it's not a problem to cast as long as:
1. You're running a mono R or W deck, or
2. You're running a two color deck where the main color is R or W, or
3. You're running a three color deck that's RWx
In Modern, between Fetches and Shocks giving even greater flexibility to mana bases, I imagine it'd be even less of an issue - assuming it sees play in that format.
Yeah I kinda agree with you here, imagine that...
I mean, in modern I'll run both woolly thoctar and leatherback baloth and there costs are manageable. Though the baloth is in a casual beast deck and the thoctar is merely a 2 of in my zoo deck. Another example, while not a creature, Unmake has a very similar cost and it was able to be played very consistently with filter lands and no duals.
No I think it could see play in modern.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Thinking it might be time to trade them away if I can get anything close to that kind of value in return. It's an awesome card for all the reasons discussed here so far, but I imagine I'll be able to get 2 or more for that price in a month or so. Remember Armada Wurm, Angel of Serenity, Lotleth Troll and others? I imagine this will be in the $10-$15 range again by the end of March.
It seems like it has gone down just a little on the 'bay the last 48 hours. I sold 2 of them for 39.99 on Wednesday. I'm holding on to my play set for now though as I just love the card.
I really want to run Boros Charm with it as I believe it makes it even 'nastier'.
What other White could be put into an Agro deck so I'm not just putting plains or R/W shocks in the deck just for 4 b. charms,,,
Is Frontline Medic still a popular choice
edit: hot dog..I finally figured out how to wrap/insert card into the text...whew
I really can't understand why this is more expensive than frontline medic.
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Cult of the Succubi Eating Kitten and Brotherhood of Hamsters - Zombie One/Hulking One - Brotherhood of Hamsters disapproves of Damage on the Stack amputation, the corruption of Mythics, and the "Major changes to Extended" in July 2010. You aborted our cards., but we approve of the Modern format. Even if it doesn't ha ve Carrion Feeder or Caller of the Claw in it.
Dex: http://deckbox.org/users/Egementium_instructoid
I really can't understand why this is more expensive than frontline medic.
Its played in Mono red, a pretty cool casual card, overall solid and fits very good in the current metagame.
Frontline Medic is solid, but it does NOT fit the metagame right now and its effects are not important.
The Reckoner has serious blow out potential with some cards, and in a red mirror, you cant kill it without getting a bad trade, and it being 3/3 first strike kills nearly every creature played against it (and that alone pushes the 4/4 sized creatures in playability, as they also survive reds current burn spells).
The card fits the metagame extremly well, and so gets expensive.
I really can't understand why this is more expensive than frontline medic.
because the card is on the same lvl as thragtusk at least. and frontline medic is not. most of the times frontline medic is just a vanilla 3/3 which does nothing else for you.
thats why frontline medic is not great, and reckoner is awesome.
because the card is on the same lvl as thragtusk at least. and frontline medic is not. most of the times frontline medic is just a vanilla 3/3 which does nothing else for you.
thats why frontline medic is not great, and reckoner is awesome.
Frontline Medic is in fact great: activating Batallion really isn't that hard and the indestructability clause can be very useful.
I attacked with him, Firemane Avenger and High Priest of Penance once and it was epic
Use brackets like this FIRE! which if you quote you'll see. Otherwise follow this but use the hard bracket instead of the ones I use:
{card=cardname}make up name you want to show{/card}
So if I want to call my fireball card as FIRE! I would go:
{card=fireball}FIRE!{/card}
oh my fault, I thought you discovered how to post images so you can actually see the image in the field, like on many primer starter pages.
It seems like it has gone down just a little on the 'bay the last 48 hours. I sold 2 of them for 39.99 on Wednesday. I'm holding on to my play set for now though as I just love the card.
I really want to run Boros Charm with it as I believe it makes it even 'nastier'.
What other White could be put into an Agro deck so I'm not just putting plains or R/W shocks in the deck just for 4 b. charms,,,
Is Frontline Medic still a popular choice
edit: hot dog..I finally figured out how to wrap/insert card into the text...whew
I know that some people would regard this as more of a sideboard choice (if at all), but I have played a whole lot and Nearheath Pilgrim has been excellent in this spot for me. It drops the turn before the Reckoner, and when paired together means you win pretty much. I'm also quite fond of pairing the Pilgrim up with a Hellrider. I face a lot of other aggro decks, so these early turn huge life swings are important for me.
I reckon this card will go up even higher in value.
seriously though, I wish i had bought more than a playset when i first saw him. he is nutty. I shame myself for being excited at the spoiler of frontline medic and going meh at him.
Seeing what he's been doing at the pro tour, I can see him at least holding his current value while in standard (for the time being anyways), but also seeing how easy it is to play around him (ala Black using his Cartel Aristocrats to sac the blocker, completely negating him) he may see a bit of a dip as well.
I know that some people would regard this as more of a sideboard choice (if at all), but I have played a whole lot and Nearheath Pilgrim has been excellent in this spot for me. It drops the turn before the Reckoner, and when paired together means you win pretty much. I'm also quite fond of pairing the Pilgrim up with a Hellrider. I face a lot of other aggro decks, so these early turn huge life swings are important for me.
I also have a Boros Aggro deck based around Medic/Hellrider/Nearheath. Reckoner's in there, but mainly because he's a just a really good 3 drop in standard right now, and I can pull of the infinite life loop maybe once in 15 games which is always a good time
Thinking it might be time to trade them away if I can get anything close to that kind of value in return. It's an awesome card for all the reasons discussed here so far, but I imagine I'll be able to get 2 or more for that price in a month or so. Remember Armada Wurm, Angel of Serenity, Lotleth Troll and others? I imagine this will be in the $10-$15 range again by the end of March.
Or am I crazy?
No, I too think he's overhyped right now. Don't get me wrong, it's a good card, but it's not "$25 for a rare" good. The card threw a wrench into the current meta and catapulted one particular deck archetype to the top spot. That's why there's excessive demand for it now, but that will fade away in a while.
For a card to consistently merit an extremely high price in Standard ($20+), it needs to fit a few criteria:
- The card has to be splashable and be easily included in any deck that wants it. Thragtusk is crazy because it's only one single green color in five mana. Meaning you can just play UW-control and splash a little green as a wincon. Same thing with Snapcaster Mage, which only needs one blue color and is good in any deck that runs some sorceries/instants. Boros Reckoner only comfortably fits in decks that are primarily white, red or both.
- The card has to be able to survive changes to the metagame. Our Reckoner is really good in a meta where mono-red just wants to punch through, it can trade with big beaters on the ground (or punish the opponent for attacking/blocking with them) and works will with the lifelink combo or Blasphemous Act. However, as someone already pointed out, Cartel Aristocrat/Blood Artist decks foil him by just sacking blockers. The meta is currently low on removal, but if the Reckoner becomes too powerful, that will just go up again and he is no defense against evasive creatures. Consistently expensive cards are good in a vacuum. Stoneforge Mystic, for example, just grabbed your best equipment (maybe put it on the board as well) and that was her primary use. There's not much the metagame can do against a toolbox fetcher. Same thing with Snapcaster.
- Related to the above point, consistently expensive creatures generally have ETB triggers or some other feature that guarantees their value. Snapcaster and Thragtusk do so. Hellrider at least has haste and your other creatures benefit from his effect right off the bat. Like I said, removal is currently low, but I don't know if red aggro decks can survive having their three-drop eat some cheap removal with no benefit at all. It ties in with the whole "good in a vacuum" argument.
- The card generally has application for the longer-term or eternal formats. I seriously doubt that a 3-mana card with 3 power is fast enough for the more aggressive formats and the combo potential is outdone by faster or more reliable combos. Snapcaster and Cavern of Souls will keep their value because of this. Boros Reckoner won't. I don't buy that decks will run a clunky three colored mana 3 powered creature just because it can trade with Tarmogoyf, which itself is an easily splashable 2 mana creature.
So yes, my personal recommendation is to dump these things for $25 while you can, unless you really want to play with them right now. You can probably get them for less than half price in a few months.
Maybe, but it should be easy enough. {IMG}[/IMG]
The trick is getting the image from where it's not leached. That part isn't real clear. But basically it the HTTP address between the image icon. You can use the icon above that looks like two mountain peaks and the sun to start it.
No, I too think he's overhyped right now. Don't get me wrong, it's a good card, but it's not "$25 for a rare" good. The card threw a wrench into the current meta and catapulted one particular deck archetype to the top spot. That's why there's excessive demand for it now, but that will fade away in a while.
For a card to consistently merit an extremely high price in Standard ($20+), it needs to fit a few criteria:
- The card has to be splashable and be easily included in any deck that wants it. Thragtusk is crazy because it's only one single green color in five mana. Meaning you can just play UW-control and splash a little green as a wincon. Same thing with Snapcaster Mage, which only needs one blue color and is good in any deck that runs some sorceries/instants. Boros Reckoner only comfortably fits in decks that are primarily white, red or both.
- The card has to be able to survive changes to the metagame. Our Reckoner is really good in a meta where mono-red just wants to punch through, it can trade with big beaters on the ground (or punish the opponent for attacking/blocking with them) and works will with the lifelink combo or Blasphemous Act. However, as someone already pointed out, Cartel Aristocrat/Blood Artist decks foil him by just sacking blockers. The meta is currently low on removal, but if the Reckoner becomes too powerful, that will just go up again and he is no defense against evasive creatures. Consistently expensive cards are good in a vacuum. Stoneforge Mystic, for example, just grabbed your best equipment (maybe put it on the board as well) and that was her primary use. There's not much the metagame can do against a toolbox fetcher. Same thing with Snapcaster.
- Related to the above point, consistently expensive creatures generally have ETB triggers or some other feature that guarantees their value. Snapcaster and Thragtusk do so. Hellrider at least has haste and your other creatures benefit from his effect right off the bat. Like I said, removal is currently low, but I don't know if red aggro decks can survive having their three-drop eat some cheap removal with no benefit at all. It ties in with the whole "good in a vacuum" argument.
- The card generally has application for the longer-term or eternal formats. I seriously doubt that a 3-mana card with 3 power is fast enough for the more aggressive formats and the combo potential is outdone by faster or more reliable combos. Snapcaster and Cavern of Souls will keep their value because of this. Boros Reckoner won't. I don't buy that decks will run a clunky three colored mana 3 powered creature just because it can trade with Tarmogoyf, which itself is an easily splashable 2 mana creature.
So yes, my personal recommendation is to dump these things for $25 while you can, unless you really want to play with them right now. You can probably get them for less than half price in a few months.
qft
reckoner is not in the same league as cavern, snapcaster, or thragtusk
hell, it isnt even in the same league as silverblade paladin or hellrider. It's just a niche card that probably only deserves a spot as a 2of md or in the sb
reckoner is not in the same league as cavern, snapcaster, or thragtusk
hell, it isnt even in the same league as silverblade paladin or hellrider. It's just a niche card that probably only deserves a spot as a 2of md or in the sb
I love Silverblade Paladin, but the fact is that this card is flat out better. As for being in the "same league" as those cards, I can't claim to know that, but this card is very clearly an automatic 3- or 4-of in any aggro deck whose mana base can reliably support him. Being able to kill creatures or deal direct damage to your opponent just for blocking or being blocked is extremely powerful, and its exactly the kind of thing aggressive decks want.
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Stating your opinion is fine. (See Point 5 for more clarification.) You could have easily written "Please don't buy cards when they spike like this. Reckoner is decent in Standard, but it has yet to prove itself in the more eternal formats." Ta-da. You had to ruin it by insulting people and using logical fallacies to support your points.
Point 1. You're too generous [with your shoddy statements]. You asserted that you had not called him a sheep. I provided proof that you had. You like moving the goalposts around.
Point 2. My kind? Pray, please tell me more about my kind. I wish I could tag you as Mr. Strawman.
Point 3. Nope. The word you're looking for is "dissent." Using the wrong word multiple times is tiresome, especially if you're using it in an infantile and inane attempt at being humorous. Please stop slaughtering the written language you are attempting to use.
Point 4. Why should its price spike matter to its use in Standard? Lightning Bolt is $.80. Must mean it's bad in Modern. Plus, false equivalence fallacy. Reckoner was just printed. Part of Bob's price is his availability.
Point 5. Reworded to "I can't provide proof of my statements, but I'll continue making them anyway." You made the original statement that the card was mediocre. The onus of proving that statement thus falls on you. This is otherwise known as a begging the question fallacy: asserting the truth of an unproven statement. When several others refuted your original statement, you moved the goalposts (arguing off the point fallacy) by then stating it was stupid for people to buy the card at inflated prices when it wouldn't hold value in the other formats. Then you proceeded to insult people by calling them sheep.
Point 6. Because you're here telling Standard players how bad a card is in the format that they play while admitting that you don't play Standard? Did you lose track of the conversation already? Do try to keep up, old boy.
Point 7. No idea. Bestiality is legal in 16 states, so have at it.
The world is on fire
and you are here to stay and burn with me.
THANK YOU! Finally...
So where could he fit? I'd be curious to try him in pod but again he's not the right creature for that really. He sticks around but doesn't give you the application of Finks. In Modern RDW, again I want to be doing damage not dragging out the game. I imagine he's a bomb in limited.
I mean he seems ok by himself and probably has something that can make him better and up to really good, but generally I like my $20 cards to be good by themselves.
Again. Appreciate the response.
Point 1: Your right and I apologized for that.
Point 2: What I meant is don't be a victim.
Point 3: Yep I'm wrong there too.
Point 4: It doesn't matter what format. Its a card game. It has nearly 20,000 moving parts and the price spiking of one new one to ridiculous levels is oh so very annoying.
Point 5: Hey, insults work.
Point 6: Ya know, I wish people would just put a sign over there sig saying I'm a standard player and thats all I care about because my esp has been a little twitchy lately and I CAN'T READ MINDS. I mean this is a general usage thread welcome to all players right? I didn't miss the sign for standard only or something?
Point 7: Errr, well I guess if your gonna do it you should know where its legal...
You guys are so much fun...
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
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I think the best way for me to look at this card is first to ignore the price because I'm so aggravated by that aspect, I kind of have blinders on the rest of it. Everybody else though, please feel free to complain about the prices of it...lol.
I think, in modern anyway, it could find a home. I really wish it was a more relevant creature type though.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
In Standard, it's not a problem to cast as long as:
1. You're running a mono R or W deck, or
2. You're running a two color deck where the main color is R or W, or
3. You're running a three color deck that's RWx
In Modern, between Fetches and Shocks giving even greater flexibility to mana bases, I imagine it'd be even less of an issue - assuming it sees play in that format.
—Jaya Ballard, task mage
As to the antigoyf comment, well he certainly kills goyf most turn threes. In fact he'll pretty much always kill goyf, but so will anything with deathtouch. He does have reach, which I like, (reach meaning the ability to get damage in, not the actual ability of course.)
As long as I don't look at the price I'm ok...lol.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Yeah I kinda agree with you here, imagine that...
I mean, in modern I'll run both woolly thoctar and leatherback baloth and there costs are manageable. Though the baloth is in a casual beast deck and the thoctar is merely a 2 of in my zoo deck. Another example, while not a creature, Unmake has a very similar cost and it was able to be played very consistently with filter lands and no duals.
No I think it could see play in modern.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Up to $25 on SCG now. Holy crap.
Thinking it might be time to trade them away if I can get anything close to that kind of value in return. It's an awesome card for all the reasons discussed here so far, but I imagine I'll be able to get 2 or more for that price in a month or so. Remember Armada Wurm, Angel of Serenity, Lotleth Troll and others? I imagine this will be in the $10-$15 range again by the end of March.
Or am I crazy?
I agree
It seems like it has gone down just a little on the 'bay the last 48 hours. I sold 2 of them for 39.99 on Wednesday. I'm holding on to my play set for now though as I just love the card.
I really want to run Boros Charm with it as I believe it makes it even 'nastier'.
What other White could be put into an Agro deck so I'm not just putting plains or R/W shocks in the deck just for 4 b. charms,,,
Is Frontline Medic still a popular choice
edit: hot dog..I finally figured out how to wrap/insert card into the text...whew
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and the "Major changes to Extended" in July 2010. You aborted our cards., but we approve of the Modern format. Even if it doesn't ha ve Carrion Feeder or Caller of the Claw in it.Dex: http://deckbox.org/users/Egementium_instructoid
Its played in Mono red, a pretty cool casual card, overall solid and fits very good in the current metagame.
Frontline Medic is solid, but it does NOT fit the metagame right now and its effects are not important.
The Reckoner has serious blow out potential with some cards, and in a red mirror, you cant kill it without getting a bad trade, and it being 3/3 first strike kills nearly every creature played against it (and that alone pushes the 4/4 sized creatures in playability, as they also survive reds current burn spells).
The card fits the metagame extremly well, and so gets expensive.
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because the card is on the same lvl as thragtusk at least. and frontline medic is not. most of the times frontline medic is just a vanilla 3/3 which does nothing else for you.
thats why frontline medic is not great, and reckoner is awesome.
Frontline Medic is in fact great: activating Batallion really isn't that hard and the indestructability clause can be very useful.
I attacked with him, Firemane Avenger and High Priest of Penance once and it was epic
how!?
Props to DarkNightCavalier 4 da banner and SGT_Chubbz 4 avvie, here
Standard
GRAggro
GRWNaya Purphoros
GWAggro Retired 9/19/2014
RGPrimeval Titan RIP
1/5/2010 - 9/30/2011
Top 4 Channelfireball Winter series 5k Feb. 2011
3rd at California National Qualifiers 2011
40th at GP SLC 2012
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oh my fault, I thought you discovered how to post images so you can actually see the image in the field, like on many primer starter pages.
Props to DarkNightCavalier 4 da banner and SGT_Chubbz 4 avvie, here
Standard
GRAggro
GRWNaya Purphoros
GWAggro Retired 9/19/2014
RGPrimeval Titan RIP
1/5/2010 - 9/30/2011
Top 4 Channelfireball Winter series 5k Feb. 2011
3rd at California National Qualifiers 2011
40th at GP SLC 2012
Find me on MTGO @ Ruslvmusl91
I know that some people would regard this as more of a sideboard choice (if at all), but I have played a whole lot and Nearheath Pilgrim has been excellent in this spot for me. It drops the turn before the Reckoner, and when paired together means you win pretty much. I'm also quite fond of pairing the Pilgrim up with a Hellrider. I face a lot of other aggro decks, so these early turn huge life swings are important for me.
seriously though, I wish i had bought more than a playset when i first saw him. he is nutty. I shame myself for being excited at the spoiler of frontline medic and going meh at him.
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
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I also have a Boros Aggro deck based around Medic/Hellrider/Nearheath. Reckoner's in there, but mainly because he's a just a really good 3 drop in standard right now, and I can pull of the infinite life loop maybe once in 15 games which is always a good time
Standard:
RW Boros devotion/Purphoros combo
RGB Jund Midrange
Modern:
WB Martyr.proc
No, I too think he's overhyped right now. Don't get me wrong, it's a good card, but it's not "$25 for a rare" good. The card threw a wrench into the current meta and catapulted one particular deck archetype to the top spot. That's why there's excessive demand for it now, but that will fade away in a while.
For a card to consistently merit an extremely high price in Standard ($20+), it needs to fit a few criteria:
- The card has to be splashable and be easily included in any deck that wants it. Thragtusk is crazy because it's only one single green color in five mana. Meaning you can just play UW-control and splash a little green as a wincon. Same thing with Snapcaster Mage, which only needs one blue color and is good in any deck that runs some sorceries/instants. Boros Reckoner only comfortably fits in decks that are primarily white, red or both.
- The card has to be able to survive changes to the metagame. Our Reckoner is really good in a meta where mono-red just wants to punch through, it can trade with big beaters on the ground (or punish the opponent for attacking/blocking with them) and works will with the lifelink combo or Blasphemous Act. However, as someone already pointed out, Cartel Aristocrat/Blood Artist decks foil him by just sacking blockers. The meta is currently low on removal, but if the Reckoner becomes too powerful, that will just go up again and he is no defense against evasive creatures. Consistently expensive cards are good in a vacuum. Stoneforge Mystic, for example, just grabbed your best equipment (maybe put it on the board as well) and that was her primary use. There's not much the metagame can do against a toolbox fetcher. Same thing with Snapcaster.
- Related to the above point, consistently expensive creatures generally have ETB triggers or some other feature that guarantees their value. Snapcaster and Thragtusk do so. Hellrider at least has haste and your other creatures benefit from his effect right off the bat. Like I said, removal is currently low, but I don't know if red aggro decks can survive having their three-drop eat some cheap removal with no benefit at all. It ties in with the whole "good in a vacuum" argument.
- The card generally has application for the longer-term or eternal formats. I seriously doubt that a 3-mana card with 3 power is fast enough for the more aggressive formats and the combo potential is outdone by faster or more reliable combos. Snapcaster and Cavern of Souls will keep their value because of this. Boros Reckoner won't. I don't buy that decks will run a clunky three colored mana 3 powered creature just because it can trade with Tarmogoyf, which itself is an easily splashable 2 mana creature.
So yes, my personal recommendation is to dump these things for $25 while you can, unless you really want to play with them right now. You can probably get them for less than half price in a few months.
[IMG]http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=129808[/IMG]
AH, failed, oh well
So did you all check out the Reckoners in the pro tour?
Props to DarkNightCavalier 4 da banner and SGT_Chubbz 4 avvie, here
Standard
GRAggro
GRWNaya Purphoros
GWAggro Retired 9/19/2014
RGPrimeval Titan RIP
1/5/2010 - 9/30/2011
Top 4 Channelfireball Winter series 5k Feb. 2011
3rd at California National Qualifiers 2011
40th at GP SLC 2012
Find me on MTGO @ Ruslvmusl91
qft
reckoner is not in the same league as cavern, snapcaster, or thragtusk
hell, it isnt even in the same league as silverblade paladin or hellrider. It's just a niche card that probably only deserves a spot as a 2of md or in the sb
I love Silverblade Paladin, but the fact is that this card is flat out better. As for being in the "same league" as those cards, I can't claim to know that, but this card is very clearly an automatic 3- or 4-of in any aggro deck whose mana base can reliably support him. Being able to kill creatures or deal direct damage to your opponent just for blocking or being blocked is extremely powerful, and its exactly the kind of thing aggressive decks want.