So was watching the live coverage of PTGTC today, and decided to ask in the live chat, while Dave Humpherys was answering question, a bit about Duskmantle Seer. While it seemed none of my iterations of the question regarding the card just not feeling mythic at all and whatnot were ignored, asking a bit about the design behind it and why he doesn't have lifelink (I still think he should). This was his response:
Quote from Dave Humpherys »
Duskmantle Seer came from design as a throwback to Dark Confidant. While it's not a card advantage engine we found it to create a lot of fun games in both limited and constructed. We wanted to create some cards that might allow UB to create the working for a more aggressive deck and a 4/4 flyer that can actually do a lot more than 4 damage a turn, fit that bill. We wanted to make sure that UB wasn't going to be all about control, especially in conjuction with Snapcaster Mage, but instead perhaps a more aggressive build. We haven't seen it here, but Nightveil Specter was a card we hoped could fit into a more aggressive build.
Lifelink simply wasn't part of the initial goals we were aiming for, so it hadn't come up as a suggestion. Vampire Nighthawk we figured still fit that role.
So he didn't have the one thing that would have really made him worth mythic rare status, IMO, because..they didn't think to. I do see what they were getting at, with him being more for the aggro kinda UB deck than for control, and I can agree with their goal there, but man was him not having lifelink a huge missed opportunity to make the card great rather than good.
So was watching the live coverage of PTGTC today, and decided to ask in the live chat, while Dave Humpherys was answering question, a bit about Duskmantle Seer. While it seemed none of my iterations of the question regarding the card just not feeling mythic at all and whatnot were ignored, asking a bit about the design behind it and why he doesn't have lifelink (I still think he should). This was his response:
So he didn't have the one thing that would have really made him worth mythic rare status, IMO, because..they didn't think to. I do see what they were getting at, with him being more for the aggro kinda UB deck than for control, and I can agree with their goal there, but man was him not having lifelink a huge missed opportunity to make the card great rather than good.
I think lifelink would have been way too good in limited: considering how important evasion is GTC limited giving him lifelink would have entirely negated his downside.
I think lifelink would have been way too good in limited: considering how important evasion is GTC limited giving him lifelink would have entirely negated his downside.
He's a mythic, him having lifelink at a mythic rare actually would have made sense and not been a real issue in limited. Without it his drawbackS (plural) are more than enough to put him at rare status.
He's a mythic, him having lifelink at a mythic rare actually would have made sense and not been a real issue in limited. Without it his drawbackS (plural) are more than enough to put him at rare status.
It also would have made the card OBSCENELY powerful. Honestly, who asks for this type of stuff?
A 4/4 flying lifelink for 4 is already ridiculous for UB. Attaching card draw that can be built around makes it stupid. Actually... maybe that isn't enough. Let's have it draw 2 cards when it enters play too. And how about giving it Hexproof and Deathtouch? Yeah, those are good ideas too.
The issue with Lifegain is not that he'd be unflavorful as a Vampire, but he'd be undesirable to keep fielded by opponents. If you can defend against the 4/4 in the air, and your feel your deck's CMCs won't hurt you more than your opponent, it's extra cards for you.
Lifelink undoes the self-harm from Grumpypants. Making the card far more one-sided, making the change in life totals 8 in favor of Grumpy's player, no U/B/R player would let that stand without his ability, with it? Yeah, it dies. White might still go for binding it down so they can get cards and use their own Lifegain to make it a non-issue. Green... well, Green would find a way to kill it in any situation given ramp color.
Also, Nighthaunts would be crazy stupid for Black as a 3/3 for 3 with Touch, Flying, and Link. As a 2/3 it's just impressive due to the color it's in.
so just because it's a vampire, the lifelink is justified? creature type is not the only source of flavor. mechanics also have flavor. here the mechanical flavor of lifelink does not fit the flavor of the main ability. that's why it never crossed their mind to add lifelink. they never thought "what can we do to make it more like a vampire" because being a vampire is not the main purpose of this card. this is not a tribal card.
A 40 dollar mythic rare would constitute a must have 4 of that goes in many decks.
Stats About Mythics
-Mythics are on average 40% rarer than pre-mythic rares
(old blocks about 200 rares, Mythic blocks 35+ mythics)
-They are printing more new cards a year not less
(about 665 now vs. 630 in most pre-mythic block)
-To drop the value of a rare by $1 a mythic must go up $2
-In a 3 year time span deck prices doubled. I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause.
Seer with lifelink would probably be better in standard than confidant.
It would be insanely good, and certainly played extensively. A 4/4 flying lifelink for 4 would be played even with no abilities. However, it would not be better than Bob, who is in the conversation for best creature of all time.
Bob = 2 drop card advantage machine
Seer + lifelink = efficient creature with possible upside
So he didn't have the one thing that would have really made him worth mythic rare status, IMO, because..they didn't think to. I do see what they were getting at, with him being more for the aggro kinda UB deck than for control, and I can agree with their goal there, but man was him not having lifelink a huge missed opportunity to make the card great rather than good.
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
I think lifelink would have been way too good in limited: considering how important evasion is GTC limited giving him lifelink would have entirely negated his downside.
He's a mythic, him having lifelink at a mythic rare actually would have made sense and not been a real issue in limited. Without it his drawbackS (plural) are more than enough to put him at rare status.
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
lifelink would be counterproductive to the flavor and make him a $200 chase mythic.
........................
It also would have made the card OBSCENELY powerful. Honestly, who asks for this type of stuff?
A 4/4 flying lifelink for 4 is already ridiculous for UB. Attaching card draw that can be built around makes it stupid. Actually... maybe that isn't enough. Let's have it draw 2 cards when it enters play too. And how about giving it Hexproof and Deathtouch? Yeah, those are good ideas too.
Oh yeah, a vampire having lifelink is so unflavorful.
Vampire Nighthawk has deathtouch, flying, and lifelink on a 2/3 body and only costs 3 to play.
Seer is a worse Dark Confidant.
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
...On the other hand, I don't think any of the current vampires with Lifelink try to stare at the future as intently as Duskmantle Seer does.
Bob = Card Advantage
GrumpyBob = Aggression
How is this so hard to get?
The issue with Lifegain is not that he'd be unflavorful as a Vampire, but he'd be undesirable to keep fielded by opponents. If you can defend against the 4/4 in the air, and your feel your deck's CMCs won't hurt you more than your opponent, it's extra cards for you.
Lifelink undoes the self-harm from Grumpypants. Making the card far more one-sided, making the change in life totals 8 in favor of Grumpy's player, no U/B/R player would let that stand without his ability, with it? Yeah, it dies. White might still go for binding it down so they can get cards and use their own Lifegain to make it a non-issue. Green... well, Green would find a way to kill it in any situation given ramp color.
Also, Nighthaunts would be crazy stupid for Black as a 3/3 for 3 with Touch, Flying, and Link. As a 2/3 it's just impressive due to the color it's in.
........................
And vampire Nighthawk is not a mythic.
Seer with lifelink would probably be better in standard than confidant.
Stats About Mythics
-Mythics are on average 40% rarer than pre-mythic rares
(old blocks about 200 rares, Mythic blocks 35+ mythics)
-They are printing more new cards a year not less
(about 665 now vs. 630 in most pre-mythic block)
-To drop the value of a rare by $1 a mythic must go up $2
-In a 3 year time span deck prices doubled.
I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause.
It would be insanely good, and certainly played extensively. A 4/4 flying lifelink for 4 would be played even with no abilities. However, it would not be better than Bob, who is in the conversation for best creature of all time.
Bob = 2 drop card advantage machine
Seer + lifelink = efficient creature with possible upside
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